Interesting...

[FUTURE_OF_GM]

http://www.camaroz28.com/forums/showthread.php?t=675020

Interesting tidbits:

From a poster that also participates here:

-First Alpha products by MY 2013-14.

-Coupe, sedan, convertible, wagon variants being considered,

-The business plan requires Chevy to be part of the program. Draw your own conclusions.

- A LWB version may replace the CTS later next decade, after CTS gets one more freshening after this one.

-Hope you like the Converj's styling.

From another poster that also participates here:

Perhaps we might want to send some thank-you notes to Opel. The company that may wind up with a divorce from GM and a chassis they are in charge of called Espilon?

If Opel and GM-NA separate, they'll still have joint custody of Espilon and Delta, but with General Motors global operations drifting into more of a federation of independent companies, and the fact that CAFE still stands (don't foreget to send them guys thank-you cards too), might just be what it took to make a case for a chassis that most of this year, many in GM were trying to kill in favor of Espilon.

As a Euro Cadillac, the case for Alpha was extremely weak.

With Chevrolet, it's very strong.

Think Pontiac G6.... which at one time, the plan was to use it as the basis of G6's replacement.

While Zeta is made to handle the most powerful engines GM makes, the Alpha is planned to make use of 4s and V6s. The 3.6 DI (which will eventually reach 350 horsepower) will likely be the biggest engine it will be designed for. The plus side is that because it's designed for less potent engines, everything else can be made lighter.

In the end, we should have V6 engines performing like they had LS3s while getting about 30 mpg.

Same source as the first bit:

I've been told "3 series sized". But apparently a stretched version is being considered.

[Teh Ricer Civic!]

Neat!

Alpha is RWD right?

[ZL-1]

Alpha is RWD right?

Yes, sir.

They need Chevy for volume (development and production cost dilution). No Pontiac mentioned, as expected. I am seeing Pontiac fading away around the time the Alpha Chevy comes online...

[Oracle of Delphi]

It never was off, and 2014 was the expected date ... As I said before, Cadillac, Buick and Chevy ...

Edited March 18, 2009 by Pontiac Custom-S

[Drew Dowdell]

Well, if it's due for production in 2014, we should have seen the concept at this year's NAIAS.

[Intrepidation]

So...why would you have a Luxury Cadillac and a Luxury Buick on the same platform? Nothing like overlap.

[Oracle of Delphi]

So...why would you have a Luxury Cadillac and a Luxury Buick on the same platform? Nothing like overlap.

Because they are core brands, which is why Pontiac is not getting one, because it is not a core brand.

[Oracle of Delphi]

Well, if it's due for production in 2014, we should have seen the concept at this year's NAIAS.

I doubt you will see this at NAIAS until maybe 2012 ...

[Intrepidation]

Because they are core brands, which is why Pontiac is not getting one, because it is not a core brand.

That's all well and good, but once again GM and building 2 cars that will compete with each other more than the competition. a Chevy and Cadillac is fine, but since Buick is premium, the pricing would get close to the Cadillac I would suspect.

Of course they could make them look nothing a like, but GM's track record for differentiation has been hit or miss (with a lot more misses).

I mean whatever, it's good to see a RWD getting some actual use (until they cancel 2 of the 3 models 4 months before production starts), I just wonder about that whole brand overlap/competition that has plagued GM for decades.

[Drew Dowdell]

I doubt you will see this at NAIAS until maybe 2012 ...

Waaaaay too early. If it goes on sale in April 2014 it should be at the January 2014 NAIAS.

"Here's the hot new Cadillac ATS....", "oooh ahhh", "And it'll be available in showrooms in just 3 months."

[Oracle of Delphi]

Waaaaay too early. If it goes on sale in April 2014 it should be at the January 2014 NAIAS.

"Here's the hot new Cadillac ATS....", "oooh ahhh", "And it'll be available in showrooms in just 3 months."

You most likely will see the Buick in 2012, Cadillac 2013, The Chevy in 2014 ... It will be dragged out like the Solstice and 5th gen Camaro were ...

[FUTURE_OF_GM]

Hopefully things will change and Pontiac will get something from this platform (A Solstice replacement would be natural and could be shared with Opel as a global car)

I don't really care if they are one of the main models since they are a niche brand now. But it'd be stupid to exclude them from the project (B/P/GMC) should be the core brand, not Buick itself.

