Spy Shot: Chevy Volt caught from the beltline up

[A Horse With No Name]

Not bad. Something about it reminds me of the Alfa 164 they used to sell in the US.

I think so also...that was also my first thought.

Chris

[A Horse With No Name]

THe Honda Fit is probably the ugliest, most disproportioned car since the aztec. Worse, actually. UGH!

Actually I like the Fit quite a bit. But I hate, hate, hate the Yaris and the Versa with an ungodly passion.

Chris

[A Horse With No Name]

assuming they can build more than a few and sell them at a price that does something.

i love it tho, awesome looking car. a little chunky, but it makes the prius look like crap.

GM is on a roll....CTS-V, Sky, Solstice, Astra, Aura, Malibu, Enclave, Outlook, The GMT 900's, The Cruze, HHR, et al...LOTS of great product here and in the pipeline.

Things haven't really been this good from GM since the early 1970's, IMHO. :AH-HA_wink:

Chris

[red]

Looking nice, not entirely dull either. Does look a little chunky, the side profile shot reminds me of an Avenger, and the side mirrors are hopefully only for the movie.

For this car to be successful, it not only has to look good & function well, it has to be priced affordably and uphold excellent reliability. Remember what happened when Iacocca rushed the Pinto into production...

[pow]

It looks better in this shot...

[siegen]

THe Honda Fit is probably the ugliest, most disproportioned car since the aztec. Worse, actually. UGH!

Let's not get off topic here, but the Fit is an excellent looking vehicle for its class. If you can't get past the stubby hood or how far the windshield protrudes forward, then that is ok. It is odd styling to a lot of people, but in this class it is by far the best looking overall. I told myself I would never "downgrade" back to a Honda, but I am honestly considering the Fit. The idea of mid-30 MPG in the city and the large interior room is very tempting.

I certainly hope NONE of that is the case.

The devil is in the details, especially this day in age. The details make the design IMO.

The details are very important, and the Volt needs very good details. I don't like the silver parts though, I think they should be body colored. That doesn't mean that they shouldn't be well styled.

I have a feeling they will be body colored on the production model anyway, and it will look good. The wheels will be a very important part of making the vehicle look more substantial than other hybrids. I doubt it will come with those giant 19-20inch rims seen in the photo, but as long as it has some solid looking 17 inch rims, it will do good.

[BuddyP]

I for one LIKE the silver accents. I'm limited on monochromatic paint schemes. If everything was one color it'll blend all in and look bland. I remember when the monochromatic paint scheme was an option for the '93 Camaro when it came out. Red mirrors and roof.... wow did that not look right! The black roof and mirrors looked a whole lot better.

I do agree about the wheels though... they make or break a vehicle.

[GXT]

Watered down?

No, I don't think so.

I would call this car actualized.

actualized = watered down... especially when you have been running commercials for a year(?) now and Lutz has been "leaking" such gems as:

“He (Lutz) noted that the exterior design is 90% complete but that the final product will likely have a more subdued or less aggressive front-end”

http://gm-volt.com/2007/07/04/bob-lutz-interview-on-design/

90% finalized and the only change worth mentioning is a less aggressive front-end? What is a person to think?

There will be huge enthusiasm for the Volt among buyers that represent the future of the car business, and that is how GM has a shot to right the ship. It will have to be followed by other hits of the same caliber of course, but right now it is a huge leap in the right direction.

Make no mistake, the Volt changes everything.

So GM's plan is to get people excited about a Volt concept years in advance of release and then only deliver 250,000 by 2015 (GM's numbers, not mine), almost a decade after they aired the first TV spots, and charge $40,000 or more for an "actualized" version of what was promised? While Honda/Toyota etc. will offer perhaps 1,000,000 affordably priced (20,000 or less) hybrids/year? And in the meantime GM has trouble selling even 1,000 hybrids/Q (http://wot.motortrend.com/6239143/green/gm-hybrid-sales-starting-off-slow/index.html).

Building up demand for a product that you can't deliver and thereby encourage people to buy your competitor's products seems like a bad business strategy to me. But then I don't have the track record of Wagoner.

I don't think this "changes everything". It looks like management incompetence as usual to me.

