Video: GM CEO Mark Reuss talks about Cadillac ATS

[BigPontiac]

Link

[smk4565]

Two things stood out to me, first was about starting from scratch on a fresh slate. Secondly that Cadillac can't just be about big V8s and supercharged motors and how they have to lead on technology and refinement. I think both are important for this car and the Omega car.

Everyone always says their car has fantastic ride and handling, so I expected him to say that. But starting from scratch and putting refinement over big V8s are a bit different from GM, so I at least get the feeling that they understand the segment.

[riviera74]

While I agree with you smk4565, I wonder how GM will actually differentiate the ATS from competitors so that the ATS will sell. This is 3 series territory more than anything else, so the ATS had better be spectacular.

[smk4565]

While I agree with you smk4565, I wonder how GM will actually differentiate the ATS from competitors so that the ATS will sell. This is 3 series territory more than anything else, so the ATS had better be spectacular.

That is good question. From the video it sounds like they have the right idea, but the execution is what I wonder about. It does have to be spectacular, the 3-series has been dominating for 30 years. Plus it is a crowded segment, and a lot of challengers have come and gone over the past 25 years, yet the 3-series and C-class are still there on top.

[Justin Bimmer]

One thing about this car which I am looking forward to seeing is the American factor. This American factor will be novelty enough to get people to test drive it and see if it really can compete. I bet they will make sales because of it too.

[smk4565]

One thing about this car which I am looking forward to seeing is the American factor. This American factor will be novelty enough to get people to test drive it and see if it really can compete. I bet they will make sales because of it too.

Is that like the Cimmarron factor? I do get what you are saying, in that German sedans are so utilitarian in their design, that could turn some people away, especially those used to driving Fords or Chevys looking to move into the entry lux segment. But small luxury segment hasn't had an American car in it for 20 years and has been growing and thriving. I don't know if the American factor really helps much, there are a lot of import car buyers that still won't consider an American car.

How they go about the refinement issue will be interesting, because the BMW inline 6 is the best in the world, that is a fantastic engine.

[Justin Bimmer]

I think the ATS will have looks and features with a good value. These things will bring people into the dealership to at least try the car. The Cimmarron had nothing. Nobody went to a Cadillac dealer to see one of those other than to point and laugh at it.

[ocnblu]

Surprise, surprise, smk mentions the dreaded "C" word, perpetuating a decades-old joke. ha. ha. Good one.

[hyperv6]

Cadillac can't just be about big V8s and supercharged motors and how they have to lead on technology and refinement.

This is what GM has been hinting at for a while. MAny just assume they will just slap a CTS V engine in this and let her rip. I just don't see that.

I see drivetrains that we have yet to see pop up here and I see technologies that GM has to first show up here. GM has proven with new magnetic adjustable struts that they can make things that other don't have and want. How many MFG has GM sold these too now? Ferrari was all over them right after they showed up on the Corvette and the ZL1 will have them soon. Tech like this will be showcased here as Cadillac used to do in the old days and it will be stuff people will want to pay more for.

Also the technology they will bring will be ready for the market unlike things like the 8-6-4 that was no were ready to go production.

I expect the Omega based car will get a V8 and Twin Turbo V6 but the V8 will be limited to only a few sub models. I just hope they do continue to use the Chevy V8 they trim the engine and tune to Cadillac only versions and make them something you can't get in a Camaro. While it is great the Camaro is getting the CTSv engine it hurts the CTSV image.

It hurts it in the way like my HHR has a ZR1 steering wheel. While it is cool I have the same wheel in my cheap Chevy it presents a poor image of a much higer priced car. Lets face it the cost was small to make this rught. At least they will address it soon.

[ocnblu]

I don't agree. I don't think it hurts the CTS-V's image one bit.

[hyperv6]

I don't agree. I don't think it hurts the CTS-V's image one bit.

You are not the kind of person GM needs to convince Cadillac is worthy of the price. You like many of us are ok with the CTS V as it is. The fact is many people not GM fans don't feel the engine as powerful as it is lives up the their standards.

To gain non GM buyers GM must give these buyers what they expect in a car and more. The only way for Cadillac to grow is to take buyers from Benz, BMW, Jag and any other luxury car maker. What Cadillac has offered already was not enough so they need to ante up the stakes.

