2006 Buick Lucerne CXL V8 Review

[wildcat]

Buick is bridging the generation gap, good news, according to Steve Purdy of the Auto Channel.

Here's an especially nice portion of his review:

"Buick general manager, Steve Shannon, reports a 'great start' since introduction last October with Lucerne accounting for 27% of large-car sales in the fourth quarter of last year and segment leading sales in December as well. 'We’re very pleased at how Lucerne is performing out of the gate,' he said. Lucerne has also won accolades from USA Today, The Detroit News and Kiplinger’s."

Edited February 20, 2006 by wildcat

[gmcbob]

I'm glad the Lucerne is selling well. But I have only seen a couple on the streets of Houston, and Houston is the 4th largest city in the country.

[wildcat]

I've seen a number around Chicago, and I always turn my head when I do. They look nice, in my opinion. Not flashy, but nice and modern.

[Croc]

The exteriors are so good; it's just a shame the interiors are such a letdown.

[balthazar]

Obviously not a "letdown" to those who would seriously consider buying one OR those who already have.

[wildcat]

Sometimes I imagine yelling out, "How do you like your Buick?" to the driver or giving them some sort of acknowledgement, if they and I are near a stop light. So far, I haven't really had the opportunity. But should the circumstances give me that chance, watch the compliments start to fly!

[Croc]

Well, if you have no problem with acres of hard plastic on the dash where the DTS has squishy material, fine. The Lucerne interior is styled very well, but the shear amount of hard plastic is hard to reconcile. I will say this: the car gets a B- from me. If the only change made to it were an upgrade of the lower dash to some padded vinyl or something other than hard plastic, I would give the car an A-. If a few features were made available as options (like a telescoping steering wheel, a better tilt, DVD entertainment, etc) then the car would get an A+ with me. Why a B-? Because it is very obvious where GM cheaped out. GM has to stop doing this with their interiors. It's been a chronic problem at GM, and I haven't been convinced they've turned over a new leaf on this yet...too bad.

[Variance]

When the navigation comes, it'll be great. The pending ES350 assault should be a good test to see if the Lucerne can really hold its ground. The new ES is a fierce competitior but I think it can.

[Flybrian]

For a $10,000 difference in price between similarly-equipped Lucernes and DTSs, I can deal with it.

[Croc]

The LeSabre did not have a cheap, hard plastic lower dash. I do not enjoy seeing Buick regress in its interior materials.

[Northstar]

I was thoroughly impressed with the Lucerne CXS w/black interior I sat in at the auto show. I felt the materials were on par with the Avalon's, and the layout and controls were much better (the Avalon interior is just dumb with its doors and weird buttons). I also got to sit in the new ES (surprisingly) and I was not in the least bit impressed. The IS has a much better interior, and I'd say the materials inside the old ES are, in most cases, better. The interior wasn't bad in the ES, but I wasn't impressed with the door panels (Lucerne had more soft materials in places you touch -- go to the preview site at Lexus for the ES and look at the door panel; sure, it has some leather, but it's beneath where you would actually rest your arm so you would never touch it, the Lucerne on the other hand actually has nice leather where you would rest your arm), and the layout was really rather boring. The ES is definetly the worst of all the Lexus models.

[Dsuupr]

Here in import country our dealers are selling the Lucerne at a pretty good clip.

[Cananopie]

The LeSabre did not have a cheap, hard plastic lower dash.  I do not enjoy seeing Buick regress in its interior materials.

You have to admit Croc with all your cynnicism about the interior that for each thing you don't like about the interior (which seems to only be the level of hardness of the plastic) there are about 10 things you can find better about the interior of the Lucerne over the LeSabre. Even on the interior the LeSabre wasn't as stylish, wasn't as quiet, wasn't as tight, the leather is higher quality (even the cloth is cushier than the LeSabre cloth), the audio systems better, the fact they finally offer a 5 seater, and even where you rest your arm as a driver there isn't any hard plastic around that area. The only things you really touch in a vehicle are the seat, where you rest your arm, and the steering wheel and all of which are void of the hard plastic.

I don't really expect to change your mind because you seem pretty set on this idea, I'm just saying in the grand scheme of the interior it didn't really 'regress' at all. Most people will not notice the dash material that they won't even be touching. And if they do I have owned cars with much worse plastic like my 97 Skylark. Personally when I'm inside a vehicle so long as the plastic doesn't affect my comfort I could care less how hard it is because I really am rarely going to be touching it and it effects quality little. I'd prefer to have tighter gaps and a quieter ride than a softer plastic on things I rarely touch. In fact aside from only a couple people in C&G I've never met anybody who bases their buying decisions on the plastic they rarely touch.

