Camaro May Be a Sore Eye to GM's Prospective New Owners

[Z-06]

[source: Motor Authority]

Camaro too popular for GM's own good?

There's no denying the new 2010 Chevrolet Camaro is an eye-catcher, and it has the performance to match it, with even the V6 variant checking in at over 300hp. But all that mean and too little green could be making it harder for General Motors, despite over 18,000 sales so far.

GM's new de facto controlling investors - lawmakers in Washington - do not appreciate the car's success, however. Despite the V6's 29mpg highway rating, the Camaro, especially the V8-powered models including the 2010 Camaro SS (pictured above), does not fit with the 'advanced vehicle technology' tag being bandied about the industry.

A more eco-friendly approach may be necessary to appease the legislators, reports Financial Times, but that may not be something GM can justify doing - at least not if it means cutting back on the Camaro. Already the huge interest in the car has lead to the addition of another shift at the Oshawa plant where GM builds the Camaro.

A similar problem faces all carmakers in the U.S. market right now: go for the advanced vehicle technology assistance and leave behind a huge segment of the market? Or play both sides of the field, hoping that neither hand sees what the other is doing?

In the end, it may just be that whatever sells cars wins the day - and the Camaro is certainly selling, even in the face of a recall over bad battery cables.

[G. David Felt]

The GOV needs to wake the f@#k up and get over the green $h!. I am so tired of everything has to be green. I do my best to recycle everything and put very little garbage in the ground. I have gone way above the building code on my house so that it cost me very little to heat or cool. But when it comes to my auto, Keep your hands off. Support the Auto industry so they can move to and make efficient hybrids, diesels and electric auto's and allow the technology to mature so that eventually even performance, truck and suv's can be moved to the technology. Just stop trying to say all has to be green now. It will not work.

Right now the Camero is creating jobs and profits and that is a good thing!

Edited May 19, 2009 by dfelt

[hyperv6]

These are the same guys that are willing to kill out economy even more than it is for the eviroment.

No matter if GM is controled by the goverment these are the same people passing laws that will end the Camaro as we know it soon enough.

I also fear for racing as this is also something these same people would like to see killed.

As far as many of them are concerend they would rather see us on tolleys and trains or even a bike. All this is fine if your going the way they are going but where I live none of these would work for me.

You right to own and drive the car of your choice is under attack. Once some of these laws are passed and the right to own some cars are removed we will have a very hard time to get the rights back.

As automotive enthusiast we need to fight for our rights and do it soon.

[Intrepidation]

I love how they threw in this bit:

and the Camaro is certainly selling, even in the face of a recall over bad battery cables.

Because no car has ever had recalls right out of the box? Certainly far worse than a battery cable.

As for the the situations, it's stupid and we knew it was coming, but that's the problem with GM deciding to take money from the government. Ford played it smart and stayed away from that mess, so now they can have fuel efficient Fiestas and high powered Mustangs.

[pow]

Editorial disguised as a news story. I've yet to see one quote from the government that singles out the new Camaro as inappropriate.

Here's the original article the Financial Times "reported" on: Popularity of Camaro headache for GM.

[FAPTurbo]

But all that mean and too little green could be making it harder for General Motors, despite over 18,000 sales so far.

GM's new de facto controlling investors - lawmakers in Washington - do not appreciate the car's success

Yeah, because creating a product to meet market demand is how to not run a business, especially when the company could use any bit of cash they can get.

Maybe instead of blaming GM, the government should go after the voters for wanting to buy the vehicles that they desire. But of course, that doesn't win elections.

This article is dumb.

Edited May 19, 2009 by Captainbooyah

[pow]

Yeah, because creating a product to meet market demand is how to not run a business, especially when the company could use any bit of cash they can get.

Maybe instead of blaming GM, the government should go after the voters for wanting to buy the vehicles that they desire. But of course, that doesn't win elections.

Those quotes above are all conjecture. I want to see the proof - when exactly did the US government say they do not appreciate the Camaro's success?

I might as well create an article reporting that the US government is delighted by the sales of the new Camaro, so that GM can pay off their loan sooner.

The entire article, that the Camaro is a "headache" for GM, is based off the author's one sentence assertion that the Camaro doesn't have an eco-friendly image.

[Intrepidation]

You can tell that the other has an anti-Camaro agenda by the last line where he fels the need to sneak in the battery cable recall, and that somehow its selling despite this DEVASTATINGLY CATASTROPHIC recall.

[z28luvr01]

Looking at the Camaro as a bad apple is just wrong, and I'm not just saying this as a Camaro fan. If the government doesn't want to give more money to GM they'll leave the Camaro alone. The damn thing is selling despite all the negativity surrounding GM's future. A much better approach would be to get behind the Camaro and invest in i so that it meets future MPG/emissions standards yet keeps it's Camaro-ness. I am talking hybrids, alt fuel versions, turbo 4 options, etc.

