Official: Saturn is Dead, Pontiac is a Ghost

[CaddyXLR-V]

Simple...

1) GM is a global company and is structuring itself as such. The major growth in our lifetimes will come from China and India. The US is a mature market, and probably -- unfortunately (I hope I'm wrong) a shrinking market for GM. Buick has a global presence that saved it's ass. Pontiac does not AND Pontiac basically duplicates Chevrolet in the market unless it's a nice performance brand (which I hope GM fulfills it's promise of) So instead of 3 divisions fighting for the volume seller spot (Saturn, Chevrolet and Pontiac) GM has (naturally) given Chevy the nod, killed Saturn (because it's the easiest to kill) and reduced Pontiac to hopefully something very promising.

2) GM isn't worried about share anymore. If it can sell 2 Buicks for every 4 Pontiacs it sold and sell them at a better ROI (profit point; READ: not to fleet) then mission accomplished. The current Opels are too upscale to be passed off as Pontiacs (save for the Astra) without decontenting the hell out of them. If GM tried that, it would lose sales and lose it's ass profit-wise. GM previously believed that the Opels were too sporty to be Buicks. These factors made the Opel-Saturn marriage a perfect fit. But with the dire straights the company is in now, and Saturns failure to sell the cars (even though that was more the fault of GM as a whole) that makes Buick the new dancing partner. (which is a complete reversal of the 2005 plan) I'd say the performance of the Enclave raised a few eyebrows in the RenCen as well and saved Buick from death.

I just hope this plan works... Chevrolet and Cadillac (if it gets product) will both be fine and I think Buick has huge potential given certain aspects of the brands image. However, if GM f*cks the marketing up like they typically do, I don't see Buick lasting long. I also think that GM needs to give Pontiac a very focused line up that will begin to rebuild the image of the division AND I think that Saab should be retained and allowed to operate independently, concentrate on increasing it's global pressence and make america a high 2nd priority. (i.e. Sell well here, but grow big where you're strengths are)

That's ok then. I'll be happy buying somewhere else. I'll never buy a Buick, and now that Pontiac is going away, I'll never buy a GM. I bought one Chevy, and only because I couldn't afford the Pontiac I wanted at the time. Goodbye GM.

[gm4life]

That's ok then. I'll be happy buying somewhere else. I'll never buy a Buick, and now that Pontiac is going away, I'll never buy a GM. I bought one Chevy, and only because I couldn't afford the Pontiac I wanted at the time. Goodbye GM.

Don't count Pontiac dead yet. After all if the market gets good again that could be good for Pontiac.

[Intrepidation]

Don't count Pontiac dead yet. After all if the market gets good again that could be good for Pontiac.

You're being hopelessly optimistic my friend. GM will cut Pontiac's models down two or three at best, and I suspect will phase the brand out over time. The writing has been on the walls for a while now. With Lutz gone, there's no car-guy near the top who can push to keep Pontiac going anyway.

[Satty]

Pontiac will get one or two models, become even less relevant than it is now (I assume thats possible) and be dead by 2020. Saturn had a definition, a direction, GM just messed with it. Pontiac has been rebadging Chevrolets for 30 years.

EXCITEMENT!!!!!!! anyone?

Edited February 19, 2009 by Satty

[Intrepidation]

That's more excitement than I can handle...

[Satty]

More EXCITEMENT!!!!!!!!!!!

[Intrepidation]

Even more EXCITMENT!!!!!!!

[Satty]

This is so much EXCITEMENT!!!!!!!!! that your heart might explode!

[Robert Hall]

Ah, Pontiac. The Excitement Brand <tm>.

[Intrepidation]

Wait for it.........

ultimate EXCITMENT!!!!!!!!!!

[Satty]

I'll never forget an article I read years ago online. It was originally from one of the newspapers in Detroit. Someone described Pontiac's styling as, "They ran a fork down the side of a clay model of a Chevy."

[Intrepidation]

Brilliant!

[vonVeezelsnider]

This is so much EXCITEMENT!!!!!!!!! that your heart might explode!

To be fair we had one of those vans and it was good to us...

This is how I see things looking after the restructure

CHEVY

-Spark/Aveo

-Cruze

-Malibu SWB Ep II

-Impala LWB Ep II

-Orlando

-Traverse

-Equinox

-Volt

-Silverado

-Colorado

-Suburban

-Camaro

-Express

PONTIAC

-G8

-Solstice

BUICK

-Astra

-Regal (Insignia)

-LaCrosse

-Enclave

-Possibly a TE Crossover

GMC

-Sierra

-Acadia

-Yukon (XL model Only)

-Savana

-Terrain

CADILLAC

-Converj

-BTS

-CTS

-DT7

-SRX

-Escalade

[Satty]

So much EXCITEMENT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! it cant keep its hood closed!

(Seriously, WTF? Did they not close it all the way or are the gaps that huge? It looks like it'll fly open above 60mph)

[Intrepidation]

MOAR EXCITEMENT!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Satty]

Ultimate EXCITEMENT!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Intrepidation]

Oh man, with fake wood on the sides and everything!

[Satty]

Fake wood FTW!!!!

