The New GM: Chevrolet, Cadillac, and...

[Northstar]

Right now, I'm pretty convinced GM is probably going to go bankrupt, and the government is going to force the current management out in order for them to "save" GM and give them a loan to start over, or at least something like this is what I feel will happen.

Anyways, when the "new" GM comes around, I envision a lineup of Chevy, Cadillac, and one other brand. What should that brand be? I'd like to see what everything thinks, just for the hell of it.

[Camino LS6]

Well, I'm not ready to buy the premise.

But I voted anyway.

[vonVeezelsnider]

Just Chevy-Cadillac I think is how it's gonna be... I'd love to see Pontiac Live but they've let development stagnate so much that I don't know if they'd see it feasible to bring them along for the Ride... the GM Europe Operation would likely split off from GM and join GMDAT or something so conceivably Buick would go with them for sale in china, not with GMNA. Saab has great research facilities but would likely prosper on its own... GMC Maybe but only for commercial trucks I'm afraid. Hummer... nope. And Saturn well, I just don't see GM trying again with them.

[Croc]

I don't buy into this premise at all. I don't see why GM would get a bailout under those terms, with a nw management intent on eliminating every brand. It just isn't that simple. Do you eliminate Buick? But it's profitable in China. Pontiac? Beats Chevrolet in Canada. HUMMER is already going away, so whatevs. GMC? The public has somehow been convinced that GMC > Chevrolet and don't really cross-shop the two brands. And with GMC being mostly rebadges, that's a sales outlet that is pure profit, as the engineering costs would have been incurred as Chevrolet needs a presence in the truck market anyway.

Saturn? It could go. But will it? Or would it be rebranded Opel?

SAAB? That's what I voted for. Don't throw things--hear me out: If GM is going to lose all the other brands, then it should keep a brand that a) brings something unique to the table, and b) has no baggage. SAAB has a unique product line, it has a relatively blank slate image-wise, and it has darn good product. Its only weakness is a tiny-ass dealership network. GM might cut brands, but a government baillout won't like job losses from all the legacy dealerships across the country. SAAB would get a dealership base, and I honestly don't see why people don't buy more SAABs as they are awesome cars. Very well-crafted and well-made. Plus, SAAB could sell whatever Opels are to be foisted upon North America, as it is already considered a premium brand, and commands much higher transaction prices compared to Saturn.

[CSpec]

I also voted for Saab. Good reputation and excellent product when given the resources.

[SoCalCTS]

Cadillac, Chevrolet, CMC and Opel.

[Sixty8panther]

I voted Buick...but it was with a heavy heart.

Pontiac is near and dear to my soul, always

will be, wheather it survives or not.

Those who voted Saturn.... I'm speechless.

Would I like to see some of Saturn's current

products live on? Sure... as "Saturns?"

F*** no!

Saturn has about as much soul, character or

history as a wet sock. What a disgusting turn

of events it would be if SATURN the parasite

that has done nothing but sucked the life from

GM for two decades, lived on and Buick &

Pontiac were to join Oldsmobile in the great

dusty bookshelf of lost-&-almost-forgoten

Automotive industry.

[FUTURE_OF_GM]

If it happens, the most likely is Saturn.

I personally voted for Pontiac.

I don't really see GM shedding any brands though (Maybe Pontiac or GMC)

All of the divisions are vital to the company in the global marketplace.

Chevrolet, Saturn and Cadillac are all givens...

Buick is vital in China, Saab is basically an entity in itself and can piggy back on Opel without any support from GMNA

Hummer is gone either way (sadly)

Pontiac sells so well here and in Canada that GM could technically use that as a bargaining chip. Not to mention, both Pontiac and Buick are linked to Holden and GM-DAT in the global scene.

And GMC piggy backs entirely on Chevy.

Nothing substantial can be gained from eliminating ANY of the divisions, unless we're looking at a DRASTICALLY smaller GM (and by that I mean a GM that holds 10-12% of the market)

Edited November 17, 2008 by FUTURE_OF_GM

[Camino LS6]

If it happens, the most likely is Saturn.

