Legalizing Pot

[usonia]

There are rumblings in various states about legalizing pot. I think it's only a matter of time before it happens nationwide. So, I'm just curious, if pot becomes legal and generally available, would you start using it if you don't already? If you already use pot, would you use it more?

I tried it a couple of times in college and didn't like how it affected me. I say legalize it if they want, but I won't be using it.

[loki]

it only takes a look at the alcohol prohibition of the early 1900's to realize how drug prohibition is the same in it's effects, black market, violence, prison population skyrocketing, the cost to enforce such policies.

if it is legalized it will most likely be treated like cigarettes, tax hikes of ~50%+ every other year...which will lead back to the problems of prohibition.

[frogger]

It makes sense from a tax revenue standpoint from all the growers and sellers. I'll continue enjoy it at the same pace every few weeks or so either way since its so easy to acquire here and its never given me a hangover. Its also easy to use incognito when out at an outdoor concert or camping (like baked into homegrown granola etc). That's the scary part, you can pop a couple THC pills (the part that gets you high) like vitamins, its almost too easy/quick. I'll never go back to smoking it.

If it does happen I hope the costs don't escalate above those of alcohol (which is heavily taxed up here).

[Blake Noble]

If I had to make a guess, I'd say California and, yep, Kentucky will probably be among the first states to legalize it and tax it.

Honestly, smoking pot isn't any worse for you than drinking beer.

I've smoked my share, mostly over the course of the summer break (a little over 2 months) between my junior and senior year of high school. If I had to make a guess, I managed to smoke a least a pound of pot, in social settings, to myself, whatever. It was fun for a while, then I had far too many close calls getting into deep shit with it, not to mention buying it illegally just plain sucks. I ultimately quit and generally stay away from it.

Edited July 14, 2010 by whiteknight

[Intrepidation]

I suppose it would be great news for those are into that sort of thing. But hey, I'd be all in favor of taxing the hell out of it.

I've got better things to do than waste my time, money, and life of such things.

[Blake Noble]

I suppose it would be great news for those who are weak willed and lacking in the IQ department.

Ha. No offense here Dodgefan, but you do not have any experience with using marijuana. The effect marijuana has on your health can be quite positive in certain aspects. I'd personally rather use it medicinally for a headache than Advil (too much of that stuff will kill your liver, FYI).

Additionally, pot and THC, the primary substance in pot, are not addictive. In fact, if you're smoking straight pot, there isn't much of a single addictive substance in it. So, you can quit the stuff at anytime and not have some sort of horrible withdrawal from it like you do with alcohol and cigarettes. I quit it cold turkey, no problems, even hung around a guy who would smoke it around me and could easily refuse it, no problem. Don't tell me it's addictive and smoking it makes you a junkie because if that were the case, I'd be stealing money to get a fix and I wouldn't be here talking about it.

I respect anyone's decision not to use pot, believe me. I don't advocate anyone trying to get a hold of a dime and trying it out. But people who use it are not "weak willed" or stupid. Would you call someone with terminal cancer using medicinal marijuana as a form of pain relief and as an appetite stimulant "weak willed"? That's really fairly ignorant of you to say. I might would agree with you if we were talking about cocaine, herion, or meth. Those three drugs are ultimately useless and have no redeeming values whatsoever.

Edited July 14, 2010 by whiteknight

[Intrepidation]

Because I'm sure the pot heads use it for medicinal purposes.

The of course there's the people who then "move up" from marijuana to the drugs you mentioned.

Experience using it? Nope. Experience with someone who uses it? You bet. And what a fine father he turned out to be.

Use it if you want, but keep that $h! far away from me.

