Detroit 2010: Cadillac XTS Platinum Concept

[Intrepidation]

The production car won't be so wide or aggressive. Great... Zzzzzz.

That's two big strikes against a car that already has mixed opinions.

[smk4565]

To steal a quote from Mr. Clarkson, "it's a large sensory deprivation tank, for rich, old people." This has geezer-mobile written all over it. It is the size of a Lincoln MKS, it is front wheel drive like a Lincoln MKS, it has a V6 like the MKS, and has an optional engine with 350 hp like the MKS. These huge, soft, boring front drivers don't sell, Cadillac has one already and it is terrible. Why do they keep appealing to the 1980s luxury car buyer that doesn't exist anymore?

Problem 2, is what is Cadillac? Are they CTS-V and performance/luxury, or are they snooze-mobiles like a Lexus ES or LS. BMW and Mercedes are successful because every car has the same theme, Audi has the Quattro and LED front lights thing going, but every car is in the same theme. Cadillac is all over the map, trying to be like Lexus with one model, Lincoln with another, BMW with another. Luxury brands need identity, that is how they build image and get the big bucks for their cars.

Another problem is this car works only in the USA, and even then it will probably be a slow seller. The Mercedes S-class works here, it works in South Africa, in the Middle East, in England, in Germany, etc. It works in London traffic at 5 mph, or on the Autobon at 150 mph. Anywhere you put it, anything you ask it to do, it can do. That is the measure of a great car.

The exterior I find bland, except I like the grille. Cadillacs should have sharp edges, this is too rounded off, you can't be edgy and round at the same time, the STS tried that, rounded off doesn't work for Cadillac. Inside looks pretty good, but I dislike suede on anything but a head liner. The gauge display looks too hokey or cartoony, those LCD/LED screen gauges are nice when they look like traditional gauges, such as with the Range Rover or S-class. But with the XTS and new Lincoln MKX, it looks tacky.

[Camino LS6]

That's two big strikes against a car that already has mixed opinions.

Yup.

It would seem that GM will insist on building this car, but I feel certain that it will be the last FWD luxo-barge Cadillac ever offers.

Edited January 14, 2010 by Camino LS6

[Blake Noble]

The main reason why this will be the last front-drive luxo barge Caddy: they'll probably manage to sell all of two of them, each to some elderly retired couple in Florida.

You know what this car is? Yeah I'm going to say it: a Cimmaron for the second decade of the 21st century with a fancy interior. Whoopity do. Take away the interior and it's a gussied up Malibu. To this Cadillac I say "Screw you!" (Hey, I had a rhyming scheme going there, had to keep going with it.)

And before someone says, "Why do you bash this car so much? We know you don't like it, it wasn't made for someone like you. Just stop" I'll offer a simple rebuttal: Of course it isn't made for someone like me; I don't have white hair growing out of my ears; I don't go to church and eat Jolly Ranchers and Werther's Originals while I fall asleep in the middle of the sermon; I don't wear Dockers, a St. John's Bay button up plaid shirt, and Doc Martens; I don't have major hearing loss; I don't watch the PIR while I chug down a glass of Metamucil. I don't have a wife that keeps her hair in a big gray bun; I don't own property in Florida; I don't have 18 different types of meds; I don't go to bed after Andy Rooney gives his final thoughts on life (all the while agreeing while it's on) on 60 Minutes. But most of all -- and I stress this -- I don't worry about erectile dysfunction and having prostate exams.

Edited January 14, 2010 by whiteknight

[Lamar]

Tell us how you REALLY feel, whiteknight...

[smk4565]

The main reason why this will be the last front-drive luxo barge Caddy: they'll probably manage to sell all of two of them, each to some elderly retired couple in Florida.

You know what this car is? Yeah I'm going to say it: a Cimmaron for the second decade of the 21st century with a fancy interior. Whoopity do. Take away the interior and it's a gussied up Malibu. To this Cadillac I say "Screw you!" (Hey, I had a rhyming scheme going there, had to keep going with it.)

