GM market share hits new low

[evok]

Doesnt seem like we would gain much in Japan.
LOL !

[post="36927"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]

You are so out of touch with reality I still continue to read your post with amusement. As I have said before, read some international economic publications. You might learn something.

Who the hell do you think is keeping the US government afloat? US tax revenue? Try the Koreans, Japanese and Chinese. That is who are buying the treasure bonds that are funding the Iraq war, Katrina and the rest of the pork coming out of DC. That is who. Todays economy is so interwoven, and international, the WWII era principles you subscribe to are only small factors in todays world.

As much as I though the book was outdated when written, go read a book. The book I recommend is Tom Friedmen's Lexus and the Olive Tree. You might learn something. Even from Friedman. Edited November 1, 2005 by evok

[evok]

See above. Edited November 1, 2005 by evok

[daves87rs]

You are so out of touch with reality I still continue to read your post with amusement.  As I have said before, read some international economic publications.  You might learn something.

Who the hell do you think is keeping the US government afloat?  US tax revenue? Try the Koreans, Japanese and Chinese.  That is who are buying the treasure bonds that are funding the Iraq war, Katrina and the rest of the pork coming out of DC.  That is who.  Todays economy is so interwoven, and international, the WWII era principles you subscribe to are only small factors in todays world.

As much as I though the book was outdated when written, go read a book.  The book I recommend is Tom Friedmen's Lexus and the Olive Tree.  You might learn something.  Even from Friedman.

[post="36986"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]

Evok, razor does make a good point about Japan though. GM's chances for
any kind of sales increase in Japan just is not going to work. Think Razor is
stubborn? Try selling US cars to the Japanese.... :lol: On the other hand, there
is a lot to be had in China...

You kinda lost me on the bonds thing...Bond sales aren't heavy on just those three...I realize the point of the other countries buying, but quite a few others
are also funding our war in Iraq.....

[daves87rs]

This is not the governments problem, it's a free market problem. If they can't sell in Japan, why not elsewhere? I hear sales in China are rosy. If GM can't make money in one market, it's their job to find a new one to sell in, or create a new one altogether, or work on fixing their current market. It's not the government's job to come to the aid of every business that suffers from poor management. We don't want GM to turn into another Northwest Airlines, do we?

[post="36840"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]

Very true, WJ.

[daves87rs]

GM isn't even near the disasterous state they where in the early 90s.  Relax and enjoy the show, as many would love to see GM fail so they will continue to rip on them all they can.  GM has more than enough cash, great new products making money, and more great new products on the way to prevent the need for bankruptcy.

[post="36695"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]

I do have to agree with that...I think if the SUVs and trucks do pretty well,
that could help even more...

The big things that they need to fix within these next few years is healthcare
(working on) and getting plants in line with their current sales...

[TKR]

GM is still at a major disadvantage in China (as in Japan) in that it cannot set up by itself. GM must buy into another company to sell in these markets hence the tie ups with Suzuki, Isuzu etc. This then allows the locals to have a say on product placement and marketing. Does everyone still think this is how business should be done? Edited November 1, 2005 by TKR

[razoredge]

You are so out of touch with reality I still continue to read your post with amusement.  As I have said before, read some international economic publications.  You might learn something.

Who the hell do you think is keeping the US government afloat?  US tax revenue? Try the Koreans, Japanese and Chinese.  That is who are buying the treasure bonds that are funding the Iraq war, Katrina and the rest of the pork coming out of DC.  That is who.  Todays economy is so interwoven, and international, the WWII era principles you subscribe to are only small factors in todays world.

As much as I though the book was outdated when written, go read a book.  The book I recommend is Tom Friedmen's Lexus and the Olive Tree.  You might learn something.  Even from Friedman.

[post="36986"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]

Once again just more proding out of you, little else.

Amusing ? I dont find any of this amusing, Im not surprised you do after a little observation.

You quote my guess about potential GM car sales in Japan, if ? Then say its amusing but offer nothing yourself about it ? So whos the comedian ?