[loki]

I might would agree with you if we were talking about cocaine, herion, or meth. Those three drugs are ultimately useless and have no redeeming values whatsoever.

from wiki "amphetimines"

In the United States, amphetamine and methamphetamine are Schedule II drugs, classified as CNS (central nervous system) stimulants.[70] A Schedule II drug is classified as one that has a high potential for abuse, has a currently-accepted medical use and is used under severe restrictions, and has a high possibility of severe psychological and physiological dependence.

stang might offer some insight on this subject.

i dont' advocate the use of any of this, but pot certainly has a lot of potential, and legalizing it would legalize hemp too (or it should). then we can start many industries back up to use hemp and replace more than a few things we currently use oil for, like nylon.

[Blake Noble]

Because I'm sure the pot heads use it for medicinal purposes.

... What? Clarify this statement and I'll get back with you.

The of course there's the people who then "move up" from marijuana to the drugs you mentioned.

This myth: busted?. I would be inclined to say so because this and other studies show that use of hardcore drugs by a user is not solely due to the fact that they smoked a joint on some given Tuesday in August. It's rooted in personal dysfunction, i.e. a person's psychology.

Experience using it? Nope. Experience with someone who uses it? You bet. And what a fine father he turned out to be.

Now this is something I will outright refuse to make a comment on out of respect to you.

Use it if you want, but keep that $h! far away from me.

Don't read outside or around the lines. As I said, I do not advocate anyone buying it or using it, especially under current circumstances.

I personally quit using it for a large number of reasons. The people you wind up mingling with are not people you want to hang out with everyday and other, far more serious drugs are in your face on numerous occasions. The people you are with, acquaintances or whatever, sometimes try to convince you to go "bolder".

I was content with just smoking pot, so refusing the heavier shit was easy for me.

As for why I tried it and started it, I had some major personal issues to resolve and I really think the times I managed to smoke it among friends or in a friendly, no worry setting in general helped me to resolve a lot of those issues and ultimately helped me be here today. I managed to just unwind and think about things and open up to myself and, if someone I called a friend was there, I could open up to them. I suppose that sounds stupid and I suppose it is. It was a way to "self-medicate" myself. Maybe that is weak or was a moment of weakness, who am I to judge? I personally don't think so, but whatever. I do, however, know that I am not out smoking crank, dealing drugs by phone, and trying to get a fix, so it is most certainly not a "gateway drug" and I think my experience ultimately helped me become a stronger person overall.

Edited July 14, 2010 by whiteknight

[Intrepidation]

See Point 3 to see why I made Point 1.

All that needs to be said is that, among other personal reasons, is why I have such a low opinion of it. No offense to you personally about what I said earlier. Like I said in my post, use it if you want, but keep it far away from me.

That's all I have to say in this thread.

[regfootball]

Because I'm sure the pot heads use it for medicinal purposes.

The of course there's the people who then "move up" from marijuana to the drugs you mentioned.

Experience using it? Nope. Experience with someone who uses it? You bet. And what a fine father he turned out to be.

Use it if you want, but keep that $h! far away from me.

i know a handful of potheads, they continue to enjoy being hooked on it. brain is mush, i guess its their choice.

rather counterproductive, addictive, expensive, and yes, it affects others in your life. generally they seem to place a greater importance on pot than moving up in the world.

i've found in a couple cases with the potheads its also a threat to their job.

pot is prob fine for the college years but once you get in your 30's and 40's it kind of seems ridiculous for someone to be a pothead. it's like, grow up already.

Edited July 14, 2010 by regfootball

[FAPTurbo]

I support legalization, if only for tax revenues. Ideally, corporations like Philip Morris will be the ones owning the market, as it'll be easier to regulate, like tobacco and alcohol.

The problem with pot is that growers and dealers will mix other drugs like PCP and ecstasy into the stuff making it very dangerous, and addictive. Additionally, the strains today are very strong. Of course, I live in the pot capital of North America, so this may not be the case elsewhere.

