Cadillac News: Cadillac Introduces The Elmiraj Coupe

[Lamar]

Why not focus on ATS and CTS coupes, and getting the SRX back to RWD.

The SRX went FWD and sales more than doubled from the 1st-gen RWD model. RWD will never return because the market demands a luxury FWD crossover. Caddilac did this to chase down the Lexus RX and it worked like gangbusters. No need to mess with success.

When the new SRX debuted, it was also a few thousand bucks cheaper than the 1st gen. Let's not forget that.

Of course, the entry price is higher now, but Cadillac has staked its claim.

[balthazar]

[hyperv6]

Two main draw backs to the current SRX both come to what is Interior Space. Old SRX you could easily get 4-6 bags of golf clubs and still haul 5 people. Today's SRX you loose the back seats to get golf clubs in for just two. The interior space might be fine for a couple of 5'8" tall adults, but you would still loose the back seats to get sets of golf clubs in the auto. Try getting in a 6'6" tall person like me and no one can sit behind me, but they can in the first generation SRX. While Cadillac clearly gave the public what they wanted to buy, they also took short cuts.

Get a Lacrosse Shaq fits.

I am 6 foot and have more than enough room and have had a buddy that is 6.5 in our car and he fits fine. The real issue is the present platform caters to the rear seat room more than cargo. GM took the path that people haul people more than cargo and if anything added almost too much rear passenger room. Out Terrain is limo like.

Like it or not the first SRX failed and failed hard. While not a bad vehicle it was not what the public wanted. Sales of the latest model were so much better with the formula that the market wants.

[hyperv6]

Looks like a Round Peg in a Square Hole.

With all those hard lines how could you put a round shape in the middle that does not match the styling of the car?

Might even note the grill is a similar shape of the emblem and the lower line is the V.

[balthazar]

Riiiggghhht- that's why mercedees & BMW and every other car maker shapes it's grille emblems to match the grille outline. I LOVE all those mercedes/BMWs with the perfectly circular grilles, gets all my ducks in a row.

You so crazy.

[Drew Dowdell]

I'm trying to imagine what Audi 's or Jaguar's grille would look like in that case...

[balthazar]

Audi :

Don't forget ferrari.

[Blake Noble]

On the opposite end of the spectrum, the crosshair grille became Dodge's emblem.

It's interesting to note that the wreath and vee sort of merged to become the edge around the new Cadillac crest. Look close and you can sort of see what I mean.

Edited August 19, 2013 by black-knight

[Robert Hall]

On the opposite end of the spectrum, the crosshair grille became Dodge's emblem.

It's interesting to note that the wreath and vee sort of merged to become the edge around the new Cadillac crest. Look close and you can sort of see what I mean.

Yes..what is interesting is the crosshair grille was originally a Chrysler grille (early 60s 300, for example) before Dodge started using their own version of it in 1985.

Edited August 19, 2013 by Cubical-aka-Moltar

[balthazar]

Dodge did toy around with cross-hair grilles in the '50s & '60s, but not consistently; mostly it was used on their trucks. Chrysler's came out for '60, ran thru '67.

[Drew Dowdell]

... so about that hot new Cadillac coupe concept.... (nudging back on topic)

[Robert Hall]

Dodge did toy around with cross-hair grilles in the '50s & '60s, but not consistently; mostly it was used on their trucks. Chrysler's came out for '60, ran thru '67.

And came back for '69 (300), '79 (Cordoba 300 edition) and in '83 on the Cordoba..

Edited August 19, 2013 by Cubical-aka-Moltar

[G. David Felt]

Specifying a size is not a shortcut. You're not going to fit in a Corvette either, but that is by design..it wasn't Chevy taking a shortcut

Actually, I can fit in the corvette which is surprising to me, same with the XLR I could fit in. So I do believe that if they spent just a little more time they can get the seats and comfort to fit more people and still haul cargo. I had a friends mom sold on the SRX, but then she ended up going with the Infinity due to the new design, they increased the interior rear space so that you can get golf bags in it and still haul 5 people. The first FX35/45 was worthless for hauling anything other than groceries. Yet many of the people buying these lead active lives and I think Cadillac needs to rethink how they do the interior space on the SRX. I think there is allot of wasted space covered up.

Two main draw backs to the current SRX both come to what is Interior Space. Old SRX you could easily get 4-6 bags of golf clubs and still haul 5 people. Today's SRX you loose the back seats to get golf clubs in for just two. The interior space might be fine for a couple of 5'8" tall adults, but you would still loose the back seats to get sets of golf clubs in the auto. Try getting in a 6'6" tall person like me and no one can sit behind me, but they can in the first generation SRX. While Cadillac clearly gave the public what they wanted to buy, they also took short cuts.