Edited September 11, 2011 by hyperv6

[riviera74]

You are not the kind of person GM needs to convince Cadillac is worthy of the price. You like many of us are ok with the CTS V as it is. The fact is many people not GM fans don't feel the engine as powerful as it is lives up the their standards.

To gain non GM buyers GM must give these buyers what they expect in a car and more. The only way for Cadillac to grow is to take buyers from Benz, BMW, Jag and any other luxury car maker. What Cadillac has offered already was not enough so they need to ante up the stakes.

Sad but true. Remember when GM felt that Cadillac did not have to compete against BMW and M-B? That led them to where they are now. Now Cadillac must be hyper aggressive in capturing market share with product. The Germans will not stand still; neither will Lexus or Jaguar.

[ocnblu]

Then I expect nothing less than 6 valves per cylinder and 4 camshafts per cylinder bank. Make it so!

[hyperv6]

Then I expect nothing less than 6 valves per cylinder and 4 camshafts per cylinder bank. Make it so!

See they are not tageting people like you that think a Swisher Sweet is the best damn Cigar. Cadillac is looking to target the La Gloira Cigar lovers. Yes they are both Cigar and they both burn the same but a Cuban is somthing people consider special and make folks willing to pay up to $20 each for them.

Cadillac needs the Delight factor as Bob Lutz puts it. When products are done correctly they bring great delight or pleasure. Cadillac needs to build cars people love and find great delight in. Delight is that cool factor and that thing about a car that projects it's image onto its owner. You will find most buyers of BMW and Benz do so because of the image the car projects and how it makes the owner look or feel. Few ever drive at a track or in triple digits and ever test the cars performance. Just knowing they can is all they care about.

A guy can get by just as well with a 2011 Impala but it just dose not fill his ego with delight nor does it wow the guys at the country club.

Buyers in this class want the best technology, the best performance and the best luxury. Quality is not as much of a issue here as witnessed the lack of it with major brands over the last few years. Like Bob said the more delight they find the more it make those little Squeaks and rattles vanish. How do you think cars like this get great owners ratings but often have many mechanical issues.

Think of it this way. A convertible normally makes for a very poor car. It lack support, leaks, creaks, rattles and has issues that a normal coupe never has. But the owner loves it so much when he puts the top down that all those issues are worth the extra trouble.

I think Bob knows what he is talking about. Any guy who can sell a premium 2 seat car with a folding top, no roll up windows and no outside door handles and little trunk understands customers wants in a premium car. Just try to sell a Sonic with no door handles a leaking roof and a hot cockpit.

Cars are all about wants and needs. Chevys are for needs when Cadillac is all about wants and excess. While the present CTSV is a really cool car it still lacks things as if it had what it needed people want they would not be buying other cars. GM and Cadillac are not going to slay Benz and BMW with the ATS or the next CTS or even the Omega. But the goal of each of these models is to take more customers with each line and each generations. We have heard the saying death by a 1,000 paper cuts well that is what we are looking at here. BMW and Benz did not take Cadillac over night or with just one model to think GM would would be foolish.

It is like the old pushrod DOHC argument. Yes the pushrod is great but it just does not have the same image or technical image many in this class look for. The same could have been said for the Cadillac V16. Yes the V8 was all it ever needed, It has less parts and is cheaper to build. But what car did someone buy when they wanted to make a statment about who they are and what power they held?

I just wish GM could do an engine for Cadillac that it did not have to share. I know the cost is a factor but it could really boost their image with something really advanced and special.

To beat the others GM needs to best them in technology and image. These new models will grow the image.

[ocnblu]

No, you're right, they are not "tageting" me (?)

I don't smoke.

Do you think the M-B or BMW buyer will think twice when all he can see are those two red blades disappearing into the night while his precious, multi-cam wonder makes noise but cannot keep up with the Cadillac with the Corvette engine?

