1984 Celebrity drum brakes eaten by cancer

[Dsuupr]

So yesterday I dropped my beloved Marie (1984 Celebrity wagon) off at the Chevy dealer because she was making a grinding sound as if her brakes had gone bad. Upon inspection they noted that the entire rear drum brakes had fallen apart due to age and cancer. They are unable to locate replacements and at this point she is labeled undriveable. I am friends with the owner of the dealer and have full confidence in them telling me the truth, have had no luck finding the part myself, don't want junk yard parts as they will only have the same problem and love the car to much just to give up on her.

Anybody have ideas on how to get new parts for the old car? Maybe converting her to all disc brakes or ?? Keep in mind that it is the ENTIRE drum braking system that must be replaced.

Thanks for anyone who can help!

Edited May 18, 2011 by Dsuupr

[Robert Hall]

Wierd they can't find parts...would think a brake shop (local or a chain like Brakes Plus) would be able to find them...would think it would be the same parts as used on the Ciera which ran through '96 (same platform)> The dealer probably just doesn't want to put any time and effort on something so old.

[z28luvr01]

Go to a u-pull-it junkyard, find yourself a GM A-body, and call it a day.

[Dsuupr]

Wierd they can't find parts...would think a brake shop (local or a chain like Brakes Plus) would be able to find them...would think it would be the same parts as used on the Ciera which ran through '96 (same platform)> The dealer probably just doesn't want to put any time and effort on something so old.

These guys have no reason not to fix it. This is the only place I take my cars to be fixed and like I stated, I am friends with the owner. I have bought more than a 1/2 dozen vehicles from them plus I send them a new customer multiple times per year.

Go to a u-pull-it junkyard, find yourself a GM A-body, and call it a day.

They all tend to be falling apart at the same places. Getting the old parts might buy me a year, possibly two, but will not ultimately solve the problem.

Edited May 18, 2011 by Dsuupr

[loki]

upgrade to discs? hahah.. what would that be, like a couple $100? awwww

[Drew Dowdell]

What part is rusted? check out RockAuto.com There is no way the parts aren't available. There are still lots of A-bodies out there.

[SAmadei]

These guys have no reason not to fix it. This is the only place I take my cars to be fixed and like I stated, I am friends with the owner. I have bought more than a 1/2 dozen vehicles from them plus I send them a new customer multiple times per year.

Still, its a dealer coping with a vehicle 27 years old. Dealers do not do well with older cars.

I would guess that they looked up the parts in the GM inventory system and came up with a blank... because GM really does not have a source of parts for it if the OEM stuff is gone and GM didn't bother having more built... this is nothing new to us with lots of old cars. You can't usually get OEM sheetmetal for older cars from the dealership, for example, regardless of popularity, because once GM stops listing it, it don't exist... even if there are 20 companies that have licensed it to make reproductions.

Take it to a good mechanic and find out exactly what parts you need. Most drum brake parts are heavy enough that it does not really rust out. I have to assume they are having trouble getting the "brake hardware kit"... the springs and retainers... they are small parts and break fairly easily once rust sets in. Only other brake parts that rust out are steel lines or the braking brake cable. Drums, shoes, backing plate, slave cylinder all generally don't rust away (unless the car is spending time at the bottom of the Atlantic Ocean).

My Autozone is listing...

Drum 33.99

Shoes 16.99

All-in-one Hardware Kit 8.99

Adjusting screw assembly 9.99

Brake hose 9.99

Wheel Cylinder 10.99

Granted a few of those are special orders, but at least in NJ, special orders have been fast and no problem.

The only things left at that point are the backing plate and parking brake line. Those could be somewhat hard to find. Backing plate would be a junkyard thing, IF your freakishly rotted out.

Speaking of junkyard parts... unless we are talking about parts that are explicitly replaceable, like shoes or pads, you can always find some junkyard parts that are fine. Every car ages differently, and I've pulled delicate, pristine parts off cars that were so damaged I questioned why they even wasted space in the pick-a-part.

Failing everything else, let me know if there are a few parts you need and I will steal them off my '83 Celebrity, as its unused and likely a future Hyundai.

[SAmadei]

Anybody have ideas on how to get new parts for the old car? Maybe converting her to all disc brakes or ?? Keep in mind that it is the ENTIRE drum braking system that must be replaced.

Converting Marie to front rear disc brakes would be a real PITA, most likely. I don't remember offhand which FWD A-bodies had rear disc brakes, but assuming we track that down, you would be needing to swap out everything from the backing plates outward, the master cylinder and the proportioning valve. You'd certainly be going the junkyard path to get the parts... and in the end you'd have a car with really hard to find parts (A-bodies were probably 95% drum, >5% disc) and barely better brakes.

In the end, drum brakes are not that awful, especially in the rear. Thats why there are still cars being built with them... to every automotive writer's horror.

Edited May 18, 2011 by SAmadei

[Drew Dowdell]

I don't think it has front drums brakes.

[SAmadei]

I don't think it has front drums brakes.

They most definitely didn't. That was a typo from shuffling some text around.

You didn't catch my funnier typo where I didn't know which FWD A-bodies had rear brakes. :-P

Edited May 18, 2011 by SAmadei

[Dsuupr]

Still, its a dealer coping with a vehicle 27 years old. Dealers do not do well with older cars.

The only things left at that point are the backing plate and parking brake line. Those could be somewhat hard to find. Backing plate would be a junkyard thing, IF your freakishly rotted out.