And before someone says, "Why do you bash this car so much? We know you don't like it, it wasn't made for someone like you. Just stop" I'll offer a simple rebuttal: Of course it isn't made for someone like me; I don't have white hair growing out of my ears; I don't go to church and eat Jolly Ranchers and Werther's Originals while I fall asleep in the middle of the sermon; I don't wear Dockers, a St. John's Bay button up plaid shirt, and Doc Martens; I don't have major hearing loss; I don't watch the PIR while I chug down a glass of Metamucil. I don't have a wife that keeps her hair in a big gray bun; I don't own property in Florida; I don't have 18 different types of meds; I don't go to bed after Andy Rooney gives his final thoughts on life (all the while agreeing while it's on) on 60 Minutes. But most of all -- and I stress this -- I don't worry about erectile dysfunction and having prostate exams.

Best post ever on C&G. Wow, I wouldn't even go so far as to call it a Cimmaron for the 21st century, but the person described in the last paragraph is who will be buying this car.

Another issue facing this car, is likely for the same money, one could get a Hyundai Equus, that is probably roomier, and is very well equipped and has a 400 hp V8 sending power to the rear wheels. If a LaCrosse can hit 4100 pounds, what will the larger XTS with the hybrid stuff weigh?

[Justin Bimmer]

Best post ever on C&G. Wow, I wouldn't even go so far as to call it a Cimmaron for the 21st century, but the person described in the last paragraph is who will be buying this car.

Another issue facing this car, is likely for the same money, one could get a Hyundai Equus, that is probably roomier, and is very well equipped and has a 400 hp V8 sending power to the rear wheels. If a LaCrosse can hit 4100 pounds, what will the larger XTS with the hybrid stuff weigh?

What is the XTS' weight level?

It's over 9000!

What? 9000?

Seriously though, this is not even close to a Cimmaron. This car is far away from the worst Cadillac ever

[gm4life]

I wonder if EPII can fit a V8? If there is to be a V8 it will not be a DOHC. GM doesn't have one and won't spend the money to build a DOHC V8 just for this car, especially with the LS V8 easily able to put out 600 horsepower.

That is what I worry about is the EPII wide enough, to transversely mount one? What do you think, because I honestly have no idea...

[Drew Dowdell]

Sing it with me again guys, twin-turbo 3.6 liter V6. In the SEMA Camaro it had something like 465 horsepower. In case you hadn't noticed, Turbocharging is "in" again.

[Satty]

The highest price Lexus LS is a hybrid, I think that if GM does the rest of the car right, a hybrid-only Cadillac flagship will be fine.

Edited January 14, 2010 by Satty

[smk4565]

A transverse mounted V8 is a bad idea, front drive is limited to around 280-290 hp, a V6 can do that. And more power isn't the problem, weight balance is. Front drive or any AWD car with a transverse mounted engine can't do what a rear drive car can do.

[NINETY EIGHT REGENCY]

Just a little humor for those who do not care for the XTS:

The Cadillac Style jingle of the late 1980's and early 1990's when most Cadillacs were front wheel drive:

the commercial:

The jingle words:

The only way to travel is Cadillac Style.

Some people want more, not just a little bit.

This is your life, your the only one who's livin' it.

Let's go, let's live, let's love every mile

The only way to travel is Cadillac Style.

Cadillac, Cadillac, Cadillac Style.

[saxophone solo]

Cadillac, Cadillac, Cadillac Style.

Some people want more, not just a little bit.

This is your life, your the only one who's livin' it.

Let's go, let's live, let's love every mile

The only way to travel is Cadillac Style.

Cadillac, Cadillac, Cadillac Style.

The jingle Reworded to fit XTS:

Cadillac Style:

The only way to travel is with XTS now.

Some people want an Olds, not just a Buick.

This is GM's new line, V6 and front drive is the only way they are selling it.

Let's go, let's live, the Chinese will love this style

The new way to travel is Cadillac XTS Style.

Cadillac, Cadillac, Cadillac XTS Style.