[vonVeezelsnider]

Every time I see stuff like this I just get madder and madder.

[pow]

Every time I see stuff like this I just get madder and madder.

Agreed. Fake news sucks when it's not funny.

[gm4life]

Editorial disguised as a news story. I've yet to see one quote from the government that singles out the new Camaro as inappropriate.

Here's the original article the Financial Times "reported" on: Popularity of Camaro headache for GM.

I hope your right. I haven't heard anything like that either but... Still I can't fathom government having a problem with a sucessful product from GM that consumers are buying at sticker. Good for the company and North American workers. Yet green stuff does sell but I can't imagine big gov having a problem with a fun car or two as long as they are selling seriously, if they do they can screw off. This to me looks lik ean editorial disguised as a news story, just in the way it reads.

Edited May 19, 2009 by gm4life

[Sixty8panther]

Our Government gets stupider by the minute!!!

[A Horse With No Name]

I just read today that they want a 39 MPG fleet average...

Divided on this. Would love a new camaro, but not even fuel efficient sporty cars like the MINI hit 39 MPG.

But I am tired of giving my fuel money to idiots in the middle east.

The Camaro will be around for about four or five more years, and then the next wave of fuel saving automobiles will hit.

Better get a Camaro while you can.

Chris

[gm4life]

The Camaro will be around for about four or five more years, and then the next wave of fuel saving automobiles will hit.

Better get a Camaro while you can.

This is so true with any in about five years (or at least a couple) my son or I will be getting an SS. Also will prolly just wait till the last year and get the "special edition". That will be in 2015, I would bet.

Edited May 19, 2009 by gm4life

[FAPTurbo]

Anyone know the author's email address? I want to send him this image for making up news:

Edited May 19, 2009 by Captainbooyah

[A Horse With No Name]

...Any color so long as it's Tan or Maroon, right GM4life?

I really hope you get one. Your enough of a GM guy that IMHO you "deserve" to enjoy one.

Chris

[A Horse With No Name]

...and 2015 sounds like a nice round number. HMMM...GM...the performance years at Chevy.

Start-Small block, great bodystyle 1955

End-Special Camaro, 2015, 60 years later.

[gm4life]

...Any color so long as it's Tan or Maroon, right GM4life?

I really hope you get one. Your enough of a GM guy that IMHO you "deserve" to enjoy one.

Chris

Thanks you know I am, and my son is even more-so than me. One of us will get one prolly the last year in order to save up for the extra goodies. No this one will be white or whatever color the special edition comes in on an SS of course. Thanks for the kind words.

[gm4life]

...and 2015 sounds like a nice round number. HMMM...GM...the performance years at Chevy.

Start-Small block, great bodystyle 1955

End-Special Camaro, 2015, 60 years later.

Yep well that is what I am betting if its five model year cycle so that would sound right... Zeta is good until or through 2016 I have read. Take a look at this... a photo from an early LT/RS photo-shoot for C&D... This is why I bet 2015 model year.

Edited May 19, 2009 by gm4life

[A Horse With No Name]

I'd actually like to see it (new Camaro) in white...I love white cars.

(off topic)

Maybe they'll even have racing series for the new Camaro like they do the Mustang...wouldn't that be sweet...Hmmm...35 white Camaros rubbing paint and running full throttle around Mid Ohio, Laguna Seca, Road Atlanta, Road America, Daytona, et al.

(on topic)

Glad the Camaro is providing jobs for people.

Chris

[hyperv6]

I still feel our country is being taken down one step at a time internally.

They could not defeat us militarily but they can fiscally.

The things I have seen in the last 10 years make me wonder where the hell were going to be in 10 more years.

[Robert Hall]

Yep well that is what I am betting if its five model year cycle so that would sound right... Zeta is good until or through 2016 I have read. Take a look at this... a photo from an early LT/RS photo-shoot for C&D... This is why I bet 2015 model year.

Great photo..really emphasizes it's 'hippyness'. I worry that once Zeta is phased out, the next Camaro will be based on the Cruze (which is probably what GM has been planning all along, crisis or not).

Rob

Edited May 20, 2009 by Cubical

[gm4life]

Great photo..really emphasizes it's 'hippyness'. I worry that once Zeta is phased out, the next Camaro will be based on the Cruze (which is probably what GM has been planning all along, crisis or not).

Rob

I don't see much hope for a 6th generation model lets put it that way. Either it won't offer an affordable 8 cylinder (even if small that is a must) or it won't offer one at all. Sadly that will not interest me or many other car guys/gals. That is why someone in my family either I or my son will be getting a 5th gen SS.