Get a Lacrosse Shaq fits.

I am 6 foot and have more than enough room and have had a buddy that is 6.5 in our car and he fits fine. The real issue is the present platform caters to the rear seat room more than cargo. GM took the path that people haul people more than cargo and if anything added almost too much rear passenger room. Out Terrain is limo like.

Like it or not the first SRX failed and failed hard. While not a bad vehicle it was not what the public wanted. Sales of the latest model were so much better with the formula that the market wants.

I have the first gen SRX and Love it, will not be getting rid of it any time soon. The 2nd gen might be a sales success, but is a failure to me. Big rear blind spots and a lack on interior space for big people and cargo.

[G. David Felt]

Dodge did toy around with cross-hair grilles in the '50s & '60s, but not consistently; mostly it was used on their trucks. Chrysler's came out for '60, ran thru '67.

Lovely, Simply Lovely

[G. David Felt]

It's interesting to note that the wreath and vee sort of merged to become the edge around the new Cadillac crest. Look close and you can sort of see what I mean.

In looking at the front, I see the point your making as it does seem to have that and the new emblem does flow with the front grill. Very nice over all.

This weekend my Cadillac dealer had a customer appreciation party with music, food and test drives along with an old car show/competition. Will post pictures in another thread, but back on topic, I talked with many who had not heard about the ElMiraj and when they looked at it, they loved it. There were many old 60's and 70's Eldorado's there and this new car was a huge hit.

Interesting is that many of the owners of the old Eldo's thought it would be a good car to have that name on it, but they also felt the Eldorado was history now and a new name would be better. It was unanimous that people from the NW Cadillac club all felt GM needs to go back to names and drop this letter naming of the cars. Younger people I talked with like this concept but felt it should be a simple designation letter to fit the family. Some even suggested they drop Escalade and just go with ESV or ES depending on the body. Young are so not in tune with the auto industry.

[dwightlooi]

I think this is a lousy stylistic element...

The upward sweeping trim line and under tray makes it look as if the tail is jacked up and the suspension isn't level.

That brings two pretty uninspiring pictures to mind -- that of a dancing low rider and that of an unloaded pickup with leaf spring suspension.

Neither of which fits the identity of a classy luxury coupe.

[balthazar]

^ It is borderline. On one hand, from some angles it gives the car attitude. However, from other angles the car has a lot of 'underbelly tumblehome', and from this angle it makes the rear tire protrude too far out of the wheelwell, AKA a off-road truck. I think the bulk of the issue is that the tail is a tad too tapered in plan view.

Design could use a bit of detail refinement here & there, IMO.

[Robert Hall]

I like that upswept trim line..it's distinctive.

[hyperv6]

Riiiggghhht- that's why mercedees & BMW and every other car maker shapes it's grille emblems to match the grille outline. I LOVE all those mercedes/BMWs with the perfectly circular grilles, gets all my ducks in a row.

You so crazy.

I love how when you have no argument you take things so out of context.

I just gave an observation on the Cadillac grill in this car, did I say anything about BMW or Benz.....No!

It's interesting to note that the wreath and vee sort of merged to become the edge around the new Cadillac crest. Look close and you can sort of see what I mean.

In looking at the front, I see the point your making as it does seem to have that and the new emblem does flow with the front grill. Very nice over all.

This weekend my Cadillac dealer had a customer appreciation party with music, food and test drives along with an old car show/competition. Will post pictures in another thread, but back on topic, I talked with many who had not heard about the ElMiraj and when they looked at it, they loved it. There were many old 60's and 70's Eldorado's there and this new car was a huge hit.

Interesting is that many of the owners of the old Eldo's thought it would be a good car to have that name on it, but they also felt the Eldorado was history now and a new name would be better. It was unanimous that people from the NW Cadillac club all felt GM needs to go back to names and drop this letter naming of the cars. Younger people I talked with like this concept but felt it should be a simple designation letter to fit the family. Some even suggested they drop Escalade and just go with ESV or ES depending on the body. Young are so not in tune with the auto industry.

The real question is how many past new Eldo owners are still driving. You know the eye sight goes once you hit the 80's. LOL!

I think this is a lousy stylistic element...

The upward sweeping trim line and under tray makes it look as if the tail is jacked up and the suspension isn't level.

That brings two pretty uninspiring pictures to mind -- that of a dancing low rider and that of an unloaded pickup with leaf spring suspension.

