Toyota, GM Partnership Nears End

[Newbiewar]

Link To Article

TOKYO (AP) - A symbolically key partnership between Toyota and General Motors is ending next month just as the leading Japanese manufacturer threatens to overtake its U.S. rival as the world's top automaker.

Toyota Motor Corp. and General Motors Corp. inked a five-year deal in 1999 to work together in technology, and that was extended for two years April 1, 2004. Another extension is dubious when the agreement expires end of March.

GM and Toyota officials -- including former Toyota president Fujio Cho and GM's head of research, Larry Burns -- have said since last year that both sides are talking about possible collaboration in technology.

Such technology includes pollution-free hydrogen fuel cells and hybrids, which run on both a gasoline engine and electric motor to deliver better mileage than comparable regular models.

But beyond a lot of talking -- and the initial handshake -- the deal has produced little else.

"We are continuing our discussions," Toyota spokesman Paul Nolasco said Thursday, declining to comment on speculation the deal may be ditched soon.

Still, the partnership is significant as a sign of friendly relations amid intense global competition. Toyota may also want to maintain that positive image to help avert any possible backlash from U.S. consumers and politicians.

If Toyota keeps up its current pace of growth, it could well surpass GM as the world's No. 1 automaker in the next few years.

GM sold 9.17 million vehicles worldwide in 2005, the most it has sold in 27 years. Late last year, Toyota announced a global production target of 9.06 million vehicles for 2006, which includes output from group manufacturers.

Tsuyoshi Mochimaru, auto analyst with Deutsche Securities in Tokyo, believes it's better if GM and Toyota can maintain the alliance even as a symbol of good relations between two powerful companies.

"There's no point in terminating it," he said. "Technological alliances like this generally don't produce visible results that quickly."

But General Motors has already picked other automakers for a hybrid alliance.

Last year, GM agreed with DaimlerChrysler AG of Germany to develop hybrid engines together, and Munich, Germany-based BMW Group later joined that agreement.

Toyota has been gaining market share in the United States, partly on the success of its hybrids such as the Prius model, while Detroit-based GM is facing deep financial trouble.

Their contrasting fortunes have some Japanese, including Toyota Chairman Hiroshi Okuda, worrying about intensifying trade friction.

GM, which lost $8.6 billion last year, has announced a revival plan to cut 30,000 jobs and close 12 plants by 2008. Earlier this month, it outlined a plan to cut white-collar pension and health-care expenses, slash its dividend and trim executive salaries as part of its latest bid to avoid bankruptcy.

Toyota profits, meanwhile, are booming. The automaker based in the central Japanese city of Toyota chalked up a 397.6 billion yen ($3.35 billion) profit during the October-December quarter, its best ever.

Under a separate partnership, General Motors and Toyota run an auto plant together in Fremont, Calif., called New United Motor Manufacturing Inc., or NUMMI, set up in 1984.

[FUTURE_OF_GM]

But beyond a lot of talking -- and the initial handshake -- the deal has produced little else.

What a surprise!!! Another GM "partnership" in which GM gets screwed and their competitor hits paydirt. I'm sure Toyota received something. Funny how NO company in the world wants to actually work with GM, not even the suppliers. But they're first in line to take advantage of GM and the GM execs seem to like to whore the company's resources out anyway, so whatever.

I bet the 'partnership' was struck solely for this reason:

Toyota may also want to maintain that positive image to help avert any possible backlash from U.S. consumers and politicians.

Oh yeah; and the REST of that sentence reads "WHEN TOYOTA FINISHES DESTROYING THE AMERICAN AUTO INDUSTRY AND ILLUSTRATES THE STUPIDITY OF AMERICANS AS THEY FLOCK TO 'FALL IN LINE' AND DITCH YET ANOTHER INDUSTRY AND YET ANOTHER SYMBOL OF AMERICANA."

There will be NO backlash... I don't understand why Toyota is worried. The politicians do a whole lot of NOTHING regarding american business and the media is ensuring, through Toyota praise/new domestic articles that the consumer does EXACTLY what they're told; which is to NOT buy or care for domestics.

If Toyota keeps up its current pace of growth, it could well surpass GM as the world's No. 1 automaker in the next few years.

COULD?!?!? LOL... Try WILL!!