Edited May 20, 2009 by gm4life

[Justin Bimmer]

I'm sorry, but the media becomes less and less believable every day. Look at that guy that made up a quote on wikipedia and all the news outlets that printed or aired it.

[Daryl Z71]

Every time I see stuff like this I just get madder and madder.

Same here. I think it's time for a revolution Im getting sick of the governments bull$h!!

[daves87rs]

Every time I see stuff like this I just get madder and madder.

+2

[pow]

I just read today that they want a 39 MPG fleet average...

Divided on this. Would love a new camaro, but not even fuel efficient sporty cars like the MINI hit 39 MPG.

But I am tired of giving my fuel money to idiots in the middle east.

The Camaro will be around for about four or five more years, and then the next wave of fuel saving automobiles will hit.

Better get a Camaro while you can.

Chris

CAFE isn't calculated with consumer EPA figures, but rather pre-2008 MPG that hasn't been adjusted.

The Camaro V6, which gets 23-mpg combined, achieves 29-mpg combined CAFE. The light-hybrid Malibu gets 40-mpg combined CAFE.

[balthazar]

>>"CAFE isn't calculated with consumer EPA figures, but rather pre-2008 MPG that hasn't been adjusted.

The Camaro V6, which gets 23-mpg combined, achieves 29-mpg combined CAFE."<<

Any more detail on this; me confuseded.

[pow]

Here ya go...

WHY WINDOW STICKERS DON'T TELL THE REAL STORY

The Environmental Protection Agency has long been criticized for the testing procedure it uses to gauge fuel economy — which determines the mileage numbers that car shoppers seen on window stickers.

The current EPA method, introduced in the 1970s, is based on outdated assumptions: that motorists drive slower than they really do, that they never use air-conditioning, never go up a hill, never start their cars in the cold, never get stuck in traffic jams, etc.

In 1985, the EPA tried to account for some of the shortcomings in its lab-based tests by adjusting its fuel-economy numbers downward by 10 percent for city driving, and 22 percent for highway mileage. The revised figures were slightly more realistic, but critics argued that they still failed to account for real-world driving conditions that can drag down gas mileage.

In early 2006, the EPA proposed going one step further, adding tests to simulate high-speed driving, rapid acceleration and stop-and-go traffic, among other factors. The new system will likely slash mileage ratings for many models by 10 percent to 20 percent for city driving.

The revamped testing procedure is expected to be in place for 2008 models. The change will force carmakers to post lower mileage numbers on window stickers, but it won't affect whether they are judged to be in compliance with CAFE standards.

That's because back when the EPA first revised its mileage numbers downward, automakers won a lawsuit barring the agency from using the new numbers for CAFE purposes. The Department of Transportation, which administers the CAFE program, still uses the overly optimistic numbers produced by the earliest mpg tests.

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=5448289

For the 2010 Camaro V6 automatic --

EPA window sticker '08+:

18/29 mpg

(23 mpg, combined)

EPA window sticker <'08:

21/31 mpg

(26 mpg, combined)

Unadjusted, pre-2008 (CAFE):

23/38 mpg

(30 mpg, combined)

(Pre-2008 window sticker figures are estimates that are consistent with vehicles of similar mpg; combined figures are weighted 55% city and 45% highway.)

Edited May 20, 2009 by empowah

[Teh Ricer Civic!]

So then it IS possible to get 38mpg out of this Camaro while cruising at 50 mph with the cruise control on on a flat plane with the A/C off?

hmmm...

[hyperv6]

I have found both of the 2008 Chevys I bought the engines under normal driving will get better MPG than listed.

My SS was 19 and 27 MPG on the window sticker. to get 19 MPG it has to be all city and I have to have the pedal to the floor all the time. If driven normal in the city it will jump up fast.

My 24 mile commute daily is city streets with about 7-9 miles of the 24 being highway stop and go. My day driving will return an average of 24-25 mpg. IF I stick to the highway on a trip 29-30 is easy beating the posted numbers.

[Drew Dowdell]

Our Government gets stupider by the minute!!!

apparently, so do C&G users...

[cletus8269]

no he's right, the litigation and red tape is becoming absurd. you cant so much as fart without there being repercussions these days. everything is being mandated right out of existence just so happy few are just that happy. THIS IS WHY I PAY GAS GUZZLER TAXES, btw does that mean that the Z06's are going to have to start charging a gas guzzler tax? maybe people should freakin do their homework before they stand up and vote on a bill or a law. i cant help but think what the crap that bimbo was thinking when she looked at her hud and say that her car was making 32mpg and she believed that we were this close whats 3 more? im sorry, i guess i'm just going to have to do a fat smokey burnout in my impala everytime i pull up to a green car just out of sheer pissed offery. For a country to condemn a car company for not making what people want and then people step up and say well everyone likes this car it may cause a problem. how is that not stupid?