[saxophone solo]

Cadillac, Cadillac, Cadillac XTS Style.

The people on Cheers and Gears want more, GM says they will not get it.

This is GM's line, they are sticking with it.

Let go, let GM live, its front wheel drive for every mile

The only way to travel is Cadillac XTS Style.

Cadillac, Cadillac, Cadillac Style.

[turbo200]

The highest price Lexus LS is a hybrid, I think that if GM does the rest of the car right, a hybrid-only Cadillac flagship will be fine.

the problem is it's hard to visualize this being a competitor in the crowded field of $50k-60k sedans without it being equipped exactly as the concept shown. without the hybrid, AWD, hand sewn interior detailing, extra tech, this is little upgrade from a standard lacrosse.

[turbo200]

at $50k, this is competition for the E-class and 5-series. i seriously don't see it doing well in sales going up against those heady competitors without serious perks. this car should not come ill equipped. make hybrid and awd standard. make the driving dynamics worthy. make the interior worthy.

[Robert Hall]

at $50k, this is competition for the E-class and 5-series. i seriously don't see it doing well in sales going up against those heady competitors without serious perks. this car should not come ill equipped. make hybrid and awd standard. make the driving dynamics worthy. make the interior worthy.

$50k is the price point of a nicely equipped CTS. S-Class, 7-series, LS are all well north of $85k, well over $100k for some versions. I can't see an Epsilon II-based car in that league.

[Blake Noble]

Just make Cadillac the ATS, CTS, Escalade, and park the SRX to the side for the ladies. At least then the brand wouldn't risk losing a huge chunk of credibility.

Edited January 14, 2010 by whiteknight

[turbo200]

$50k is the price point of a nicely equipped CTS. S-Class, 7-series, LS are all well north of $85k, well over $100k for some versions. I can't see an Epsilon II-based car in that league.

well that's exactly my point. in pricing, they won't dream of setting this in the $70k range...offering a car this big for a discount price already is a strike against caddy's image. it shows they don't believe in thier own product enough to price it according to other full size sedans. of course we know they wouldn't because it's based on epsilon, and in the end will not feel like as much of a car as those others.

but then you have it still competing against some really good cars in the 50k-60k price range. i don't know where they will want to come in on price...in 2 years they'll have a 2 year old e-class, a 1 year old 5 series, a new A6 probably debuting around then, new lexus GS, the list goes on and on.

i don't feel without the technology, that this car is going to compete well with 5-series or E-class, which own the prestige label, have sophisticated and powerful engines, have great refined ride and driving characteristics, and aren't going to feel like full size sedans.

again this is cadillac going after discount car buyers. in order to lessen that label, and really make a mark in the luxury field, this should be their luxury hybrid tour de force AWD flagship, for now, but no need to tell buyers that.

imagine what a base FWD xts without the platinum wheels, great interior, flashy tech bits, non-hybrid powertrain would be like.

[balthazar]

Cubical-aka-Moltar =>>"Well, whether you 'buy it' or not, things certainly seem to be moving that way."<<

2009 hybrid marketshare in U.S. by sales : 3%. It's moving that way... very very slowly....

-- -- -- -- --

I read quite a bit here & elsewhere about the XTS last night, and images of the pics kept popping into my head thruout the day. More & more I am liking this car. And I am not going to make complete guesses as to other versions, to be fair I can only comment on what was presented- this XTS Platinum. First, the styling :

The top 3 are all immediately dated. Esp the horrible s-class- with it's '90's Taurus-esque bubble greenhouse & it's mazda-inspired north-south fenders. The car is a styling wreck. Lexus is an anonymous blob with no brand ID. 7-series is just weird with numerous awkward touches. Where is the CS BMW teased us with a couple years ago ??

a8 looks ancient in comparison. The steep angle between the hood & upright windshield, the obvious black outlining the side glass, the laughably cheap plastic triangle at the rear quarter window, the same, blocky fist-dent/ basket handle door pulls we've seen on everything down to $9K econoboxes, and the Lego-inspired, interchangable front & rear fascias... those vertical seams that make it look like they snap on & off--- ruins any fluidity that car attempted to have. Ahh, and the swollen, bulbous, heavy FWD nose....

