Inside the 2010 Camaro SS

[Justin Bimmer]

I wouldn't be too worried about CAFE. Every time they raise the CAFE numbers, every auto company becomes doubting thomases. Yet, they still find a way to meet the legal requires and INCREASE power output.

[Daryl Z71]

Hell Im just happy the thing has a better designed motor instead of the POS LT1 thats in my car. When I sat in one at the dealer I thought the interior was the best yet, and again ALOT better than my POS LT1 Camaro.

[Chazman]

I wouldn't be too worried about CAFE. Every time they raise the CAFE numbers, every auto company becomes doubting thomases. Yet, they still find a way to meet the legal requires and INCREASE power output.

I don't know if we'll see alot of power increases in the near future, but my impressions are that meeting CAFE will not be the bear we think it will be. The emphasis now will be on weight loss. So in effect, we may get cars with better power to weight, even if hp stays the same or drops slightly. I find that pretty exciting actually.

[gm4life]

I don't know if we'll see alot of power increases in the near future, but my impressions are that meeting CAFE will not be the bear we think it will be. The emphasis now will be on weight loss. So in effect, we may get cars with better power to weight, even if hp stays the same or drops slightly. I find that pretty exciting actually.

Smaller cars do not excite me sorry, just an honest disagreement. The government in a free country telling what kind of cars and trucks we need to drive doesn't excited me. I guess I like big cars, and always have. We shouldn't have to have our car compaines already struggling trying to meet this standards. That said I just don't think there is anyway we will have a bunch of 8 cylinder American cars running around after the current model cycle.

[A Horse With No Name]

Hell Im just happy the thing has a better designed motor instead of the POS LT1 thats in my car. When I sat in one at the dealer I thought the interior was the best yet, and again ALOT better than my POS LT1 Camaro.

Your LT1 Camaro is still a very special car. At my last house I had a neighbor who always kept a very low mile 82 Indy Pace Car Replica Camaro in his garage. Sweet car. Your LT-1 Car was state of the art for 1994...

Hmm...let's see....my son was born in 93, the year your style of Camaro first came out....he's now 16...good to know GM has had some great people at work on the Camaro.

Hopefully Daryl you get a Trifecta...your LT-1, a Modern Camaro, and your sweet truck.

Then You can go Double Trifecta-A 70-Z28 Rally Sport, an 010 Camaro SS, and your current Camaro

Combined with

SSR, 1958 Chevrolet Cameo, and your current truck.

THAT would be awesome.

Chris

[Drew Dowdell]

I am not betting on it with CAFE. I have looked at it and there is no WAY. A V8 might be around but it will be a range topping 50K Z28 and bet it won't be as big as the 6.2L due to the smaller size. I keep saying for my son and I the 5th generation SS is the car for us.

CAFE will be the least of your worries.

[gm4life]

CAFE will be the least of your worries.

You really think? And if so why do you say that, just wondering.

[SAmadei]

Hell Im just happy the thing has a better designed motor instead of the POS LT1 thats in my car. When I sat in one at the dealer I thought the interior was the best yet, and again ALOT better than my POS LT1 Camaro.

Whats wrong with the LT1? Its a nice upgrade over previous small blocks. Sure, its no LS{1,2,3}, but then the LS series will seem lame when the next generation of cold fusion small blocks come out featuring 60mpg and 900 hp.

[Chazman]

Smaller cars do not excite me sorry, just an honest disagreement. .

Fair enough. Of course the 5th gen is large on the outside but small on the inside.

[A Horse With No Name]

CAFE will be the least of your worries.

The crashing economy that will continue to decline, peak oil, the changing buyer demographic, increased competion from cars like the Hyundai Genesis, safety concerns, market saturation in the pony car segment, social pressures on GM to build more cars like the Volt, the decline of men as the main breadwinner in the home, the rise of a female buying demographic, et al.

Mostly the buying demographic of this new Camaro is 40+. This group of men is the hardest hit by the current economy and will continue to be the hardest hit. Before, middle aged white guys could ride out bad economic times. This current downturn has white guys over 40 (like me) in its crosshairs.

As this group gets older, GM will have more luck selling them a car like the Malibu or Lacrosse if they still have good jobs.

Not saying performance will go away completely...it won't...but the market will shrink and GM is smart enough to know this.

Like I said, if you wnt one, get it now.