[gm4life]

no he's right, the litigation and red tape is becoming absurd. you cant so much as fart without there being repercussions these days. everything is being mandated right out of existence just so happy few are just that happy. THIS IS WHY I PAY GAS GUZZLER TAXES, btw does that mean that the Z06's are going to have to start charging a gas guzzler tax? maybe people should freakin do their homework before they stand up and vote on a bill or a law. i cant help but think what the crap that bimbo was thinking when she looked at her hud and say that her car was making 32mpg and she believed that we were this close whats 3 more? im sorry, i guess i'm just going to have to do a fat smokey burnout in my impala everytime i pull up to a green car just out of sheer pissed offery. For a country to condemn a car company for not making what people want and then people step up and say well everyone likes this car it may cause a problem. how is that not stupid?

Couldn't agree more.

[hyperv6]

apparently, so do C&G users...

Stop being so politically sensitive. You should appologize for that comment.

He was making a general comment of goverment in general. Please do not be like so many others today that only want their words to be heard and they insult anyone who disagrees. That is so wrong based on what and how this country was founded. Many of us may disagree with you but we do not condem you on your stands. We all need to be tollorant of each other out of respect.

There is enough bad going on in all partys to let everyone to take the blame. The sad part I see no end to the grief of the car enthusisast. We are facing times now that will be more damaging to our automotive interest than ever before.

I see the next move to force people into cars they want others to drive will be a large gas tax. This is not just to pay off the gov debt but to also make up for the lost revenue of the higher mpg cars. With gas $5-$7 it will force people into the smaller cars. The excuse for rasing the tax is that we will have higher MPG ratings to help cut the cost of the tax to the people. I have heard folks on both side call for this.

The car companies have supported this large tax only because they knew they would be force to build cars no one wanted and this is the only way they can sell them. The tx would be a great help to the Volt.

Just one last note

To quote a great man "That government : of the people, by the people, for the people, shall not perish from the earth." I wish more of us would remember these words other wise their is a lot to lose.

[wildpaws]

Stop being so politically sensitive. You should appologize for that comment.

He was making a general comment of goverment in general. Please do not be like so many others today that only want their words to be heard and they insult anyone who disagrees. That is so wrong based on what and how this country was founded. Many of us may disagree with you but we do not condem you on your stands. We all need to be tollorant of each other out of respect.

There is enough bad going on in all partys to let everyone to take the blame. The sad part I see no end to the grief of the car enthusisast. We are facing times now that will be more damaging to our automotive interest than ever before.

I see the next move to force people into cars they want others to drive will be a large gas tax. This is not just to pay off the gov debt but to also make up for the lost revenue of the higher mpg cars. With gas $5-$7 it will force people into the smaller cars. The excuse for rasing the tax is that we will have higher MPG ratings to help cut the cost of the tax to the people. I have heard folks on both side call for this.

The car companies have supported this large tax only because they knew they would be force to build cars no one wanted and this is the only way they can sell them. The tx would be a great help to the Volt.

Just one last note

To quote a great man "That government : of the people, by the people, for the people, shall not perish from the earth." I wish more of us would remember these words other wise their is a lot to lose.

HyperV6, I totally agree!! I've been ranting and raving on many forums the last few months, I'm not picking on either major political party as I think they are both full of idiots that have absolutely no idea how to effectively run this country. Our personal choices and freedoms are disappearing faster than any possible climate change, they can't come up with a budget based on the taxes that come in, they increase existing taxes and add new ones every day, they would not recognize the US Constitution if it smacked them upside the head. They can't enforce existing laws, so they pass more new ones every day that they will not be able to enforce, our spineless "Supreme Court" is suffering from a severe case of not upholding the US Constitution (and has been suffering so for the last 50 years or more), we are being led down the road of "globalization" of the USA and losing our country. The problems and issues we will have being able to get autos and trucks of our choice (instead of what our government mandates) will seem like a non-issue when the public at large finally wakes up and realizes that we are totally screwed in every facet of our life. I don't see any existing political party that is willing to go far enough to keep our country as it should be, all I see is people looking to promote their own agendas and the country be damned. I certainly plan to buy a 2SS (unless they happen to come out with a ground shaking Z/28 or hipo engine package that will use even more fuel) and I fully intend to burn every last gallon I can afford to put in it. They'll have to pry the keys and steering wheels of my Camaros and SUVs out of my cold, dead hands (along with my Ribeye steaks, smokes, and what ever else I feel like indulging in).

Clyde