GM needs a new name

[SODDOFFBALDRICKZ28]

Lets face it the latest cars out of GM are light years better than what it had been producing for the last twenty years. Look at the new Caddy's and the new Vette not to mention the SSR and the new SUV's and I think the company should be renamed to pay tribute where it is due. On this forum the new name for GM should be... LUTZWAGON!!!!! Can i get an amen brothers and sisters. :metal:

[z28luvr01]

Uuummm.....maybe not. That would be like the New York Yankees or Frank Sinatra (if he were still alive) changing their names. All are American icons and household names. Why give any of that up?

[Cory Wolfe]

Not from me... :D I'm quite sick of the non-stop name changing. That and I think Lutz is highly overrated.

[aaaantoine]

Uuummm.....maybe not. That would be like the New York Yankees or Frank Sinatra (if he were still alive) changing their names. All are American icons and household names. Why give any of that up?

[post="44038"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]

You mean you wouldn't root for the New York Steinbrenners!?

For shame.

[capriceman]

Not from me... :D

I'm quite sick of the non-stop name changing. That and I think Lutz is highly overrated.

[post="44039"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]

:huh:

Lutz hmmm...... hmmm.... a NO! At least he got cars aproved the HHR Solstice SKY Arura............ Partialy the Cobalt G6 helped new Impala.... atleast he doesnt sit in a chair and collect money....... cough* nevermnind dont want to hurt any ______ lovers cough*

[razoredge]

The cars are not light years ahead, they are the result of steady evolution over the past 50 years. So yes, lets give credit where credit is due.

[SODDOFFBALDRICKZ28]

Not from me... :D

I'm quite sick of the non-stop name changing. That and I think Lutz is highly overrated.

[post="44039"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]

I"m new here so I have no idea what you are talking about as far as non-stop name changing is concerned but I noticed that you call yourself BlackViper hmmm. Is that at all a reference to the auto my young lad? If so then your comment is particularly interesting since I believe Mr Lutz was part of that project too. :blink:

[SODDOFFBALDRICKZ28]

The cars are not light years ahead, they are the result of steady evolution over the past 50 years. So yes, lets give credit where credit is due.

[post="44318"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]

You are right! Damn how could I have made such a statement "light years ahead"?
Have you ever seen the fit and finish on a brand new 60's or 70's era GM product? Not some current overly restored hand-made 69 camaro, I'm talkin about being there my man, the way you brought them home brand new. Did you ever drive a brand new 80's "down sized for better fuel efficiancy" abomonation? Do you remember 175 hp 3800 lb Vetts that in direct sun you could look through the black paint and see the orange primer underneath. Well I have seen them and driven them and boy you are right the new products are not light years ahead, they'er from another planet. They'er from planet LUTZLAND! Thanks Bob! :bowdown:

[Cory Wolfe]

I"m new here so I have no idea what you are talking about as far as non-stop name changing is concerned but I noticed that you call yourself BlackViper hmmm. Is that at all a reference to the auto my young lad? If so then your comment is particularly interesting since I believe Mr Lutz was part of that project too.

My name has nothing to do with the Dodge....

[razoredge]

Oh boy, yet another terrorist. Its always better when someone hangs around awhile first before they begin making assumptions and critizing.

[SODDOFFBALDRICKZ28]

Oh boy, yet another terrorist.

Its always better when someone hangs around awhile first before they begin making assumptions and critizing.

[post="44397"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]

I'm saying that GM is finally making good cars that can compete with what the rest of what the world offers and I"m happy about that and it makes me a terrorist?
What am I assuming and what am I criticizing?


Ok yes I"m a terrorist, I like the new GM products and I think Bob Lutz is OK!

Beware I'm a mad fiend!!! I"m pro GM!!!! :ph34r:

[SODDOFFBALDRICKZ28]

Just ignore the criticism. Any GM fan is always welcome here.

And who is this bald rick you want to sod off?

[post="44413"][/post]

Thanks.





Our hero Mr S Baldrick or just Soddoff to his friends. Know of him and ye shall know of ripping yarns of survival and wo.

[razoredge]

Just ignore the criticism. Any GM fan is always welcome here.