If this were to be implemented in my neck of the woods, the 'plan' I envision would be to raid every corner of the province, and take away the plants from growers while they are still illegal. Just make it a huge, massive, coordinated RCMP romp into every house with a big Hydro bill. Then, the best strains and plants would be auctioned off by the government to Big Tobacco, which would generate huge amounts of profits for the government coffers. It'll stunt 'private' growers, and the companies can get their product onto liquor store shelves complete with ample taxes on top of the 'cigs'. They may even find a way to get rid of the awful stench that comes with smoking it.

This is a huge financial windfall waiting to happen. It will put an end to a lot of petty criminals, and it may even curb the use of pot as well; it'll be easier to highlight the risks associated with its use, and people will be more willing to come forward admitting that they may have a problem.

[Blake Noble]

(Accidentally left this part out of my earlier post.)

But, as I said, I have nothing but respect for people who don't pick it up and don't use it and I don't advocate anyone buying it or trying it. You have every reason in the world to stay the hell away from it, Dodgefan.

I will, however, rebuke the "REEFER MADNESS" point of view simply because I think anyone who is going to make an educated opinion on this subject needs to know the dry and uncut facts. I'm tired of hearing the Mueller-style spin on things.

Edited July 14, 2010 by whiteknight

[frogger]

Is pothead worse than alcoholic??? I don't think so.

[Blake Noble]

i know a handful of potheads, they continue to enjoy being hooked on it. brain is mush, i guess its their choice.

"Hooked on it?" Yeah. No, not really.

If you smoke a metric ton of it, it will make you stupid, however. Then again, it's something you're not meant to smoke a metric ton of in the first place. If you use this stuff, you need to have a sense of moderation and responsibility. But people who are usually that burnt out somewhere along the way get the bright idea to pop pills in addition to smoking a QP a day. That's just the case with a self-destructive personality. People like that have a one-track mind and they're very hard to fix and they simply can't help themselves.

rather counterproductive, addictive, expensive, and yes, it affects others in your life. generally they seem to place a greater importance on pot than moving up in the world.

I managed to score a 31 on a practice ACT test (which was a previously used test that had been released as sample questions) in my senior English class stoned. Counterproductive? Yeah. Noooo.

My score sober was a 24. Of course, I ran out of time on the damn writing section and didn't even try on the math, but still.

Addictive? Yeah. No. Someone who uses it daily for 20 years should seek serious counciling besides self-counciling.

Expensive? I suppose considering what you get for 10 bucks, you're right.

i've found in a couple cases with the potheads its also a threat to their job.

See above.

Edited July 14, 2010 by whiteknight

[loki]

capt. since it's not the place to discuss it, i will only say your "plan" sounds like corporatism.

since pot became illegal, rolling your own cigarettes has pretty much become illegal too. making sure you have to buy them from P.M. and other corporations, and keeping tobacco farmers in stasis because the number of them is regulated through licenses and they are limited number. strangling, i mean helping (), the supply (farmers) and in some states taxing the hell out of it. is it different up there?

[FAPTurbo]

capt. since it's not the place to discuss it, i will only say your "plan" sounds like corporatism.

since pot became illegal, rolling your own cigarettes has pretty much become illegal too. making sure you have to buy them from P.M. and other corporations, and keeping tobacco farmers in stasis because the number of them is regulated through licenses and they are limited number. strangling, i mean helping (), the supply (farmers) and in some states taxing the hell out of it. is it different up there?

Eeeh, I suppose it is corporatism to an extent. Fortunately, that's not a terribly big deal in Canada compared to the US. In fact, during your prohibition, our provincial governments nationalized liquor distribution, which is still maintained today. It was deemed easier to manage, and generated profits. Heck, our federal government already grows marijuana for medicinal purposes; the seized goods could be used to set up a state-owned Crown Corporation for all I care; just get the situation under control, and make some money off of what amounts to be my province's second largest industry.

The RCMP already raids houses that are deemed to be grow-ops. The only real difference here is that the people of Canada, and tobacco/liquor corporations would stand to benefit financially, instead of the police showing off their spoils on TV and then burning it, or smoking it themselves.

[Camino LS6]

If this actually happens, it would be a welcome sign that the US is finally growing-up.