Speaking of junkyard parts... unless we are talking about parts that are explicitly replaceable, like shoes or pads, you can always find some junkyard parts that are fine. Every car ages differently, and I've pulled delicate, pristine parts off cars that were so damaged I questioned why they even wasted space in the pick-a-part.

Failing everything else, let me know if there are a few parts you need and I will steal them off my '83 Celebrity, as its unused and likely a future Hyundai.

They called Autozone, all possible suppliers, etc. They went down the list of people they called. Like I said, this is not your everyday dealership. They did state I could scour the internet and if one was found they would install it.

It is the backing plate that has given way of which RockAuto does not show available.

Edited May 18, 2011 by Dsuupr

[Robert Hall]

I don't think it has front drums brakes.

They most definitely didn't. That was a typo from shuffling some text around.

You didn't catch my funnier typo where I didn't know which FWD A-bodies had rear brakes. :-P

I saw that one...thought maybe you were thinking of the mythical '82 Celebrity Scooter which was the stripped down model w/ vinyl seats, 3spd column shift manual, and no rear brakes..

Anyhoo, all joking aside, I can't recall the last time I saw a Celebrity wagon on the road..pretty scarce.

Edited May 18, 2011 by Cubical-aka-Moltar

[SAmadei]

They called Autozone, all possible suppliers, etc. They went down the list of people they called. Like I said, this is not your everyday dealership. They did state I could scour the internet and if one was found they would install it.

It is the backing plate that has given way of which RockAuto does not show available.

Yeah, I thought nobody would be making reproduction backing plates. Turns out Dorman is making backing plates, but not one for the Celebrity. Maybe they will in the future... there are a LOT of A-bodies out there. It was a pleasant surprise to see that '78-'92 backing plates are make for GM RWD intermediates, at least.

You are clearly in the realm of the pick-a-part.

Hollander seems to list your rear brakes as part 1190B... the interchange is a bit confusing, vast and I'm unclear just how much actually interchanges beyond the drums... but it look like you have a pretty good chance of being able to get a backing plate from '84-'92 A-bodies (6000, Celebrity, Century, Ciera)... this likely extends to '96 for Century and Ciera, but my Hollander cuts off at 1990 and info into the '90s is incomplete. It also appears that GM used these brakes on early C/H-bodies (up to '93)... LeSabre, Electra, Park Avenue, Bonneville, 88, 98... and the '90-'93 U-vans... Silhouette, Lumina, Trans Sport... and finally some FWD Cadillacs from '85-93.

I would take the backing plate with me and eye-ball the parts... hit the newer A-bods first, especially wagons.

Unfortunately, the backing plate on my '83 Celebrity coupe uses the 100mm bolt circle (your wagon is 115), and so the baking plates are likely different. It looks like GM started using the 115 on wagons first, then across the board.

I have cars with 45+ years of rust on them, and the backing plates were still thick enough to function fine. In fact, I don't think I've ever seen one rot out... surprising here in the land of salt, salt and more salt... so I feel you will find a useable one in the yards that will give you years of use. worst case scenario, start calling the yards in the south west.

Edited May 18, 2011 by SAmadei

[Drew Dowdell]

Did any of the A-bodies have rear disk? I bet you could find all the parts needed to swap to that.

[SAmadei]

Did any of the A-bodies have rear disk? I bet you could find all the parts needed to swap to that.

I'll take that bet. Only the 6000 appears to have ever had rear discs... '84-'86 is one type... 2075... '87-'88 is one type... 2103 '88 and '89 (AWD only) is 2120... and all three are unique to ONLY the 6000. I would say these are rare as hens teeth... though Autozone is showing listings for the replaceable parts, you would still need the backing plate. Luckily, the beam axles are interchangeable... so you only apparently need the brake parts.

These are all likely STEs. Even the late Cieras and Centurys were all drums.

Master Cylinder is actually the same as the drum cars in '84-'86 non ABS... 753B... but in '86-'89 ABS 6000's the master cylinder is unique... part 891. Hopefully, this would be a stand alone ABS system. In either case, I have no listings for proportioning valves, so that would likely need to be grabbed from the donor car. There also may be some sort of add-on residual pressure valve on the 753B master cylinder. Drum MCs usually do not work on drum/disc without some slight modification.

Again, I don't think they would help performance enough to make up for the parts rarity or hassle.

[Drew Dowdell]

ah, I was just looking for another way out.

[SAmadei]

ah, I was just looking for another way out.

I hear ya. Its just when you hear A-body rear discs referred to as 'unicorns', you can put that dream on hold. LOL.

Its interesting how the A-body parts (which were based on X-body parts 8-0) funnel into H-bodies and U-vans. In fact, there is some research being done by A-body enthusiasts to use '05 U-van disc brakes on the older A-bodies, as the beam axle and its bearings seem to fit. You don't want the '06-08 U-vans, as they have 6 lugs.

Of course, I hear this and start thinking about converting my Celeb coupe into a modern V6 powered AWD beast. ;-)

[daves87rs]

What part is rusted? check out RockAuto.com There is no way the parts aren't available. There are still lots of A-bodies out there.

+q

[SAmadei]

They couldn't have scoured that hard, I found them at Autozone: http://www.autozone....omString=search

That's not a backing plate.

[Dsuupr]

I ended up with a new Cruze Eco (pictures to be posted later). I will spend time looking for the part and am now open to looking at a junk yard since I don't have to rely on the car to be my daily driver.

[Drew Dowdell]

I'm gonna get a link from a friend that might help.