[Blake Noble]

Looking through the pics in the last post, I can't help but to think that this car could be acceptable if it was engineered to be more like the Audi under the skin. But it's not.

Point-blank: this car needs Zeta. Bad. Mixed reviews are something a flagship car should not have tied around its waist. This car should not only meet but exceed all expectations and, yep, it doesn't.

I just hope GM can steer this particular land-barge the right way before its too late ...

Or else I'll be making more bad Ma and Pa Kettle jokes when the production car is unveiled.

Edited January 14, 2010 by whiteknight

[SAmadei]

Sing it with me again guys, twin-turbo 3.6 liter V6. In the SEMA Camaro it had something like 465 horsepower. In case you hadn't noticed, Turbocharging is "in" again.

Twin turbo V6 sounds expensive and a hassle to maintain.

I'd take a supercharged V6... but I'm sorry... when I want power... I want it now... less than a tenth of a second. Turbos lag, and aren't for me. IMHO, most normal GM stuff has too much fuel injector lag, let alone turbo lag.

I haven't seen the power graphs for this twin turbo'd V6, but I doubt it really passes the "area under the line" test. I don't want to have to drive my car like I stole it just to keep up with a decade old supercharged Grand Prix.

Color me skeptical.

[pow]

Making it full-hybrid makes sense... it's one more differentiating factor from the LaCrosse, and it allows GM to charge a premium for it. A plug-in 100 MPG version (like the proposed VUE) would be groundbreaking.

If the production car has all the detail and size of this concept, IMO Cadillac can still charge $62K for a fully-loaded "base" hybrid. They already charge that much for a tarted-up Tahoe.

Edited January 14, 2010 by pow

[bobo]

My first thought when I saw the car was Cadillac BLS, Take 2. It looks like a reskinned Buick Lacrosse, with a greenhouse that has a little too much Malibu or Jetta. It's not terrible, but it's a Cadillac for Grampa.

[cire]

Cubical-aka-Moltar =>>"Well, whether you 'buy it' or not, things certainly seem to be moving that way."<<

2009 hybrid marketshare in U.S. by sales : 3%. It's moving that way... very very slowly....

-- -- -- -- --

I read quite a bit here & elsewhere about the XTS last night, and images of the pics kept popping into my head thruout the day. More & more I am liking this car. And I am not going to make complete guesses as to other versions, to be fair I can only comment on what was presented- this XTS Platinum. First, the styling :

The top 3 are all immediately dated. Esp the horrible s-class- with it's '90's Taurus-esque bubble greenhouse & it's mazda-inspired north-south fenders. The car is a styling wreck. Lexus is an anonymous blob with no brand ID. 7-series is just weird with numerous awkward touches. Where is the CS BMW teased us with a couple years ago ??

a8 looks ancient in comparison. The steep angle between the hood & upright windshield, the obvious black outlining the side glass, the laughably cheap plastic triangle at the rear quarter window, the same, blocky fist-dent/ basket handle door pulls we've seen on everything down to $9K econoboxes, and the Lego-inspired, interchangable front & rear fascias... those vertical seams that make it look like they snap on & off--- ruins any fluidity that car attempted to have. Ahh, and the swollen, bulbous, heavy FWD nose....

I have to admit that the new A8 looks very dated and pathetic in comparison to the XTS Concept. I would probably choose the XTS if I were given a choice between these 2 cars.

That being said, I still see what I perceive to be an Epsilon II based Impala in the overall shape. It's not bad or unattractive, but it just doesn't represent "Cadillac" to me. To me, the overall shape would make a killer flagship sedan (and a competent Taurus competitor) for Chevrolet.

[Drew Dowdell]

Twin turbo V6 sounds expensive and a hassle to maintain.

Oh right, because V12s are such misers in that regard.

