But most of all, it's a Jaguar.

[Drew Dowdell]

Quality problems plaguing the new XF

Link to AutoBlog

Few would argue that the Jaguar XF is a great looking car and those who have driven it admire its dynamic characteristics. Unfortunately, as soon as you get in and press the start button, you can't help but wonder if the disastrous quality reputation that British cars have seemingly carefully nurtured for decades will afflict this car as well. The gear selector knob that rises out of the center console and the vents that roll over to expose themselves seem like bits that are destined to fail in time.

If the results seen by Automobile Magazine and respondents to TrueDelta's Car Reliability Survey are any indication, those fears are likely to come true. Automobile's long-term XF has been afflicted by a litany of issues ranging from faulty window regulators and bad rear axles to a failed power steering system. TrueDelta surveys owners and has found the XF requires far more trips to the dealer than competing models such as the BMW 5 Series, Cadillac CTS and Mercedes-Benz C-Class. While the other models range from 33 to 97 dealer visits per year for every 100 cars, XF owners ended up back in the service bay 141 annually per 100 cars. Hopefully these are just first year production glitches, but this sort of news does not inspire confidence. Thanks for the tip, Leo!

[cletus8269]

failing rear axles? what are these people doing? dumpung the clutch everytime they pull out of a parking lot?

[Robert Hall]

At least Jag is consistent...poor reliability has been a brand value for decades.

[Z-06]

TrueDelta surveys owners and has found the XF requires far more trips to the dealer than competing models such as the BMW 5 Series, Cadillac CTS and Mercedes-Benz C-Class.

But but C class and CTS are not competing with the XF. CTS is not world class, Caddy brand is not world class since it does not have 256 color interior with 1,024 way seats and 512 functions navigation and 2,048 functioned i-driveesque knob and shifter. Plus XF is a revolution and has RWD proportions.

[Lamar]

Oldsmoboi, you know whose response we can't wait to read... if he responds.

[Drew Dowdell]

I have no idea what you're talking about.....

[Intrepidation]

There are a few things in life that never change: Death, Taxes and a broken down Jags

[FAPTurbo]

But but C class and CTS are not competing with the XF. CTS is not world class, Caddy brand is not world class since it does not have 256 color interior with 1,024 way seats and 512 functions navigation and 2,048 functioned i-driveesque knob and shifter. Plus XF is a revolution and has RWD proportions.

Don't forget the 167 speaker audio system so you can listen to your DVD-Audio discs at 96 KHZ in full surround sound!!!!!!!

[Drew Dowdell]

Don't forget the 167 speaker audio system so you can listen to your DVD-Audio discs at 96 KHZ in full surround sound!!!!!!!

Not in base 8. FAIL!

[tmp]

This for some reason reminds me of a Top Gear episode where they compare the quality of an old Jag saloon with a Town Car by seeing how watertight they were. By running a fire hose through the sunroof. Needless to say the Lincoln didn't retain water like the Jag.

I remember thinking at the time that this was a good thing; considering a Jag's reliability, using it as an aquarium would be a good back-up plan.

[FAPTurbo]

Not in base 8. FAIL!

8[

[Robert Hall]

Don't forget the 167 speaker audio system so you can listen to your DVD-Audio discs at 96 KHZ in full surround sound!!!!!!!

And you need at least 4000 watts of amplification, and the amps need to go to 11.

[ZL-1]

And people still come here and complain about Saab's reliability

[smk4565]

Jaguar's JD power quality and reliability ratings have been good over the past few years, and they are #1 in both sales satisfaction and service satisfaction. First year glitches, Jaguar will fix it, and Jaguar is no Saab. There aren't reports of horrible glitches on the XK or XJ, so they'll take care of the XF's problems. The CTS and C-class are priced too low to compete with the XF.

[Drew Dowdell]

ah there he is..... like a moth to a flame....

[Intrepidation]

ah there he is..... like a moth to a flamethrower....

Fixed.

Don't let silly things like facts get in the way of your bias smk.

[regfootball]

oh my gosh, send them to the scrapper!

[ZL-1]

Jaguar's JD power quality and reliability ratings have been good over the past few years, and they are #1 in both sales satisfaction and service satisfaction. First year glitches, Jaguar will fix it, and Jaguar is no Saab. There aren't reports of horrible glitches on the XK or XJ, so they'll take care of the XF's problems. The CTS and C-class are priced too low to compete with the XF.

