Improving the LaCrosse?

[buickguy]

I happen to like the LaCrosse, but sales are down the past couple of months. It also gets some unfair criticism in the media, called bland by some. Bland=Camry.

Anyway, what changes could be made before the '07 models start rolling out?

More chrome?

Portholes?

I saw a picture somewhere of a LaCrosse with portholes (ebay I think) and it looked cool. My dealer told me some dealerships are putting the portholes on.

[stodge]

I haven't driven one yet, but I have sat in several in showrooms and a car show.

- It needs a fifth gear

- ABS standard across all models

- Better side impact safety rating (was only 3* I think?). can't remember if there are side air-bags available

- Dash quality needs improving - all those little buttons? The car is aimed at older people, who most likely don't have such good hand-eye-button coordination as younger people

- Front seats didn't feel bucket-like enough to me

- Rear headroom was disappointing, but that would involve a re-design of the body shape

- Make the CXS suspension standard across the board and stiffen further the CXS' suspension

- No port holes

I quite like the shape of the LaCrosse - it's quite sleek from the front.

Edited May 3, 2006 by stodge

[Intrepidation]

- Give the front a bit larger grill and headlights

- Show more incriments on the speedometor

- Redesign the buckets

- USE REAL WOOD not the cheap plastic stuff you can find in a Chevy

- Redesigned center stack, use piano black on it

- Improve the materials all around

- Softer leather

- More appealing interior colors

- 5 or 6 speed autmatic

- Better suspension tuning across the board

- More standard equipment across the board...it's a Buick not a Chevy

- Navigation system...if you can buy it on a Mazda3 or a civic, you should be able to get it on a Buick

Edited May 3, 2006 by Dodgefan

[Imaj]

This has been going on forever, GM knows what has to be done!

[VenSeattle]

Anyway, what changes could be made before the '07 models start rolling out?

See the two topics below for expected changes... I have a feeling that we'll see the changes for each on both (except exterior colors.)

2007 Allure Changes

http://www.cheersandgears.com/forums/index...?showtopic=8277

2007 LaCrosse Changes

http://www.cheersandgears.com/forums/index...?showtopic=8072

[Paolino]

I haven't driven one yet, but I have sat in several in showrooms and a car show.

- It needs a fifth gear

- ABS standard across all models

- Better side impact safety rating (was only 3* I think?). can't remember if there are side air-bags available

- Dash quality needs improving - all those little buttons? The car is aimed at older people, who most likely don't have such good hand-eye-button coordination as younger people

- Front seats didn't feel bucket-like enough to me

- Rear headroom was disappointing, but that would involve a re-design of the body shape

- Make the CXS suspension standard across the board and stiffen further the CXS' suspension

- No port holes

I quite like the shape of the LaCrosse - it's quite sleek from the front.

GM does not have a 5-speed FWD auto tranny.

ABS is standard across all models

There are no port holes on the LaCrosse unless the dealer installs them.

As for the other changes, I agree.

[ZL-1]

Exterior: new front end. This car shares its badge with the Velite/Enclave and not with the Jaguar X-Type.

Interior: real wood and navigation (full colour screen).

Mechanics: 2.8L and 3.6L V6 both with 6sp auto.

[OshKoshBerJosh]

GM does not have a 5-speed FWD auto tranny.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't the equinox come with a 5-speed auto? Didn't the Saturn Ion have a 5-speed auto when it first came out that was later replaced with a more reliable 4 speed unit?

[Cadillacfan]

There's only so much you can improve on such an old platform.

Moving to the Epsilon platform will give it a clean slate.

From there, Lutz can take care of the rest. Look at what he's done so far.

The current Lacrosse is in no way competitive with the other cars in it's segment other then having a quiet interior. I sat in one and I couldn't get over how cheap everything felt. Though, I wasn't too surprised. It is a pre-Lutz GM vehicle.

Edited May 3, 2006 by Cadillacfan

[Paolino]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't the equinox come with a 5-speed auto?  Didn't the Saturn Ion have a 5-speed auto when it first came out that was later replaced with a more reliable 4 speed unit?

Those aren't GMs... they got them from another company... Aisin I believe.