It's not that soft plastic wouldn't be a good option for the CXS or CXL V8 or even a fine replacement for the current plastic. But don't beat Buick up over it, everything you'll be interacting with daily is so much better.

[Croc]

Yea...um, so show me a single competitor that uses hard plastic like that in a ~30k "luxury" car. "Better" than LeSabre still isn't good enough. The competition and points of reference aren't with GM's past models, but rather other manufacturers. Now, here are some reasons why the use of hard plastic does affect daily enjoyment of the car (or will soon after buying):

Rattles. Plastic rattles, especially if the roads are full of potholes. Rattles will develop with dash panels.

Safety. In an accident, if your head were to fly forward, would you rather hit a padded vinyl or hard plastic? Yea, that's what I thought...

Quality. It just doesn't seem as high of quality when you know that GM and Buick cheaped out on the dash to cut costs. I've said this before and I'll say it again: if a manufacturer is going to cut costs and cheap out, the manufacturer should only do so on parts the consumer will have LITTLE TO NO CONTACT with. No one is going to care about the material underneath the dash at the back of the footwells, no one cares if the floor carpeting extends under the front seats (or if there's a plastic tray there instead), no one cares if the trunk liner is of high quality materials (as long as it isn't obviously crappy-looking) and no one cares if the glovebox is lighted/made of excellent materials because the only thing that will fit in there is the owner's manual. But people do start to care when there's this big hunk of cheap hard plastic staring at them from the dash every day. Again, find a competitor's vehicle that has a huge plastic dash like the Lucerne's.

To make sure everyone's on the same page...

Edited February 21, 2006 by Croc

[Flybrian]

Can't we have one Lucerne discussion without melodramatically whining about the f@#king dashboard?

[Croc]

Can't we have one Lucerne discussion without melodramatically whining about the f@#king dashboard?

It's not melodrama. And it is the one glaring flaw in an otherwise superb vehicle. Fly, even your Aurora has higher interior dash quality than the Lucerne, and it predates it by a decade.

[Drew Dowdell]

Yea...um, so show me a single competitor that uses hard plastic like that in a ~30k "luxury" car.  "Better" than LeSabre still isn't good enough.  The competition and points of reference aren't with GM's past models, but rather other manufacturers.  Now, here are some reasons why the use of hard plastic does affect daily enjoyment of the car (or will soon after buying):

Chrysler

[Flybrian]

It's not melodrama.  And it is the one glaring flaw in an otherwise superb vehicle.  Fly, even your Aurora has higher interior dash quality than the Lucerne, and it predates it by a decade.

I know, we all know, but c'mon. The safety and rattle comments you made have to do with build quality and engineering, not dash materials. If your head flies forward in a modern car, its going to hit an airbag, not the dash. Your head shouldn't be thrown that far if you're properly belted in the first case. And even so, its not a '61 Invicta; even 'hard' plastics are padded and designed to give to varying degrees. And you and I both know G-cars are very safe so head contact won't even be an issue.

The simple fact is, if it bothers you that much, fine. If you're okay with it, fine. Fighting the battle of its importance on a personal level is ridiculous and circular. However, I think we can all agree there is room for improvement in the Lucerne as there is in every single car on the market, God's chariot the Avalon and such included.

I think Cananopie said it best...

It's not that soft plastic wouldn't be a good option for the CXS or CXL V8 or even a fine replacement for the current plastic.

[caddycruiser]

It's not melodrama.  And it is the one glaring flaw in an otherwise superb vehicle.  Fly, even your Aurora has higher interior dash quality than the Lucerne, and it predates it by a decade.

Yeah...right....along with some nasty fit & finish in some parts, and not nearly as high grade of tightness and solidity. Just because something is squishy doesn't necessarily make it high end in a car...

A big critic myself, the only thing that really bugs me about the Lucerne's interior is the black pod in the center of the dash that just sticks out too much.

Softer stuff typically does give off a more luxurious feel, but go check out a BMW or VW sometime...not a whole lot that's "squishy", but they always still come off as damn nice and high end.