No, it isn't. Saab 9-3 just topped a reliability survey although it didn't do that well on the longer-term part. i have to try and scan it even though it is in Portuguese.

Where Jaguar excels is in dealers pampering costumers, and I think that is a very good thing: not in the US, but my brother once bought a used Jag and my sister-in-law got this huge bunch of flowers delivered to her when my brother took posession of the car. I found that to be a really nice and classy touch, one I'd like to see other brands/dealers follow.

[Drew Dowdell]

Jaguar's JD power quality and reliability ratings have been good over the past few years, and they are #1 in both sales satisfaction and service satisfaction. First year glitches, Jaguar will fix it, and Jaguar is no Saab. There aren't reports of horrible glitches on the XK or XJ, so they'll take care of the XF's problems. The CTS and C-class are priced too low to compete with the XF.

The S-type, which the XF is based on, was never a reliability queen. They had, what 6 years, to sort the platform out?

The XF's price is it's disadvantage. It offers nothing you can't get in the Benz or Cadillac except maybe that turny button thingy for the transmission and James Bond HVAC vents.

[smk4565]

The S-type, which the XF is based on, was never a reliability queen. They had, what 6 years, to sort the platform out?

The XF's price is it's disadvantage. It offers nothing you can't get in the Benz or Cadillac except maybe that turny button thingy for the transmission and James Bond HVAC vents.

You can get a DOHC V8 (385 hp, 16/25 mpg on 2010 model) in the Jag, lasar cruise control, rear view camera, better stereo, better leather, better wood, better carpet, better headliner, real aluminum trim, real leather on the dash, metal grille, style and sophistication. CTS is a good entry level car, it is nothing more. No Cadillac competes with the XF, and the E-class is for the 65+ crowd and can't match the XF in performance/handling.

If the CTS were $52,000 base, nobody would buy it, Cadillac is not on par with Jaguar and the Germans. Cadillac is Lincoln/Acura, nothing more.

Edited March 10, 2009 by smk4565

[FAPTurbo]

CTS is a good entry level car, it is nothing more.

If the CTS were $52,000 base, nobody would buy it, Cadillac is not on par with Jaguar and the Germans. Cadillac is Lincoln/Acura, nothing more.

[Cory Wolfe]

Someone is smoking some pretty good $h!.

[Drew Dowdell]

You can get a DOHC V8 (385 hp, 16/25 mpg on 2010 model) in the Jag, lasar cruise control, rear view camera, better stereo, better leather, better wood, better carpet, better headliner, real aluminum trim, real leather on the dash, metal grille, style and sophistication. CTS is a good entry level car, it is nothing more. No Cadillac competes with the XF, and the E-class is for the 65+ crowd and can't match the XF in performance/handling.

If the CTS were $52,000 base, nobody would buy it, Cadillac is not on par with Jaguar and the Germans. Cadillac is Lincoln/Acura, nothing more.

You can get a 556hp V8, pop up NAV, manual transmission, 40 gig hard drive, better handling, more interesting styling. "Better wood, carpeting, headliner" are just red herrings. What you don't get in the CTS is Jaguar reliability.

The XF is nothing more than a MKS Vanden Plas..... and looks it too.

[smk4565]

You can get a 556hp V8, pop up NAV, manual transmission, 40 gig hard drive, better handling, more interesting styling. "Better wood, carpeting, headliner" are just red herrings. What you don't get in the CTS is Jaguar reliability.

The XF is nothing more than a MKS Vanden Plas..... and looks it too.

MKS is on a totally different platform, front drive and about 9 inches longer than the XF. They have less in common than a CTS and DTS. Lexus has better reliability than any luxury brand, doesn't mean they make the best car. Jaguar is a growing brand, and doing it with zero products under $50,000. The other luxury brands have moved downmarket in search of sales in the $30-50k range.

[Intrepidation]

How the hell is it a growing brand? It's still a 3 model lineup (4 if you count the Mondeo, which will die eventually, putting it back to three).

Do you enjoy being a glutton for punishment?

[Drew Dowdell]

MKS is on a totally different platform, front drive and about 9 inches longer than the XF. They have less in common than a CTS and DTS. Lexus has better reliability than any luxury brand, doesn't mean they make the best car. Jaguar is a growing brand, and doing it with zero products under $50,000. The other luxury brands have moved downmarket in search of sales in the $30-50k range.