[balthazar]

Buyers these days are heinously ignorant of engine technology. BMW owners never pop their hoods, rapping at the giant plastic engine shrouds, explaining the invisible double-humpity-hump-hump cams. The OVERWHELMING majority buy on reputation & image, not intangible mechanical bits. This is not to say it doesn't play a minor, periphery influence, but it doesn't sell cars in & of itself. Ocnblu is right; results trump the spec sheet, because at least that is tangible.... tho this takes time to manifest itself in blind loyalty. In other words, the majority of buyers here are buying a "BMW", not a 'DOHC, VVT inline 6'. Look no further for verification than the 75% of 1-series buyers (and 40% of 3-series buyers) whom BMW themselves admitted bought their car for it's FWD technology.

[PurdueGuy]

No, you're right, they are not "tageting" me (?)

I don't smoke.

Do you think the M-B or BMW buyer will think twice when all he can see are those two red blades disappearing into the night while his precious, multi-cam wonder makes noise but cannot keep up with the Cadillac with the Corvette engine?

I think the M-B or BMW owner will just tell himself it doesn't matter, because his or her car is more refined, etc. Doesn't matter if they have never sat in or driven a Cadillac to know if it's refined or not.

[CSpec]

Somehow I doubt that GM (which has no money) has the right engine strategy when not one other luxury marque (flush with cash) agrees.

[hyperv6]

No, you're right, they are not "tageting" me (?)

I don't smoke.

Do you think the M-B or BMW buyer will think twice when all he can see are those two red blades disappearing into the night while his precious, multi-cam wonder makes noise but cannot keep up with the Cadillac with the Corvette engine?

The CTSV Does that now and you you see all them people flocking to Cadillac to make thme #1 don't you?

GM has the results and from what I see styling all going in the tight direction but they lack leading technology. It is like the AMG and M series cars you see Clarkson pointing out the crazy stupid bottons on the steering wheel to all sorts of thing to get the stig around the track.

Many here underestimate people in this class. While they may not be able to point out the exact location of a part on the engine they can still tell you all the electronic aids they have to put the power to the ground. Their hands may not be dirty but they do read up on what they buy.

The Fact is Cadillac still has more work to do. If they plan to do a Flagship they really have a lot of work to do. I get the feeling we will see a influx of technology soon that many here just don't expect in a GM product. Marks words are telling and GM now has the money to compete. Lets face it the CTS was done when they had to make do with what they had. They did a good job but it was not enough yet. More HP is not the answer.

It takes Styling, Quality, Performance, and Technology in this class. Each have to come in excess as that is what all these cars in this class are about. Many owners understand each while others don/t but they all know they have the best when they buy it.

Even in this day and age Results msy not even be enough for even just a Chevy.

Marketing sells and the guy who can convince he has the best and most wins. Like stated many may not know what they have and I know most never drive or use the technology they own but the fact they have it feeds the ego. Cadillac has a lot going for it but it still has not gained that factor for many that says hey I drive a Cadillac.

Edited September 12, 2011 by hyperv6

[dwightlooi]

Two things stood out to me, first was about starting from scratch on a fresh slate. Secondly that Cadillac can't just be about big V8s and supercharged motors and how they have to lead on technology and refinement. I think both are important for this car and the Omega car.

Everyone always says their car has fantastic ride and handling, so I expected him to say that. But starting from scratch and putting refinement over big V8s are a bit different from GM, so I at least get the feeling that they understand the segment.

Well, first of all, big V8s and supercharged motors do not necessarily have to be behind on technology or refinement. In fact, if you compare today's GM Pushrod 6.2 V8s with most DOHC V8s in the 4.6~5.5 liter class, they are neither less refined nor inferior in performance or fuel economy. The next generation will bring with it Direct Injection, Variable timing and cylinder deactivation -- all the technological goodies that some DOHC engines enjoy over the current crop of Smallblock V8s.

An interesting development will be a reverse flow Pushrod V8 with a single turbo nestled in the valley of the engine. This is interesting for two reasons. The first being that a single large turbo is more efficient than two smaller ones. The second being that it is also cheaper, as well as neater in terms of intercooler and intake plumbing. Such as engine, using a state of the art turbo like the ball-bearing Honeywell-Garrett GTX3582R will be capable of about 650 hp @ 6200 rpm along with an extremely linear 550lb-ft @ 2200~6200 rpm torque band.

[ocnblu]

SWEET Dwight!

