Automobile: Buick aims for Lexus

[wildcat]

There's a new, brief review of the Buick Lucerne which says that while GM aimed for Lexus, the bull's-eye hit Cadillac. The article appears in Automobile magazine.

[Cananopie]

Run your hands over the plastics, though, and you'll realize that the materials are, alas, not quite as rich as the Avalon's.

It's comments like these where I want some God damn reasons.

What entails "rich" interior and how is it so noticable with the glide of a hand? I want some proof... what makes Avalon's materials "richer" than the Lucerne's. If someone has sufficient reasoning for it, I will gladly listen and accept it... but just offhand comments like that, that basically say "Don't worry, Toyota is still better than Buick" without any sufficient reasoning bothers me.

A lot of ways things are done aren't "better" or "worse" but just different and up to the opinion of the driver, such as people who bash the 3800 for things that are so miniscule in difference though there are still plenty of us out there who would never trust any engine half as much as it. It's just a reliable engine, it's not the crazy computer engines of today, and I don't have a problem with it. If you find it significantly poor on gas mileage or power it might be time to phase it out, but the 3800 is still a powerful engine that typically sits around 200 HP and the gas mileage isn't terrific but it's not the worst either, not to mention it now meets SULEV requirements.

The point is people need to understand things are opinions and to openly say "this is inferior" you need some signficant proof of that.

[balthazar]

A lot of ways things are done aren't "better" or "worse" but just different and up to the opinion...

Uh-oh; you are going to get strong opposition to that idea from those unable to see this. Needless to say; you are absolutely correct.

Point is people need to understand things are opinions and to openly say "this is inferior" you need some signficant proof of that.

Correct: without a means of measuring or quantifying such statements, those statements are self-rendered meaningless.
Again, needless to say; the modern automotive 'journalist' is best qualified to report on the condition of his own colon rather than produce objective reporting.

[FUTURE_OF_GM]

It's comments like these where I want some God damn reasons.

It's just more SUBJECTIVE (READ: without substantial proof) reasoning for the media to continue to justify their bias...

They have to have some way of telling themselves that they're still correct in assuming their biases of imported=better, so they always find something to focus on... Reliability, panel gaps, quality of interior material and the next step; retail/image (Prius=good image, Hummer=bad for example)

It's the same sort of thing that appeals to a staunch Conservative or Liberal. You can argue the opposite view to them all day, but in the end they will STILL find a way to justify their bias or decision, no matter how outlandish it is or has become, because to retrench would be admitting guilt or that they were wrong and effects ideal self too negatively.

It's a proven point in psychology... Reducing dissonance.

Correct: without a means of measuring or quantifying such statements, those statements are self-rendered meaningless.
Again, needless to say; the modern automotive 'journalist' is best qualified to report on the condition of his own colon rather than produce objective reporting.

And therein lies my major gripe with the American media.... FACT is no longer FACT... OPINION is now FACT. They make the news, establish their fan base, and wrap their garbage up into a nice, tidy soundbite and all the LIKE MINDED people feast.

Yet, the typical american is clueless..... Clueless that he/she should not take someone's opinion as gospel and oblivious to the fact that he/she is nothing more than a sheep.

[FUTURE_OF_GM]

Milford, Michigan Buick's campaign to remake itself as an American version of Lexus began last year with the LaCrosse, which was a valiant effort flawed by somnambulant styling. In developing its new Lucerne flagship, which effectively replaces both the aged Park Avenue and the LeSabre, Buick continued its case of Toyota envy by benchmarking the Avalon and the ES330. Slide into the Lucerne's driver's seat, squint at the creamy, finely stitched leather and the close tolerances of the interior trim pieces, and you might actually think you're in one of those cars. Run your hands over the plastics, though, and you'll realize that the materials are, alas, not quite as rich as the Avalon's.

And the author establishes the initial BAD first impression and all the while reaffirms and reassures import drivers that they are STILL correct by purchasing import over domestic.

GM aimed at Lexus with the Lucerne, but the bull's-eye turned out to be Cadillac.