Chris

[A Horse With No Name]

Fair enough. Of course the 5th gen is large on the outside but small on the inside.

Part of that is safety, part of that is style. The Prius is big on the inside and moderatly sized on the outside...do you want the Camaro to look like the Prius?

Part of the issue is the "crumple zone" in the side of the car. Do a side intrusion crash test with a 68 Camaro and an 010 Camaro and tell me what you think.

Chris

[A Horse With No Name]

Smaller cars do not excite me sorry, just an honest disagreement. The government in a free country telling what kind of cars and trucks we need to drive doesn't excited me. I guess I like big cars, and always have. We shouldn't have to have our car compaines already struggling trying to meet this standards. That said I just don't think there is anyway we will have a bunch of 8 cylinder American cars running around after the current model cycle.

Maybe the government is trying to work in our actual best interest so that we don't have a bunch of people locked into payments of $429 a month on Trailblazers when gas goes to 6 bucks a gallon and the world supply is starting to run short?

Just a thought. We have hit and passed peak oil. The only reason that prices are so low is that the economy is in the tank. Give it time, high gas prices and shortages will be back.

If I could I would cruise around in a 58 Pontiac Bonneville for the rest of my days on this rock. However, given the choice of driving a Priuslike or VW TDI like car and walking...the Prius/TDI wins over walking every time for some really odd reason.

But I would love to drive a 58 Bonneville forever, belive me!

Chris

[Chazman]

Part of that is safety, part of that is style. The Prius is big on the inside and moderatly sized on the outside...do you want the Camaro to look like the Prius?

Part of the issue is the "crumple zone" in the side of the car. Do a side intrusion crash test with a 68 Camaro and an 010 Camaro and tell me what you think.

Chris

Jeeze dude, there sure is a LOOOOOOOOONG stretch between wanting Camaro to slim down and wanting it to "look like a Prius".

BTW, you do know that the lighter Mustang gets 5 star frontal crash ratings and the Camaro 4.

[Drew Dowdell]

You really think? And if so why do you say that, just wondering.

Because even if GM builds a V8 engine and thumbs their nose at CAFE, you won't be able to afford to fuel it.

The biggest story that hasn't been in the news lately is that all of the major oil fields are now in steadily increasing decline. The oil producing countries are trying to pump more oil to make up for recession losses, but the oil fields simply aren't producing.

Mexico will stop exporting oil around 2014. Even if they found the world's largest untouched reserve tomorrow, that oil wouldn't come online till after Mexico was forced to stop exports.

[gm4life]

Because even if GM builds a V8 engine and thumbs their nose at CAFE, you won't be able to afford to fuel it.

The biggest story that hasn't been in the news lately is that all of the major oil fields are now in steadily increasing decline. The oil producing countries are trying to pump more oil to make up for recession losses, but the oil fields simply aren't producing.

Mexico will stop exporting oil around 2014. Even if they found the world's largest untouched reserve tomorrow, that oil wouldn't come online till after Mexico was forced to stop exports.

I see what your saying. That is why a 5 generation Camaro is perfect for me, big car, and a big motor!

Edited September 30, 2009 by gm4life

[gm4life]

Maybe the government is trying to work in our actual best interest so that we don't have a bunch of people locked into payments of $429 a month on Trailblazers when gas goes to 6 bucks a gallon and the world supply is starting to run short?

Just a thought. We have hit and passed peak oil. The only reason that prices are so low is that the economy is in the tank. Give it time, high gas prices and shortages will be back.

If I could I would cruise around in a 58 Pontiac Bonneville for the rest of my days on this rock. However, given the choice of driving a Priuslike or VW TDI like car and walking...the Prius/TDI wins over walking every time for some really odd reason.

But I would love to drive a 58 Bonneville forever, belive me!

Chris

I understand that but I don't want government telling me what to drive. We should be free to drive what we want even if gas is $6 a gallon.

[gm4life]

Fair enough. Of course the 5th gen is large on the outside but small on the inside.

I know that is why I am passing on a sunroof. :AH-HA_wink:

[A Horse With No Name]

I understand that but I don't want government telling me what to drive. We should be free to drive what we want even if gas is $6 a gallon.

I don't want either of my sons drafted to go fight on the other side of this rock so we can have dead dino juice to run our cars.

As much as I hate to admit it, I have bought my last V8 car I think.