The illegality of pot is a symptom of infantile thinking becoming law and no one correcting the error for about eight decades.

I'll leave it there for now.

[ShadowDog]

Eeeh, I suppose it is corporatism to an extent. Fortunately, that's not a terribly big deal in Canada compared to the US. In fact, during your prohibition, our provincial governments nationalized liquor distribution, which is still maintained today. It was deemed easier to manage, and generated profits. Heck, our federal government already grows marijuana for medicinal purposes; the seized goods could be used to set up a state-owned Crown Corporation for all I care; just get the situation under control, and make some money off of what amounts to be my province's second largest industry.

The RCMP already raids houses that are deemed to be grow-ops. The only real difference here is that the people of Canada, and tobacco/liquor corporations would stand to benefit financially, instead of the police showing off their spoils on TV and then burning it, or smoking it themselves.

The two things I wonder worth fearing over would be whether the ingredients to a marketable fatty will be controlled? Or is big tobacco going to end up putting carcinogens and addictive components into them? The thought downright scares me.

My brother-in-law was part of the RCMP drug task force in our region of B.C. He's since been transferred twice, but the story is the same everywhere he goes, that the RCMP doesn't bother getting into the faces of producers or minor offenders unless there is potential for organized crime, gang warfare or danger to the community. He said simply that if the RCMP even had the resources to go after every producer from housing grow-ops to major outdoor, forested and irrigated harvesting system, B.C. would go broke. I mean, it's only the second largest economic driver of the province, next to forestry... which makes me wonder what it is now since forestry is in the toilet around here.

FWIW, the pot bonfires are impressive. As for the spoils, the best thing about busting grow-ops is enjoying all the freebie irrigation supplies to make the greenhouse make some seriously tasty veggies! Thanks pot-growers!

If this actually happens, it would be a welcome sign that the US is finally growing-up.

The illegality of pot is a symptom of infantile thinking becoming law and no one correcting the error for about eight decades.

I'll leave it there for now.

Definitely. It doesn't just stop with pot. The only reason this one seems to be so noteworthy is because of all the high profile controversy with regard to its benefits vs drawbacks.

I live in pot country here in B.C. - taking hikes in the forest and stumbling upon "hunters" with sawed off 12-gauge shotguns (right), as they protect their grounds is common-place. Sure, there is still a lot of illegal activity going on that involves pot, such as the theft of high-volume fertilizers, potting mixes and irrigation supplies from landscaping and retail companies. I don't think legalizing it will ever counter this sort of activity; however, if the market pricing isn't ridiculously high, then maybe the profitability of illegal growers will fall and prevent things like these thefts and the local crack-shacks from continuing.

Eh, giv'er.

Oh, and for the record, I've never bothered to try pot because I didn't think I'd have any reason to try it. I mean, even a six pack of beer can sit in my fridge for half a year and end up being less-than fresh. I'm just not into recreational consumption all that much. While I don't have anything particularly against pot, the smell of it does give me a headache, so I tend to stay upwind of it when I can.

Edited July 14, 2010 by ShadowDog

[SAmadei]

I don't use pot and wouldn't use it if it was legalized. However, I support its legalization, as it can be taxed and regulated... instead of profiting the gangs... and distribution and use would not fill our jails.

Only way this would affect me is if I was to grow a crop for resell... but its too much of a security hassle, legal or not.

[Croc]

I'm all for it, but I doubt Prop 19 passes now that NAACP endorsed it, created controversy, and now got it all up on everyone's radar. It'll be close, though.

Will I use it? No, not really. I'm allergic to it, though occasionally I'll have a hit or two...and then I'll throw up. No worries, though...I prefer uppers.

[CSpec]

The betting markets aren't too optimistic about passage in CA, but there's still time:

.

This completely ineffectual and counterproductive prohibition must end.

[the_yellow_dart]

Canada essentially legalized carrying quantities less than one ounce for about a year in the 2002-2003 time frame, then caved to American pressure and recinded it.