Hyper, you mention "quality" as one of the things people in this class aspire to. M-B and BMW... and Audi, are not known for being bulletproof. They are very nice cars to look at and drive... but not to live with on a longterm basis. Dare I say that Cadillac is at the very least already more than a match for M-B and BMW quality over the typical lease term, and if the car is purchased, not leased over a short term, I'd put money on the Cadillac costing less to own in repairs and maintenance over 5-10 years of ownership.

M-B and BMW customers do not care as much about quality as they do about image... lucky for M-B and BMW.

[smk4565]

SWEET Dwight!

Hyper, you mention "quality" as one of the things people in this class aspire to. M-B and BMW... and Audi, are not known for being bulletproof. They are very nice cars to look at and drive... but not to live with on a longterm basis. Dare I say that Cadillac is at the very least already more than a match for M-B and BMW quality over the typical lease term, and if the car is purchased, not leased over a short term, I'd put money on the Cadillac costing less to own in repairs and maintenance over 5-10 years of ownership.

M-B and BMW customers do not care as much about quality as they do about image... lucky for M-B and BMW.

I think it depends on what you call quality. JD Power sees quality/reliability as fewest repairs, and in this case a Camry does great and a BMW maybe not so well. But if looking at how long a car will last, I think German cars do very well. Not only do the engines last, but the leather and interior trim pieces hold up well over time because they are using high grade materials to begin with. This is where Cadillac has to get better, Cadillac is probably doing just fine in keeping repair costs down. Cadillac may already beat BMW and Mercedes in repair costs, but BMW and Mercedes still whoop them in sales.

I'll put my personal story into this. I got my Aurora with 26k miles on it 8 years ago. Now it has 135k miles, I've been good with all the maintenance on it, the engine still runs very well, although it does burn about 2 quarts of oil in between oil changes. But on that car I've had to have 3 power windows repaired, 3 engine mounts replaced, 2 wheels because they leak (and the 2 originals are leaking now) torque converter and obviously shocks/struts and tie rods which I expect after 100k miles on Pittsburgh's pothole filled roads. It hasn't been a cheap car to maintain. But what annoys me most is the headliner on the sliding sun roof cover is peeling back and falling off, and I don't even open or close it often. I just get the feeling when they built that car, they didn't built it to last more than 10 years. I still get that feeling from GM cars, they they aren't really built for the long haul.

Even the calendar in my car stops around 2020, I mean didn't they think the car might last more than 20 years?

[Lamar]

I'll put my personal story into this. I got my Aurora with 26k miles on it 8 years ago. Now it has 135k miles, I've been good with all the maintenance on it, the engine still runs very well, although it does burn about 2 quarts of oil in between oil changes. But on that car I've had to have 3 power windows repaired, 3 engine mounts replaced, 2 wheels because they leak (and the 2 originals are leaking now) torque converter and obviously shocks/struts and tie rods which I expect after 100k miles on Pittsburgh's pothole filled roads. It hasn't been a cheap car to maintain. But what annoys me most is the headliner on the sliding sun roof cover is peeling back and falling off, and I don't even open or close it often. I just get the feeling when they built that car, they didn't built it to last more than 10 years. I still get that feeling from GM cars, they they aren't really built for the long haul.

Even the calendar in my car stops around 2020, I mean didn't they think the car might last more than 20 years?

Man, I hear you. I deal with many of those similar issues in my Bonneville. Especially those window regulators.

But I have to believe that GM has learned from the corners they cut a decade ago. They pretty much have had no choice.

[hyperv6]

SWEET Dwight!

Hyper, you mention "quality" as one of the things people in this class aspire to. M-B and BMW... and Audi, are not known for being bulletproof. They are very nice cars to look at and drive... but not to live with on a longterm basis. Dare I say that Cadillac is at the very least already more than a match for M-B and BMW quality over the typical lease term, and if the car is purchased, not leased over a short term, I'd put money on the Cadillac costing less to own in repairs and maintenance over 5-10 years of ownership.

M-B and BMW customers do not care as much about quality as they do about image... lucky for M-B and BMW.

BM and BMW have never really been as good as many give credit to for Quality, God know I have had to fix some really f'd up stuff on both. Cadillac on the other hand was much worse and today are as good or better. They even show it in the ratings.

the real issue is precieved quality. It is like Toyota for years people give them ore credit thant they should have gotten. In this case Cadillac does not get enough credit.