I still don't get why Pontiac isn't a core division, but whatever, I guess. I don't see why they would've kept the division around if they were just going to close it. They could've just as easily said that they were closing Pontiac along with Hummer and Saab. And don't get me started about the "sales would fall" thing. With the way the media is reporting the (premature) death of Pontiac AND GM as a whole, sales can't fall much more.

My point is; unless GM had some sort of use for Pontiac, it would've been extremely easy, in this difficult situation, to just kill the division off. So something must be there. Sure, the dealers would bitch, but GM is in too desperate of shape right now to care much about the dealers. They're certainly desperate enough to stir the pot and shake things up, if need be.

[toesuf94]

Waaaaay too early. If it goes on sale in April 2014 it should be at the January 2014 NAIAS.

"Here's the hot new Cadillac ATS....", "oooh ahhh", "And it'll be available in showrooms in just 3 months."

EXACTLY! DEAD ON! YOU READING THIS GM??? Mazda and Hyundai both had copies of the Enclave on the streets before you did! Show it at the auto show and tell everyone that is excited about it to go BUY ONE TOMORROW AT YOUR LOCAL GM DEALER. You keep tipping your hat and everyone gets tired of waiting and buys elsewhere and your competition moves quicker to market with your ideas! (See SSR, CTS-V Coupe -I know this is a weak example as it is coming pretty damned quick comparatively, Camaro, Enclave...pretty much every launch since what - 1977?)

Again: Show the Car/truck/crossover at the autoshow that corresponds with the release of that automobile. Just like it was back in the good old days of GM when it was on the Ed Sullivan show last night and suddenly in the showroom TODAY!!!! Let's get the EXCITEMENT back into GM and the buying public back into the showrooms.

[G. David Felt]

Interesting, Will take a Wait and See attitude!

[CaddyXLR-V]

Hopefully things will change and Pontiac will get something from this platform (A Solstice replacement would be natural and could be shared with Opel as a global car)

I don't really care if they are one of the main models since they are a niche brand now. But it'd be stupid to exclude them from the project (B/P/GMC) should be the core brand, not Buick itself.

I still don't get why Pontiac isn't a core division, but whatever, I guess. I don't see why they would've kept the division around if they were just going to close it. They could've just as easily said that they were closing Pontiac along with Hummer and Saab. And don't get me started about the "sales would fall" thing. With the way the media is reporting the (premature) death of Pontiac AND GM as a whole, sales can't fall much more.

My point is; unless GM had some sort of use for Pontiac, it would've been extremely easy, in this difficult situation, to just kill the division off. So something must be there. Sure, the dealers would bitch, but GM is in too desperate of shape right now to care much about the dealers. They're certainly desperate enough to stir the pot and shake things up, if need be.

Maybe GM's executives are old and senile. It would explain why they would keep Buick over Pontiac. A small RWD buick, it will flop, and I hope it does. When will Buick be killed, when it's sales no longer reach 100k? That day is coming.

[Camino LS6]

We shall see.

[regfootball]

why we can't simply have a grand am and grand prix and a solstice for pontiac? the grand am and solstice sould be on alpha. grand prix could just be on zeta. they will continue to make zeta for a long time i think.

g6 sedan and coupe. g8 sedan and wagon. solstice targa and regular.

then put camaro on alpha.

Edited March 18, 2009 by regfootball

[hyperv6]

The Hyundia Genesis is the future of the coupe sporty market.

I would expect a Impala and Camaro replacment with this platform if this does not change 15 time as it will by 2014.

DI and Turbo's for everyone!

I like the part about lighter cars. There is so much more to gain in perfromance with less weight.

[Northstar]

Unless the Buick and Cadillac are a lot different, I see no reason for both of them. They should give Chevy the Camaro, Pontiac a $17-30k sedan/coupe/convert (or some combination), and Cadillac $30k+ models. I would assume that the Buick will be $27-37k (same as TSX for the most part), which means a lot of them are just going to be competing against the Cadillac, and you know they're going to make the Cadillac better than the Buick (see the canceled Saab SRX). The Pontiac can be made "worse" than the Cadillac, especially at $17k starting price, and there'd be no overlap.

[Intrepidation]

Saab SRX?

[Cory Wolfe]

Because they are core brands, which is why Pontiac is not getting one, because it is not a core brand.

GM is doomed, either way.

