Simple, But Not Cheap

[ocnblu]

Just spec'd out a 2012 Wrangler. Durn thing ran up to $27k, and it was a Sport with hardtop and manual transmission plus a few options. WTH?

Too many luxury features are available on the Wrangler, imo.

[Robert Hall]

A new 2dr convertible 4x4 for under $30k, seems like a bargain..and it's the only vehicle of it's sort on the market today. I like that they have options and modern features available to make them more drivable on road...

[Satty]

$27k isn't bad at all, if you want an '86 Jeep hop on Craigslist and find an '86.

[PurdueGuy]

I really don't understand buying a new wrangler. New vehicle = new paint, etc, don't want to get it dirty or scratch the paint. Wrangler = lame if you don't take it off road, where it'll get dirty & the paint will get scratched.

[ocnblu]

This is it, the one I specified. I think "Dozer" is a cool colour, although I like just about all the colours.

[Robert Hall]

I really don't understand buying a new wrangler. New vehicle = new paint, etc, don't want to get it dirty or scratch the paint. Wrangler = lame if you don't take it off road, where it'll get dirty & the paint will get scratched.

I understand it..get the.warranty and reliability of a new car and avoid the headaches of a used car. I'd buy a new Wrangler and take it off road, since I bought my Grand Cherokee new and took it off road a week later...

[Satty]

You can spec a Wrangler Unlimited up to $40 grand. When you think about it, you get like 6 vehicles in one. You can drive it every day to take the kids to school, you can carry just about anything Home Depot sells, you can drive it up a mountain, in the summer its an open-top cruiser, in the winter its a blizzard-beater. I think the fact that it has power windows and air conditioning is just fine.

[A Horse With No Name]

Just spec'd out a 2012 Wrangler. Durn thing ran up to $27k, and it was a Sport with hardtop and manual transmission plus a few options. WTH?

Too many luxury features are available on the Wrangler, imo.

You need a used jeep of the 1997-2006 vintage...the one with the good inline six.

You already have a nice new Chevy as a daily...you need something older you can beat on and get dirty...

You can spec a Wrangler Unlimited up to $40 grand. When you think about it, you get like 6 vehicles in one. You can drive it every day to take the kids to school, you can carry just about anything Home Depot sells, you can drive it up a mountain, in the summer its an open-top cruiser, in the winter its a blizzard-beater. I think the fact that it has power windows and air conditioning is just fine.

It is one heck of a vehicle, and Ohio built as well!

This is it, the one I specified. I think "Dozer" is a cool colour, although I like just about all the colours.

I like the Dozer, but the natural green is better IMHO!

[pow]

Not only are they pricey... they're pretty heavy, too. An Unlimited weighs more than 4,000 lbs.

[A Horse With No Name]

All the more reason to get the 97-2006 model and modify it for a little trail work...

[ocnblu]

What can I say, I've been craving something that still feels... mechanical.

[A Horse With No Name]

Agreed....

Buying an older Jeep would b e wicked cool...

[Satty]

If you can't find a decent CJ or TJ on Craigslist for under $4 grand, you're a failure at the internet.

But if you really want something new that isn't a modern car, I'm sure the good people of India would welcome you to their country to sample a Nano.

[A Horse With No Name]

Bingo on the cheap Jeep on the internet thing...

Saw a Chinese three wheeler for sale on a car lot in Columbus the other day....

[A Horse With No Name]

Chevy thrown in just for fun....

[ocnblu]

I know Jeeps are used as summer and winter runabouts by a fair number of owners as second cars or whatever, but... those above posted photos make me skeert to consider a used one. Mental blockage?

[A Horse With No Name]

They built eleventy billion of them...find one that hasn't been trashed.

[Satty]

Clean, unmodified examples will run closer to $7-10 grand but they'll run forever. It isn't tough to find one that was bought to be a boulevard cruiser.

[ocnblu]

A base model Sport without S package, with a hardtop, is still about $24k. The only other things I'd like to have are a positraction rear end and A/C. Cool looking steel Cragar black wheels only cost $99 apiece, and BFG All-Terrain T/A tires would complete the look. Those base 16" silver steelies look positively TINY inside those wheel arches.

[Blake Noble]

I wish my Jeep would've worked out. I really miss it. My Cherokee probably had the best driving position of any SUV I've been in, bar none. And considering how well taken care of it was before I bought it, it handled like a champ.

Jeeps are like an incurable virus. Once one gets underneath your skin, there's no getting away from one.

[A Horse With No Name]

I wish my Jeep would've worked out. I really miss it. My Cherokee probably had the best driving position of any SUV I've been in, bar none. And considering how well taken care of it was before I bought it, it handled like a champ.