Chris

[A Horse With No Name]

Jeeze dude, there sure is a LOOOOOOOOONG stretch between wanting Camaro to slim down and wanting it to "look like a Prius".

BTW, you do know that the lighter Mustang gets 5 star frontal crash ratings and the Camaro 4.

I pegged the sarcasm meter and at least one person seemed to notice. GREAT!

Agree with you about the Camaro being lighter. However, this will for the reasons that Oldsmoboi and I have put forth probably be the last V8 musclecar Camaro ever.

Does it have faults? yes.

Do I want one? Yes.

Just want us all to enjoy this car for what it is for as long as it is around.

Will I buy one? No, probably a more fuel efficient sporty car like a GTI or a MINI Cooper S. So you can understand that I like light, sweet cars.

I just want one with the fuel economy of the S when gas hits 6 bucks a gallon.

Chris

[Chazman]

I pegged the sarcasm meter and at least one person seemed to notice. GREAT!

Agree with you about the Camaro being lighter. However, this will for the reasons that Oldsmoboi and I have put forth probably be the last V8 musclecar Camaro ever.

Does it have faults? yes.

Do I want one? Yes.

Just want us all to enjoy this car for what it is for as long as it is around.

Will I buy one? No, probably a more fuel efficient sporty car like a GTI or a MINI Cooper S. So you can understand that I like light, sweet cars.

I just want one with the fuel economy of the S when gas hits 6 bucks a gallon.

Chris

Well, would you be against a smaller lighter Camaro, with an available turbo 4, which gets over 30 MPG?

BTW, I think the GTI and Mini S are great cars. I wish GM had something like that to offer us.

[Drew Dowdell]

I understand that but I don't want government telling me what to drive. We should be free to drive what we want even if gas is $6 a gallon.

See, that's the wrong attitude to take. What you should be thinking (yes, I'm a Democrat, so I can tell you what to think) is, "We should be free to drive what we want even if that means rebuilding our entire fuel infrastructure around an alternative fuel."

I fully support your wish to drive whatever you want with however big of an engine you want. What I don't support is your desire to fuel it with whatever you want.

[A Horse With No Name]

Well, would you be against a smaller lighter Camaro, with an available turbo 4, which gets over 30 MPG?

BTW, I think the GTI and Mini S are great cars. I wish GM had something like that to offer us.

Dude, that would be the car of my current dreams. My only two points in this thread are:

1 We can't diss the current Camaro too baldy, it is one hell of an effort from the general. No car is perfect, but the new (current) Camaro is one hell of an effort.

2. Enjoy it now, it will be the last of it's breed.

I am actually hoping that GM comes out with a cool premium small car, along the lines of the GTI and the Mini S. Most of the cars I have owned have been GM and I have had great luck with them. A car starting every day without complaint in the middle of an Ohio winter year in and year out...that does a lot to generate good faith.

Chris

[Camino LS6]

(yes, I'm a Democrat, so I can tell you what to think)

The republicans do that too...

Agreed on the fuels, that's what we should be changing - not the cars.

[Chazman]

Dude, that would be the car of my current dreams. My only two points in this thread are:

1 We can't diss the current Camaro too baldy, it is one hell of an effort from the general. No car is perfect, but the new (current) Camaro is one hell of an effort.

2. Enjoy it now, it will be the last of it's breed.

I am actually hoping that GM comes out with a cool premium small car, along the lines of the GTI and the Mini S. Most of the cars I have owned have been GM and I have had great luck with them. A car starting every day without complaint in the middle of an Ohio winter year in and year out...that does a lot to generate good faith.

Chris

Although it doesn't hit my personal bullseye, I agree, it's a hell of an effort. Considering what the Camaro Team was given as a basis, the constraints they were under and just the general atmosphere of chaos and bad politics - I give them credit.

Last of the breed? If you mean a two ton ponycar? Then thankfully yes. If you mean last of the viscerally styled, exciting, RWD coupes - not by a long shot.

I'm hoping GM enters the Mini/GTI segment too. But those two not only are great cars, they've got alot of brand equity in them. Chevy would need alot of focus to create something like that out the Cruze or Aveo.

[CaddyXLR-V]

The republicans do that too...

Agreed on the fuels, that's what we should be changing - not the cars.

But they shouldn't take away the cars we want in the meantime either.