I'd take a supercharged V6... but I'm sorry... when I want power... I want it now... less than a tenth of a second. Turbos lag, and aren't for me. IMHO, most normal GM stuff has too much fuel injector lag, let alone turbo lag.

I haven't seen the power graphs for this twin turbo'd V6, but I doubt it really passes the "area under the line" test. I don't want to have to drive my car like I stole it just to keep up with a decade old supercharged Grand Prix.

Color me skeptical.

BMW has twin turbos, why can't Cadillac?

The DI 3.6 has great low end torque even in it's current iterations. Even the 280hp version in the Lacrosse moves with much gusto.

[NINETY EIGHT REGENCY]

I had to sit and think about this. I have no issues with the car. It looks nice, I like the digital/lcd instrumentation and the length of the car. I do not care for the seat control placement or the no bench seat, but other than that, it is fine.

I thought about this in detail..

This car is not Cadillacs flagship. Cadillac is up to something. They are not telling.

Here is my thinking..

CTS will get larger next time around to increase interior room and put it more on par with E Class and BMW 5 series. It is the right length now, but interior room is not on par with them.

This car is like a Lexus ES 330 or something midlevel like that. Some or most of those cars are front wheel drive. Buick is an Acura fighter( or trying to be one). That may be the reason why they are on the same platform.

That is why no Buick will be bigger than LaCrosse so they will not compete with Cadillac. Buick's image is being reestablished.

GM may need time to develop a true flagship car. I would not be shocked if it and the next Holden Caprice and Statesman and some Chevrolet shared the same platform with modifications.

A true flagship would have a longer wheelbase and length. This car is doing what CTS did when it first came out.. that is to find its segment. GM is watching the market and this car really replaces the STS more than it does DTS.

GM is watching gas prices and the market. This car plays it safe if fuel prices go up and more, GM is covered. If they stay where they are and GM is released from its current situation, they you could create a true flagship. Cadillac would not make a flagship smaller than a Mercedes Benz S Class or BMW 7 Series.

This car is as long the 7 Series and Lexus LS.

ATS is the 3 Series fighter.

This car is designed for a global market not just America. This car will replace SLS in China.

This car competes directly with Lincoln MKS.

There will be a flagship model battle coming between Lincoln and Cadillac in the future. They both know they need a rear drive long wheelbase flagship.

Think about it.. this car is a hybrid too. A flagship would cost a lot of money and be bigger and heavier. You have to have something to appeal to the masses that brings in the cash to make other models. This is Cadillacs Impala....

Watch what happens...

[SAmadei]

Oh right, because V12s are such misers in that regard.

Big deal, a few more plugs, valves, pistons and main bearings... all stuff designed to last a long time with minimal upkeep.

Turbos... they get extremely hot, spin at excessive speeds and require special cooling and lubrication. Plus you need to replumb the exhaust and intake to make engine access a bear. Turbos have a long history of coking up, destroying bearings, grenading, and even ones working properly have lag.

BMW has twin turbos, why can't Cadillac?

The DI 3.6 has great low end torque even in it's current iterations. Even the 280hp version in the Lacrosse moves with much gusto.

BMW has the bangle-butt, why can't Cadillac... you can apply that to anything. BMW has a N-S drivetrain and real RWD, why can't the big Caddy?

For some reason, I don't think granpa is going to care much for the way a DI 3.6 twin turbo in a 4400 lb Caddy is going to spin the front wheels and torque the car into the next lane.

[Robert Hall]

BMW has the bangle-butt, why can't Cadillac... you can apply that to anything. BMW has a N-S drivetrain and real RWD, why can't the big Caddy?

For some reason, I don't think granpa is going to care much for the way a DI 3.6 twin turbo in a 4400 lb Caddy is going to spin the front wheels and torque the car into the next lane.

Speaking of people cross-shopping BMWs w/ Caddys,et al..I know one anecdotal story of a friend's father--not a car enthusiast, but a civilian--that had an '02 Merc S-class--had massive electrical problems, traded it after a couple years on an '04 BMW 7 series--had problems w/ the I-drive, brakes, etc--traded on an '06 DTS. Still has the DTS last time I talked w/ my friend, been happy w/ it.