Neither of which fits the identity of a classy luxury coupe.

I noticed this too. In some photos it stands out and others less so. Also the over sized wheels do not help. I think the wheels would look better 2-4 inches smaller.

[G. David Felt]

I actually like the design element, I think it works well for the car and gives it a bit of a hot rod look.

[balthazar]

Riiiggghhht- that's why mercedees & BMW and every other car maker shapes it's grille emblems to match the grille outline. I LOVE all those mercedes/BMWs with the perfectly circular grilles, gets all my ducks in a row.

You so crazy.

I love how when you have no argument you take things so out of context. I just gave an observation on the Cadillac grill in this car, did I say anything about BMW or Benz.....No!

I merely responded to this, your words :

Might even note the grill is a similar shape of the emblem....

No one echoes the shape of their grilles to their emblem, so if it was a point, it has zero context in the auto industry. BMW & Daimler were examples of (the lack of) that.

[hyperv6]

Riiiggghhht- that's why mercedees & BMW and every other car maker shapes it's grille emblems to match the grille outline. I LOVE all those mercedes/BMWs with the perfectly circular grilles, gets all my ducks in a row.

You so crazy.

I love how when you have no argument you take things so out of context. I just gave an observation on the Cadillac grill in this car, did I say anything about BMW or Benz.....No!

I merely responded to this, your words :

>Might even note the grill is a similar shape of the emblem....

No one echoes the shape of their grilles to their emblem, so if it was a point, it has zero context in the auto industry. BMW & Daimler were examples of (the lack of) that.

So, They did something original. Sorry some of us like some new things and have stopped living totally in the past like you. You off all people should be happy that Cadillac had an original idea and not just tried to clone a German model.

Hell BMW and Benz never had large Fins either.

Ok it is not out of context it was just a pointless remark on your part.

[balthazar]

Benz actually did follow Cadillac and ran fins on their early '60s cars (when it was already on the decline here... but mercedes has traditionally had trouble maintaining pace with the styling line of scrimmage, at least until the 1980s. Of course, I only know this because I apparently "live in the past".) Fact is, you can't fully appreciate the present unless you also know the past.

Cadillac has had many times over the original stylistic idea vs. mercedes, and as a fan of the marque, that's a large part of what attracts me to it. The Elmiraj is not an "original" idea in that it doesn't propose anything new (in general), but it is a very well done piece all the same. I prefer the Ciel immensely, tho- has tremendous presence. I look forward to the '3rd shoe' in this series, esp if it is some degree of a melding of the two.

[G. David Felt]

So then we all agree that this captures the past glory of Cadillac and also encompasses a nice 21st century take for the product line?

[balthazar]

IMO, it,s a good next step forward. Cadillac can do better tho. The '14 CTS has even better dynamicism out front than the Elmiraj.

[smk4565]

Cadillac says this car is production doable, but I can't imagine a 205 inch long 2-door is going to have much success, and how would they price it? A CL550 is $115,000 and that is a car that gets replaced by the S550 Coupe next year, and will probably carry the same price or perhaps even more. They can't price the Elmiraj at $100,000, no one would buy it, so if it costs $60,000, does it even have appeal there? It is bigger than an XTS, but supposed to be a luxury sports coupe? Then you have the CTS V-sport, ELR and Corvette in that price point, so if you push the Elmiraj to $75,000 or higher to get it away from those cars, doesn't it just become the next Allante or XLR?

[Blake Noble]

Cadillac says this car is production doable, but I can't imagine a 205 inch long 2-door is going to have much success, and how would they price it? A CL550 is $115,000 and that is a car that gets replaced by the S550 Coupe next year, and will probably carry the same price or perhaps even more. They can't price the Elmiraj at $100,000, no one would buy it, so if it costs $60,000, does it even have appeal there? It is bigger than an XTS, but supposed to be a luxury sports coupe? Then you have the CTS V-sport, ELR and Corvette in that price point, so if you push the Elmiraj to $75,000 or higher to get it away from those cars, doesn't it just become the next Allante or XLR?

Shut yer pie hole. If you don't want to throw your Monopoly money at your computer screen like the rest of us, then you can just geddoudt.

Build this car right, people will buy it. I don't give a damn what you think, an S-Class coupe looks like a Toyota Solara next to the Elmiraj.

[balthazar]

smk :: You think that anyone would consider the ELR, CTS-V, Corvette & an Elmiraj as cross-shoppable?? Tough to get 4 more dissimilar demographics together without including trucks.