X-Type.

S-Type.

Why is Jaguar abandoning the 29k-49k market??!!?!! Jaguar is a shrinking brand.

Do I really have to post my MKS/XF overlay again? I don't care that they are on a different platform. That I had to go look it up to make sure the XF wasn't on the MKS platform should say enough in of itself.

With the CTS, I get a car that out handles the XF, has all the luxury appointments except laser cruise control (which I don't want anyway, I'm buying the car so I can drive, not the computer), has a manual transmission, an optional 556hp V8 that even BMW doesn't top, I spend 20k less, and I have a car that will turn more heads than the jellybean XF. With the engine note on the CTS-V, I'll turn heads just by turning the key. (note: I don't give a rat's ass about push button start)

[Drew Dowdell]

How the hell is it a growing brand? It's still a 3 model lineup (4 if you count the Mondeo, which will die eventually, putting it back to three).

Do you enjoy being a glutton for punishment?

He's going to be a glutton for punishment somewhere else if he keeps it up.

Isn't there a Jaguar forum for you to troll?

Edit: There is! Here you go SMK!

[smk4565]

Jaguar sales rose 8% worldwide in 2008. They are small, but growing revenue. They abandoned the sub $50k market, because that was a Ford idea, and they are not an entry level luxury brand. Porsche doesn't sell $35k cars either, because they (like Jaguar) cater to upscale clientele.

[Intrepidation]

Right, because an extra 8k is really more upscale.

2008 Porsche Cayenne starts at $43,400

Jag sales went up because they had no where to go but up, because they've been on the decline for decades.

[longtooth]

An example as to how deep-seated prejudices can span a lifetime: Since I was able to comprehend such things, the phrase "Jaguar Reliabilty" was considered by my inner-circle (very small group of lifelong chums) to be an oxymoron.

Chevy 350 c.i. engine swaps were common amongst the guys I knew in my growing up since repeated attempts to maintain that legendary 'jag reliability' came to naught.

One friend, my senior by 5 years and a Viet Nam vet, had a '71 XKE packing a V-12 that he converted to a Chevy V-8 powered street terror. 'Buddy X'. Also was fond of tinkering with MGs before and after 'Nam.

He was so 'go fast' crazy that he hooked-up a rather large-displacement West Bend 2-cycle chainsaw engine to a lightweight go-kart chassis. The phrase, "if it had wings it would fly" was not very far from the truth.

'Buddy' returned from 'Nam fundamentally changed. Slightly out of phase and given to suddenly shifting to that 'thousand yard stare' mode. But flashes of the old Buddy would shine through occasionally.

Three houses down the street, another elder mentor/friend, Renfrew 'Rennie' Beaumont was killed in the Viet Nam conflict in 1968. His speciality, which fascinated the sh*t out of my 11 year-old psyche, was building catapults/slingshots with tractor trailer tire inner tubes building rudimentary hot-air balloons out of glued-together strips of tissue paper and baling wire.

Rennie's Mom, Pat drove a Jag (which saw the inside of the local foreign car shop often) and his Dad, Warren, drove a split-window Sting Ray.

Buddy an Rennie. Good folks.

[Blake Noble]

Someone is smoking some pretty good $h!.

It's gotta be kush.

[regfootball]

You can get a DOHC V8 (385 hp, 16/25 mpg on 2010 model) in the Jag, lasar cruise control, rear view camera, better stereo, better leather, better wood, better carpet, better headliner, real aluminum trim, real leather on the dash, metal grille, style and sophistication. CTS is a good entry level car, it is nothing more. No Cadillac competes with the XF, and the E-class is for the 65+ crowd and can't match the XF in performance/handling.

If the CTS were $52,000 base, nobody would buy it, Cadillac is not on par with Jaguar and the Germans. Cadillac is Lincoln/Acura, nothing more.

doesnt have much more features than an 010 SHO with basically the same performance at what 20 grand cheaper?

XF looks nice, but apparently the legend of jaguar will live on, i.e. the shop.

[regfootball]

Right, because an extra 8k is really more upscale.

2008 Porsche Cayenne starts at $43,400

Jag sales went up because they had no where to go but up, because they've been on the decline for decades.

you mean the porsche touareg?