Out of touch with reality ? Me ? Well heres some reality for you ! America is full of working poor. The working poor in America have had their incomes in decline for a decade. At the same time many areas have had incomes go through the roof.

that is the only reality Im interested in and you want to laugh at me ?

You have yet to ever offer anything, anything what so ever into the reality of the American workforce. You wanna pass over all that, ignore it, and go straight to Japan, China or Korea. So now tell me why these detesting countrys and their populations are destroying our way of life and why Im supposed to be OK with it ? Just say it - "Because it makes my life much wealthier, screw you people"

Am I supposed to be impressed that our "economy is so interwoven" with the rest of the world ? In fact thats a little funny, you just made a funny. Here you say our economies are interwoven, yet within our country our economies are like day and night. Those that dont bat an eye at paying $100,000 for a building lot and those that struggle to come up with 2500 for their property tax's every year.

So yea, you just sit and poke at me because of your reality, have you been beyond you own little protected sanctuary ?

"Who the hell do you think is keeping the US government afloat? US tax revenue? Try the Koreans, Japanese and Chinese. That is who are buying the treasure bonds that are funding the Iraq war, Katrina and the rest of the pork coming out of DC."...............
and I suppose you are just the kind of American that is in favor of this and approves of this ? This is the exact kind of thing I have been talking about.

I wonder why thoses countries have money for bonds while yet here we do not ? :blink:

As for the government, I would be in favor of confiscation of all former and current politicians assets and throwing them all into a dungeon underneath some prison and forgetting about them. Hows that for reality ? :lol: Im sure you would like to tell me they deserve and have "earned" better than that ? :lol: According to one of your above paragraphs they have earned nothing and spent more while doing so. :blink: Thanks for admitting our GOv takes money from other country to protect foreign interests while ignoring the interests of our own population.

:lol:

Were still the consumer nation, now if only most of what we consume was in house ? It wouldnt hurt to consume a little less either.

[evok]

Evok, razor does make a good point about Japan though. GM's chances for
any kind of sales increase in Japan just is not going to work. Think Razor is
stubborn? Try selling US cars to the Japanese.... :lol: On the other hand, there
is a lot to be had in China...

You kinda lost me on the bonds thing...Bond sales aren't heavy on just those three...I realize the point of the other countries buying, but quite a few others
are also funding our war in Iraq.....

[post="37002"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]

The Japanese market is irrelevant to the US base. Any US manufacturer that would like to make in roads there would have to invest billions. Not only in infrastructure and product but the most critical market perception. They are picking their battles and China is the growth region. Strategic partners in the Japenese market is the most logical approach. That has already been taken care of. In GM's case, do not under estimate the importance of Suzuki.

Your second point is not entirely true. Years ago there was the gold standard, today we have the US T-Bill standard. China's currancy is pegged to the US dollar. What do you think they are using as collateral.

A few months ago, Korea was going to sell a big portion of there T-Bills and that made a splash. I just do not remember the specifics. And yes, many countries do purchase US bonds. But in the context of this discussion, my points are still valid.

[evok]

Razoredge: Here is another book for you to read. The End of Work by Rifkin.

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detai...=books&n=507846

Instead of reacting to change you might anticipate it.

[Polish_Kris]

So the Japanese market would be 27% of what ours is and we purchase 37%  foreign.

Not sure what that means ? Ill have to chew on it awhile.

Doesnt seem like we would gain much in Japan. Maybe a few hundred thousand sales after a few years ?

So forget it, just put a ban on Japanese car sales !!!!!!!! Let that industry go through the turmoil.

=}:-0

LOL !

[post="36927"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]

Can I ask how old you are?

[Cremazie]

GM is still at a major disadvantage in China (as in Japan) in that it cannot set up by itself. GM must buy into another company to sell in these markets hence the tie ups with Suzuki, Isuzu etc. This then allows the locals to have a say on product placement and marketing.

Does everyone still think this is how business should be done?

[post="37076"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]

I think that all countries should play by same rules if they want their companies to set up in other countries.