Edited August 29, 2008 by GXT

[Robert Hall]

Looks like a decent $20k compact. I don't see it having many takers at $40k.

[FAPTurbo]

Looks like a decent $20k compact. I don't see it having many takers at $40k.

It's the same deal with the Prius, though. I can't understand how people could fork over 30K Canadian for something that makes the Corolla look plush.

[Satty]

Drive a Prius, then a Corolla, and you'll see there is no comparison. The Prius isn't a penalty box, and if definitely worth what Toyota is asking. The Volt would probably be the same way if it were priced alongside the Prius, maybe a bit more because of the technology factor, but pricing the Volt well above max sticker for the Prius and Camry isn't the best idea. Hell, $40,000 almost buys an RX hybrid.

[Camino LS6]

The Volt will be the only mass produced car that can do what it does when it hits the market - the tech eclipses that of the Prius. That fact alone will have early adopters spending what they have to in order to get one. Then add in the very,very likely tax incentives to help defray the cost, and GM will sell every one it can build.

And that's another thing, E-flex is set for huge expansion in production worldwide so initial numbers are just that: initial.

[A Horse With No Name]

I can't wait until this thing hits the market...and I think your right, they will sell every one they can build.

Chris

[A Horse With No Name]

Let's not get off topic here, but the Fit is an excellent looking vehicle for its class. If you can't get past the stubby hood or how far the windshield protrudes forward, then that is ok. It is odd styling to a lot of people, but in this class it is by far the best looking overall. I told myself I would never "downgrade" back to a Honda, but I am honestly considering the Fit. The idea of mid-30 MPG in the city and the large interior room is very tempting.

The driving dynamics make the car, it is a VERY good driving vehicle.

MUCH better than the crappy driving Yaris and Versa.

Chris

[thegriffon]

The original US-market Fit was Dolly Partonized with oversized bumpers to meet US regulations. I'd agree that it spoilt the looks. That's what you get for making a last-minute adaptation because you are caught of-guard by Chevy selling boat-loads of Aveos. Incredibly, like the Yaris, the new model is still several inches longer than the JDM/Euro version. The Koreans can do it without plastic surgery, so what's up with Toyota and Honda?

[thegriffon]

The concept looked like a coupe. This seems more obviously a 4/5-door.

[siegen]

The original US-market Fit was Dolly Partonized with oversized bumpers to meet US regulations. I'd agree that it spoilt the looks. That's what you get for making a last-minute adaptation because you are caught of-guard by Chevy selling boat-loads of Aveos. Incredibly, like the Yaris, the new model is still several inches longer than the JDM/Euro version. The Koreans can do it without plastic surgery, so what's up with Toyota and Honda?

I am fairly sure the Fit being "Americanized" and released here had nothing to do with how well the Aveo was selling. The model had been on sale since 2001 in the rest of the world, and the US barely got any inventory to sell when it finally did get sold here. And as far as the '09 Fit goes, its release date was moved forward by over a month in response to selling out of '08 Fits.

After seeing the USDM and JDM Fits, I like the slightly longer bumper of the USDM model better. The difference is slight though, but the JDM model looks slightly stubbier.

I feel like a thread hijacker, sorry.

But since Edmonds compared the Fit to the Prius recently, I suppose in some crazy round-about way it's slightly on topic.

[GXT]

The Volt will be the only mass produced car that can do what it does when it hits the market - the tech eclipses that of the Prius. That fact alone will have early adopters spending what they have to in order to get one. Then add in the very,very likely tax incentives to help defray the cost, and GM will sell every one it can build.

And that's another thing, E-flex is set for huge expansion in production worldwide so initial numbers are just that: initial.

There are already plug-in Priuses on the road using the Hymotion pack. Google has 4 of their own that they've been driving for about a year now:

http://www.google.org/recharge/index.html

The hymotion pack is apparently $9,995 including installation. It is 5KWh and uses A123 cells (one of the two companies in the running for the Volt). So either Toyota could make a 5KWh pack for a fraction of that price or GM's 16KWh pack is going to keep the volt price well north of $40,000.

Either way, it shows that the Prius can already do pretty much what the Volt hopes to do in 2011ish. And because of the limitations of the Volt's design GM needs a lot more battery than the Prius and therefore Toyota should be able to do it for much less money.