The Lucerne is a terrific car, no doubt, but I think it'd be more productive to focus on issues like the sub-200 hp V6, antique 4-speed, and that homely looking bubble of a nose than constantly doing piece by piece analysis of which little interior piece is soft or not soft enough...

[Cananopie]

However, I think we can all agree there is room for improvement in the Lucerne as there is in every single car on the market, God's chariot the Avalon and such included.

God's chariot, haha, I like that. Perhaps Toyota should just consider that as the new name for the Avalon with the next generation.

[-Camaro-]

Yea...um, so show me a single competitor that uses hard plastic like that in a ~30k "luxury" car.  "Better" than LeSabre still isn't good enough.  The competition and points of reference aren't with GM's past models, but rather other manufacturers.  Now, here are some reasons why the use of hard plastic does affect daily enjoyment of the car (or will soon after buying):

Rattles.  Plastic rattles, especially if the roads are full of potholes.  Rattles will develop with dash panels.

Safety.  In an accident, if your head were to fly forward, would you rather hit a padded vinyl or hard plastic?  Yea, that's what I thought...

Quality.  It just doesn't seem as high of quality when you know that GM and Buick cheaped out on the dash to cut costs.  I've said this before and I'll say it again: if a manufacturer is going to cut costs and cheap out, the manufacturer should only do so on parts the consumer will have LITTLE TO NO CONTACT with.  No one is going to care about the material underneath the dash at the back of the footwells, no one cares if the floor carpeting extends under the front seats (or if there's a plastic tray there instead), no one cares if the trunk liner is of high quality materials (as long as it isn't obviously crappy-looking) and no one cares if the glovebox is lighted/made of excellent materials because the only thing that will fit in there is the owner's manual.  But people do start to care when there's this big hunk of cheap hard plastic staring at them from the dash every day.  Again, find a competitor's vehicle that has a huge plastic dash like the Lucerne's.

To make sure everyone's on the same page...

That's like saying that a car with lower quality rubber on their wheels compared to the competition is a bad disadvantage. How again exactly does hard plastic look worse? Plastic is plastic, there is no such thing as higher quality plastics in cars. It's just personal preference that makes people like certain plastics better. Again the hard plastics aren't where people are going to touch very often and if your head hit padded vinyl, you'd probably still be dead or be hurt really bad, it's not an airbag... which most cars do come with now days. Edited February 21, 2006 by -Camaro-

[Croc]

If you sit in a Lucerne and don't just look at the photographs, you will understand that it is unfortunate. You just kind of sit there and touch it and are like "...oh!" and then re-touch it because you can't believe they did that. I saw this happen time and again at the various autoshows I've been to...it's really disconcerting.

[pow]

That's like saying that a car with lower quality rubber on their wheels compared to the competition is a bad disadvantage. How again exactly does hard plastic look worse? Plastic is plastic, there is no such thing as higher quality plastics in cars. It's just personal preference that makes people like certain plastics better. Again the hard plastics aren't where people are going to touch very often and if your head hit padded vinyl, you'd probably still be dead or be hurt really bad, it's not an airbag... which most cars do come with now days.

Why'd GM go through the "trouble" of upgrading the plastics in the DTS then?

To set the record straight, soft doesn't immediately mean expensive and high quality, nor does hard immediately mean cheap. The shiny, molded, soft vinyl plastics in the LeSabre are dated and low-budget by today's standards, while the Tahoe's rock-hard plastics are very convincing simulations of more expensive materials.

[VenSeattle]

The LeSabre did not have a cheap, hard plastic lower dash.  I do not enjoy seeing Buick regress in its interior materials.

No, but my Park Avenue has a hard plastic middle section that doesn't look bad in the least. Since the Park Avenue is above the LeSabre, there's no "regression."

Hard dash plastic doesn't fade or warp over time and is very easy to keep clean. See 10-year-old Buick interiors for reference. The hard plastics still look new with minimal maintenance. You may think hard plastic is cheap, but it’s also long lasting and durable.

As for the hard plastic looking cheap in the Lucerne, it doesn't. No one knew it was hard when looking at the pictures. It's low-gloss, nicely textured plastic. Even sitting inside, you CAN NOT tell without touching.

Croc, you didn't even detect it on your initial TEST DRIVE. You disputed it with OC and had to check it again at the Auto Show. If you, a car enthusiast, didn’t bother testing the dash plastic during your inspection and test drive (after all, it’s a critical point in determining the quality of a car)… then why would a normal individual in their 40s or 50s, do it?