Jeeps are like an incurable virus. Once one gets underneath your skin, there's no getting away from one.

This would be correct...once your addicted...your addicted.

[Robert Hall]

I'm lusting after the 4th gen Grand Cherokee. Would like to get 150k out of my 2nd gen '00 before I trade or buy another, though. Though I really like the Charger, Challenger, 300, Mustang, Camaro, and Panthers....

[Blake Noble]

I wish my Jeep would've worked out. I really miss it. My Cherokee probably had the best driving position of any SUV I've been in, bar none. And considering how well taken care of it was before I bought it, it handled like a champ.

Jeeps are like an incurable virus. Once one gets underneath your skin, there's no getting away from one.

This would be correct...once your addicted...your addicted.

I know this: another Cherokee is pretty much in my immediate future. The first one was enough of a learning experience of what to look out for (mainly, condition of heads and head gaskets) and how to buy one cheap.

I wish Jeep would build a true successor to the Cherokee, though: an innovative, highly capable, well handling, tough and rugged, lightweight, cheap and efficient compact mid-sized SUV (of course, with the customer's choice of two or four doors, two four-wheel drive systems, and two different transmissions and engines).

The only time the Liberty came remotely close was with the Renegade package, but even then its hefty curb weight still left it lacking. The 2008 and up models are an insult to what legacy the Cherokee left. Sure, you could argue the four-door Wrangler Unlimited is better poised to carry the Cherokee's torch, but it comes at a hefty cost whereas the Cherokee always remained affordable throughout its entire run. The Patriot makes for a fun runabout, but it lacks the real off-road prowess of the SUV it tries so hard to emulate.

The Grand Cherokee is in a league of its own, far removed from the original Cherokee. It doesn't fit into this picture, despite being originally designed to replace it.

Alas, it seems corporate ignorance has buried one of the best modern SUVs any company has ever built ... and the company that truly takes credit for that impressive piece of design would be AMC (with a dump truck's load of credit to Richard Teague), the McGyver of automotive design and engineering. Ironically the Cherokee has left most, if not all, of Jeep's line-up under the weight of its shadow since it left the room. Look at how ChryCo redesigned the Liberty and designed the Patriot; look at how they designed the Commander and consider why they decided to build the Wrangler Unlimited with four full doors. You don't just build any successful vehicle relatively unchanged for almost two decades and expect people to just forget why they bought one in the first place.

Also consider the fact it was the Cherokee just about everyone scrambled to compete with during the late '80s and early '90s. Because of the Cherokee, GM had to add an extra set of doors to the Blazer and Jimmy. Because of the Cherokee, Ford had to take the Bronco II down to the bare foundation and redesign it to be bigger and, yep, with a set of four doors (read: Explorer). It was the Cherokee's original formula that everyone copied and that would eventually lead to the SUV boom.

I have to wonder how many people who shown up to trade their old Cherokees in around the debut of the original Liberty were completely turned off and away by what they were presented with at their Jeep dealer.

I can't forget the truck the Cherokee spawned, either. With Ford giving up on compact trucks and Dodge moving on to follow Honda's failed model by slapping beds on minivans, Jeep could really take hold of the compact truck market in a big way if they built another truck like the Comanche. The Comanche was exceptionally light-weight, good looking, and fuel efficient for a small truck while still remaining rugged and capable and a new Jeep designed in the exact same vein would bring a lot of sales. I guarantee that, especially if they also add different cab configurations into the mix (that's the only thing the original Comanche should've stayed ahead on).

Anyway, my rant is over.

Edited October 20, 2011 by black-knight

[ocnblu]

Jacket's words ring true.

[A Horse With No Name]

I'm lusting after the 4th gen Grand Cherokee. Would like to get 150k out of my 2nd gen '00 before I trade or buy another, though. Though I really like the Charger, Challenger, 300, Mustang, Camaro, and Panthers....

I would suggest Grand Cherokee...your an SUV kind of a guy in a way.

The new Grand Cherokee is one of the hotest things out there IMHO.

I wish my Jeep would've worked out. I really miss it. My Cherokee probably had the best driving position of any SUV I've been in, bar none. And considering how well taken care of it was before I bought it, it handled like a champ.

Jeeps are like an incurable virus. Once one gets underneath your skin, there's no getting away from one.

This would be correct...once your addicted...your addicted.

I know this: another Cherokee is pretty much in my immediate future. The first one was enough of a learning experience of what to look out for (mainly, condition of heads and head gaskets) and how to buy one cheap.