[daves87rs]

You most likely will see the Buick in 2012, Cadillac 2013, The Chevy in 2014 ... It will be dragged out like the Solstice and 5th gen Camaro were ...

Funny. I heard that, but no mention of the Chevy.

Are you are sure there is going to be a chevy?

[Camino LS6]

The Hyundia Genesis is the future of the coupe sporty market.

Bleakness.

[ocnblu]

As ever, this platform is essential for Pontiac, and Pontiac is essential for Alpha. Buick does not fit. AT ALL.

[Oracle of Delphi]

Funny. I heard that, but no mention of the Chevy.

Are you are sure there is going to be a chevy?

Oh yes I'm sure, Alpha needs Chevy for the volume aspect of the brand ...

[Robert Hall]

Because they are core brands, which is why Pontiac is not getting one, because it is not a core brand.

Which is fundamentally stupid--doesn't Pontiac outsell Buick?

More likely because if Buick's getting one, Cadillac has to have one, and vice versa to keep their dealers happy.

[Oracle of Delphi]

Hmmmm, didn't Lutz say the current generation of the Zeta dies in North America around 2013, never to return?

http://www.cheersandgears.com/index.php?showtopic=27725

Why would Chevy have a need for Alpha about that time again ?

[CaddyXLR-V]

Which is fundamentally stupid--doesn't Pontiac outsell Buick?

More likely because if Buick's getting one, Cadillac has to have one, and vice versa to keep their dealers happy.

I believe Pontiac outsells Buick 2 to 1. Alpha also fits with the brand Pontiac should be, and GM said it would be, but never made it happen. It does not fit with Buick's image at all. We will get to hear complaints about the suspension being too harsh because some older person bought it thinking it would be a smaller floaty Buick. That is, if anyone buys it.

Too bad it won't be a Pontiac. I'll have the cash to buy one by the time it's out.

[Camino LS6]

As ever, this platform is essential for Pontiac, and Pontiac is essential for Alpha. Buick does not fit. AT ALL.

Amen!

[gm4life]

As ever, this platform is essential for Pontiac, and Pontiac is essential for Alpha. Buick does not fit. AT ALL.

I agree, and I hope were suprised. Good news anyways Zeta is good through 2016 I have read. Pontiac ain't dead yet but I do expect less models but am prepared for the worth.

[Oracle of Delphi]

Good news anyways Zeta is good through 2016 I have read.

Ohhhhhh, I'll take that bet ...

[Lamar]

Hmmmm, didn't Lutz say the current generation of the Zeta dies in North America around 2013, never to return?

http://www.cheersandgears.com/index.php?showtopic=27725

Why would Chevy have a need for Alpha about that time again ?

I considered that.

All I'm sayin in response to that is... if they can't put an LSx in there, they can keep it.

[Chazman]

You most likely will see the Buick in 2012, Cadillac 2013, The Chevy in 2014 ... It will be dragged out like the Solstice and 5th gen Camaro were ...

Any reason for the order of that rollout? Actually, I wish it could be reversed.

[Camino LS6]

Any reason for the order of that rollout? Actually, I wish it could be reversed.

Because they need a brand for the Buick fans to go to when they cancel the car by killing off BPG in a cost-cutting move in 2013.

Don't be stupid GM, give Alpha to Pontiac.

[Blake Noble]

I'd never thought I would say this, but praise Opel and praise CAFE.

[hyperv6]

Before we start complaining about who get a Alpha and if they are going to compete lets see the cars first and plans.

This BS is like complaining about a meal before it is even cooked.

We used to be a little better around here and at least have some real facts before going negitive.

Lets also first make sure there even going to sell the dang thing in the first place.

So sit back and wait till the facts get in the way before we complain.

Edited March 19, 2009 by hyperv6

[Camino LS6]

Actually, I think now would be the time to speak up.

If it's not already too late, that is.

The alleged plans for this platform make little sense as has been pointed out in this thread.

Alpha could really be something great - if done right. And done right means not wasting it on Buick.

[hyperv6]

Actually, I think now would be the time to speak up.

If it's not already too late, that is.

The alleged plans for this platform make little sense as has been pointed out in this thread.

Alpha could really be something great - if done right. And done right means not wasting it on Buick.

Well you said it Alleged Plans.

Let see what they are going to do offically before we get too carried away. What is said here is not going to change GM's plans anyway.