[post="44413"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]

criticism ? Hows about reading the two posts directed to myself and another. :unsure:

GM has always made competitive product, they have made much product, one simply needed to know which were the right products to look at. I didnt see where many of the comments were pro GM.

Once again all we are seeing today is evolution.

I have no opinion on Lutz other than he has said some stupid stuff that made a few scandalous moments. I highly doubt hes the only responsible party for any improvements, and he certainly is no Harley Earl or Bill Mitchell though he or somebodies have tried to put himself in that light, a light that never shown on Earl or Mitchell and their crews when they were writting history. So I say why all the attention on Lutz ? He's a bought and paid for, here today gone tomorrow corporate officer, not a visionist. Earl, Mitchell dedicated their lives to GM and it showed. Who knows where Lutz will be in 2 years, next highest bidder or retired.

[Satty]

General Motors should change its name to General Toyota, that would bring in the buyers.

[SODDOFFBALDRICKZ28]

criticism ? Hows about reading the two posts directed to myself and another.  :unsure:

GM has always made competitive product, they have made much product, one simply needed to know which were the right products to look at. I didnt see where many of the comments were pro GM.

Once again all we are seeing today is evolution.

I have no opinion on Lutz other than he has said some stupid stuff that made a few scandalous moments. I highly doubt hes the only responsible party for any improvements, and he certainly is no Harley Earl or Bill Mitchell though he or somebodies have tried to put himself in that light, a light that never shown on Earl or Mitchell and their crews when they were writting history. So I say why all the attention on Lutz ? He's a bought and paid for, here today gone tomorrow corporate officer, not a visionist. Earl, Mitchell dedicated their lives to GM and it showed. Who knows where Lutz will be in 2 years, next highest bidder or retired.

[post="44472"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]

Woah, this is way too important to you. I see you must win. You remind me of a Dodge Ram owner on the east bound LIE during rush hour. The posting was a joke J O K E!
But this seems to mean quite alot to you so yes you are right I am wrong you are perfect I am bad. Talk about a terrorist.
As for Bill Michell, I actually have a letter hand written by him answering a question I had about a 69 Camaro convertible I was restoring way back in High school. It was in the days before companies like Year One and the internet so I wrote to him. It hung in a frame in my bedroom for years so I had alot of admiration for his work. You apparently have gotten really into Bob Lutz where I just know that when he was at Chrysler they made some really nice cars like the Viper and now that he is at GM they are making some really nice cars like the XLR. The observations about 60's 70's and 80's GM quality control are just that observations. I remember the misaligned panels and rattles and squeeks. I distictly remember the man across the street from me bringing home a new black and silver pace car Corvette that I would wash for him once a week and yes you could see through the paint. But I am a GM fan and none of that mattered to me the car was bad to the bone no matter what the finish was like. Bob is in charge now and GM is making nice cars. Thats all the post was about so lighten up.

I apologize to you, I'm new here and I though this was supposed to be fun.

I'm sorry I made the joke about calling it Lutzwagon although I think its kind of funny.

I'm sorry to all who did not understand it was just a silly light hearted JOKE!!!

To everybody who did understand, we'll talk. :hijacked: Edited November 17, 2005 by SODDOFFBALDRICKZ28

[razoredge]

Dont have a clue what your problem is. I will return to my first responce before you went off on something that is surely very important to you

The cars are not light years ahead, they are the result of steady evolution over the past 50 years. So yes, lets give credit where credit is due.

[SODDOFFBALDRICKZ28]

Dont have a clue what your problem is. I will return to my first responce before you went off on something that is surely very important to you

[post="44506"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]

Holy crap I really do owe everyone an apology. You were 1000% right I really should have made myself more familiar with the site before I responded to your first comment. I want to humbly apologize to all who have read this, My God I didn't know, I would never have entertained your comments if I had!

I just went back and read the comment you made about woman and immigrents.
:omfg:

[Cory Wolfe]

One more thing...

Look at the new Caddy's and the new Vette not to mention the SSR...

...and now that he is at GM they are making some really nice cars like the XLR.