[I hope GMRULES again]

[quote name='evok' date='Oct 31 2005, 11:56 PM']
Who the hell do you think is keeping the US government afloat? US tax revenue? Try the Koreans, Japanese and Chinese. That is who are buying the treasure bonds that are funding the Iraq war, Katrina and the rest of the pork coming out of DC. That is who. Todays economy is so interwoven, and international, the WWII era principles you subscribe to are only small factors in todays world.


So what your saying is Korea,Japan and China have the U.S. by the balls?

[daves87rs]

The Japanese market is irrelevant to the US base.  Any US manufacturer that would like to make in roads there would have to invest billions.  Not only in infrastructure and product but the most critical market perception.  They are picking their battles and China is the growth region.  Strategic partners in the Japenese market is the most logical approach.  That has already been taken care of.  In GM's case, do not under estimate the importance of Suzuki.

Your second point is not entirely true.  Years ago there was the gold standard, today we have the US T-Bill standard.  China's currancy is pegged to the US dollar.  What do you think they are using as collateral.

A few months ago, Korea was going to sell a big portion of there T-Bills and that made a splash.  I just do not remember the specifics.  And yes, many countries do purchase US bonds.  But in the context of this discussion, my points are still valid.

[post="37099"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]

Ok, got ya. Yep, You do make some good points...
Parnters in that market could work..but I don't see any company touching GM
with a ten foot pole...that might cause backlash in their own markets....

Though as far as T-bills..there are many countries also purchase those..and
some do have more invested than others...but if countries can just use that
as a threat again us, we have even more problems than I could imagine... :(

[daves87rs]

Can I ask how old you are?

[post="37118"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]

Can we stick with the subject at hand, PLEASE? :)

[daves87rs]

So what your saying is Korea,Japan and China have the U.S. by the balls?

[post="37157"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]

Man, I hope not..

[The O.C.]

Dead on !

[post="36860"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]

Yeah...you ARE right. The consumer has been conditioned by THE BIG THREE not to buy domestic...because of all the totally undesirable cars (either in design or quality) that the Big 3 offered for too many years....

That's the only "conditioning" that has gone on....

Sounds like the same old "...it's someone else's fault...." thinking from certain GM loyalists that we've heard way too much lately....

[evok]

Though as far as T-bills..there are many countries also purchase those..and
some do have more invested than others...but if countries can just use that
as a threat again us, we have even more problems than I could imagine... :(

[post="37184"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]

Just goes to show, how interwoven the global economy has become. No one country is a stand alone entitiy anymore. All nations and respective economies are dependent on the others.

[FUTURE_OF_GM]

[quote]This is not the governments problem, it's a free market problem. If they can't sell in Japan, why not elsewhere? I hear sales in China are rosy. If GM can't make money in one market, it's their job to find a new one to sell in, or create a new one altogether, or work on fixing their current market. It's not the government's job to come to the aid of every business that suffers from poor management. We don't want GM to turn into another Northwest Airlines, do we?[/quote]

It would be different if it were JUST GM..

But we're talking about ENTIRE sectors here... Autos, Airlines, Steel, Auto Suppliers, Textiles....


[quote]Japans government is doing a great job protecting the interests of their people, I would suggest we wake TFU and start doing the same ![/quote]

I agree... But instead of caring someone will just accuse you of being a Communist/Marxist/Protectionist, like they did me.

[quote]Who the hell do you think is keeping the US government afloat? US tax revenue? Try the Koreans, Japanese and Chinese. That is who are buying the treasure bonds that are funding the Iraq war, Katrina and the rest of the pork coming out of DC. That is who. Todays economy is so interwoven, and international, the WWII era principles you subscribe to are only small factors in todays world.[/quote]

So, because of this we should sacrifice our industry and repay them by buying an asian car, or letting them have unfair advantages? (INCLUDING a free ride from the media and consumers) Hell, once you borrow enough from the bank you own the bank anyway... Pretty soon they'll OWN us... And we will pay the ultimate price. (Of course, it won't be felt on an individual level for YEARS to come)

[quote]So what your saying is Korea,Japan and China have the U.S. by the balls?[/quote]

Pretty much, see above comments.