With products it is not so much how good you are but how good people think you are.

[Drew Dowdell]

Do you think the M-B or BMW buyer will think twice when all he can see are those two red blades disappearing into the night while his precious, multi-cam wonder makes noise but cannot keep up with the Cadillac with the Corvette engine?

this.

[Drew Dowdell]

I think it depends on what you call quality. JD Power sees quality/reliability as fewest repairs, and in this case a Camry does great and a BMW maybe not so well. But if looking at how long a car will last, I think German cars do very well. Not only do the engines last, but the leather and interior trim pieces hold up well over time because they are using high grade materials to begin with.

LULZ!

That's why there is the saying "Never own a BMW that isn't under warranty!". Ask Nick about his 5-series..... VW's are atrocious with all kinda interior bits falling off. My ex's Passat had a smooth engine that ran well... but the rest of the car fell apart around it.

[Camino LS6]

The perceived demand among luxury car buyers for DOHC is a myth perpetuated by automotive hacks.

It is a non-issue.

[Robert Hall]

I think it depends on what you call quality. JD Power sees quality/reliability as fewest repairs, and in this case a Camry does great and a BMW maybe not so well. But if looking at how long a car will last, I think German cars do very well. Not only do the engines last, but the leather and interior trim pieces hold up well over time because they are using high grade materials to begin with.

LULZ!

That's why there is the saying "Never own a BMW that isn't under warranty!". Ask Nick about his 5-series..... VW's are atrocious with all kinda interior bits falling off. My ex's Passat had a smooth engine that ran well... but the rest of the car fell apart around it.

I think the key to happiness w/ BMWs or other German cars is the 3 yr lease. Drive it a few years then get another one. That's what friends of mine do that have BMWs and Benzes. That way you never have to deal w/ expensive out-of-warranty issues.

[Drew Dowdell]

I think it depends on what you call quality. JD Power sees quality/reliability as fewest repairs, and in this case a Camry does great and a BMW maybe not so well. But if looking at how long a car will last, I think German cars do very well. Not only do the engines last, but the leather and interior trim pieces hold up well over time because they are using high grade materials to begin with.

LULZ!

That's why there is the saying "Never own a BMW that isn't under warranty!". Ask Nick about his 5-series..... VW's are atrocious with all kinda interior bits falling off. My ex's Passat had a smooth engine that ran well... but the rest of the car fell apart around it.

I think the key to happiness w/ BMWs or other German cars is the 3 yr lease. Drive it a few years then get another one. That's what friends of mine do that have BMWs and Benzes. That way you never have to deal w/ expensive out-of-warranty issues.

So even if Cadillac builds to a more durable standard (and I submit that they already do), it still won't matter.

[Robert Hall]

So even if Cadillac builds to a more durable standard (and I submit that they already do), it still won't matter.

The ATS will need good marketing. That will be important to bringing in new customers...

[hyperv6]

The perceived demand among luxury car buyers for DOHC is a myth perpetuated by automotive hacks.

It is a non-issue.

So say you.

Many here are too close to the auto industry to really see what the unwash massed believe. We know the truth on many things but these idiots Hemm Customers pay more for thinks like E3 plugs and other things that cost more and do nothing.

Many here predicted failure of the sale of the Ecoboost DOHC V6 Turbo, a very unpickup like engine. Today people taking them as soon as the dealer gets one and paying not only a grand more than thre V8 but also near or full sticker.

Chevy would be doing good if they could move 20% of their trucks with a V6 let alone near 50%.

Never underestimate what the public will demand or think is best.

As long as you offer a Chevy engine in a Cadillac it is just another GM engine. I am not sure how they will do it but they really need their own power plant that only they will have. It should not be found in a Camaro or a pick up.

While the Nstar was not a perfect engine it did a lot for Cadillacs image vs the 307 Olds or the 4.9 boat anchor.

GM needs to sell Cadillacs to people who don't care about GM now and really never would want a Chevy.