The box to build a RWD car is very small. The new platforms are very flexable. GM is at least still looking at a RWD car when most are moving away.

Give a chance to show what they really are thinking vs just some post on some lose outlines that are not proben yet.

[FUTURE_OF_GM]

Before we start complaining about who get a Alpha and if they are going to compete lets see the cars first and plans.

This BS is like complaining about a meal before it is even cooked.

We used to be a little better around here and at least have some real facts before going negitive.

That's before GM's own employees were allowed to come here and pit GM's own divisions against each other.

As for me... I'm NOT better than that. Because I think GM pays attention to the blogs and Pontiac can use all the help it can get right now. Better to voice my opinion and lose respect in the eyes of some than allow something completely wrong and wasteful to happen. (Then again, that's ALWAYS been my philosophy here and in life, and that's also why I would NEVER survive at GM)

Edited March 19, 2009 by FUTURE_OF_GM

[FUTURE_OF_GM]

Actually, I think now would be the time to speak up.

If it's not already too late, that is.

The alleged plans for this platform make little sense as has been pointed out in this thread.

Alpha could really be something great - if done right. And done right means not wasting it on Buick.

Exactly...

Buick will target it's audience just fine with Epsilon and Delta... They don't care about "drive wheels" and a Buick Alpha will only compete with Cadillac (Especially if it is done as well as the new Lacrosse. That interior looks better, to me, than the unit in the CTS) That, in turn will piss Cadillac off and Buick will become the next "target"

Pontiac, on the other hand, was MADE for this platform. And it would HARDLY compete with Cadillac. (Chevy is no longer an issue, since Pontiac is no longer a volume brand by definition and will not have a full line)

Therefore, the BPGMC dealers can be happy too, since Buick can provide "nicer" as PCS said, versions of Chevrolets Epsilon and Delta volume products (even with AWD) and Pontiac can offer "nicer" versions of the Alpha project.

That satisfies everyone... Chevrolet gets core products, BPGMC gets all the product to sell AND all of their divisions well defined with excellent product. Pontiac is no longer a "volume" threat to Chevrolet or Buick. And Cadillac doesn't have anyone invading it's space in the market via price/prestige (Buick) or size and content (Pontiac) But I guess that makes too much sense for GM to comprehend. Instead, they'll cut Pontiac to nothing and duplicate Saturn's line up at Buick. And when Chevrolet is eating Buick's lunch because of the same pricing structure, they'll shake their heads and wonder why "all of the great product at Buick (that is nothing like what the brand sold for the last 20 years) isn't selling" ...SSDD...

Just as an aside; as far as Cadillac goes... Maybe they/GM should get off their asses and actually position themselves/compete in the market where they are SUPPOSED to be. Then we wouldn't have to worry about their paranoid tendencies toward "lesser" middle GM divisions. Hell, after what I've heard about Caddy, it wouldn't surprise me if THEY lobbied for Oldsmobile to be killed. (Since Oldsmobile was in the process of pairing with their dealerships AND had better products overall)

Edited March 19, 2009 by FUTURE_OF_GM

[DBeaSSt]

Any reason for the order of that rollout? Actually, I wish it could be reversed.

My guess is because Cadillac is more expensive. They can begin to recoup the costs more quickly with a more pricey model while they develop the less expensive models in sequence.

Besides, if Cadillac is to be the flagship brand, it should get the newer technology first. :twocents:

[wildcat]

Alpha could really be something great - if done right. And done right means not wasting it on Buick.

Can't you and others show your support for Pontiac without being so negative toward Buick? Pontiac Custom-S has told you what's going to happen, yet you can't seem to accept it and keep coming up with unrealistic and "dream" Pontiac line-ups, etc. (And I like Pontiac, too.) Why can't you all be happy that Alpha is proceeding... especially in light of Buick's topping the J.D. Power study... and say that a Buick Alpha might be a good thing? You should want GM to give every division class-leading product!

