Some gifts...

[gm4life]

I know it is before Christmas but pass it along to Santa that I would like a new G8 GXP! Anyways here are some more photos of the new G6 Vert, G8 GXP and the G3. *Which looks great in the Pontiac photos in silver, no kidding it makes the Yaris look down right gross!*

G8 GXP First...

G3

[gm4life]

And for the 2009.5 G6 Vert...

As always enjoy...

Edited November 21, 2008 by gm4life

[Lamar]

All that sexy, and then you show the G3...

The redone G6 does look better though, probably 'cause it's a much-needed update.

[Satty]

The G3 still looks like a Daewoo.

[Northstar]

The G3 is the most overpriced pile of automotive lard in history.

The G8 GXP, on the other hand, looks sweet.

[GMTruckGuy74]

I love those rims on the G8 GXP.. they're the same as the G8 show car had,m though those were painted whereas the GXP's are chrome plated. If for no other reason, I'd like a G8 GXP just because of those rims!

[gm4life]

I don't mind the G3 I think of it as an Aveo with a good nose. Actually it isn't that overpriced all they need to do and offer a grand or two off and it is fine. Honestly it is alot better looking than the Yaris to be perfectly honest. The G8 GXP is honestly so hot, and I actually love it. And I thought the G8 GT was hot, if I got one for the extra four grand I would pop for the GXP that is a no brainer.

Edited November 22, 2008 by gm4life

[Satty]

Its not overpriced but they need to lower the price?

[gm4life]

Not as overpriced as the folks let on. I am factoring rebates in when you buy one.

[Robert Hall]

The G8 GXP is soo sweet. I'd love to see it dark gray with those rims in a dark titanium.

[Satty]

Not as overpriced as the folks let on. I am factoring rebates in when you buy one.

So you admit then that GM overpriced it.

[gm4life]

Not really because you factor in the rebates and it is fine. And everyone knows you'll get a rebate. I said it isn't THAT overpriced. People act like it is 20K.

Edited November 22, 2008 by gm4life

[ToniCipriani]

The G3 is the most overpriced pile of automotive lard in history.

The G8 GXP, on the other hand, looks sweet.

Yet up here I see more Waves than Aveos and Swift+ combined...

But I think end of day transaction prices would be comparable.

Canadians do have something for Pontiacs I guess...

Edited November 22, 2008 by ToniCipriani

[Satty]

GM should have factored these rebates into the MSRP so they dont have to rely on "$2000 off!!" deals to get people into the showrooms. Currently, there are no rebates on the Aveo, and the red tag price is about $400 less than MSRP. Thats overpriced.

[SAmadei]

I don't mind the G3 I think of it as an Aveo with a good nose. Actually it isn't that overpriced all they need to do and offer a grand or two off and it is fine. Honestly it is alot better looking than the Yaris to be perfectly honest. The G8 GXP is honestly so hot, and I actually love it. And I thought the G8 GT was hot, if I got one for the extra four grand I would pop for the GXP that is a no brainer.

I can't complain about the G3. Its a needed product that is one of the signs of the times.

OTOH, what I think the Aveo/G3/Yaris segment needs is a pocket rocket, like the early '80s GTI... give the G3 turbo and make it exclusive to Pontiac. Yeah, and call it a GXP. Get the money-strapped young folks used to the GXP badge, if GM is going to keep it around... as they will be BMW, Lexus and Cadillac buyers of the future.

GM doesn't have the rocks to invent a new segment, though.

Donning my fireproof underwear now...

[Robert Hall]

I can't complain about the G3. Its a needed product that is one of the signs of the times.

OTOH, what I think the Aveo/G3/Yaris segment needs is a pocket rocket, like the early '80s GTI... give the G3 turbo and make it exclusive to Pontiac. Yeah, and call it a GXP. Get the money-strapped young folks used to the GXP badge, if GM is going to keep it around... as they will be BMW, Lexus and Cadillac buyers of the future.

GM doesn't have the rocks to invent a new segment, though.

Donning my fireproof underwear now...

A B-segment hot hatch would be cool..they have 'em in Europe--like the Fiesta ST or Vauxhall Corsa VXR. B-seg cars don't have to always be cheap, nasty penalty boxes...