[hyperv6]

I think it depends on what you call quality. JD Power sees quality/reliability as fewest repairs, and in this case a Camry does great and a BMW maybe not so well. But if looking at how long a car will last, I think German cars do very well. Not only do the engines last, but the leather and interior trim pieces hold up well over time because they are using high grade materials to begin with.

LULZ!

That's why there is the saying "Never own a BMW that isn't under warranty!". Ask Nick about his 5-series..... VW's are atrocious with all kinda interior bits falling off. My ex's Passat had a smooth engine that ran well... but the rest of the car fell apart around it.

I think the key to happiness w/ BMWs or other German cars is the 3 yr lease. Drive it a few years then get another one. That's what friends of mine do that have BMWs and Benzes. That way you never have to deal w/ expensive out-of-warranty issues.

So even if Cadillac builds to a more durable standard (and I submit that they already do, it still won't matter.

They already do have what I consider a more durable car and it does not matter as many in this class feel they are not as good and the image is less than the others.

Many in this class think that if you drive a Cadillac you are either cheap or can't afford the German car.

Cadillac did have a Beer image in a champagne class. They are working out of it but still have work to do. You have to earn image.

The real joke is how many year BMW owners had tool kits in their trunk. They thought it an badge of honnor and a added touch when the truth is they needed it to keep it running. PRECEPTION COUNTS!

One thing we all need to remember here. Dan Akersons goal is to restore Cadillac to world standard again. He even went to the lenghts of bringin Bob Lutz back with out asking him to leave Lotus. GM is really for once serious on Cadillac and we will soon start to see the real results in the next few years. The ATS is only the first shot and an entry level one at that. As the new cars come and the prices climb we will see a level of Cadillac we have not seen in decades.

[smk4565]

Man, I hear you. I deal with many of those similar issues in my Bonneville. Especially those window regulators.

But I have to believe that GM has learned from the corners they cut a decade ago. They pretty much have had no choice.

I've had both rear window regulators replaced. The front window broke for a different reason that I forget. And my car has 3 engine mounts, I have replaced all 3, and the mechanics say that the V8 lifts because of the torque and it bends the mounts until they break. Why didn't GM make a stronger mount then? I had to replace the AC compressor last year also, my second GM car in a row that had that break.

I hope they have learned from these quality problems, because I like my car, but with the maintenance record I have had with it, I am hesitant to consider another GM car.

[smk4565]

Many in this class think that if you drive a Cadillac you are either cheap or can't afford the German car.

GM is really for once serious on Cadillac and we will soon start to see the real results in the next few years. The ATS is only the first shot and an entry level one at that.

As the new cars come and the prices climb we will see a level of Cadillac we have not seen in decades.

On the first statement I would agree. It goes beyond the price to image also, a German car has the image of more sophistication (the wine, cheese, and opera crowd), a Cadillac is for old people in Florida or gangsters.

Point 2 I am not sure of yet. If GM was so serious, why the front drive vehicles with Chevy underpinnings. GM said they were serious on Cadillac in 2003 when the first CTS came out, and it would be followed by a more rear drivers to fight the Germans, and 8 years later the STS, SRX (rwd) and XLR are in the graveyard. So I remain skeptical that Cadillac is for real serious this time.

On the 3rd point, I hope you are correct and Cadillac gets back to the Standard of the World. But as I said, I am not convinced yet. The ATS is step one and it is going after a legend so it better be good.

Edited September 17, 2011 by smk4565

[Drew Dowdell]

Many in this class think that if you drive a Cadillac you are either cheap or can't afford the German car.

GM is really for once serious on Cadillac and we will soon start to see the real results in the next few years. The ATS is only the first shot and an entry level one at that.

As the new cars come and the prices climb we will see a level of Cadillac we have not seen in decades.

On the first statement I would agree. It goes beyond the price to image also, a German car has the image of more sophistication (the wine, cheese, and opera crowd), a Cadillac is for old people in Florida or gangsters.

Point 2 I am not sure of yet. If GM was so serious, why the front drive vehicles with Chevy underpinnings. GM said they were serious on Cadillac in 2003 when the first CTS came out, and it would be followed by a more rear drivers to fight the Germans, and 8 years later the STS, SRX (rwd) and XLR are in the graveyard. So I remain skeptical that Cadillac is for real serious this time.