[z28luvr01]

I don't see why Pontiac and Buick can't BOTH have one. Consider this recipe

Alpha coupe:

Sold as Holden in AU

Sold as Pontiac in US

Sold as Buick in CN

Sold as Opel in EU

Alpha Sedan:

Sold as Buick in US and CN

Sold as Holden in AU

Sold as Opel in EU

Sold as Chevy elsewhere

note: I'm leaving out the "guaranteed" Chevy and Caddy Alphas

[turbo200]

we all have to stop being small-minded. it's not ocnstructive to talk about this and say buick will automatically fail or it doesn't fit. none of that is very logical and it immediately discredits. i do happen to see the characteristics of a performance RWD car being able to fit the concept of an aggressive more sport tailored Pontiac better. however, I can also see a more luxurious sport-lite romantic conservative and enduring buick working off of this, the return of the gentlemen's car. what matters is the design is substantial, not a copy, something that looks good all over the world, that reaches back but also stands out as a classic. it's not that hard to do. following everyone else's trends like the lacrosse or creating a car that doesn't look like a buick in the case of the insignia is not the way to build a substantial recognizable design family. not saying those aren't good cars, cause they are. whatever GM works at in the future needs to be tailored for that design family, like volvo does, or audi, or nissan, or honda, or mercedes, or everybody else. GM is really the poorest company out there at managing brands and understanding the essence of a car.

[loki]

buick....mmmmm turbo coupe.

[Camino LS6]

Can't you and others show your support for Pontiac without being so negative toward Buick? Pontiac Custom-S has told you what's going to happen, yet you can't seem to accept it and keep coming up with unrealistic and "dream" Pontiac line-ups, etc. (And I like Pontiac, too.) Why can't you all be happy that Alpha is proceeding... especially in light of Buick's topping the J.D. Power study... and say that a Buick Alpha might be a good thing? You should want GM to give every division class-leading product!

Simple.

Alpha is not a natural for Buick, and it is for a Pontiac.

I don't see that as being negative toward Buick, I simply see it as using logic.

[CaddyXLR-V]

Can't you and others show your support for Pontiac without being so negative toward Buick? Pontiac Custom-S has told you what's going to happen, yet you can't seem to accept it and keep coming up with unrealistic and "dream" Pontiac line-ups, etc. (And I like Pontiac, too.) Why can't you all be happy that Alpha is proceeding... especially in light of Buick's topping the J.D. Power study... and say that a Buick Alpha might be a good thing? You should want GM to give every division class-leading product!

Sorry, I have no allegiance to Buick, or for that matter GM, especially with recent announcements regarding Pontiac. I don't care what Buick makes, as I won't buy a Buick anyway. This is the car I have been waiting for Pontiac to get for years. The G8 is a little to big for my tastes, and Alpha would fit perfectly. And now it's going to Buick? Sorry, but that's not, and will never be ok with me. The only reason I ever owned a GM outside Pontiac(my 2000 Chevy Malibu) was because I had no credit and couldn't get the Pontiac I wanted because it cost more.

[Chazman]

My guess is because Cadillac is more expensive. They can begin to recoup the costs more quickly with a more pricey model while they develop the less expensive models in sequence.

Besides, if Cadillac is to be the flagship brand, it should get the newer technology first. :twocents:

Are you saying that the Buick should be more expensive that the Cadillac?

[FUTURE_OF_GM]

Can't you and others show your support for Pontiac without being so negative toward Buick? Pontiac Custom-S has told you what's going to happen, yet you can't seem to accept it and keep coming up with unrealistic and "dream" Pontiac line-ups, etc. (And I like Pontiac, too.) Why can't you all be happy that Alpha is proceeding... especially in light of Buick's topping the J.D. Power study... and say that a Buick Alpha might be a good thing? You should want GM to give every division class-leading product!

I have nothing against Buick and I think they need more products like the Enclave and Lacrosse (2 of my favorite GM vehicles)

But unless GM learns some SERIOUS marketing skills between now and 4 years from now, do you really think that the brand will be able to occupy the position it does (we saw what happened to Oldsmobile when it angered its loyal customers) successfully take up what Saturn was supposed to be (with the upcoming Regal and Astra replacement) and then occupy premium pontiac territory with a performance/RWD platform? (I say premium because Chevy will presumably take lower Pontiac sales)

Factor in GMs track record on defining and marketing their divisions, then give me an honest answer.