[smk4565]

The G3 is embarrassing. Pontiac has little credibility left as it is, the G3 shattered whatever was left. The G8 GXP was a waste of time and money, because the brand image won't support a $40k car (that gets 14 mpg). They are only selling 1,000 or so G8s a month as it is.

[daves87rs]

If the G3 is a few grand cheaper, it would be perfect for my Aunt......

[gm4life]

The G3 is embarrassing. Pontiac has little credibility left as it is, the G3 shattered whatever was left. The G8 GXP was a waste of time and money, because the brand image won't support a $40k car (that gets 14 mpg). They are only selling 1,000 or so G8s a month as it is.

Once again you sound like a total moron. It is a sign of the times that Pontiac is selling a compact car in the good ol' US of A but it is times like these when you do what you need too. If it helps get Pontiac's CAFE numbers up and ends up being a better looking Aveo 5 who the hell really cares? I for one don't, no is it a performance car certainly not but it is slightly sporty and serves a real function. I also agree a turbo GXP for Pontiac would be sweet as well. As for the G8 GXP it was a car that HAD to happen! You say the G3 will hurt Pontiacs image but then you say the G8 GXP won't do anything for it because their image so what is it? Offering a consumer choice is NEVER A BAD THING. If you believe the GXP won't sell then you are full of $h!, and if you believe it was a waste of money when the development literally cost nothing because it was done for Holden, it was a no brainer. It is going to cost 36K not 40K and I expect epa fuel economy to be around 14-15 city and 22-23 highway. Sounds pretty good to me and it will run on regular. This is a car that will boost there peformance image, generate showroom traffic along with the new Solstice Targa and build some more excitement in the brand. That can't hurt and with the products ranging from the G3 to Vibe to Torrent to the G8 GXP offering a car for everyone and there budget/needs is a good idea. I would love to see a Pontiac without any boring small 4 cylinder cars but that is what sells, the trick is to make them sporty and they are learning. The Solstice GXP is proof, along with the 2009.5 G6 Coupe with the 2.4L VVT and six speed automatic. So if you are so foolish to believe the G8 GXP will make no difference I disagree and I thought G8 sales were about 2,000 a month not 1,000. Go hump a damn Toyota.

Have you ever seen an early 60's Tempest it was a boring old lady car, but then they did a GTO also so once again a wide range of products even if some are rebadges isn't a bad idea because a rebadge costs hardly anything and generates sales and hopefully revenue so someday we will see a very unique Pontiac like the 90's showed us. They don't have to be RWD to sell or be sporty either.

Edited November 22, 2008 by gm4life

[smk4565]

Pontiac's CAFE is irrelevant, GM's as a whole is all that is measured. The G8 GXP is going to be 14/20 mpg and $40,000 (with destination and gas guzzler tax). The Vette requires premium, since this is the same engine, it should also. G8 sales were around 1,800-2,000 the first couple months it was out but only 1,000 last month. 12,390 so far this year (wasn't for sale in Jan-Feb I think).

The M5 couldn't save Pontiac's image at this point, the G8 won't either. Too many years of minivan and Equinox rebadges, rental fleet Grand Prix and G6 and now the econo box G3. I'm not against a compact, but make it with a Turbo 4 and aim it against the Mazda 3Speed, Civic Si or Mini Cooper S. The G8 dashboard would actually be good for such a car, since it is best suited to for the $20-23k price range.

If anyone wants to test the G8's build quality, open the door with the window all the way down and then slam the door while keeping an eye on the top of the window. The window will rattle back and forth inside the door. Windows shouldn't rattle when you shut the door. It was a problem with F-body Firebirds a dozen years ago and they have yet to fix it.

[FUTURE_OF_GM]

That G8 is super sexy!!!

You know, I really kind of like the G3...

And there is absolutely NO reason why it SHOULDN'T sell. However, I suspect that after the media gets done with it, it'll sit on the lots to no end.

I mean, it's a competent, attractive car. But the assholes in the media are already cracking jokes about it without even being exposed to it (That's typical... Because they're a bunch of biased assholes)

It's hella more attractive than it's Aveo counterpart.

What GM needs to do as a quick fix is ax the ugly Aveo 5, throw some sexy wheels and a few cool 'bits' on this piece and market the hell out of it.

[Satty]

There is absolutely no reason the G3 should sell, its a half-assed, overpriced rebadge.