I wish Jeep would build a true successor to the Cherokee, though: an innovative, highly capable, well handling, tough and rugged, lightweight, cheap and efficient compact mid-sized SUV (of course, with the customer's choice of two or four doors, two four-wheel drive systems, and two different transmissions and engines).

The only time the Liberty came remotely close was with the Renegade package, but even then its hefty curb weight still left it lacking. The 2008 and up models are an insult to what legacy the Cherokee left. Sure, you could argue the four-door Wrangler Unlimited is better poised to carry the Cherokee's torch, but it comes at a hefty cost whereas the Cherokee always remained affordable throughout its entire run. The Patriot makes for a fun runabout, but it lacks the real off-road prowess of the SUV it tries so hard to emulate.

The Grand Cherokee is in a league of its own, far removed from the original Cherokee. It doesn't fit into this picture, despite being originally designed to replace it.

Alas, it seems corporate ignorance has buried one of the best modern SUVs any company has ever built ... and the company that truly takes credit for that impressive piece of design would be AMC (with a dump truck's load of credit to Richard Teague), the McGyver of automotive design and engineering. Ironically the Cherokee has left most, if not all, of Jeep's line-up under the weight of its shadow since it left the room. Look at how ChryCo redesigned the Liberty and designed the Patriot; look at how they designed the Commander and consider why they decided to build the Wrangler Unlimited with four full doors. You don't just build any successful vehicle relatively unchanged for almost two decades and expect people to just forget why they bought one in the first place.

Also consider the fact it was the Cherokee just about everyone scrambled to compete with during the late '80s and early '90s. Because of the Cherokee, GM had to add an extra set of doors to the Blazer and Jimmy. Because of the Cherokee, Ford had to take the Bronco II down to the bare foundation and redesign it to be bigger and, yep, with a set of four doors (read: Explorer). It was the Cherokee's original formula that everyone copied and that would eventually lead to the SUV boom.

I have to wonder how many people who shown up to trade their old Cherokees in around the debut of the original Liberty were completely turned off and away by what they were presented with at their Jeep dealer.

I can't forget the truck the Cherokee spawned, either. With Ford giving up on compact trucks and Dodge moving on to follow Honda's failed model by slapping beds on minivans, Jeep could really take hold of the compact truck market in a big way if they built another truck like the Comanche. The Comanche was exceptionally light-weight, good looking, and fuel efficient for a small truck while still remaining rugged and capable and a new Jeep designed in the exact same vein would bring a lot of sales. I guarantee that, especially if they also add different cab configurations into the mix (that's the only thing the original Comanche should've stayed ahead on).

Anyway, my rant is over.

Post of the Month....!

[ocnblu]

Doesn't this look fun? <iframe width="480" height="360" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/SZKShqlmsHY?rel=0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[Drew Dowdell]

Cool save bro!

[ocnblu]

HAHA! Yikes, I am agonizing over some things right now. I am so torn on what to do. I'd love to be able to have the means to own a 2012 Wrangler and keep my little Chevy for the commute, but alas...

Edited October 28, 2011 by ocnblu

[FAPTurbo]

Jeeps are like an incurable virus. Once one gets underneath your skin, there's no getting away from one.

Just sit in a Compass. Then you'll be inoculated for life.

[Blake Noble]

Jeeps are like an incurable virus. Once one gets underneath your skin, there's no getting away from one.

Just sit in a Compass. Then you'll be inoculated for life.

Nope. While I would never go out and buy a Compass over the other Jeeps out there, I do understand its purpose in Jeep's line-up. It's a Jeep for folks who really don't need a real Jeep. They appreciate the idea of one, but would never use one to its full potential. Its there for the guys and gals who bought Cherokees (or RAV4s ... or Vibes ... you get the idea) in the past but never took them off-road and only needed a Jeep as a means to get to work when the weather was a little too rough for their liking. It's another runabout, like the Patriot minus the off-road capabilities.

The recent updates also fixed a lot of the Compass's previous shortcomings.

Also considering Jeep had flirted around with the idea of small, more car-like SUVs (albeit in concept form) before the introduction of the Compass, it's really not all too surprising Jeep decided to go through with it in the end.

That said, it's still not a Cherokee.

Edited October 28, 2011 by black-knight

[Robert Hall]

Had HUMMER survived, maybe they would have made a Compass-like H4 compact CUV.

Edited October 28, 2011 by Cubical-aka-Moltar

[z28luvr01]

Jeeps are like an incurable virus. Once one gets underneath your skin, there's no getting away from one.

This.

I just had a 4dr Wrangler as a rental for 10 days in Las Vegas. it was huge enough inside, but it still was a manageable size and it had a great seating position. It didn't have any bells and whistles, and it won't do too well around the Nurburgring, but none of that mattered. There's just something about driving one with the top flipped back and the radio blasting that feels so.....right. I'd put a 2dr Wrangler at the top of my list of replacements for my Cobalt when I try to unload it next spring.