Now, I'm all for throwing another tranny in if it'll make the car look better (and still perform as wonderful as the 4-speed), but I don't think they can do that... since people say the platform can't handle the 6-speed auto GM just came out with.

[Paolino]

I'm a little annoyed--I really thought for 2007 we were going to see the LaCrosse Super.

[VenSeattle]

I sat in one and I couldn't get over how cheap everything felt.  Though, I wasn't too surprised.  It is a pre-Lutz GM vehicle.

As much as people want to whine about the styling, lack of features, & wood pattern... the interior materials are not cheap. Almost the entire interior (dash and door panels) is covered in soft touch materials. The headliner is woven. The leather's suppleness compares to vehicles costing several thousands more. The cloth material is durable. It's lighter than what some prefer but the cloth material is not cheap.

I've been is loaded CXS LaCrosses and stripped CXs. The LaCrosse's interior is well built and solid. The mentioned changes in the other topics may help with the perception. The most important one is the Allure's wood grain change.

[CSpec]

I'm a little annoyed--I really thought for 2007 we were going to see the LaCrosse Super.

You'll have to wait one more year, but it will be shortlived as W-bods stop production in early 2009.

[Paolino]

You'll have to wait one more year, but it will be shortlived as W-bods stop production in early 2009.

I know, but part of me is very disappointed because we could have used the grille change and optional V8 for more than one year. It might have helped sales, and unified Buick's look being we'll have the Enclave and Lucerne with their nice, non-ovoid grilles.

[Cadillacfan]

As much as people want to whine about the styling, lack of features, & wood pattern... the interior materials are not cheap. Almost the entire interior (dash and door panels) is covered in soft touch materials. The headliner is woven. The leather's suppleness compares to vehicles costing several thousands more. The cloth material is durable. It's lighter than what some prefer but the cloth material is not cheap.

I've been is loaded CXS LaCrosses and stripped CXs. The LaCrosse's interior is well built and solid. The mentioned changes in the other topics may help with the perception. The most important one is the Allure's wood grain change.

Then you and I were in entirely different vehicles.. because that car did not feel like an expensive interior. It may have looked nice, but that ugly black center consule just ruined it. My Grand Am interior feels better. Honest!

[caddycruiser]

Then you and I were in entirely different vehicles.. because that car did not feel like an expensive interior.  It may have looked nice, but that ugly black center consule just ruined it.  My Grand Am interior feels better.  Honest!

I agree. It does have a lot of generally nice touches, like SOME of the dash and door materials, the headliner/pillars, and the soft leather, but that HUGE black rectangle in the center of the dash (which, somehow, doesn't even have buttons on it from any other GM vehicle...and that's not a good thing...) looks so awful, and there are still a few cheap touches right beside some of the okay ones elsewhere.

It is assembled solidly, that is true, just as are most GM vehicles, but just is not at all impressive and parts like that huge flat black area just look out of place and more prototype-tester than anything. Not to mention the lack of room.

A nice car, but nothing great, and REALLY dopey looking in typical CX'd hubcap guise. A loaded black CXS is quite striking, though, somehow...hmm...

Edited May 4, 2006 by caddycruiser

[Chicagoland]

Needs all new platform, newer motors, and 5-6 speed automatics. And portholes too.

[Flybrian]

The shame of the LaCrosse's center stack is that its probably as dimensionally wide as the preceeding Regal's, yet the Regal's looked sporty and better laid-out. This has always been my big LaCrosse gripe.

[VenSeattle]

Cadillacfan & Caddcruiser: I was not commenting on appearances. Styling is VERY subjective. A lot of people don't like the Black colored center stack. That has to do with styling/appearance.

You fail to recognize that the center stack would look better in a different color or shaped differently, but there's no need to use a different material. Also, the integration of the Radio & HVAC controls are far superior to any of GM's other midsize sedans. The details are there.

Caddycruiser, I have no idea what you're referring to about the "other cheap" touches. Grab handles are dampened. Everything is illuminated. Gaps are tight inside and out.

Both of you elaborated on a specific detail, however the original comment stated everything felt cheap. That is nowhere close to the truth.

[VenSeattle]

And honestly, I'm not defending the center stack. It could look much better.