The only real questions are whether it makes sense to do it, whether Toyota wants to do it and whether they have the capacity to create the batteries to do it. Regarding that capacity, I don't think it is clear that either company is ahead of the other.

The only meaningful advantage the Volt could claim (even in this era where GM gets to make up all the other specs at will) was the aggressive styling. And that apparently is gone.

The fact is (even according to GM) that you just won't be able to get a Volt. And compared to a $40,000 volt that you can't get a $20,000 Prius or an 18,000 Honda GSH looks pretty darn good.

[michaelv13]

There are already plug-in Priuses on the road using the Hymotion pack. Google has 4 of their own that they've been driving for about a year now:

http://www.google.org/recharge/index.html

The hymotion pack is apparently $9,995 including installation. It is 5KWh and uses A123 cells (one of the two companies in the running for the Volt). So either Toyota could make a 5KWh pack for a fraction of that price or GM's 16KWh pack is going to keep the volt price well north of $40,000.

Either way, it shows that the Prius can already do pretty much what the Volt hopes to do in 2011ish. And because of the limitations of the Volt's design GM needs a lot more battery than the Prius and therefore Toyota should be able to do it for much less money.

The only real questions are whether it makes sense to do it, whether Toyota wants to do it and whether they have the capacity to create the batteries to do it. Regarding that capacity, I don't think it is clear that either company is ahead of the other.

The only meaningful advantage the Volt could claim (even in this era where GM gets to make up all the other specs at will) was the aggressive styling. And that apparently is gone.

The fact is (even according to GM) that you just won't be able to get a Volt. And compared to a $40,000 volt that you can't get a $20,000 Prius or an 18,000 Honda GSH looks pretty darn good.

Good argument regarding the economics of comparing a 5KWH not OEM system to that of the Volt but you have some major flaws.

#1 the economy of scales. You will have someone who has been selling 10-20 cars a month even give the most benefit of doubt to 100 cars a month compared to someone who will produce at least 1,000 cars a months initially (Assuming 10,000 units in first year of production run). Don't you think that one order of magnitude of production will produce at least 50% reduction in cost?

#2. Those $9,000 involves three costs. One - battery suppliers own profit markup, two - the aftermarket suppliers own markup for "purchasing" the batteries plus costs for retrofitting. If you have mass production (point #1) you will be better able to control the price of the supplier, reduce the overhead price for selling it to the consumer and there will be no retrofitting cost.

#3. At this point the aftermarket supplier has non existent competition. Tell me the numbers when the Volt or even plugin Prius starts making those vehicles as OEM.

[deftonesfan867]

Exactly. You can't say "oh well Toyota MIGHT, again MIGHT be able to use the aftermarket system" because then Toyota would have to be handing money over to that company to use it. We all know Toyota want's to have it been there own even if they didn't make it. Not to mention warranty claims and the fact the GM is STILL the only car company right now with a SOLID layout for a plug in. I ask you, where's the others plug in's @? I don't see any being tested on the roads....

Edited August 29, 2008 by deftonesfan867

[gm4life]

I am typically a Volt buyer but could be swayed to buy one if they look this good and they are priced right. Still prefer a nice G8 or Camaro tho.

Edited August 30, 2008 by gm4life

[regfootball]

whoever packaged hiperf hybrid in an attractive package will be the new paradigm. this car might do it. toyota doesn't have the ability to make a stylish vehicle. they won't be the ones to do it. honda has some serious mental masturbation issues in their styling department lately too.

[pow]

Chevy Volt Unmasked on Transformers 2 Set Is "Not Production Vehicle," but Close

http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/News/articleId=131426

[dwightlooi]

It's a nice looking car. Very modern, very proportionally "right". Sleek roof line, short hood, high deck. Just as unique but far better looking than the Camaro or the Cruze. I like it!

Hybrid or not, Chevys should look like that.

Maybe they should have a high performance version of it... say a two 120kW (240kW; 321hp total) Permanent Magnet motors driving the wheels. Forget the plug-in part and just have a low capacity, high current Li-Ion battery to cope with short acceleration bursts. Power can come from a 60~70kW gas turbine generator the size of a small waste paper basket. Again, performance, light weight and high power density is the goal here not ultimate fuel economy. It'll be RWD, it'll have the equivalent of active differentials with its ability to meter torque to the left and right rear wheels at will, it'll be light given the extremely small gas turbine generator plant.