[Croc]

Croc, you didn't even detect it on your initial TEST DRIVE. You disputed it with OC and had to check it again at the Auto Show. If you, a car enthusiast, didn’t bother testing the dash plastic during your inspection and test drive (after all, it’s a critical point in determining the quality of a car)… then why would a normal individual in their 40s or 50s, do it?

I explained that at the time; that I had tested both the Lucerne and DTS in the same day, back-to-back, and that since the interiors on both are extremely similar I forgot about the plastic in the Lucerne.

The DTS interior is perfect, material-wise. I think some of the styling is a bit off, but the quality of materials is spot-on. The Lucerne should have the DTS's lower dash materials. Including that would not change the price of the car substantially if at all. My biggest beef with the DTS is that it is grossly overpriced.

No, but my Park Avenue has a hard plastic middle section that doesn't look bad in the least. Since the Park Avenue is above the LeSabre, there's no "regression."

I also think the Park Avenue was overpriced. As for your point regarding the regression, well the Park Avenue was introduced in 1997 and the LeSabre in 2000. I would hope the LeSabre had better interior materials (which it did). I don't see the logic behind your claim that since the Lucerne replaced a dated model and a much less-dated model, that there was no regression in interior materials with the Lucerne because it's interior materials are on-par with the dated model and behind the less-dated model? I don't get that, please explain. Edited February 22, 2006 by Croc

[ocnblu]

Why you gotta do this all the time?

[VenSeattle]

I also think the Park Avenue was overpriced.  As for your point regarding the regression, well the Park Avenue was introduced in 1997 and the LeSabre in 2000.  I would hope the LeSabre had better interior materials (which it did).

Sorry, but one look alone will say otherwise. See the interior door panels on the LeSabre compared to the Park Avenue for confirmation. OC would have to chime in and certify if the materials used in the 2000 LeSabre are actually higher quality than the 1997 Park Avenue, but I suspect they aren't.

There are proper and improper uses of Hard Plastic. Where it is on the Park Avenue is fine. There's no reason someone would come in contact with it. The lower part of the dash is soft/padded plastic, which includes the glove box door. The ashtray cover is hard plastic but grained/dyed perfectly to be invisible with the surrounding soft plastics. The PA interior, although traditionally styled, is high quality and well made.

The Lucerne is to. The lower plastic is hard, but dyed and grained to blend in with the door panels and center console. The Lucerne would benefit from the DTS's softer lower plastic, but the Lucerne is less expensive than the 2000-designed LeSabre and even the 1997-designed Park Avenue.

As mentioned before... for $10,000k less it's a small matter to fret over so much.

[sciguy_0504]

The upper part of the dashboard can also be lifted up to reveal a nice big gap.

[Croc]

In the Lucerne, the console is the same hard plastic as the dash lower. Now, I do need to clarify one thing: I am assuming what you say regarding the Park Avenue is true since you are a current owner, but I do not recall large expanses of hard plastic in the P.A. like the Lucerne has.

I shall be looking this up...

EDIT:

This is the best interior shot of the Park Avenue I could find...

Honestly? The only thing offensive about this is the design (purely subjective) and the fit and finish (mainly that panel under the center stack that looks loose, otherwise a minor complaint). I think the materials used are, for the most part, fine. Now, Ven, where is this hard plastic located? The only place I can see that would be similar to the Lucerne's is the passenger airbag cover, but I know that is not hard plastic. I see no large expanse of hard plastic in this picture. (I guess that's my biggest problem with the Lucerne's plastic...it is one large, unbroken expanse in front of the passenger).

Edited February 22, 2006 by Croc

[Cananopie]

The upper part of the dashboard can also be lifted up to reveal a nice big gap. 

Didn't you also "scrape your leg through jeans" on the interior? No offense but I have a feeling you tend to exaggerate since not one single other person has experienced these defects that make it sound like a poorly put together torture chamber. Maybe it was just your car but until someone else finds the interior plastic equal to concrete and able to open huge gaps when Buick specifically touts it has some of the tightest gaps in the industry you might be able to convince some people of its cheapness.

[TurboRush]

there is cheap hard plastic like that in almost every car. It all depends on the dash's shape if its going to be more in contact with or not. Croc, do you realize that if they put nice cushy dash padding in that area that yes, it would be nicer when you aply your hand on the dash or if you end up in a colision you may have a bit less scaring.... Under those nice cushy dash pads, there is a cheap feeling plastic.