[Robert Hall]

Jeeps are like an incurable virus. Once one gets underneath your skin, there's no getting away from one.

This.

I just had a 4dr Wrangler as a rental for 10 days in Las Vegas. it was huge enough inside, but it still was a manageable size and it had a great seating position. It didn't have any bells and whistles, and it won't do too well around the Nurburgring, but none of that mattered. There's just something about driving one with the top flipped back and the radio blasting that feels so.....right. I'd put a 2dr Wrangler at the top of my list of replacements for my Cobalt when I try to unload it next spring.

Now that fall is finally here, I'm seeing a lot of Wranglers rolling around top down. They have a lot of charm.

[A Horse With No Name]

Jeeps are like an incurable virus. Once one gets underneath your skin, there's no getting away from one.

This.

I just had a 4dr Wrangler as a rental for 10 days in Las Vegas. it was huge enough inside, but it still was a manageable size and it had a great seating position. It didn't have any bells and whistles, and it won't do too well around the Nurburgring, but none of that mattered. There's just something about driving one with the top flipped back and the radio blasting that feels so.....right. I'd put a 2dr Wrangler at the top of my list of replacements for my Cobalt when I try to unload it next spring.

Now that fall is finally here, I'm seeing a lot of Wranglers rolling around top down. They have a lot of charm.

You and blu both need to do the right thing, walk through the front door, and buy one.

[ocnblu]

You guys and your Jeep stories. You're making me want to unload my brand new little blue sedan and get a 3.6L Wrangler. DARN YOU ALL TO HECK!!!

[daves87rs]

Cool save bro!

Not bad!

[ocnblu]

It is snowing to beat the band here. I'm bored. So I went lot hopping to the second-closest Jeep dealer. They have some nice ones. But I didn't get out of the car. Car did fine so far, the roads are slushy here, but they're calling for quite a bit more snow to fall.

[A Horse With No Name]

Blu...your missing the point. Move to Arizona, and your still a truck guy...plain and simple.

Not gonna change...

YOU NEED A JEEP OR A TRUCK DUDE...no amount of wishing this away is going to change things.

[ocnblu]

So yeah my pain continues. One of our salesdudes said 3 potential customers have seen my car parked on the lot and inquired about it, which piqued my interest. I told him I'd sell it.

And the Jeep dealer wants to give me a grand total of $13k for my 2012 Cruze with 2700 miles, that had an MSRP of $19,285, purchased in August. He says it is too new to accurately put a value on it, that he does not want it for his lot, and that the Chevy dealers he called to help him with value say they have too many new ones on the lot, so essentially a 2012 with 2700 miles that has been registered is worthless to them.

[A Horse With No Name]

Rather than take a 7500 dollar depreciation hit on the Cruze, put 5 grand into an old Wrangler and be done...it's not like you don't know anyone who can do bodywork, now is it?

Seriously...it might just be something you would have to wait on. I've been enjoying the Miata for years now and waiting to buy a MINI, a GTI, or a C30...there are restaurants that I have wanted to try for years and haven't gotten around to trying...

That being said, I think next summer is going to maybe see a GTI, C30 Volvo, or MINI Cooper S in the driveway.

[Z-06]

Satisfying wants can cause downfalls, satisfying needs causes mental peace.

[ocnblu]

...and I definitely need some mental peace.

Was talking to my cousin today, she started off with a new Cherokee in the early 90s, bought an '02 Liberty and traded that on a '10 Liberty with SkySlider roof. She loves the solid feel behind the wheel of a Jeep, but with gas the way it is (she's getting 18 mpg with hers), she says I will not like the gas mileage. Prolly true, although 18 is better than my '10 Colorado.

So my hotness has cooled off some. I wish Jeep had seen fit to put the new V6 in the Liberty with a 6-speed auto, but with it being a lame duck, I guess I understand why they dint. I just hope the next generation isn't ruined.

Now the Focus AllRoad... errr... Escape is starting to grow on me, after my initial shock and distaste has worn off, and that isn't on the lots until summer, so I got time to chill. The SE trim looks very decent, according to the galleries I've perused, and that 237 hp turbo 4 with a real 6-speed auto sounds like a great combo. Am I going soft in the noggin?

[A Horse With No Name]

YES!....a Wimpy Ford isn't the same as a Jeep. but your still thinkin of this wrong....buy a cheap jeep or a cheap pick em up and be done with it, my friend.