My opinion is; unless GM gets its head on straight, Pontiac will be gone by 2013 and Buick will be gone by 2014-15. (Then again, knowing GM, that might be the ultimate goal)

I don't see why Pontiac and Buick can't BOTH have one. Consider this recipe

Alpha coupe:

Sold as Holden in AU

Sold as Pontiac in US

Sold as Buick in CN

Sold as Opel in EU

Alpha Sedan:

Sold as Buick in US and CN

Sold as Holden in AU

Sold as Opel in EU

Sold as Chevy elsewhere

note: I'm leaving out the "guaranteed" Chevy and Caddy Alphas

I agree and disagree... I don't see why the BPGMC Alpha couldn't be sold as a Buick in China and then a nose grafted on (a la G8) for Pontiac here, at the very least. However, I just don't see why Buick needs 2 Epsilon sedans and an Alpha sedan that is roughly the same size.

Honestly, I would LOVE to see a sexy Buick convertible or roadster on Alpha. Not to mention, that could 'test the waters' on whether or not Buick could sell to this clientele.

however, I can also see a more luxurious sport-lite romantic conservative and enduring buick working off of this, the return of the gentlemen's car.

If Buick is to work with Opel, that will not be the brands market. Opel = Saturn which is tech savy, young professionals that typically wouldn't consider GM or traditional GM cars.

whatever GM works at in the future needs to be tailored for that design family, like volvo does, or audi, or nissan, or honda, or mercedes, or everybody else. GM is really the poorest company out there at managing brands and understanding the essence of a car.

I couldn't agree more.

Edited March 19, 2009 by FUTURE_OF_GM

[hyperv6]

That's before GM's own employees were allowed to come here and pit GM's own divisions against each other.

As for me... I'm NOT better than that. Because I think GM pays attention to the blogs and Pontiac can use all the help it can get right now. Better to voice my opinion and lose respect in the eyes of some than allow something completely wrong and wasteful to happen. (Then again, that's ALWAYS been my philosophy here and in life, and that's also why I would NEVER survive at GM)

Ok with the feed back but we need to keep it real.

Your not going to get V8 engines as that is not in the cards for any GM car other than the Vette. It will have it as long as the trucks have it. Your going get powerful V6 and Turbo 4 cylinders that will meet the goverment CAFE. You want a V8 dont write GM write your senetar.

As for GM competing withg each division? Lets give them a chance to give us an Idea of what they are planning. This platform can be so many different things as it will be flexable like the Zeta can be more. GM with each new platform they have been competing less and less with each other. I find it funny how some complain about GM competing with itself are some of the same who cry to bring back the Firebird or like the G6.

Any comments need to be address with an eye to the position GM is in, We need to consider Market Trends MFG cost, lack of GM funds, crash testing, building cost, weight, MPG, Emission, and the many other paramiters GM has to operate under. When we comment we need to think under their conditions not our free as a bird this is a good blog idea blog thougt.

We also need to consider just because this is RWD it is not just a perfromance car. It has to be many things. It has to satify the genneral market first and the enthusiast market second. THe enthusiast is in the minority and always has been. They always base performance cars on regular models for a reason since they sell may fewer of them vs basing a regular model on a perfomance model.

The trend today. GM is watching things like the Genesis, Soul and the Versa. These are going to be two very hot products in the future. Building an RWD Impala sedan may not be a good idea as I can see the Versa overtaking the Camry in the future in sales. I am not a fan of either but you can't plan cars on what you want but what the market wants. I see the Versa as the Chrysler Caravan of the future. Can the Orlando compete?

I see a AWD Versa like Chevy doing very well but it will not be on a Alpha. GM already has a good AWD platform to suit it.

Over all I would like to hear a little more on the car and an idea of where GM is going before I would get too critical on the Alpha as of yet.

GM has a lot of good product people there now and they have made few duds of late. Each car they have revamped in the last 5-6 years was a big imporvment and I would expect it to continue.

Buick today has shown GM quality is up.

To break preception GM needs to build cars for the people who have been buying imports and not worry so much obout where they have been. Everyone else has moved on and that has been part of GM's problem.

Also we need to keep in mind no wild hair ideas on new radical products as we are in the last of the 9th with two outs. Lets face it it has been a long time for GM to lead in a trend. IF they want to start a trend it had better be a no miss because they can't afford anything less.

Ideas like a Kappa are good but can they really afford to develop a car that is not going to sell in great numbers right now? GM needs to address volume cars and Chevy is the one to do it.

The economy is not going to get better soon that is the reality. We need to consider this. Affordable, good value reliable cars will be what many will want in the coming years. Small vans and pick up on the Alpha may be something to consider too. Just look at how many already are using HHR panels for their companies.

Edited March 19, 2009 by hyperv6