On the 3rd point, I hope you are correct and Cadillac gets back to the Standard of the World. But as I said, I am not convinced yet. The ATS is step one and it is going after a legend so it better be good.

RWD is not the panacea it once was. Quite soon every single major luxury player will have a FWD vehicle for sale. So unless you are implying that BMW, Infiniti, and Mercedes "aren't serious" then you cannot apply that term to Cadillac.

You may not like the current SRX, but you have to admit that it is still outselling the German imports at the same price point. There aren't any major incentives going on the SRX for it to move that volume... even with the questionable 3.0 and 2.8T, Cadillac was moving each and every one. Cadillac simplifying the lineup by consolidating onto the 300hp 3.6 instead will only improve the vehicle AND improve the profits for Cadillac. By every single objective measure, Cadillac is outperforming BMW, Mercedes, Audi, Infiniti, and Acura in this segment. People are clearly happy with their purchases or there would be a well stocked inventory of used SRXes out there. There isn't one. At some point SMK, you will have to admit that Cadillac was right and that you were wrong.

In the case of the SRX, it is quickly becoming the car for Suburban well-to-dos. The CTS is the same. Nearly every new CTS I see is being driven by a 35-55yo white guy in a tie.

And as if sent from heaven, and example of the superior German technology broke down in front of my house this morning. The guys are on the phone waiting for BMW roadside assistance to come pick up the car. I don't know what's wrong with it, but it sounds awful when they try to start it and it won't stay running for more than a minute.

[Robert Hall]

Many in this class think that if you drive a Cadillac you are either cheap or can't afford the German car.

GM is really for once serious on Cadillac and we will soon start to see the real results in the next few years. The ATS is only the first shot and an entry level one at that.

As the new cars come and the prices climb we will see a level of Cadillac we have not seen in decades.

On the first statement I would agree. It goes beyond the price to image also, a German car has the image of more sophistication (the wine, cheese, and opera crowd), a Cadillac is for old people in Florida or gangsters.

Point 2 I am not sure of yet. If GM was so serious, why the front drive vehicles with Chevy underpinnings. GM said they were serious on Cadillac in 2003 when the first CTS came out, and it would be followed by a more rear drivers to fight the Germans, and 8 years later the STS, SRX (rwd) and XLR are in the graveyard. So I remain skeptical that Cadillac is for real serious this time.

On the 3rd point, I hope you are correct and Cadillac gets back to the Standard of the World. But as I said, I am not convinced yet. The ATS is step one and it is going after a legend so it better be good.

RWD is not the panacea it once was. Quite soon every single major luxury player will have a FWD vehicle for sale. So unless you are implying that BMW, Infiniti, and Mercedes "aren't serious" then you cannot apply that term to Cadillac.

The difference is BMW and MB will be using FWD only on the cheap entry-level stuff...the good stuff remains RWD.

[Potluck]

Many in this class think that if you drive a Cadillac you are either cheap or can't afford the German car.

GM is really for once serious on Cadillac and we will soon start to see the real results in the next few years. The ATS is only the first shot and an entry level one at that.

As the new cars come and the prices climb we will see a level of Cadillac we have not seen in decades.

On the first statement I would agree. It goes beyond the price to image also, a German car has the image of more sophistication (the wine, cheese, and opera crowd), a Cadillac is for old people in Florida or gangsters.

Point 2 I am not sure of yet. If GM was so serious, why the front drive vehicles with Chevy underpinnings. GM said they were serious on Cadillac in 2003 when the first CTS came out, and it would be followed by a more rear drivers to fight the Germans, and 8 years later the STS, SRX (rwd) and XLR are in the graveyard. So I remain skeptical that Cadillac is for real serious this time.

On the 3rd point, I hope you are correct and Cadillac gets back to the Standard of the World. But as I said, I am not convinced yet. The ATS is step one and it is going after a legend so it better be good.

RWD is not the panacea it once was. Quite soon every single major luxury player will have a FWD vehicle for sale. So unless you are implying that BMW, Infiniti, and Mercedes "aren't serious" then you cannot apply that term to Cadillac.

The difference is BMW and MB will be using FWD only on the cheap entry-level stuff...the good stuff remains RWD.

$32,000 for a B-class ain't cheap.