[Lamar]

Speaking of people cross-shopping BMWs w/ Caddys,et al..I know one anecdotal story of a friend's father--not a car enthusiast, but a civilian--that had an '02 Merc S-class--had massive electrical problems, traded it after a couple years on an '04 BMW 7 series--had problems w/ the I-drive, brakes, etc--traded on an '06 DTS. Still has the DTS last time I talked w/ my friend, been happy w/ it.

Both of those were kinda the dark days of MB and BMW, too... MB with quality issues, and BMW with iDrive and the beginnings of the Bangle butt.

[Intrepidation]

Balthy's comparison with the A8 does show that it's a lot better to look at than the A8.

Something that worries me though is that according to C&D GM insiders are saying the production XTS won't be as wide or dramatically styled. Considering this is far from dramatic and the car's opinions are mixed already, that doesn't bode well for the production car.

[Robert Hall]

Balthy's comparison with the A8 does show that it's a lot better to look at than the A8.

Not to me. The A8 looks much better, IMHO. Nicer proportions, clean lines.

[ZL-1]

Something that worries me though is that according to C&D GM insiders are saying the production XTS won't be as wide or dramatically styled. Considering this is far from dramatic and the car's opinions are mixed already, that doesn't bode well for the production car.

Read that too... strikes me as odd, so I hope someone at C&D misunderstood what those GM insiders meant.

Edited January 14, 2010 by ZL-1

[Intrepidation]

Not to me. The A8 looks much better, IMHO. Nicer proportions, clean lines.

Have you seen the front overhang on that car? It's completely boring and the only giveaway that its the new one is the LED lights.

[balthazar]

I really, seriously think that the much-maligned 'grandpa' demographic is going to be seriously turned off by the wild electronics/digitals inside (at least as presented on the Platinum). Too confusing and 'new fangled'... but I CAN see it appealing to the youthful techies quite readily.

Agree with everyone who said this need to be the ONLY XTS offered: hybrid, AWD. The performance would be competitive, and there'd be no 'torquing into the next lane' with AWD & 350 HP.

Also agree with those that said this is NOT the Cadillac flagship- it is the DTS replacement with the same degree of step-up over the DTS as the CTS was over the Catera.

But with European pedestrian impact requirements, and the ever-present emphasis on interior volume, enlongated greenhouses & higher hoodlines are the future- A8 & s-class are old school.

With the CTS sedan & coupe vs. their concepts, I have high hope the 'XTS' will show a like degree of faith to this concept in every regard.

[smk4565]

Turbos are fine, especially when you do a twin turbo with one smaller that kicks in right away, then a second larger one for when it revs up more. BMW has made this work.

The problem of being over a foot longer than an E-class, and likely costing the same, maybe even less than an E-class remains. This is just a modernized DTS, and is Epsilon II really any better than the G-body chassis? I haven't been in an Epsilon II car to compare, but Epsilon 1 wasn't as good as the G-body in my opinion.

And let's remember, this is a concept, and the Platinum trim level. Probably some of this stuff won't be on the production model, and what will the base trim be like? I doubt the base car has the hybrid stuff (that will drive up cost) and I would guess FWD is standard because that adds cost and lowers fuel economy. So the base XTS, is then not much different than the current DTS and just a dressed up Buick.

[smk4565]

The DI 3.6 has great low end torque even in it's current iterations. Even the 280hp version in the Lacrosse moves with much gusto.

For the LaCrosse that is fine. But a Camry V6 has 268 hp and is 3500 or so pounds and moves with gusto as well. The problem is front drive has a limit, and cars that cost $30,000 already found it. That 280 hp may be more than enough for a Buick, but at $50-60,000 Cadillac is going against 350-400 hp cars.

[Lamar]

Also agree with those that said this is NOT the Cadillac flagship- it is the DTS replacement with the same degree of step-up over the DTS as the CTS was over the Catera.