Tsuyoshi Mochimaru, auto analyst with Deutsche Securities in Tokyo, believes it's better if GM and Toyota can maintain the alliance even as a symbol of good relations between two powerful companies.

FUTURE_OF_GM, an opinionist with Cheersandgears.com in america had this response to that comment: "F*ck that... This is war!"

"There's no point in terminating it," he said. "Technological alliances like this generally don't produce visible results that quickly."

A.K.A. Don't cut off Toyota from theiving GM technology or having inside sources in the company.

Seriously; if it isn't producing results then what exactly is the point of the partnership and WHY is this guy so adament about it continuing?

Toyota has been gaining market share in the United States, partly on the success of its hybrids such as the Prius model,

Yeah right.... The only thing the Prius does for Toyota is give the media something to latch on to so that they can create FALSE (Read: not based on fact) goodwill while belittling Detroit YET AGAIN.

while Detroit-based GM is facing deep financial trouble.

But NOT directly because of sales.

Their contrasting fortunes have some Japanese, including Toyota Chairman Hiroshi Okuda, worrying about intensifying trade friction.

Not to worry!!!! Thsi is america for god's sake!!! We sell our PORTS to our enemies for crying out loud. (Literally--check the news today) You got money? Then we're happy to oblidge, in any way you'd like REGARDLESS of how bad off it leaves us.

as part of its latest bid to avoid bankruptcy.

HEY, look at that!!! GM's past (1992) even gets thrown in their faces in BUSINESS articles now. Oh, and last time I checked, GM is still FAR from immediate bankruptcy.

Toyota profits, meanwhile, are booming. The automaker based in the central Japanese city of Toyota chalked up a 397.6 billion yen ($3.35 billion) profit during the October-December quarter, its best ever.

Those profits look impressive when the currency is manipulated in their favor, doesn't it?

Under a separate partnership, General Motors and Toyota run an auto plant together in Fremont, Calif., called New United Motor Manufacturing Inc., or NUMMI, set up in 1984.

Which has resulted in ABSOLUTELY NOTHING for GM.... Except a car identical to Toyota that doesn't SELL as well, isn't REVIEWED as well and is RANKED worse.

[PontiacTechNJ]

life will be easier VIBE FREE , those cheapskates can go elsewhere

[Guest YellowJacket894]

Good. If the agreement gets terminated, maybe GM will have one less potential problem to think about.

[haypops]

Which has resulted in ABSOLUTELY NOTHING for GM.... Except a car identical to Toyota that doesn't SELL as well, isn't REVIEWED as well and is RANKED worse.

I disagree with you on all this (except the ports thing). However, your assertion that GM gets nothing from the Freemont deal is beyond the pale. GM's 2 biggest problems are overcapacity and legacy costs. Toyota is helping GM out here not only by taking one factory off of its hands, but the one factory with the historically greatest labor disputes.

[ellives]

Don't kid yourself. I'm quite sure Toyota got quite a bit out of the deal. Quite a bit.

On what basis do you disagree?

The "overcapacity" argument is pure bull$h!. If and when they design and build themselves some "winners" that argument will be full of holes.

Toyota isn't helping anybody out but themselves. If that plant was so historically bad, GM ought to take a page out of the Walmart rule book and shut the damn thing down.

I disagree with you on all this (except the ports thing).  However, your assertion that GM gets nothing from the Freemont deal is beyond the pale.  GM's 2 biggest problems are overcapacity and legacy costs.  Toyota is helping GM out here not only by taking one factory off of its hands, but the one factory with the historically greatest labor disputes.

[haypops]

Don't kid yourself. I'm quite sure Toyota got quite a bit out of the deal. Quite a bit.

On what basis do you disagree?

The "overcapacity" argument is pure bull$h!. If and when they design and build themselves some "winners" that argument will be full of holes.

Toyota isn't helping anybody out but themselves. If that plant was so historically bad, GM ought to take a page out of the Walmart rule book and shut the damn thing down.

The qoute I was replying to clearly was that GM got nothing out of the deal, NOT what Toyota may have gotten out of the deal . GM gets a lot out of the deal as described. Before you accuse me of Bull$h! why don't youy learn to read. It is your description of overcapacity as being bull$h! that is bull$h!. Overcapacity has been a problem for many years; that's what the big rebates are all about afterall.