[maxximus1]

this car is gonna turn heads. the color looks great on this car and the side mirrors are very nice!

Edited August 30, 2008 by maxximus1

[MysteriousSol]

So if they do a performance version, will it be called the Volt Super Shock? (SS)

Pontiac has the performance E-Flex all wrapped up. :AH-HA_wink:

[Robert Hall]

Pontiac has the performance E-Flex all wrapped up. :AH-HA_wink:

G4 GXP!

[MysteriousSol]

I am typically a Volt buyer but could be swayed to buy one if they look this good and they are priced right. Still prefer a nice G8 or Camaro tho.

You just said you're a "typical" Volt buyer. Then you said you prefer a nice G8 or Camaro.

Dude...you're not a typical Volt buyer at all!

[Robert Hall]

You just said you're a "typical" Volt buyer. Then you said you prefer a nice G8 or Camaro.

Dude...you're not a typical Volt buyer at all!

Yes, a 'typical' Volt buyer would never consider anything with a V8 or remotely fun..they want green, practical, generic. The Volt has to go after the Prius intenders...

[MysteriousSol]

Yes, a 'typical' Volt buyer would never consider anything with a V8 or remotely fun..they want green, practical, generic. The Volt has to go after the Prius intenders...

I hope you're not being sarcastic because you hit the nail right on the head.

[Robert Hall]

I hope you're not being sarcastic because you hit the nail right on the head.

Nope...dead serious. It's a demographic that is new to GM...they have to tap that market for this car to be successful.

[GXT]

Good argument regarding the economics of comparing a 5KWH not OEM system to that of the Volt but you have some major flaws.

#1 the economy of scales. You will have someone who has been selling 10-20 cars a month even give the most benefit of doubt to 100 cars a month compared to someone who will produce at least 1,000 cars a months initially (Assuming 10,000 units in first year of production run). Don't you think that one order of magnitude of production will produce at least 50% reduction in cost?

#2. Those $9,000 involves three costs. One - battery suppliers own profit markup, two - the aftermarket suppliers own markup for "purchasing" the batteries plus costs for retrofitting. If you have mass production (point #1) you will be better able to control the price of the supplier, reduce the overhead price for selling it to the consumer and there will be no retrofitting cost.

#3. At this point the aftermarket supplier has non existent competition. Tell me the numbers when the Volt or even plugin Prius starts making those vehicles as OEM.

I would appreciate if you would read my post more closely before you accuse me of having "major flaws".

I wrote: "The hymotion pack is apparently $9,995 including installation. It is 5KWh and uses A123 cells (one of the two companies in the running for the Volt). So either Toyota could make a 5KWh pack for a fraction of that price or GM's 16KWh pack is going to keep the volt price well north of $40,000.

I didn't state which I believed to be the case, so I don't know you can say that I had "major flaws". Since you asked so nicely, I do think you are right. But my point was that either way Toyota has GM beat in cost effectiveness due to the limitations in the Volt design.

If you don't believe me, ask GM themselves. How long did they argue against hybrids because of the battery cost? Now what do they do? Design a car that has a battery 7 to 8 times larger but only with 4 times the usable power. And then they slapped an engine on it to negate major cost/weight benefit that their series design had.

Edited August 30, 2008 by GXT

[GXT]

Exactly. You can't say "oh well Toyota MIGHT, again MIGHT be able to use the aftermarket system" because then Toyota would have to be handing money over to that company to use it. We all know Toyota want's to have it been there own even if they didn't make it. Not to mention warranty claims and the fact the GM is STILL the only car company right now with a SOLID layout for a plug in. I ask you, where's the others plug in's @? I don't see any being tested on the roads....

How hard did you look? Apparently Toyota has had them on the road since 2007:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/19952006/

I'm not saying Toyota MIGHT be able to use the aftermarket system. I'm saying that if someone can make an aftermarket system to do it then how hard would it be for Toyota to do it?