[pow]

My biggest beef with the LaX's material quality is probably the plastic wood trim and the bare doorpanels... why no upholstery inserts? I believe the old Regal had them (or was it Intrigue?)

[VenSeattle]

As far as deficiencies in material quality, certainly the door panels are worth pointing out... no upholstery inserts and molded plastic wood trim. Didn't the old Regal have leather inserts? Or was it the Intrigue?

The molded door panel materials are the same soft-touch plastics as on the dash. They're not cheap.

Wood is on the LaCrosse's door armrests Door handles are Chrome... Both are unlike the last Regal.

IIRC, the last Regal & Century had vinyl inserts.

The Impala's molded door panels feel cheap. Not the LaCrosse's.

[pow]

The molded door panel materials are the same soft-touch plastics as on the dash. They're not cheap.

Wood is on the LaCrosse's door armrests Door handles are Chrome... Both are unlike the last Regal.

IIRC, the last Regal & Century had vinyl inserts.

The Impala's molded door panels feel cheap. Not the LaCrosse's.

It just seems a bit bare, then, without any inserts. I like the Lucerne's a lot more... the different layers of materials make it seem more... engineered?

[VenSeattle]

(edited to remove my own sarcasm - VS)

A clear pic of the dash. Styling is bad to some eyes, but it's a well built environment:

non-intrusive trunk hinges:

The interior materials are soft and low-gloss. The assembly is excellent.

[VenSeattle]

Forgive my sarcasm empowah. It's not directed at you personally. I agree with a lot of your points in several areas. I'm just burnt-out on the LaCrosse getting attacked in areas that it's actually competitive.

The interior materials and fit&finish are great. The styling lets a lot of people down though.

[pow]

Forgive my sarcasm empowah. It's not directed at you personally. I agree with a lot of your points in several areas. I'm just burnt-out on the LaCrosse getting attacked in areas that it's actually competitive.

The interior materials and fit&finish are great. The styling lets a lot of people down though.

I was offline for a while so I never saw it.

But, yeah, I realize the LaCrosse's interior represents a departure for GM and that styling is subjective. Let's all hope that the next generation LaX will be universally appealing.

[zabolots]

You'll have to wait one more year, but it will be shortlived as W-bods stop production in early 2009.

What the hell's gonna replace them? Other threads on this site say that, although rumors are swirling to the contrary, there are no plans for a Pontiac Zeta at the moment. If they kill the GP, the G6 will be the "top of the line" for Pontiac???

Edited May 4, 2006 by zabolots

[Paolino]

Okay... so, I agree the LaCrosse needs a tweak in its design... a little more style. I think the fit and finish are impeccable. The wood, is an excellent touch, but should have been real wood--at least optional. A little more chrome, maybe some silver on the center stack or piano black (which I'm not entirely keen on because it easily smudges and to me that appears dirty).

I saw in the other topic, on the NG Malibu, the interior showed some LED gauges, which would be a nice addition to the interior and give it a more upscale look. I'd like to see the in-dash 6-CD changer standard on the CX.

At first the wood appeared as a nice touch, but when it was so obviously fake, it just doesn't say "premium" to me. I am probably going to be beaten for this, but the ES330's interior would be a decent interior for the LaCrosse. To me, the environment is rich, the materials are supple and of quality.

Now, the materials in the LaCrosse, in my opinion, for the most part are high quality. I would like to see a little more style on the bland doors, maybe some fabric--which I honestly don't see why more car manufacturers don't dress up the door panels. I like the Lucerne's panels, but I still would prefer some soft fabric.

[The O.C.]

Forgive my sarcasm empowah. It's not directed at you personally. I agree with a lot of your points in several areas. I'm just burnt-out on the LaCrosse getting attacked in areas that it's actually competitive.

The interior materials and fit&finish are great. The styling lets a lot of people down though.

It's better built with nicer materials than Impala....

But it just looks WAY too GERIATRIC.....

'Nuff said, unfortunately....

[Paolino]

It's better built with nicer materials than Impala....

But it just looks WAY too GERIATRIC.....

'Nuff said, unfortunately....