[quote]Does everyone still think this is how business should be done?[/quote]

Apparently "only in america" (And I mean that in the worst way possible)

[quote]Out of touch with reality ? Me ? Well heres some reality for you ! America is full of working poor. The working poor in America have had their incomes in decline for a decade. At the same time many areas have had incomes go through the roof.[/quote]

ABSOLUTELY! And I can back that up with facts from social studies. Eventhough the economy is "supposedly" improving from all of these "service" jobs our standard of living is tanking.

[quote]Yeah...you ARE right. The consumer has been conditioned by THE BIG THREE not to buy domestic...because of all the totally undesirable cars (either in design or quality) that the Big 3 offered for too many years....

That's the only "conditioning" that has gone on....

Sounds like the same old "...it's someone else's fault...." thinking from certain GM loyalists that we've heard way too much lately....[/quote]

:rotflmao:

And THAT sounds like the same "better than you" elitest diarrhea that has spewed from the media, and certain members of it, as of late.

Never taking responsibility for the fact that THEY have destroyed these companies and continue to do AND will ultimately DESPITE the fact that Detroit has made desirable cars for years now.

It's a WEAK argument used to justify years of bitching about nothing in order to maintain an outdated and useless "rank" and save face from the sobering reality of destruction they have caused, a reality which should NOT have been tolerated and an END which should not BE tolerated.

[razoredge]

Evok - I do appreaciate your hoping to influence me to read some economic books. I doubt I ever will, Im not being a smart ass at this time either. Im really not much on books and have so many other interests and far to many projects. Now in all seriousness, are you implying that if I read some economic book I would see how its alright for what wealthy Americans have done to the other half of the population ? Things were going along pretty smoothly as I recall up until the last 10-15 years. Part of my industry left 5 years ago. The other part thats left primarily consists of exportation of raw products. Id rather the manufacturing was done in this country but it is not. I ignored those markets for years until they were all that was left. :unsure: Then - how can I put far reaching economic theories above and beyond my people ? We got more than a few generations caught in the middle of this so called new economy. Those of you it has not hit in the face like a hammer sit there and tell us that at 40 or 50 something we need to start life all over again, because things are peachy in India, Koreo, China and Turkey. I mean come on ! Do you really think we should just lay down and say OK ? Then some want to get ticked off at me and all the other BS I have endured, here, because I say I dont give a rats butt about those countries and their populations ? Because I dont give a Rats butt about how much more wealthy the uppers can get by fireing us and hireing them ? Because I say its BS that we should have to work at income levels of these other countries ? You all can throw up all the degrading comments at me you like, but not one of you can tell me why any of this ever should have happened to our country and why its not time to tighten up the belt.

[razoredge]

CD/BP Posted Today, 12:06 PM
  QUOTE(Polish_Kris @ Nov 1 2005, 10:45 AM)
Can I ask how old you are?
.
QUOTE(razoredge @ Oct 30 2005, 08:17 PM)
I only need to witness it for 20 more years. It seems like an eternity.
.
Well apparently he only has 20 years left.

Wow, was that a little gangbang ? Didnt work for me, hope it was good for you two ! :rolleyes:

Im old enough to be sick and tired of the BS.

Just to clue up the more slowly, many of my preposterous statements are made just for that reason. Somewhere here, back aways and many times throughout these various debates it has been said that certain Americans dont deserve but $9.00 and hour jobs and many, many other stupid statements regarding my fellow blue collar workers.

So Stupid, meet Stupid ! Edited November 2, 2005 by razoredge

[razoredge]

Apparently "only in america" .........Eventhough the economy is "supposedly" improving from all of these "service" jobs our standard of living is tanking.
:rotflmao:

It's a WEAK argument used to justify years of bitching about nothing in order to maintain an outdated and useless "rank" and save face from the sobering reality of destruction they have caused, a reality which should NOT have been tolerated and an END which should not BE tolerated.