I'd be rollin in a fake Woodie right now if it had, you know, an engine.

[G. David Felt]

These are so ugly they make me want to go poop!

Guess Poop +1

[Drew Dowdell]

Wide Track!

Doesn't get much more exciting than this..... landau roof, fender skirts, wire spoked white wall wheels, suspension by Serta.

[FAPTurbo]

A vehicle so EXCITING, they couldn't even sell it in the United States!

[Satty]

ENTUSIASMO!!!!!!!!!!

Edited February 19, 2009 by Satty

[Robert Hall]

A vehicle so EXCITING, they couldn't even sell it in the United States!

Whoa!!! What is that?? Never seen of one of those...tt's a Canadian version of the Chevy Spectrum? I was familiar with the Firefly and Tempest, but not this...incredible!

[Robert Hall]

All this talk of Pontiacs really makes me want to own one... I'd love to have the garage space for a G8 GXP and a '71-72 Grand Prix...

[Justin Bimmer]

These are so ugly they make me want to go poop!

Guess Poop +1

Wrong thread, yet made me laugh so hard I shed a tear.

[ZL-1]

:rotflmao: @ these replies!

[Satty]

We could probably start a "Pontiac is EXCITEMENT!!!!!!! thread, but then somone would ruin it by posting a Trans Am, which I would point out is nothing more than a Camaro with a bunch of plastic tacked on, which others would disagree with and it would quit being fun.

[Satty]

:rotflmao: @ these replies!

Those had better be lols of EXCITEMENT!!!!!!!!!!!, mister!

[Justin Bimmer]

150 HP of EXCITEMENT!

Edited February 19, 2009 by CadillacKing3

[Satty]

You FAIL! EXCITEMENT!!!!!!!!!!! must always be BOLDED and ITALICIZED. Otherwise you're disrespecting the EXCITEMENT!!!!!!!!! brand.

[FAPTurbo]

150 HP of EXCITEMENT!

HOLY &#036;h&#33;! 3D GRAPHIXCITEMENT!

[Intrepidation]

Fake wood FTW!!!!

I'd be rollin in a fake Woodie right now if it had, you know, an engine.

For a mere $21,000 and a few modifications, you could give it a hell of an engine.

[Justin Bimmer]

EXCITEMENT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!

Edited February 19, 2009 by CadillacKing3

[FAPTurbo]

urdoinitwrong

[Intrepidation]

Captain Picard (at least that's what it sounds like) says Pontiac is EXCITEMENT!!!

[Satty]

"Thoughtfully placed" while showing the steering wheel covered in buttons. EXCITEMENT!!!!!!!!!!!

[ZL-1]

Those had better be lols of EXCITEMENT!!!!!!!!!!!, mister!

You betcha, man! I feel nothing but EXCITEMENT!!!!!!!!!!! when I think about random people running around Chevy clay models with forks in their hands to design those EXCITING!!!!!!!!!!! ribbed cladding body panels!!!!

[Camino LS6]

All this talk of Pontiacs really makes me want to own one... I'd love to have the garage space for a G8 GXP and a '71-72 Grand Prix...

Remember the C&G intended purchase census?

Pontiac won.

[Cory Wolfe]

EXCITEMENT!!!!!!!!

[Robert Hall]

You betcha, man! I feel nothing but EXCITEMENT!!!!!!!!!!! when I think about random people running around Chevy clay models with forks in their hands to design those EXCITING!!!!!!!!!!! ribbed cladding body panels!!!!

Mmmmm...ribbed for your pleasure and excitement.

My car has gray ribbed cladding on the lower body, but a giant trapazoidal grille and a 3 pointed star hood ornament. 4800lbs, 121 inch wheelbase, 177k miles of gas guzzling V8 Teutonic commuter car...

[Satty]

You going to re-do that this year? I'd love to see how many people followed through.

[ZL-1]

Mmmmm...ribbed for your pleasure and excitement.

Ribs are culinary EXCITEMENT!!!!!!!!!!!

[G. David Felt]

EXCITEMENT!!!!!!!!

Damn I want one, that Crotch Cooler is such a long over looked and missing item on todays car's!

:rotflmao:

[FAPTurbo]

EXCITEMENT!!!!!!!!

Why doesn't the passenger get to have their groinal area ventilated? That's like, the polar opposite of EXCITEMENT.

[Intrepidation]

EXCITEMENT!!!!!!!!

[G. David Felt]

Why doesn't the passenger get to have their groinal area ventilated? That's like, the polar opposite of EXCITEMENT.

That is cause the woman does not like them, Only men drive EXCITEMENT!!!

[Camino LS6]

You going to re-do that this year? I'd love to see how many people followed through.

I don't yet know.

Probably.

Some of us were "not allowed" to follow through.

[Z-06]

EXCITEMENT!!!!!!!!

Add some more on the passenger seats too. Co-pilots need EXCITMENT!!!!!!!!! too.

[Justin Bimmer]

I wish my car had that many air vents in it.

Just imagine Xibit going "I hear you like air vents, so we decided to put air vents in your air vents"

[Intrepidation]

I think it needs a few more.