[Camino LS6]

But they shouldn't take away the cars we want in the meantime either.

Absolutely not!

Pronouncements from "on high" tick me off no matter which party is the source - gets my "Irish" up.

Not to mention it is a surrender-based approach.

We can, and should, do better.

[Drew Dowdell]

But they shouldn't take away the cars we want in the meantime either.

At the same time, we should also be more flexible about "the cars we want". We can be stuck in this "Give me a gasoline powered pushrod V8 or give me death!" mentality. Ford is busily proving that there is no supreme need for V8s. Before any of you V8-Or-Die people protest, I'll remind you that most of you would drop trousers for a Buick GNX.

I don't car if my next car is a 4 1/2 cylinder hybrid that is fueled with the by-product of puppy dog smiles as long as it's powerful, cheep to fuel, and doesn't fund terrorist countries.

[Robert Hall]

I'd like to have a midsize RWD or AWD luxury sedan w/ a diesel that gets over 30mpg. Europeans can get them, we can't. That sucks. Likewise, I'd be interested in a torquey diesel Camaro or Mustang..

[A Horse With No Name]

Hmmm...a diesel Camaro. I remember when stoners with Camaros used to go and "roll yards" by backing into peoples yards and doing burnouts.

Some of the VW TDI guys "soot" people who cut them off in traffic.

The thought of a Camaro driver "sooting" someone with black smoke just strikes me as funny.

Chris

[A Horse With No Name]

At the same time, we should also be more flexible about "the cars we want". We can be stuck in this "Give me a gasoline powered pushrod V8 or give me death!" mentality. Ford is busily proving that there is no supreme need for V8s. Before any of you V8-Or-Die people protest, I'll remind you that most of you would drop trousers for a Buick GNX.

I don't car if my next car is a 4 1/2 cylinder hybrid that is fueled with the by-product of puppy dog smiles as long as it's powerful, cheep to fuel, and doesn't fund terrorist countries.

I would agree. Like I said, I'd rather race a 4 cyl car than walk!

Chris

[A Horse With No Name]

Last of the breed? If you mean a two ton ponycar? Then thankfully yes. If you mean last of the viscerally styled, exciting, RWD coupes - not by a long shot.

Would love to see GM also build a RWD modern coupe like the Hyundai Genesis. Perhaps a pipe dream, but there were some neat sketches in one of the Buick threads recently.

[Drew Dowdell]

Hmmm...a diesel Camaro. I remember when stoners with Camaros used to go and "roll yards" by backing into peoples yards and doing burnouts.

Some of the VW TDI guys "soot" people who cut them off in traffic.

The thought of a Camaro driver "sooting" someone with black smoke just strikes me as funny.

Chris

I thought the Camaro being sold in the EU was going to get the 2.9litre.

[CaddyXLR-V]

At the same time, we should also be more flexible about "the cars we want". We can be stuck in this "Give me a gasoline powered pushrod V8 or give me death!" mentality. Ford is busily proving that there is no supreme need for V8s. Before any of you V8-Or-Die people protest, I'll remind you that most of you would drop trousers for a Buick GNX.

I don't car if my next car is a 4 1/2 cylinder hybrid that is fueled with the by-product of puppy dog smiles as long as it's powerful, cheep to fuel, and doesn't fund terrorist countries.

I'm already fairly flexible. I love V8s, but I'll accept a V6 and love turbo V6s. I want a lighter car, as light as possible, as long as I fit in it comfortably. I'd consider a turbo 4 if it can meet my performance requirements, although I hate how they sound.

I don't want a 2 ton car, but I also don't think every car should be required to get 40mpg either.

[A Horse With No Name]

A TDI VW Jetta can get 40 MPG with it's eyes closed and its a damn comfortable car.

Europe has been building diesel Benzes since the dawn of humanity and they get really good fuel economy also.

Something along the lines of a small Benz, RWD, with a good diesel and a nice interior package would make a sweet touring car and could easily turn 40 MPG.

But again, we need to work on the fuel source, not just the cars.

[A Horse With No Name]

And we should simplify other ways we live also. Ever think of how much energy it takes to keep twenty fast food resteraunts running on a Friday night? Or a modern department store?

There are ways we can do better.

Chris

[CaddyXLR-V]

And we should simplify other ways we live also. Ever think of how much energy it takes to keep twenty fast food resteraunts running on a Friday night? Or a modern department store?