[post="37226"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]

Na, FOG you got it all wrong, the economy is booming, the future is bright. :AH-HA_wink:

Thats why savings interest was at .5 % for over a year now .7%. The banks have all merged and now checking accounts are expensive, interest is down, required daily balances are - well more than one $9 per hr. weekly check would be and theres more laws(rules) at your local bank than the sherrifs department.

Thats why you can go into Walmart late night and see grown men stocking shelves. Grown men delivering autoparts. Anything they can get their hands on. Hell when I was a kid men didnt mow lawns, thats what some of us teenagers did for summer funds. Now its a huge industry, overly competitive and getting worse for other reasons, then finally a man will get wore out and ......go stock shelfs ? Work for facility maintence? Fast foods ? Grown men !

Its all which side of the wall you got traped on when you would never had believe it would really come to this. Remember these sayings of overreacting, dramitizing, dooms day are not new. If someone sat and predicted this huge division between work sectors 20 years ago you would have been called a "doomsday sayer". If someone sat and said a Ranchhouse would cost 350,000 and property tax's would be $2-3-4oo per month you would have been called overly dramatic, especially if you followed that by saying that grown men would still be working for only $9.00 per hour :blink:

Yep, everything must be going great, perfect, could'nt be better!

:unsure:

[razoredge]

You mentioned tightening up the belt. I believe you are suggesting tightening up the belt on trade with countries like Japan, China, etc. (If thats not what you were suggesting, lemme know.)

Yes, the baby sitting and all of it.

Does that need to happen? On some level, I think so. At the same time if we tighten the belt too much on them, those countries might stop lending us money. As pointed out earlier we are borrowing massive amounts of money from these countries lately. The only political move Japan or China would have to use is threaten to stop the flow of money and we'd be in trouble.

If that "line of credit" dries up where would that leave the US gov't? Would they take a page from the California power companies and do rolling shutdowns?

Are you telling me all the money in this country is owed to foreign investors ?  :unsure: I do wish we didnt have to waste our childrens future income tax's on this terrorist crap. I made a long post a few months back about everyone in America living off credit, making our ecomony look better than reality. Everyone with a snowmobile, a boat, a 4 wheeler, a SUV or quad Truck. So I guess finance is booming. Now I see our Government is doing the same. So "Aint that America ?"

I have my own toys though I suppose, no credit card though - NEVER  :angry:  Its working so far but there are a few inconviences, like - I have no credit, too long without loans, they made me have co signer for car loan  :lol: At 47 yrs !  B) Yea I know a thing or two about economics - If I dont have it I dont get it.

How do you strike a balance between these 2 issues?

First thing you do is START ! Begin to do something. Its always best to start hard to, as most of us should well know. My Grandfather had a saying about cutting things - " Better to go long because its easier to take a little off than it is to put it back on " seems kinda applicable to me.

 

[post="37371"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]

Edited November 2, 2005 by razoredge

[razoredge]

By the way, I think PolishKris was probably trying to see if much of the disagreement in this thread could be attributed to a generation gap.

We should never allow generation gaps to stand between us in our outlook on the future for our own population, ya know ? We built this thing, now what are we going to do with it ?

Not as kinky as your suggestion.

I have'nt gotten a look at his wife yet.....after that I could tell you how the kink went  :P 

:P  :rolleyes:

[post="37377"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]

[razoredge]

As far as Im concened forget China now, Japan is the sitting duck as the trade balance and others items sound very unbalanced at this time. Anyhow something somewhat less radical than most of my suggestions would be appropriate. Or we could wait 10 more years and get radical then . lol Na, lets just wait, do nothing , and let it all get flushed, then we can write books about the death of another Empire.

[CaddyXLR-V]

Then -  how can I put far reaching economic theories above and beyond my people ? We got more than a few generations caught in the middle of this so called new economy. Those of you it has not hit in the face like a hammer sit there and tell us that at 40 or 50 something we need to start life all over again, because things are peachy in India, Koreo, China and Turkey.