And I'm not quite sure what this means..... Unless it's the author trying to pit GM's divisions against each other... You know, same dedicated buyer base ONLY to canabalize sales. Or maybe it's just a dig at Caddy, or just to confuse the reader.

[NeonLX]

What a steaming pantload. The car rags, including Consumer Reports, will describe a buzzy engine in an Asian-brand car thusly: "...the well-crafted engine exhibits a delightfully zesty note that fairly begs the driver to engage in playful antics with the accelerator". The same exact engine in a domestic brand would be described as, "crude and agricultural; a continuous assault on the ears".

I haven't subscribed to a car magazine in years, though I do occasionally read them at the newstand in the grocery store. Consumer Reports blew what little credibility they had some years ago when they tested beer. Yes, they tested BEER. I mean, they claim to be solely objective--but by its very nature, beer-tasting is a very subjective endeavor (I should know, I'm kind of an expert :) ).

Anyhoo, sorry I blew up. Edited December 6, 2005 by NeonLX

[VenSeattle]

GM aimed at Lexus with the Lucerne, but the bull's-eye turned out to be Cadillac.

And I'm not quite sure what this means..... Unless it's the author trying to pit GM's divisions against each other... You know, same dedicated buyer base ONLY to canabalize sales. Or maybe it's just a dig at Caddy, or just to confuse the reader.

[post="53840"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]

You should know this by now: if a Toyota emulates Lexus, it's a good thing, but if Buick becomes "Cadillac-like" then it's a bad thing. GM is damned by the media either way. It's either not good enough, or it's good enough, but for the wrong reasons. As said before, the Lucerne isn't a Toyota/Lexus clone. The Lucerne addresses the buyer's wants/needs differently. That doesn't warrant an automatic "inferior" rating.

[Cananopie]

I'm glad most everyone is in agreement with my gripe. I have absolutely no problem when something IS better than something else for that type of buyer... For example the Honda Civic is a better vehicle than the LaCrosse for those whose most important quality of a car is the gas mileage. An argument like that is something I can understand and have no problems seeing the LaCrosses inferiority in gas mileage. However attention to detail would be won over by the LaCrosse... In the case of the Avalon vs the Lucerne at LEAST say they are fair game competitors and position your reasoning on why you'd choose one over the other but don't say because "it's better" unless, of course, you have some solid reasoning... not "running your hand over the material" or whatever.

[Paolino]

I hate to say this, but the only way the media is going to change is if GM spends years and years putting out cars of no less quality than the Lucerne and cars that match the enthusiasm/quality/style of the Solstice. GM needs awesome cars, continually coming, and eventually the media might change their tune. I get a little frustrated because my friends who are not as knowledgeable about cars (and the scary thing is, I know SO little about them really--I just can pick out a car on the road by its taillamps or headlights, and tell you the hp/torque/size/options of things. I by no means can do all the incredible things to cars, that the people on this site can do nor do I know history of cars before the early 90's), but ALL of their opinions are "domestic=bad" and "foreign=good". I have one friend, his father is a dr, so they always had the nicest cars. My friend is now a dr, and he has a nice new foreign make every 3 years. Here's this difference: My friend's younger sister had a friend in high school doing a survey for a senior course on something simple: "Would you buy a new Buick or Cadillac?". She surveyed the father and then the son. Father's answer: "You know, I would consider it. I miss the way Buick used to be, a nice *insert large engine displacement measured in CUBIC INCHES here*, and that boat would fly. Those were real cars. They were gorgeous, commanding, powerful... you 'made it' if you owned one." Son's answer: "No way. They're junk... If you want to know what kind of cars I want, just ask." The list spouts off german/asian makes. Not one a domestic. But I'll share a secret with you... every now and then when I had to bring him down to my level (modest income), he'd ride in one of my family's Buicks, and every now and then, there'd be like 1 thing he'd find to compliment. So, there's somethings till there, GM needs to just emphasize it and bring on more for people to look at. I think they're starting to finally. On another note, I won't tell you what he said when he drove my Century for the first time LOL! Let's put it this way, his cars have consisted of: Audi S4 Manual, Acura TL M, Lexus SC400 Auto--you get the picture. Then he drove my Century. Whoah. lol