I thought that was a shame (that is was recinded), but at the same time the laws that were in place during that period were really stupid. It was still illegal to possess in large quantities, but legal in small quantities. Also, it was not available from a controllable, taxable location - you still had to find a drug dealer.

As several other people in this thread have stated, I want to see it sold like cigarettes. I don't do it anymore personally, but I support others who want to.

[PurdueGuy]

As several other people in this thread have stated, I want to see it sold like cigarettes. I don't do it anymore personally, but I support others who want to.

Yeah, it needs to either be left illegal for now, or be made a regulated industry, none of this convoluted halfway crap.

I personally don't/won't use.

I do know some people that are *mentally* addicted to pot (used as an escape from a life with a lot of issues that stem from poor choices - sadly, the money they spend on pot could be spent to repair some of those mistakes, but they'd rather have the relief than put the effort into making things better it seems). But, this same kind of thing happens with tons of legal substances, or even hobbies, so pot can hardly be blamed.

[loki]

from http://standardmadness.com/offbeat/the-truth-about-the-war-on-drugs

http://standardmadness.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/war-on-drugs.jpg

[Camino LS6]

Like I said, infantile thinking.

Legalizing pot would be the best first step toward rational drug policy in the US.

What we do now is in no way rational.

[usonia]

Like I said, infantile thinking.

Legalizing pot would be the best first step toward rational drug policy in the US.

What we do now is in no way rational.

Absolutely! I get so angry at the 'morality' mindset of politicians in this country. I have to believe that in private, most of them probably don't give a crap but they wouldn't dare say that in public. I understand that legalizing most drugs would be a disaster, but pot? Seriously? If they leagalized it, it would finally be an example of rational thinking in public policy. I just don't see it happening any time soon. I hope I'm wrong.

[CSpec]

And how many high ranking politicians have admitted to using pot in their youth? Both Obama and Bush (well after his youth) were cokeheads at one time too.

[Camino LS6]

The reason it hasn't happened is that politicians are fundamentaly cowards.

The truth scares them.

[loki]

The reason it hasn't happened is that politicians are fundamentaly cowards.

The truth scares them.

saw an article.... oh, it was an opinion, about the budget "council" that obama initiated. it'll prolly say drastic things need to be done, but only the few that are principled, and really care about how they do their job rather than getting reelected, will keep pushing for those recommendations to be pushed into law.

such as...

SS changes

medicare and medicaid changes

removal of EIC tax code

removal of corporate tax credits

removal of other tax credits.

[FUTURE_OF_GM]

I've never smoked pot. (hell, I've never even smoked a cigarette)

But I would certainly support legalization. For revenue purposes and because I feel that it's not much different than alcohol.

Let's face it; if people want to exist in an altered state, then they'll find a way to do that, legal or not. What we really need to focus on is EDUCATION about these drugs (alcohol included) and how it affects peoples lives. That's a big reason why 'Americans can't hold their alcohol' because they aren't taught how to respect the substance. If people want to partake in this activity, then the need to be informed about the effects and possible consequences. But, ultimately it is their own free will.

As reality gets worse, more people will continue to seek escapism.

Edited July 20, 2010 by FUTURE_OF_GM

[loki]

Ron Paul on the Fair Sentencing Act

[Camino LS6]

I've never smoked pot. (hell, I've never even smoked a cigarette)

But I would certainly support legalization. For revenue purposes and because I feel that it's not much different than alcohol.

Let's face it; if people want to exist in an altered state, then they'll find a way to do that, legal or not. What we really need to focus on is EDUCATION about these drugs (alcohol included) and how it affects peoples lives. That's a big reason why 'Americans can't hold their alcohol' because they aren't taught how to respect the substance. If people want to partake in this activity, then the need to be informed about the effects and possible consequences. But, ultimately it is their own free will.

As reality gets worse, more people will continue to seek escapism.

Absolutely.