Because those theories are whats happening around you. Try understanding them instead of rambling on and on about how any higher learning wont do any good. I though you saw this coming in the 70s? And you were still caught off guard? You should have been working on a smooth transition back then, instead of allowing it to creep up on you, and "hit you in the face like a hammer". Those who refuse to evolve with the times, will endure hardships. Times change, you either adapt and make it, or you dont. Edited November 2, 2005 by CaddyXLR-V

[razoredge]

whatever the over zelous solutions I had when I was young came to life as the reality that my Father and Grandfather were talking about. I had so many solutions and answers and attitudes that I forgot them all. I was pretty anti Union, incidently. I was all full of that criptonite and had those little adreneline critters runnin through my veins.

[capriceman]

That would be extremely complicated chap 11 in the world. Wagner is serious tho. I heard about the speach about delphi's thing. He is being more competitve they have 19 billion in a safty deposit box some where and more money from world affilations and stuff. Cutting back on workers and benifits. Alos pensions are still garenteed, so there is money for that. They are cutting wastful productions like for Ex. If they sell 100,000 cobalts a year no need to make 300,000 of them. lowering prices and giving more options and power/ fuel economy are big points in there marketing, as well as safty. They arent in that bad of shape just that Media make it seem worse than it is. even yourseleves make it seem horrible. look at charts they sell more total vechcles than anybody else. if there is somthing to blame it is the U.S. health system and medicine companies. they want $700 for a 30 pills its insane. GM go with Generic brands. all post more ideas he had when i can remeber them.

[razoredge]

Because those theories are whats happening around you. Try understanding them

Are you so arrogant that you think I cant and dont know the theory behind this BS, its not applicable to the entire population, your the one with the understanding problems, even when its right in the face. Its here today, now and its not working for the entire population. If I go to the bank with a economic theory will they give me some cash ?

instead of rambling on and on about how any higher learning wont do any good.

Never said that !
I though you saw this coming in the 70s? And you were still caught off guard? You should have been working on a smooth transition back then,

Yep like you would know - back then ?

instead of allowing it to creep up on you, and "hit you in the face like a hammer". Those who refuse to evolve with the times, will endure hardships. Times change,

Nothing has changed, we still need jobs, food, houses, cars, family and life !

you either adapt and make it, or you dont.

If I pulled the carpet out from under you and forced my world on you, you would not make it, sorry but Im not that kind of man !

[post="37419"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]

Ya know what ? You are unfriggin believable

this is what I was doing...... and Im pissed.....this is un friigin believable......walk a damn mile for once would you !

I was building my future, I was building a business, I was paying bills, buying/building a house, raising a daughter, I was friggin busy. You have no idea what you are talking about on my side of the fence mister, you need to back it down on this one, because you were not there.

I would like to make a personal request that you stay the hell off my back, Im so sick of you calling me a loser in so many words. I was not in the manufactureing business. Because I saw the shutting down of industrial plants since the 70's doesnt mean I needed to worry about what I was doing ! I was busy makeing things happen. You leave me the F alone XLR ! Its always the same thing back at me from you. I should ask how old you really are, but you all would blow that all out of context. If you had some years on you , you would know better than to suggest that someone just sat around for 25 years and did nothing with their time or even had any extra in the first place.

stay away XLR or it will get ugly.

You have called me a looser far to many times !

Were not all the same damn kind of people, THIS IS SOMETHING THAT SHOULD NOT EVEN NEED TO BE SAID. We all need to make a decent living doing what suits us. I could not and do not want to do what you do and you could not and do not want to do what I do.

[razoredge]

And to top it all of XLR - while you attacking me for wasting the best hard 30 years of my life I havent even been taking about my state of affairs except for references to my experience. I have been talking about the entire population of a country and just exactly what our children are going to inherit. Yet you attack me because of where I put my hard efforts. Right on Brother !

[CaddyXLR-V]

And to top it all of XLR - while you attacking me for wasting the best hard 30 years of my life I havent even been taking about my state of affairs except for references to my experience. I have been talking about the entire population of a country and just exactly what our children are going to inherit. Yet you attack me because of where I put my hard efforts.