[SAmadei]

The G3 is embarrassing. Pontiac has little credibility left as it is, the G3 shattered whatever was left. The G8 GXP was a waste of time and money, because the brand image won't support a $40k car (that gets 14 mpg). They are only selling 1,000 or so G8s a month as it is.

More embarrassing than the T1000 or the '88-'94 LeMans? The G3 isn't my cup of tea, but its a lot more car than these were... and the T1000 was RWD.

Between these and 30 years of Sunbirds/J2000s/Sunfires, it demonstrates small Pontiacs were popular. I remember a time when it seemed like every fourth Chevette I saw turned out to be a T1000.

Again, I hate small cars. But I'm fine with the G3. What pisses me off is the idea that Pontiac will offer nothing bigger than a G5 and everything will be FWD and 4 doors.

[gm4life]

Pontiac's CAFE is irrelevant, GM's as a whole is all that is measured. The G8 GXP is going to be 14/20 mpg and $40,000 (with destination and gas guzzler tax). The Vette requires premium, since this is the same engine, it should also. G8 sales were around 1,800-2,000 the first couple months it was out but only 1,000 last month. 12,390 so far this year (wasn't for sale in Jan-Feb I think).

The M5 couldn't save Pontiac's image at this point, the G8 won't either. Too many years of minivan and Equinox rebadges, rental fleet Grand Prix and G6 and now the econo box G3. I'm not against a compact, but make it with a Turbo 4 and aim it against the Mazda 3Speed, Civic Si or Mini Cooper S. The G8 dashboard would actually be good for such a car, since it is best suited to for the $20-23k price range.

If anyone wants to test the G8's build quality, open the door with the window all the way down and then slam the door while keeping an eye on the top of the window. The window will rattle back and forth inside the door. Windows shouldn't rattle when you shut the door. It was a problem with F-body Firebirds a dozen years ago and they have yet to fix it.

I disagree you think CAFE is irrelevant think again. The G8 GXP is going to be a great car at price. We can go back and forth on what is going to cost as long as it is under 40K it wil sell. I will say this 13,000 G8's is better than none. The G8 line has merits trust me. It is doing wonders to Pontiac image, especially the GXP. Pontiac still has an image but Pontiac like they did throughout there entire life has offered a wide range of vehicles for everyone. I agree, the G3 is a good little car and it ISN'T my thing either but it will sell pretty well. I would love to see a car aimed at the Si or Cooper S but right now money is tight and if a G3 is what we get than I am happy. The G8 which I have ridden in had excellent quality and fit and finish in a car in that price range. Also the G8 dash board is very appealing and sporty which works for Pontiac, do you honestly just dislike GM or what?

Edited November 22, 2008 by gm4life

[smk4565]

We already have the G3, it's called the Aveo. Rebadging only wastes money and resources needed elsewhere. G3, G5 and G6 are not needed. I want to see GM turn it around, but the weak brands are sucking money away from the strong ones, bringing the whole company down.

[gm4life]

Then I disagree with on how to get to that point of GM being sucessful.

[smk4565]

Then I disagree with on how to get to that point of GM being sucessful.

Rebadging failed in the 80s with the original W-body cars and Cavalier/Cimmarron disaster. Failed in the 90s with the Lumina MPV vans, W-body again, and failed in the 2000s with the Trailblazer/Bravada/Ascender/Rainier/Envoy/9-7x (6 way rebadge might be an all time high) and is still failing with the Torrent, G3, G5, G6. I don't understand how GM can make the same mistake multiple times over, and still repeat it.

If GM wants to turn it around, they need big volume from strong vehicles that sell without rebates.

Edited November 23, 2008 by smk4565

[gm4life]

The G6 is not a rebadge it is a platform mate. As for the G3, G5 and Torrent they are so yes. It did work on the W-cars they sold like crazy. The GMT-360's did get crazy, it should have been TB, Envoy, Bravada then Rainier. Saab should have sucked it up without an SUV and Isuzu never deversed one. As I recall Pontiac has the Solstice and Saturn got the rebadge, yes it is a two way street.