There are ways we can do better.

Chris

Living in Arizona, where it's sunny 99% of the year, I think they should put solar panels on everything.

[CaddyXLR-V]

A TDI VW Jetta can get 40 MPG with it's eyes closed and its a damn comfortable car.

Europe has been building diesel Benzes since the dawn of humanity and they get really good fuel economy also.

Something along the lines of a small Benz, RWD, with a good diesel and a nice interior package would make a sweet touring car and could easily turn 40 MPG.

But again, we need to work on the fuel source, not just the cars.

That's great, but for me, I want performance somewhere along the lines of my GTO. The only car that comes close, while getting good mpg(still not 40mpg) is the Elise, and I doubt I would fit comfortably in it.

[z28luvr01]

Given their displacement, performance output, and curb weight of the cars they're put in, the current crop of V8s get excellent fuel economy. If the past is any indication, the V8 will evolve with the times, so I wouldn't be quick to discard it.

[Robert Hall]

A TDI VW Jetta can get 40 MPG with it's eyes closed and its a damn comfortable car.

Europe has been building diesel Benzes since the dawn of humanity and they get really good fuel economy also.

I've thought an E-Class Bluetec CDI w/ 4Matic would be ideal..now if I could get the equivalent of that in a CTS w/ a manual, I'd have found my perfect commuter car.

[Robert Hall]

Living in Arizona, where it's sunny 99% of the year, I think they should put solar panels on everything.

+1.

You would think the solar energy biz would be big out here.

[Drew Dowdell]

That's great, but for me, I want performance somewhere along the lines of my GTO. The only car that comes close, while getting good mpg(still not 40mpg) is the Elise, and I doubt I would fit comfortably in it.

a 3.6 liter Duramax in a G8 would fit the bill quite nicely.

[CaddyXLR-V]

a 3.6 liter Duramax in a G8 would fit the bill quite nicely.

Are there any diesel cars that do 0-60 in 5.5 seconds or the 1/4 mile in 13 seconds? I doubt a diesel G8 would be that quick. I wouldn't mind a diesel as a commuter car, because it still has better performance than hybrids while getting great gas mileage, but for my fun car, I just don't see diesel having as much performance as I would like.

[Robert Hall]

Are there any diesel cars that do 0-60 in 5.5 seconds or the 1/4 mile in 13 seconds?

Don't know, don't care..I'm not a drag racer, more interested in all around performance (i.e. handling, braking, steering, etc. ) BMW's 330d seems quite performant for what it is..

[A Horse With No Name]

a 3.6 liter Duramax in a G8 would fit the bill quite nicely.

Not just yes but Hell yes!

Love the idea.

Chris

[A Horse With No Name]

...and yes the 330d is quite the car.

Chris

[Bimmer325]

Are there any diesel cars that do 0-60 in 5.5 seconds or the 1/4 mile in 13 seconds?

Serious question?

[gm4life]

See, that's the wrong attitude to take. What you should be thinking (yes, I'm a Democrat, so I can tell you what to think) is, "We should be free to drive what we want even if that means rebuilding our entire fuel infrastructure around an alternative fuel."

I fully support your wish to drive whatever you want with however big of an engine you want. What I don't support is your desire to fuel it with whatever you want.

I understand where your coming from. I would love to be able to run it on bio-fuel!

Edited September 30, 2009 by gm4life

[gm4life]

Given their displacement, performance output, and curb weight of the cars they're put in, the current crop of V8s get excellent fuel economy. If the past is any indication, the V8 will evolve with the times, so I wouldn't be quick to discard it.

We can only hope so... I do really hope your right.

[gm4life]

All of this talk is making me want a new Camaro SS more and more. I am all for bio-fuels but don't want to be forced into some hybrid or 4 banger crap box. Having said that diesel is interesting to me (like the Jetta TDI, 335d), so are lighter RWD cars. I just won't line up to buy one, at least until after I get a Camaro SS.

Edited September 30, 2009 by gm4life

[Camino LS6]

Given their displacement, performance output, and curb weight of the cars they're put in, the current crop of V8s get excellent fuel economy. If the past is any indication, the V8 will evolve with the times, so I wouldn't be quick to discard it.

Yes, and I'd be happy to have one that runs on ethanol, or propane, or natural gas, or hydrogen...