How come mercedees wasn't worried when they priced the E63 @ $90K and the CLS63 @ $95K? Don't they have a real need to "distance" those two from each other? More worrisome is the overlap of the CLA @ $30K and the C @ $35K. These are interchangeable sedans, unlike an ELR and a Corvette (which aren't even the same brand/in the same showrooms).

Edited August 21, 2013 by Z-06

[Lamar]

Cadillac says this car is production doable, but I can't imagine a 205 inch long 2-door is going to have much success, and how would they price it? A CL550 is $115,000 and that is a car that gets replaced by the S550 Coupe next year, and will probably carry the same price or perhaps even more. They can't price the Elmiraj at $100,000, no one would buy it, so if it costs $60,000, does it even have appeal there? It is bigger than an XTS, but supposed to be a luxury sports coupe? Then you have the CTS V-sport, ELR and Corvette in that price point, so if you push the Elmiraj to $75,000 or higher to get it away from those cars, doesn't it just become the next Allante or XLR?

tl;dr "According to me, Cadillac can't win no matter what."

[G. David Felt]

Cadillac says this car is production doable, but I can't imagine a 205 inch long 2-door is going to have much success, and how would they price it? A CL550 is $115,000 and that is a car that gets replaced by the S550 Coupe next year, and will probably carry the same price or perhaps even more. They can't price the Elmiraj at $100,000, no one would buy it, so if it costs $60,000, does it even have appeal there? It is bigger than an XTS, but supposed to be a luxury sports coupe? Then you have the CTS V-sport, ELR and Corvette in that price point, so if you push the Elmiraj to $75,000 or higher to get it away from those cars, doesn't it just become the next Allante or XLR?

People who cannot imagine, live very boring lives so I hear.

There are plenty of people with money who will buy a 2 door like this as it meets certain needs of their life. I am one. A big car with room for me and the wife and maybe an occasional other person, but really just me and the wife on a road trip.

I am one of those people that will never buy Euro or Asian trash auto's as I prefer to support American companies first and then will look outside only when no alternative is available.

[smk4565]

How come mercedees wasn't worried when they priced the E63 @ $90K and the CLS63 @ $95K? Don't they have a real need to "distance" those two from each other?

Same chassis and engine, they are basically the same car. The CLS is an E-class with a different body. So it is do you want a sedan, or pay $5-10k more for styling and 4-door coupe look. Notice those cars stop though, where the S-class starts.

[smk4565]

There are plenty of people with money who will buy a 2 door like this as it meets certain needs of their life. I am one. A big car with room for me and the wife and maybe an occasional other person, but really just me and the wife on a road trip.

But would you, (or the people with money) spend $100,000 on this car? The Mercedes CL sold about 600 cars last year in the USA, and only 300 so far this year since that model is being phased out. If the entire market for $100,000+ full size coupes is 600 a year, which Mercedes has a monopoly on right now, even if Cadillac takes 50% of the market, it is 300 cars a year. They can't do that.

The Eldorado should return as a 191 inch long coupe based off the CTS/Alpha platform, 3.6 V6 standard, the 3.6 TT V6, and some hybrid or green powertrain, price it $55-65,000 and you have a winner. It can compete with the 6-series and E-class coupe, it gives Cadillac a cool car that is a bit of a halo product, but that is still attainable, and at a price where past Cadillac buyers can afford one.

[Drew Dowdell]

The CL isn't as sexy as the Elmiraj.... not by a long shot.

[G. David Felt]

I agree with Drew about how boring, blah and just plain dull the CL is, for that matter other than AMG I tend to find MB style rather boring and blah. BMW has a tad bit better style than MB but also not a big fan other than their M series of their cars.

Over all SMK, Yes, I would spend $100,000 on this American Made luxury 2 door!

[ocnblu]

This, my friends, is the kind of car Cadillac has needed for decades.  It is a return to their rightful place in the hierarchy.

 

 

 

[GMTruckGuy74]

Is the ElMiraj related in any way to the Ciel? I didn't follow the Ciel much, but I am smitten by the ElMiraj.

[ZL-1]

Is the ElMiraj related in any way to the Ciel? I didn't follow the Ciel much, but I am smitten by the ElMiraj.

Both are Omega-based and thus related. There still one more concept to be shown IIRC, so I guess the Ciel and Elmiraj have been shown in a work-in-progress perspective: a progression to that the LTS will be. The next concept should be a 95% production ready LTS (hope GM doesn't throw away the large coupe idea, though).

[Nub_Cannon]

Damn, this concept is sweet. Cadillac is back! Again!

[G. David Felt]

Concepts are awesome, now if they can just bring it to market then they truly will be back at creating amazing auto's and selling them.