Right on Brother !

[post="37446"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]

I'm sorry, I shouldnt have directed that at your life.
All I mean is something needs to change to keep our companies alive, and with their costs, they are collapsing under the weight. Do I hope lots of people starve? No, I dont. But if the company they work for collapses, that wouldn't help their situation either.

[daves87rs]

Na, FOG you got it all wrong, the economy is booming, the future is bright.  :AH-HA_wink:

Thats why savings interest was at .5 % for over a year now .7%. The banks have all merged and now checking accounts are expensive, interest is down, required daily balances are - well more than one $9 per hr. weekly check would be and theres more laws(rules) at your local bank than the sherrifs department.

Thats why you can go into Walmart late night and see grown men stocking shelves. Grown men delivering autoparts. Anything they can get their hands on. Hell when I was a kid men didnt mow lawns, thats what some of us teenagers did for summer funds. Now its a huge industry, overly competitive and getting worse for other reasons, then finally a man will get wore out and ......go stock shelfs ? Work for facility maintence? Fast foods ? Grown men !

Its all which side of the wall you got traped on when you would never had believe it would really come to this. Remember these sayings of overreacting, dramitizing, dooms day are not new. If someone sat and predicted this huge division between work sectors 20 years ago you would have been called a "doomsday sayer". If someone sat and said a Ranchhouse would cost 350,000 and property tax's would be $2-3-4oo per month you would have been called  overly dramatic, especially if you followed that by saying that grown men would still be working for only $9.00 per hour  :blink:

Yep, everything must be going great, perfect, could'nt be better!

:unsure:

[post="37370"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]

Razor, I don't think that could be said much better.... :)

Case in point. A good friend of mine-his dad is currently working at Walmart.
He was working in the steel industry...doing pretty well, before everything came
crashing down. He has been struggling ever since. He wants to go back to
school to get a better career, but he simply can't get the money to go.
Middle aged, and stocking shelves at Walmart? How can you improve yourself
if you can't afford to?

This is why it is so important to see it from many other people's eyes.....it
can can always be easy to explain (or see in hindsight), but much different
to experience....

[Alpha]

Then why were the reports that Honda had to drop production numbers of the Ridegeline, how poorly its doing etc?

[post="36817"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]

I think you may need to look at the Ridgeline for an answer to that question. I finally saw one in person the other day and it was more ugly than I had thought before. That short stubby hood and stubby box don't do much for a truck...

[sciguy_0504]

Here's another book: "The World Is Flat" It was recommended by my business professor when she was discussing the changing economic times in class a few weeks ago. I still need to read it but apparently it's almost dead on.

[Flybrian]

Here's another book:  "The World Is Flat"  It was recommended by my business professor when she was discussing the changing economic times in class a few weeks ago.  I still need to read it but apparently it's almost dead on.

[post="37705"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]

[Razor]
Wha...? A WOMAN professor? AHAHAHAHA Yeah right. Seriously, now...
[/Razor]
:P

[evok]

Just goes to show, how interwoven the global economy has become.  No one country is a stand alone entitiy anymore.  All nations and respective economies are dependent on the others.

[post="37197"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/conte...5101901455.html

[Guest buickman]

Months ago, before it was fashionable, I called for Wagoner to resign at the annual meeting. Offering constructive criticism, I presented Return to Greatness, a comprehensive plan to implement effective marketing. The management at GM refused to listen, instead introducing GMS to everyone. Some of you may remember, I predicted disastrous effects and now we have 22% market share, chance of Toyota overtaking GM in '06, $4,000,000,000 in losses, further junk ratings, and the BK of Delphi. But then, what would a car salesman know about selling cars? At Suski Chevy Buick last month our sales were up, we delivered 109 new and ended with 95 in stock, less than a thirty day turn. Furthermore, our advertising was less than $100 per car, and we made a lot of money. So much for effective marketing. "Red Ink Rick" has to go! Buickman Founder www.GeneralWwatch.com