GM was smart in NOT making that portion of the dash spongy and its because that part of the dash is subject to getting nicked, ripped, scrached..... Imagine a friend or relative getting into your car and her purse buckle hits the dash and part of the spongy material or surface gets torn/ripped. or rippled and it gets ugly with time as $h! just comes in contact with it.

On the other hand, the hard plastic will not ripple or tear. It may have a scratch but will remain firm and in place. Thing is with "Cheap" plastics, its if they are thick enough and flexible enough (kind of like winter tires versus summer tires. the winters are a softer ruber) and the plastic will flex a bit instead of resist and squeak or crack in cold weather. Hard plastics can also be buffed out or finely worn to remove a grove in it.

anyways, I think there needs to be a good compromise between hard "I dont care plastics" andsoft spongy and soft feeling plastics.

Even in some import vehicles, they put some soft feeling plastics, its actualy a hard plastic with what feels like a film or overlay of rubery/fuzzy surface. That stuff is nice brand new but give it 2 or 3 years and it will get scratched off in some areas and loose its apeal.

think long term and also apearance. A simple plastic surface is not going to make or break you in an accident. The build and engineering of the platform, structure and safety features will save you.

[pow]

The upper part of the dashboard can also be lifted up to reveal a nice big gap. 

Yes, I noticed that, too. The upper dash paint is "soft touch", but the actual plastic itself is brittle and hard. It's "soft" only in the sense that it flexes like a thin sheet of plastic.

[Croc]

there is cheap hard plastic like that in almost every car. It all depends on the dash's shape if its going to be more in contact with or not. Croc, do you realize that if they put nice cushy dash padding in that area that yes, it would be nicer when you aply your hand on the dash or if you end up in a colision you may have a bit less scaring.... Under those nice cushy dash pads, there is a cheap feeling plastic.

GM was smart in NOT making that portion of the dash spongy and its because that part of the dash is subject to getting nicked, ripped, scrached..... Imagine a friend or relative getting into your car and her purse buckle hits the dash and part of the spongy material or surface gets torn/ripped. or rippled and it gets ugly with time as $h! just comes in contact with it.

On the other hand, the hard plastic will not ripple or tear. It may have a scratch but will remain firm and in place. Thing is with "Cheap" plastics, its if they are thick enough and flexible enough (kind of like winter tires versus summer tires. the winters are a softer ruber) and the plastic will flex a bit instead of resist and squeak or crack in cold weather. Hard plastics can also be buffed out or finely worn to remove a grove in it.

anyways, I think there needs to be a good compromise between hard "I dont care plastics" andsoft spongy and soft feeling plastics.

Even in some import vehicles, they put some soft feeling plastics, its actualy a hard plastic with what feels like a film or overlay of rubery/fuzzy surface. That stuff is nice brand new but give it 2 or 3 years and it will get scratched off in some areas and loose its apeal.

think long term and also apearance. A simple plastic surface is not going to make or break you in an accident. The build and engineering of the platform, structure and safety features will save you.

The spongier material only gets damaged if you intentionally try to. A purse buckle will NOT scratch that in the normal process of getting in and out of the car.

EDIT: Now, my main question is where the hell the passenger airbag comes from...I mean I know the airbags can rip through the vinyl and leather dashes in other cars, but it looks like the bag is coming through hard plastic here without an obvious panel for doing so...I wouldn't want an air bag busting through hard plastic that will likely result in some small flying pieces...

Edited February 22, 2006 by Croc

[TurboRush]

The hard plastic has fracture points that cannot be noticed to just looking at it. usualy there are fracture points underneath the material. Why put the groves on the prety side?

about the scratching and tearing of spongy material, you can be carefull all you want but if you plan on putting on miles on your vehicle and getting good usage out of it, you will think long term and AANYTHING can happen. You can't predict that. I had an Alero once and thers quite a nice feeling spongy dash to it but I had noticed 2 spots where there were tiny rips in the spongy material over only 18 months of ownership.

Some models can be more vulnerable than others. Like I said, it depends on the shape of the dash and where they use the materials. Some compromises have to be made in certain areas for durability/long lasting good looks reasons. And a piece of hard plastic shatering because your head hits it will shater horisontaly and not jagged towards your face. If thers an airbag well, like I said.... fracture points regardless of hardness if plastic and britleness of plastic. It has obviously been tested for effectiveness.