Well, conservative is fine, although always perceived as geriatric. I wouldn't mind a conservative interior as long as it looked upscale. I'd like to see a little more pizzazz in the interior, but overall, I like it.

[Tailfin61]

I generally like the LaX interior. Just went to the NY Auto show and after sitting in competing vehicles, IMO the LaX is competitive. The leather is very supple. The door panels could use a little more 'style', but the quality is there. The center panel looks more integrated with the ebony/taupe interior. BTW, the BUICK area had a lot of interest and the Enclave is very elegant in person.

[trinacriabob]

The LaCrosse IS a good, competent car that will last a long time, particularly with the 3800 V6.

However, to crank it up a notch, it needs the following:

1. Front end design reworked - the upright front oval is bland...so much so that, form far away, it almost looks like a last-gen LeSabre is approaching. To make it contemporary, the grilled needs to look slightly more Lucerne-like. (Side silhouette is very nice and rear treatment is also very balanced)

2. Telescoping wheel standard on base model. Leather wrapped steering wheel standard on base model.

3. Nicer, thicker cloth materials with more texture and less like mousefur.

4. A slightly larger pod in front of the driver...not by much, but it's TOO compact.

5. The wood appliques in the dash finish out in an almost triangular fashion, this is even worse on the Lucerne. They need to be relatively squarer, with a radius at each end.

6. Ignition in dash.

7. Light switch/dial is too small...almost as if it was made for a woman with small hands. It looks like it will break off soon enough.

Edited May 6, 2006 by trinacriabob

[OshKoshBerJosh]

I sat in the LaCrosse at the DC auto show last year. The materials are definitely competitive with every other midsize car out there. The plastics are almost all soft-touch. Even the glove box was dampened.

My only complaint was the plasti-wood. The pattern is ok, but there's no depth to it.

[Paolino]

I sat in the LaCrosse at the DC auto show last year.  The materials are definitely competitive with every other midsize car out there.  The plastics are almost all soft-touch.  Even the glove box was dampened. 

My only complaint was the plasti-wood.  The pattern is ok, but there's no depth to it.

Well, the wood is being redone for 2007, so let's hope there is improvement there.

[trinacriabob]

But it just looks WAY too GERIATRIC.....

As much as I want to LOVE the car, I can't. I do like it though. Which styling traits could be tweaked to make it less geriatric and still retain its core audience as well as attract newcomers?

[Croc]

The wood is the worst part, as well as the center stack with more acres of plastic than the Barbie Dream House. SOMETHING needs to break up the gray!

[Paolino]

As much as I want to LOVE the car, I can't.  I do like it though.  Which styling traits could be tweaked to make it less geriatric and still retain its core audience as well as attract newcomers?

Update grille and nose, update center stack and gauges. Tweak tail and give it some horizontal taillamps, maybe make the car's profile more rakish, a la Lucerne.

[Croc]

Paulie, don't expect any changes to anything other than fascias/interior trim bits until the EPII redesign. Anything else would just be too costly.

Edited May 8, 2006 by Croc

[Paolino]

Paulie, don't expect any changes to anything other than fascias/interior trim bits until the EPII redesign.  Anything else would just be too costly.

Oh, I'm not. I mean, before we found out the 2007 changes, I had hopes of a new grille, but that was blown out of the water.

The most I expect are different packages, colors, trim pieces (as you said), maybe the addition of an option or two, like navigation, etc. I have very little hopes for anything spectacular until 2009.

[tomg]

With 125k miles on my century, I looked at the Lacrosse in January. Things I didn't like and hoped would be fixed or replaced on the 2007 model was the 3800 engine which is 40 years old, unbalanced 90 degrees which needed counter rotating shafts, no VVT etc. These are things I wouldn't know except for the office car expert who puts doubts in your mind and thus changes your decisions. The Lucerne also was scratched from my buying list for this reason. The Impala 3.5 would be OK in the Lacrosse.

If I went with the 3.6 engine, I would have to get the dual zone climate control, which contains 17 small push buttons, which is overwhelming. My century had a manual dual zone system which is not offered on the CX. It is a single zone. This also should be fixed. The sales person even hinted these 17 buttons was causing problems with his older customers, and since this was a dual dealership, he was steering some people over to the Impala's.