[ocnblu]

The Jeep ® Patriot Freedom Drive II system with brake-lock differential works great according to the video demos I've seen and the owner reviews in Edmunds. For 2012, Chrysler has recalibrated the CVT for better operation all-around. For one of the best fuel economy/4X4 capability setups, the Patriot is hard to beat.

There is a Rescue Green Patriot Latitude with Freedom Drive II Trail-Rated package "in transit" to a local dealer. I've emailed them and asked them to contact me when it comes in so I can look at it.

[ocnblu]

Found a dealership in Wrightsville, PA that has at least 3 Trail Rated package 2012 Patriots, including one in the new Rescue Green colour. They just got 3 green ones in today, of varying equipment. The green ones weren't ready to be driven as they weren't through the PDI process, but I did get to drive a White Latitude with the package.

I like it very much. The CVT (mandatory on the Trail Rated version) is much better behaved in the Jeep than it is in my mother's Nissan Cube, with very little of the rubber band effect. After the initial windup, it settled down quickly and quietly (Chrysler has reportedly tweaked the CVT for 2012 to improve driving behavior). The ride is solid and smooth. I can see the hood while driving (can't see it in the Wrangler), and the vehicle is small enough there is no problem with placing it for parking, despite the baby Hummer flat low roof. The green one has the sunroof/high powered stereo package as well on the Latitude model, for an MSRP of $25,300+. The thing has a lot of features for the money compared to an Equinox or Escape, not to mention it's a rugged looking little wagon, where the Equinox is citified and the Escape looks dated. It has a timeless Jeep ® look to it.

Sooo... I am returning to the dealership on Saturday to drive the green one and have my Cruze appraised. If the numbers line up for me... I think I am going to go for it.

Edited November 24, 2011 by ocnblu

[AAS]

Found a dealership in Wrightsville, PA that has at least 3 Trail Rated package 2012 Patriots, including one in the new Rescue Green colour. They just got 3 green ones in today, of varying equipment. The green ones weren't ready to be driven as they weren't through the PDI process, but I did get to drive a White Latitude with the package.

I like it very much. The CVT (mandatory on the Trail Rated version) is much better behaved in the Jeep than it is in my mother's Nissan Cube, with very little of the rubber ban effect. After the initial windup, it settled down quickly and quietly (Chrysler has reportedly tweaked the CVT for 2012 to improve driving behavior). The ride is solid and smooth. I can see the hood while driving (can't see it in the Wrangler), and the vehicle is small enough there is no problem with placing it for parking, despite the baby Hummer flat low roof. The green one has the sunroof/high powered stereo package as well on the Latitude model, for an MSRP of $25,300+. The thing has a lot of features for the money compared to an Equinox or Escape, not to mention it's a butch little wagon, where the Equinox is citified and the Escape looks dated. It has a timeless Jeep ® look to it.

Sooo... I am returning to the dealership on Saturday to drive the green one and have my Cruze appraised. If the numbers line up for me... I think I am going to go for it.

Sounds exciting! Did you get to see one with the tan interior? If so, how does it compare to the black?

How is the fuel economy with the Trail Rated 4x4 system and CVT? Back when I was looking MPG's with the CVT took a big hit compared to the lower level 4x4 system and 5MT.

[ocnblu]

Was unable to see one with tan interior, nor do I see any listed so far in my area on the inventory locator tool @ Jeep®.com. The light-coloured pillar trim and headliner go far to mitigate any claustrophobia, imo, although I'd still like to see one with the tan.

With Freedom Drive II, the EPA ratings are 20/23, with Freedom Drive I and CVT, the rating is 21/26. I'd have to travel a good ways to see one of the few manuals with 4WD, which are rated at 22/28.

Yup, I am excited and hopeful to break into Jeep territory with a Patriot. We'll see, come Saturday, if they give me a fairer price for my car and a good deal on the Jeep, otherwise I have no choice but to walk.

Edited November 26, 2011 by ocnblu

[ocnblu]

• 
  Edmunds.com
  The 2011 Jeep Patriot was named the Edmunds.com 2011 Lowest True Cost to Own^® SUV under $25,000. The lowest True Cost to Own award is based on the projected ownership cost over a five-year period assuming 15,000 miles driven per year.
  

Hopefully there is no harm in posting this.

Edited November 26, 2011 by ocnblu

[A Horse With No Name]

Sounds like your getting things sorted out...that's good!

[ocnblu]

It's a nice driving little 4X4. I do not feel claustrophobic while driving it, and over-the-shoulder visibility is just fine with the square windows.

Payments would be $100 higher per munt than the Cruze. This dealer offered me $2000 more for it in trade than the first place I went.

And it's packed with features for the price.