GM itself has dubbed this the new flagship. Many times.

If a "proper" flagship is still coming, why waste money, time, and floor space on this? There is nothing, content-wise, in it or on it that would have been lost had they even put the concept on Zeta. Or even a stretched Sigma II, since it's just a concept.

[balthazar]

^ So what does this mean then ? :

>>" “A real luxury flagship is still on our wishlist,” says Clay Dean, Cadillac design chief.<<

[caddycruiser]

It didn't sizzle me at first...but pictures aren't giving the real effect of it, at all. It's classy, crisp, and big Cadillac without being over the edge as much. Maybe boring to some, but we'll see in more time.

I trust Peter DeLorenzo when he calls it his best in show, period. That doesn't happen unless it's THERE, and as he said tonight on AutoLine in reference to forum & web chatter (such as "it looks like a Taurus") you simply have no idea until you see this car in person, from the shape to the sheer size of it. Can't wait for it, Epsilon II AWD & all. Great. The STS never sold, the DTS is old, and this seems great, hopefully to sell in big numbers.

http://www.autoextremist.com/

The Autoextremist Best in Show: I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again, but Ed Welburn’s troops at GM Design have been on a roll for several years now, and they’ve done it yet again with the sensational Cadillac XTS Platinum Concept. Wonderfully proportioned and craftily rendered, the surface detailing alone on this machine is nothing short of a clinic on how it’s done. Combine that with an interior design and execution that’s simply second to none, and the XTS Platinum has everything a car worthy of “best in show” accolades must have from where we sit. The Cadillac XTS Platinum not only has a majestic presence, it’s clearly the direct spiritual successor to the magnificent Sixteen concept from several years ago. The XTS Platinum will allow Cadillac to take its rightful place again as the ultimate expression of American luxury, and the new Standard of the World.

Not nitpicking a proportion here or there, just want to see more. It's not a big Lacross, Malibu, etc., it's a BIG Cadillac, and one done great. Zeta can't be everything and, honestly, for this car, Sigma aside, I think EP-II with the DI 3.6L, Hybrid and whatever else are good moves.

Just my take

Edited January 15, 2010 by caddycruiser

[Drew Dowdell]

If the Regal GS can have AWD with torque sent primarily to the rear, why can't the XTS?

[pow]

If the Regal GS can have AWD with torque sent primarily to the rear, why can't the XTS?

With a Haldex system, that only occurs when the front wheels start to slip. It's not "predictive" AWD like it is on Audis, Subarus, etc. Still, I don't think that really matters on a car like this. Most of the effort should go to poshness and design, IMO.

[Drew Dowdell]

With a Haldex system, that only occurs when the front wheels start to slip. It's not "predictive" AWD like it is on Audis, Subarus, etc. Still, I don't think that really matters on a car like this. Most of the effort should go to poshness and design, IMO.

No. You can set the AWD in the Regal GS to send the majority of the torque to the rear wheels. It has 3 modes.

[balthazar]

With some of the design work coming out of GM recently, I give appropriate credit to Welburn's comments RE the XTS.

DeLorenzo... I have had major issues with in some of his past pieces... he has a chip on his shoulder WRT GM... but perhaps that earns his comments even more legitimacy coming from him, if that's true.

I would truely like to see this one in person, more than any other modern vehicle I can remember.

[Blake Noble]

I really, seriously think that the much-maligned 'grandpa' demographic is going to be seriously turned off by the wild electronics/digitals inside (at least as presented on the Platinum). Too confusing and 'new fangled'... but I CAN see it appealing to the youthful techies quite readily.

Exactly what I ranted about earlier. The DTS pretty much has the same switch gear you find in an Impala; it's simple and straight-forward with no guess work, although I can see an Old Blue Hair getting a little confused about how to get the Sat-Nav to not direct you to Deliverance, Georgia. The XTS is going to really turn away those traditional buyers who want to just turn a knob to turn on the heat in the depths of winter and not program in 90 different codes.