[Casket Demon]

WHAT?!?!?!?!...No 2nd Gen Vibe?!?!?...Oh, how the world is lost!!!!!

[FUTURE_OF_GM]

Don't kid yourself. I'm quite sure Toyota got quite a bit out of the deal. Quite a bit.

On what basis do you disagree?

The "overcapacity" argument is pure bull$h!. If and when they design and build themselves some "winners" that argument will be full of holes.

Toyota isn't helping anybody out but themselves. If that plant was so historically bad, GM ought to take a page out of the Walmart rule book and shut the damn thing down.

LOL... PERFECT..

Everyone bitches at me to no end about how "I think GM is a charity instead of a company"

Yet, then I make comments like this and the rebuttle is that; in fact, Toyota is a charity HELPING GM because they are after all, perfect, saintly good hearted Toyota.

Toyota is in it for TOYOTA and the KNOW what they've done/are doing to GM and Ford. As much as they try to put the icing on the cake, it's still blatantly obvious.

BTW, this post wasn't directed at haypops, he/she is a very respectful poster. I'm just making a point in general.

[Newbiewar]

BTW, this post wasn't directed at haypops, he/she is a very respectful poster. I'm just making a point in general.

its a he... Tim to be exact... and thank you...

[GM GUY]

Here is what is going to happen. GM is going to say "no" to the deal on the partnership. So Toyota will the buy into GM, Lets say something like 10 percent so they can get a person on the board. They then will try to force GM to give them the technology.

[Newbiewar]

Here is what is going to happen. GM is going to say "no" to the deal on the partnership. So Toyota will the buy into GM, Lets say something like 10 percent so they can get a person on the board. They then will try to force GM to give them the technology.

naa... toyota wont do that...

[GM GUY]

naa... toyota wont do that...

Of course they would. For one it would be cheaper, and second it would be faster for them. They wouldnt have to spend the billions of dollars or years on the development of these systems.

Edited February 24, 2006 by GM GUY

[Newbiewar]

Of course they would. For one it would be cheaper, and second it would be faster for them. They wouldnt have to spend the billions of dollars or years on the development of these systems.

then people wouldnt trust Toyota products because its designed by domestic engeneers...

[Polish_Kris]

Don't worry, this is the partnership that was the sharing of some tecnhologies. If you read the article at the end, it says that GM and Toyota has a seperate partnership, the NUMMI plant, and yes, there is a new Vibe coming in the fall of next year.

[Newbiewar]

Don't worry, this is the partnership that was the sharing of some tecnhologies.  If you read the article at the end, it says that GM and Toyota has a seperate partnership, the NUMMI plant, and yes, there is a new Vibe coming in the fall of next year.

damn another vehicle to drag down GM's relability...

According to J.D Power and Associats, the Vibe is the worst Vehicle GM sells

[haypops]

LOL... PERFECT..

BTW, this post wasn't directed at haypops, he/she is a very respectful poster. I'm just making a point in general.

Thanks. Since we see some of these things quite differently, that comment means a lot to me.

[Polish_Kris]

damn another vehicle to drag down GM's relability...

According to J.D Power and Associats, the Vibe is the worst Vehicle GM sells

I don't know where you got that info from? And personally, JD Power and associates is the wrost source to determine a car's reliability. They only investigate the first three months of vehicle ownership.

[Snate]

I don't know where you got that info from?  And personally, JD Power and associates is the wrost source to determine a car's reliability.  They only investigate the first three months of vehicle ownership.

Actually its probably the best...and they do long term studies as well.

[El Scorcho]

3 years is my understanding.

[haypops]

I checked the Uplander, Aveo, and theVibe and they had the same overall quality and mechanical rating. Not a particluarily good showing for any of them. One could argue GM' s worst matched the Toyota Vibe.

[Charger4U]

i think thats good news.....the sobs did/proably take advantage of gm.

[Polish_Kris]

Actually its probably the best...and they do long term studies as well.

The best, un-bais publication is the Canadian "Lemon-Aid" it is published every year.

[Snate]

The best, un-bais publication is the Canadian "Lemon-Aid" it is published every year.

I have no idea what that is...since I'm not from Canada.

[!!!TED!!!]

I have no idea what that is...since I'm not from Canada.

http://www.lemonaidcars.com/