I personally voted for Pontiac.

I don't really see GM shedding any brands though (Maybe Pontiac or GMC)

All of the divisions are vital to the company in the global marketplace.

Chevrolet, Saturn and Cadillac are all givens...

Buick is vital in China, Saab is basically an entity in itself and can piggy back on Opel without any support from GMNA

Hummer is gone either way (sadly)

Pontiac sells so well here and in Canada that GM could technically use that as a bargaining chip. Not to mention, both Pontiac and Buick are linked to Holden and GM-DAT in the global scene.

And GMC piggy backs entirely on Chevy.

Nothing substantial can be gained from eliminating ANY of the divisions, unless we're looking at a DRASTICALLY smaller GM (and by that I mean a GM that holds 10-12% of the market)

That sums things up well.

[Drew Dowdell]

I pick two.

Saturn and Buick.

Chevy to beat Toyota

Saturn to beat VW/Volvo/Ford of Europe

Buick to beat the softer side of Lexus/Acura/Lincoln

Cadillac to run with the Beemers.

[gm4life]

I say Pontiac and Buick stay you can get rid of the rest. Pontiac's product is more unique than GMC's, Chevrolet truck's are GMC. I still would hate to see GMC go because they attract a different kind of buyer. Saturn is a failure just like McCain's campigen. Saab is pointless in the US anyway so can them as well. I don't care about seller loyality.

Edited November 17, 2008 by gm4life

[regfootball]

why should GM keep cadillac?

seriously, why hasn't anyone asked this?

Chevy, Saturn, Buick

[Drew Dowdell]

why should GM keep cadillac?

seriously, why hasn't anyone asked this?

Chevy, Saturn, Buick

because they'd get laughed off the forum.

That'd be like telling Toyota to ditch Lexus and Subaru in order to save Toyota, Scion and Daihatsu.

[Brougham-Holiday]

I voted Buick, I can't see GM tossing out the money Buick makes in China and the solid quality reputation it has kept in North America, which they should do a better job of shouting from the top of the proverbial highest mountain.

[ZL-1]

Buick bc of China. Opel could live too as the Insignia-to-Chinese-Regal transition woked quite well...

[Paolino]

It' so sad I can't find reason for any of those brands to stick around when just considering NA. But I'm going to have to say Buick since it's my passion (since Olds left us).

[Northstar]

why should GM keep cadillac?

seriously, why hasn't anyone asked this?

Chevy, Saturn, Buick

Chevy and Cadillac are the easy choices because not one vehicle from the two brands really compete with each other, or at least they are not supposed to. You could argue that the Escalade is similar enough to the Tahoe, and that the XLR and Corvette are somewhat similar, but the price difference is definitely there.

Unless you want to move Buick upmarket to Cadillac's level, which I don't feel will work, your lineup might as well just be Chevy and Saturn or Chevy and Buick. What Saturn is aiming for is not that far off from where Buick is now.

[Oracle of Delphi]

Let's just say I didn't pick Pontiac, I like to bet on a sure thing!

[ehaase]

Chevrolet and Cadillac are enough. The general public could care less about the other brands.

[Lamar]

It was a hard choice between Pontiac and Buick, but I picked Pontiac. Though I'd love to see them together as one channel... soft luxury versus hard performance.

As far as GMC, they can do as Ford did and include a more luxurious trim level in the Silverado/Yukon lineup. Though I'd miss the Acadia...

I had hope for Saturn but they've pretty much been Ford's Mercury.

Saab... quirky, but unnecessary.

HUMMER... er, ah, no.

[Satty]

Buick stays because of China, as long as Buick is around GMC and either Pontiac or Saturn will be around to make current BPG dealers full line. Saab and Hummer need to find a way out.

[FUTURE_OF_GM]

I would like to see a 6 division GM again.