I don't this car appealing to the tech-savvy younger demographic you mentioned that could afford this car; the core specifications are too much like their grandma's old Deville. That will be enough to keep them in their BMWs and Mercs.

Agree with everyone who said this need to be the ONLY XTS offered: hybrid, AWD. The performance would be competitive, and there'd be no 'torquing into the next lane' with AWD & 350 HP.

The ugly truth: there will be a base model and the Haldex AWD system will probably be optional.

Also agree with those that said this is NOT the Cadillac flagship- it is the DTS replacement with the same degree of step-up over the DTS as the CTS was over the Catera.

The CTS was a major step up in styling and driving dynamics versus the Catera and easily rivaled the competition. While the XTS is, in a few key areas, a major step up in styling, it won't have driving dynamics that should blow the DTS into the weeds and seriously compete with the names that have just about eclipsed Cadillac in this segment.

But with European pedestrian impact requirements, and the ever-present emphasis on interior volume, enlongated greenhouses & higher hoodlines are the future- A8 & s-class are old school.

It still shouldn't compromise styling when done correctly, though. And even still, the car's Achilles Heel is the front-drive platform pretty much forcing the extreme cab forward styling.

With the CTS sedan & coupe vs. their concepts, I have high hope the 'XTS' will show a like degree of faith to this concept in every regard.

I won't be holding my breath.

[Lamar]

^ So what does this mean then ? :

>>" “A real luxury flagship is still on our wishlist,” says Clay Dean, Cadillac design chief.<<

Means they waffled on this one.

Edited January 15, 2010 by Lamar

[CanadianBacon94]

I am getting so annoyed about the people, with their geezer cruiser, torque steer, and low power Complaints(is their any point i'm missing?)

firstly, i find this automobile, supremely attractive from any angle, and it has an amazing interior.

Greezer cruiser, is the LaCrosse a geezer car, no its meant to lower the average age of Buick buyers, it is not a floaty or old school Buick, example, the regal has an optional manual transmission. This will definitely include the fancy shocks that can change in milliseconds. putting all this together i believe this will at the very minimum handle COMPETITIVELY in this class

torque steer/FWD? people this is a AWD vehicle, and in the Regal it can send more torque to the rear wheels than the front so my guess is you will be able to in this application as well. also about the V-8 CarAndDriver said that "that two more cylinders are an easy fit up front." and besides if this is a hybrid i'm guessing that instead of putting out a v-8 or turbo six, they will add the 149(to 200) HP electric motors from the volt(200 as in i would like to see that the converje receives more power, but it would be better as a Buick Electra) to the 304 HP 3.6L V-6. This would equal class leading horse power in the 5 series size class and class competitive in the 7 series class.

with everything i have stated above i think it will be easy to charge in the 49995(Base AWD, V-6 No hybrid)-69999(Platinum Hybrid,) dollar range right where GM would like to price it, it would not seem too cheap to compete and it would definitely feel expensive.

[CaddyXLR-V]

If the Regal GS can have AWD with torque sent primarily to the rear, why can't the XTS?

The strangest part to me, is that GM always backs out on RWD, and uses CAFE, and weight as an excuse. So they can't make a RWD car, because it is too inefficient, yet they can make a heavier AWD car? For efficiency purposes, which they must care about or this car wouldn't be a hybrid, wouldn't RWD be more efficient, with less drivetrain losses and lower weight?

[Drew Dowdell]

In this case, I think it was more the platform they were doing it on. Back when they started designing this thing Zeta was dead to the US except for the Camaro. The only other option was to use EpsII.

[Intrepidation]

In this case, I think it was more the platform they were doing it on. Back when they started designing this thing Zeta was dead to the US except for the Camaro. The only other option was to use EpsII.

This right here.

[Justin Bimmer]

Also, I don't think a lack of RWD products from GM has been because of CAFE. I think it has been because their business plan from old school bean counters said no to it.

[NOS2006]

Also, I don't think a lack of RWD products from GM has been because of CAFE. I think it has been because their business plan from old school bean counters said no to it.

+1