The only Cadillacs Lutz touched were the STS, DTS. Even then, they are not all-Lutz. He just applied his so-called "talents" to them. The only one you can thank him for is the new Escalade. The ones that single-handedly turned around Cadillac's image were pre-Lutz. Lutz said he actually wouldn't have greenlighted the CTS if he had been at GM earlier.

Same with the Corvette and SSR. Pre-Lutz. You can thank Dave Hill for just about everything that the C6 is. The only thing Lutz may have touched is the interior. The first all-Lutz vehicles were the Solstice, Hummer H3, HHR, and Lucerne.

So I'll agree with Razor that it's been an act of evolution, mostly. All Lutz really does is just decide what gets produced. That and he likes to water-down designs and make every GM vehicle look like each other.

[razoredge]

Holy crap I really do owe everyone an apology.  You were 1000% right I really should have made myself more familiar with the site before I responded to your first comment.  I want to humbly apologize to all who have read this, My God I didn't know, I would never have entertained your comments if I had!

I just went back and read the comment you made about woman and immigrents.
:omfg:

[post="44529"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]

Holy flying medow cookies :blink:

so how much is 1000% ?

what comments did you entertain? of mine that is, I can see yours are quite entertaining

finally please lets see these comments about women and immigrants (though I know it was immigration)

:lol:

[SODDOFFBALDRICKZ28]

You see Baldrick, we have two warring factions here at C&G. There are those who think Bob Lutz is a great car guy and has done much to turn around the fates of GM. Then there are those who think he has not done enough to help out GM and dislike how he chooses what vehicles to greenlight. Best not to get involved and just root for the return of the Camaro.  :CG_all:

P.S. What did Bill Mitchell write to you? Anything cool and noteworthy?

[post="44571"][/post]

Well I first have to say the letter was thrown out during a "cleaning" that I wasn't involved in and this was over thirty years ago so I don't remember every detail.

The question was about the counter balance vibration dampers, one was missing from the car I had. I was getting a lot of longitudinal flex while driving. What that translated into was if you drove over bumps and looked at the relationship between the top of the console and the bottom of the dash above it, it would appear that the dash would move in a side to side motion in relation to the bumps cowl shake I later found out it was called. I kinda figured it was due to the missing damper but I wasn't even sure there was supposed to be two of them in the front since the one that was missing was on the battery side. I though possibly the weight of the battery did the job on that side. Also ther was the huge vacuum tank and actuator tanks for the hide away lights thrown in to the mix. The dealers parts man couldn't help and the parts book didn't list a number for the dampers. I have to tell you though at that point I didn't even know they were dampers I just knew there were two heavy tanks bolted in the trunk and one behind one headlight and knowing a little about engineering I was guessing that's what they were. Well thats what I wrote and asked Mr Mitchell. He said that he didn't have anything to do with their design but they were in fact vibration dampers and there should be four of them. He had no idea what the part number was for them but for the car to ride properly I had to get the other one. He also said that the cowl shake could be because the car was missing a plate that bolted over the drive shaft tunnel tieing together the two halves of the subframe connectors (it was). That was about it but it helped a whole lot.

Just for a goof before I wrote this I keyed in Camaro convertible dampers into MSN search and got a whole lot of information instantly. Now you guys have it a whole lot easier to do resto's, I'm jealous.

I have a cunning plan my lord Edited November 18, 2005 by SODDOFFBALDRICKZ28

[SODDOFFBALDRICKZ28]

Holy flying medow cookies  :blink:

so how much is 1000% ?

what comments did you entertain? of mine that is, I can see yours are quite entertaining

finally please lets see these comments about women and immigrants (though I know it was immigration)

:lol:

[post="44638"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]

Lancia Montecarlos. Rustbuckets :rotflmao:

[razoredge]

Yea my 75 & 76 Oldsmobiles are somewhat rustier than my 76 Lancia but I dont find any of it funny. :unsure:

[Teh Ricer Civic!]

Hmm... my 80s GM truck has soft grainulated plastic on the dash... new GM cars dont really have soft grainulated plastic... much less faux alumium across the dash.. Yep GMs really come a lonngg way