Edited February 22, 2006 by TurboRush

[Croc]

No, I meant the plastic hitting one in the head due to the explosion (airbag) behind it. I'm just trying to figure out how the airbag deploys without sending shards flying or without the plastic tearing the airbag.

[TurboRush]

No, I meant the plastic hitting one in the head due to the explosion (airbag) behind it.  I'm just trying to figure out how the airbag deploys without sending shards flying or without the plastic tearing the airbag.

Like I said... fracture points make the plastic open up in a piramid/triangles of plastic open up and one part of the triangle has a smaller or non-existent fracture point and stays attached to the rest of the dash. That way, the pieces open up but the bottom part of the plastic stays attached to the dash

[Cananopie]

No, I meant the plastic hitting one in the head due to the explosion (airbag) behind it.  I'm just trying to figure out how the airbag deploys without sending shards flying or without the plastic tearing the airbag.

Airbags in any vehicle would not be safe if there weren't fracture points for the way the dash blows off otherwise having shards of anything coming at you at 100 mph, even your precious soft plastic, could be lethal. The way airbags work is nothing but the airbag is supposed to hit your face.

If you still don't understand the way an airbag works is it senses the accident and the airbag deploys. The way the dash material is made BEHIND the exterior has certain break points in it because once the airbag deploys you'll need a new one anyway, when it breaks it will hit the break points making the dash blow off to the side leaving nothing but the airbag in front of the human.

[balthazar]

No- actually Buick tested nothing and when the air bags go off, giant, foot-long, razor-sharp shards of "hard, brittle, cheap" plastic (possibly laced with a chemical byproduct of production with similar affects as those of a lesser nerve agent) will embed themselves in the occupant's face, neck and upper torso, rendering them dead before they contact the airbag.

Doesn't matter; Buick buyers are all "dying off" anyway.

[z28luvr01]

This has gone beyond beating a dead horse. Now we're running it through a meat grinder, and torturing its surviving relatives.

[VenSeattle]

In the Lucerne, the console is the same hard plastic as the dash lower.  Now, I do need to clarify one thing: I am assuming what you say regarding the Park Avenue is true since you are a current owner, but I do not recall large expanses of hard plastic in the P.A. like the Lucerne has.

I shall be looking this up...

EDIT:

This is the best interior shot of the Park Avenue I could find...

Honestly?  The only thing offensive about this is the design (purely subjective) and the fit and finish (mainly that panel under the center stack that looks loose, otherwise a minor complaint).  I think the materials used are, for the most part, fine.  Now, Ven, where is this hard plastic located?  The only place I can see that would be similar to the Lucerne's is the passenger airbag cover, but I know that is not hard plastic.  I see no large expanse of hard plastic in this picture. (I guess that's my biggest problem with the Lucerne's plastic...it is one large, unbroken expanse in front of the passenger).

In the above picture, from the dashshelf down to the wood trim(Center Stack, Instrumentation, DIC, passenger airbag cover, Air vents, door speakers) is all hard plastic. Am I complaining? NO. There's nothing wrong with its application. It looks fine. It's not offensive by any means. The dash is very easy to clean and maintain. Yes, the styling is traditional but the interior flows together nicely and is very well thought out. I still love it after all these years. No squeaks, rattles, loose panels, etc.

The panel on the lower part of the dash (left to the glove compartment) is where the ashtray opens up/folds down. The panel cover is hard plastic while the rest of the lighter colored lower dash is soft and spongy (including the glove compartment door.) Even in person you can't tell they're made of different materials without touching them. The plastic panel cover is around 1/5" thick and is very strong/sturdy. It's not paper thin or brittle. The Lucerne’s dash is probably similar in thickness, if not more so. I doubt the Lucerne's dash will ever crack, break, dent, fade, etc. I also anticipate it will continue looking new ten years from now with low maintenance damp-rag care (or in the sunny states some type of agent to protect from severely excessive sun exposure).

---------------

As for the Lucerne passenger airbag, it appears the airbag deploys from above the wood trim when it's activated

--------------

And yes... this has been beaten to death.

--------------

[pow]

The hard plastic has fracture points that cannot be noticed to just looking at it. usualy there are fracture points underneath the material. Why put the groves on the prety side?

about the scratching and tearing of spongy material, you can be carefull all you want but if you plan on putting on miles on your vehicle and getting good usage out of it, you will think long term and AANYTHING can happen. You can't predict that. I had an Alero once and thers quite a nice feeling spongy dash to it but I had noticed 2 spots where there were tiny rips in the spongy material over only 18 months of ownership.