That's when the company did well.

1) Chevrolet

2) Pontiac

3) GMC

4) Saturn (Oldsmobile)

5) Buick

6) Cadillac

I hate to see Hummer go, but oh well. As for Saab... Was it ever really there in the first place?

[Lamar]

I hate to see Hummer go, but oh well. As for Saab... Was it ever really there in the first place?

Yeah, I've often had to tell people that GM runs Saab.

[Enzora]

I voted for Buick, simply because it's the only one that has enough of its own identity to maybe have a chance to survive. Still, if I were betting, I'd go with a Chevy-Cadillac lineup.

[§carlet §wordfish]

I voted for Pontiac; back in the day it was not just a "sporty" brand, it was a luxury division with high-performance models to reel in the younger crowds. There needs to be something between Chevy and Caddy for Caddy to move upmarket, and a sporty, near-luxury Pontiac would be perfect for that.

Buick I think would work as well; it has it's history of sporty cars (Grand National, T-types, um... others I'm sure) so it might also be able to provide some sporty models in the near-lux range.

Ideally they could be sold back-to-back, Pontiac being the more flamboyant, sporty brand while still having nice appointmens, with Buick being more traditional but still having high-performance offerings.

[regfootball]

really, is cadillac needed when the world is saturated with Lux cars already? Caddy is not big in Europe or Asia. Its not like Caddy's technology is filtering down through GM anyways.

Buick thrives in China. Keep that.

Keep Saturn and rename it Opel. Or at least make the logos the same. Fold Saab into Opel if needed.

Chevy is chevy/daewoo.

I would even argue that Saab should stay over Caddy and get Caddy's resources.

still i agree with GM in that don't fold brands. Consolidate dealers and sales channels (faster).

I would merge BPG with chevy. although not every chevy dealer would have BPG, but I would not allow standalone BPG dealers. Then it top ends chevy and means you can get by with a much smaller BPG lineup, but still keep the brand. Buick becomes the luxury car available at a Chevy dealer. It becomes roughly what Lincoln is now. another reason to do this, then BPG dealers are not in competition with chevy dealers for similar cars since they all sell the same.

I would keep Caddy separate but allow them to join with Saab if desired. Saturn Saab Caddy, only I think it would work better as Opel / Caddy. Some parts of the US would not have sales traffic for Opel, Saab, Saturn what have you.

I should qualify in this idea that Pontiac has a g6 line, g8 line (including wagon), gto (g8 coupe), the solstice, and maybe a compact (to duke the WRX's of the world). The g6 line could either be alpha small or epsilon fwd/awd. g8 would be large rwd/awd. vibe dies. G3 dies.

Buick I would have the Zeta Park Avenue, and then a couple of fwd/awd offerings. I don't see Buick needing a compact. I might be tempted to kill the Enclave. I would bring back the rendezvoux the size of the Lexus RX/murano. I would make a retractable hardtop 4 seat riviera coupe. that would be buick's unique roadster.

seriously, if pontiac and buick each have like 4 model lines, 1 new line a year is not that much. they just need to keep it current.

GMC would just to me only exist as specialty edition rebadge trucks. Acadia, Yukon, Sierra, but in very limited numbers. I would kill the canyon.

I don't think caddy needs a CTS coupe. Just me. Wagon, yes, coupe, no. Caddy needs two new bookends, to be more in line with the 3,5,7 BMW trifecta. a BLS coupe, yes. The SRX can stay for a bit. I think the escalade is a stretch.

Edited November 19, 2008 by regfootball

[Enzora]

I would even argue that Saab should stay over Caddy and get Caddy's resources.

Are you high, or just a fan of sophistry? Because that makes zero sense.

Scratch that. That makes negative sense.

[regfootball]

explain how to prop up caddy as a world brand when it has not gained any traction yet outside the US?

[Satty]

Scratch that. That makes negative sense.

I was thinking i.

[ocnblu]

How do the names Chery and Cadirrac sound?