Where is the Ipod jack?

Buick's are suppose to be a premium car and I was willing to pay the price if only they had finished the Lacrosse/Lucerne. "Do it right the first time".

[Cananopie]

Things I didn't like and hoped would  be fixed or replaced on the 2007 model was the 3800 engine which is 40 years old, unbalanced 90 degrees which needed counter rotating shafts, no VVT etc. These are things  I wouldn't know except for the office car expert who puts doubts in your mind and thus changes your decisions.

Man, the office car expert only knows fancy technological names that don't improve the car almost at all compared to the pushrod V6 3.8. It has stuck around this long for a reason and many car owners swear by it. It still gives competitive gas mileage and is probably the most reliable engine ever made. It's been REFINED over 40 years, it's not the same engine it was when it was invented. I have the 3.8 Series II in my Regal and it is enough power and is very quick still. The series III thats in the LaCrosse is even more refined, and quicker on the pickup than the Series II.

If you really let the "car office expert" tell you what is good (even though wouldn't have known better otherwise) then its what he'd buy, not you. You will not get a more reliable engine than the 3.8 and that's a fact... and with the mileage you have on your Century it is looking like that is what you should be considering, not the fancy names your coworker is telling you that hardly do anything different anyway.

[trinacriabob]

With 125k miles on my century, I looked at the Lacrosse in January. Things I didn't like and hoped would  be fixed or replaced on the 2007 model was the 3800 engine which is 40 years old, unbalanced 90 degrees which needed counter rotating shafts, no VVT etc. These are things  I wouldn't know except for the office car expert who puts doubts in your mind and thus changes your decisions. The Lucerne also was scratched from my buying list for this reason. The Impala 3.5 would be OK in the Lacrosse.

If I went with the 3.6 engine, I would have to get the dual zone climate control, which contains 17 small push buttons, which is overwhelming. My century had a manual dual zone system which is not offered on the CX. It is a single zone. This also should be fixed. The sales person even hinted these 17 buttons was causing problems with his older customers, and since this was a dual dealership, he was steering some people over to the Impala's.

Where is the Ipod jack?

Buick's are suppose to be a premium car and I was willing to pay the price if only they had finished the Lacrosse/Lucerne. "Do it right the first time".

Welcome, you and others have an ax to grind with the 3800. Me and a handful of others defend it to the hilt. People buy Buicks for faultless reliability. I know that's why I bought my current car and the 3800 has been nothing short of impeccable. I think that the average person can't discern the difference of 90 vs. 60 degree and, having rented both Impalas and MCs, the Chevy 3.5 and 3.9 emit a lot of noise, more so than the 3800 in Buick products.

[ponchoman49]

The axle ratio change to 3.05:1 is long overdue. Best to make the car at least similar to 1999-2004 Buick Regal standards which had this ratio all along. Hopefully the seat material is still good quality and a bit darker with more of a pattern to it. A change in the woodgrain should help too. What I really was hoping for was a new or revised front end treatment like the Super and a nice dark blue interior option like in the Lucerne and Caddy DTS. When the 3800 runs out we may see the 3500 or 3900 as the base engine. With Buicks quiet tuning these engines could be made quieter than the Impala/Monte. I have said all along that Buick should have made a lower cost Century version with the 3500, quiet tuning, 6 passenger seating, less available features and standard equipment and some different exterior styling cues for around $19995. This would make a nice lower cost volume leader that would do nothing but help Buick sales. Many people I have talked to miss the Century because of this. It was an inexpensive way to get into Buick quality.

Would also like to see the center stack made the color of the dash. This would be a very inexpensive thing to do.

[trinacriabob]

Right. Every day, I see a LaCrosse approaching frontally and driving down the other side of the road and I don't really like it very much. It's a real miss. They are really not listening since most of us are clamoring for more color and texture. They could have done the center stack as a recessed panel, much like the Intrigue and wrap in the dash material/dash color to accentuate the depression. I think the dark blue interior would sell quite well. But, they are cheap. Look at Monte and Grand Prix - black, tan and gray (not on GP) and with all black dashboards - beyond horrendous. At least the LaCrosse color coordinates the dashboards.