[Croc]

The G6 is not a rebadge it is a platform mate. As for the G3, G5 and Torrent they are so yes. It did work on the W-cars they sold like crazy. The GMT-360's did get crazy, it should have been TB, Envoy, Bravada then Rainier. Saab should have sucked it up without an SUV and Isuzu never deversed one. As I recall Pontiac has the Solstice and Saturn got the rebadge, yes it is a two way street.

The Ws were fairly well-differentiated. I wouldn't really call them badge jobs. The G6--you're right--it isn't technically a badge job, but the styling vocabularies of it and the AURA are so similar and poorly differentiated that they might as well be badge jobs. They look as similar as the GMT-360s all did, even though the 360s only shared roof panels--huge waste of money for GM, designing 6 different vehicles with non-interchangeable panels that still look almost exactly the same.

I also wouldn't characterize the SKY as a rebadge at all--that thing looks like a mini-Corvette, while the Solstice has an extremely unique design.

[gm4life]

I agree on the GMT-360's.

[A Horse With No Name]

...and I still feel the G8 is a step in the right direction.

Chris

[Croc]

...and I still feel the G8 is a step in the right direction.

Chris

I love the G8, except for the interior trunk release being located in the same nonsensical place as the 1980 Sedan de Ville my family owns. GM's usually really good about ergonomics, so this foible is all the more glaring.

[Robert Hall]

The Ws were fairly well-differentiated. I wouldn't really call them badge jobs. The G6--you're right--it isn't technically a badge job, but the styling vocabularies of it and the AURA are so similar and poorly differentiated that they might as well be badge jobs. They look as similar as the GMT-360s all did, even though the 360s only shared roof panels--huge waste of money for GM, designing 6 different vehicles with non-interchangeable panels that still look almost exactly the same.

I also wouldn't characterize the SKY as a rebadge at all--that thing looks like a mini-Corvette, while the Solstice has an extremely unique design.

Yeah, the Ws were platform mates..probably didn't share more than the windshields in any give year as far as external parts, maybe front doors on 4drs. Sky is a platform mate of the Solstice, probably no body panels in common besides the windshield frame.

[Robert Hall]

I love the G8, except for the interior trunk release being located in the same nonsensical place as the 1980 Sedan de Ville my family owns. GM's usually really good about ergonomics, so this foible is all the more glaring.

Where is the trunk release on the G8, by the way? My '87 Mustang GT has the hatch release in the glovebox, which is odd..

[A Horse With No Name]

The trunk release is a minor issue though. Overall, I like the G8 better than the Charger and really even better than many of the BMW products.

Chris

[Robert Hall]

The trunk release is a minor issue though. Overall, I like the G8 better than the Charger and really even better than many of the BMW products.

Chris

Yeah, the Charger is a car I like as far as it's specs (in Hemi form), but the stying does nothing for me. I love the design of the G8--clean, subtle and modern with great RWD proportions.

[A Horse With No Name]

For some reason though the Charger looks a whole lot better as a Police car than the Crown Vic. The PD depts around here have switched to chargers, and they just look right in black and white with a push bar and a gun rack.

Chris

[Croc]

Where is the trunk release on the G8, by the way? My '87 Mustang GT has the hatch release in the glovebox, which is odd..

The G8 is equally odd, I'm afraid.

[FUTURE_OF_GM]

There is absolutely no reason the G3 should sell, its a half-assed, overpriced rebadge.

hide 'n watch

[gm4life]

So was my 1992 Cadillac Sedan Deville, god I miss that ole' girl.

[ToniCipriani]

The Ws were fairly well-differentiated. I wouldn't really call them badge jobs. The G6--you're right--it isn't technically a badge job, but the styling vocabularies of it and the AURA are so similar and poorly differentiated that they might as well be badge jobs. They look as similar as the GMT-360s all did, even though the 360s only shared roof panels--huge waste of money for GM, designing 6 different vehicles with non-interchangeable panels that still look almost exactly the same.

I also wouldn't characterize the SKY as a rebadge at all--that thing looks like a mini-Corvette, while the Solstice has an extremely unique design.

If anything the Aura was the last minute badge job, not the Pontiac. All they did was take some cues from the Vectra and slapped it on. The G6 (back then still named the Grand Am) was already slated for production back in 2003.

http://www.mdsystem.com/html/data/gm_fiat_...ctions_2003.pdf

Look for GMX381, you'll see what I mean. The Aura was still unheard of at that point.