Some models can be more vulnerable than others. Like I said, it depends on the shape of the dash and where they use the materials. Some compromises have to be made in certain areas for durability/long lasting good looks reasons. And a piece of hard plastic shatering because your head hits it will shater horisontaly and not jagged towards your face. If thers an airbag well, like I said.... fracture points regardless of hardness if plastic and britleness of plastic. It has obviously been tested for effectiveness.

High-quality "spongy" materials can be every bit as durable as hard plastics.

[TurboRush]

High-quality "spongy" materials can be every bit as durable as hard plastics.

spongy material in general is what it is... spongy. things that are spongy all react in the same way..... they are all flexible to movement and cushioning but will eventualy tear given enough of a blow with the right object. It doesnt take something sharp... but if you did take something sharp to spongy material it is most definately going to have an adverse effect on its looks.

Hard plastics are generaly more resistant to that. And we are talking about manufacturing cars in general here..... not somuch just GM and its lucern. PPl look for soft feeling plastics and all this cloud 9 dreamyland stuff....... what happened to utility/functionality...... spongy material is the sugar coating on the cake..... its the extra little candy on top of th ice cream......

to tell you the honest truith, there are a gazilion things in a car I look at an have priority over the section of dash that has a hard plastic.

I wined over the candy on the ice cream and the icing on the cupcake when I was 6, maybe as far as 8 years old........ time to move on from being loly-gaged and sothed all the time. Gime a firm but comfortable ride, nice seats and a nice layout of instruments all wraped up with a good powertrain all in a nice decent package and the dash density, molecular structure and scientific makeup will be the last on my list.... in fact, never has been on my list..... just a slight bonus where the dash is made in special feeling material. Its a car. seat, engine, ride, performance.

[pow]

spongy material in general is what it is... spongy. things that are spongy all react in the same way..... they are all flexible to movement and cushioning but will eventualy tear given enough of a blow with the right object. It doesnt take something sharp... but if you did take something sharp to spongy material it is most definately going to have an adverse effect on its looks

Depends on what your definition of spongy is... ... but let me reiterate; high-quality, dense materials can be perfectly durable.

[pow]

to tell you the honest truith, there are a gazilion things in a car I look at an have priority over the section of dash that has a hard plastic.

I wined over the candy on the ice cream and the icing on the cupcake when I was 6, maybe as far as 8 years old........ time to move on from being loly-gaged and sothed all the time. Gime a firm but comfortable ride, nice seats and a nice layout of instruments all wraped up with a good powertrain all in a nice decent package and the dash density, molecular structure and scientific makeup will be the last on my list.... in fact, never has been on my list..... just a slight bonus where the dash is made in special feeling material.  Its a car. seat, engine, ride, performance.

Agreed... I don't deliberately get into a car and immediately start anaylzing the plastic quality. What's more important is the overall impression of quality and solidity that the interior gives, and only when a $40K car start to feel half its price, do I inspect closer and determine the cause.

If I point out dash bongers, interior lighting, material quality, seat rail design, glovebox thunk, new car smell, and window switches, I'd be branded nitpicky, but if I just say that the interior feels cheap, I'd be asked to substantiate my claims.

Edited February 22, 2006 by empowah

[Croc]

if you don't like the discussion no one is making you read it

Thank you Ven for that .avi file, really cleared it up. I understood how airbags deploy and the fracture points involved, just having a hard time figuring out how it would work with hard plastic without things going airborn, but obviously it isn't an issue in the Lucerne.

[Flybrian]

This is really the most I've laughed in a while. Seriously. Jesus.

[sciguy_0504]

Didn't you also "scrape your leg through jeans" on the interior? No offense but I have a feeling you tend to exaggerate since not one single other person has experienced these defects that make it sound like a poorly put together torture chamber. Maybe it was just your car but until someone else finds the interior plastic equal to concrete and able to open huge gaps when Buick specifically touts it has some of the tightest gaps in the industry you might be able to convince some people of its cheapness.

The "scraping my legs through jeans" comment was meant to be a somewhat funny take on how hard the lower dash plastic is. I was even more surprised that the top portion of the dash could be lifted up towards the windshield. Yes, it could have been the car that I was in since it was at the car show, so try it the next time you are in one. Grab a hold of the dashboard above the IP and see if it wiggles or is able to be lifted up.