Edited August 30, 2008 by GXT

[deftonesfan867]

How hard did you look? Apparently Toyota has had them on the road since 2007:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/19952006/

I'm not saying Toyota MIGHT be able to use the aftermarket system. I'm saying that if someone can make an aftermarket system to do it then how hard would it be for Toyota to do it?

Erm, GM is testing FOR production vehicles, Toyota isn't.

The Plug-in HV displayed Wednesday runs on the same nickel metal hydride battery as the Prius and has a cruising range of 13 kilometers (8 miles) on electricity. Takimoto said tests will help in deciding the range consumers want.

Hmmmmm....yep, still NOTHING like the Volt, which was what I asked for.

Edited August 30, 2008 by deftonesfan867

[Sixty8panther]

Looks like it has ordinary FWD proportions rather the wheels-forward look of the concept.

And there you have it... my interest went from "high" to "zero".

This is typical GM bull$hit half-assing!

Too bad, other than the terrible proportions it's an improvement

over the concept... detailing & greenhuse looks quite nice.

[z28luvr01]

It's on Delta II, so I would expect proportions not all that different from the Cruze, which does have nice proportions for a FWD car.

[BatmanGTO]

Is shoving an LS3 in the Volt Eco-Friendly???

[Sixty8panther]

hahaha.... DarKnight-Goat,

Who cares, it's smile inducing. :-)

[pow]

Tranformer Volt: Built on a Malibu Chassis

Date posted: 09-02-2008

STORY TOOLS

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SANTA MONICA, California — Last week Inside Line published photos of the future Chevrolet Volt caught on the scene of the new Transformers 2 movie set, and GM officials were adamant that the Volt seen running with what could be the latest Autobots and Decepticons was not the Volt that will be coming to Chevrolet showrooms next year.

Merely semantics, we'd say, as a source within GM has since confirmed what we suspected late last week; the Volt spotted on the streets of Long Beach, California was not a full running prototype, but a fiberglass replica of the production Volt design riding on a Malibu chassis with a full Malibu drivetrain and interior.

Built by Saleen, the company that also crafted the Camaros for the original Transformers movie, the Volt was specifically built for Transformers 2. But unlike the Camaros where they built several cars, only one Volt movie car was constructed, and it was supposed to be held under very tight security.

From 25 feet away, the distance of these spy photos, the Volt looks like a real car. However, like many movie replicas, the Volt is sporting everything from unique show car paint to oversized brake discs made of cardboard.

Set for production debut next summer, the Chevy Volt will be released at the same time Transformers 2 is hitting movie theaters, which is why GM benefits from the Volt's movie appearance, even if the electric car does not get a starring role.

What this means to you: The Chevy Volt has become the poster child for the future of GM. And a couple of thousand movie posters can't hurt, either.— Kelly Toepke, News Editor

[Robert Hall]

Tranformer Volt: Built on a Malibu Chassis

Date posted: 09-02-2008

STORY TOOLS

Print thisPrint this Save thisSave this Digg this storyDigg this!

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SANTA MONICA, California — Last week Inside Line published photos of the future Chevrolet Volt caught on the scene of the new Transformers 2 movie set, and GM officials were adamant that the Volt seen running with what could be the latest Autobots and Decepticons was not the Volt that will be coming to Chevrolet showrooms next year.

Merely semantics, we'd say, as a source within GM has since confirmed what we suspected late last week; the Volt spotted on the streets of Long Beach, California was not a full running prototype, but a fiberglass replica of the production Volt design riding on a Malibu chassis with a full Malibu drivetrain and interior.

Built by Saleen, the company that also crafted the Camaros for the original Transformers movie, the Volt was specifically built for Transformers 2. But unlike the Camaros where they built several cars, only one Volt movie car was constructed, and it was supposed to be held under very tight security.

From 25 feet away, the distance of these spy photos, the Volt looks like a real car. However, like many movie replicas, the Volt is sporting everything from unique show car paint to oversized brake discs made of cardboard.

Set for production debut next summer, the Chevy Volt will be released at the same time Transformers 2 is hitting movie theaters, which is why GM benefits from the Volt's movie appearance, even if the electric car does not get a starring role.

What this means to you: The Chevy Volt has become the poster child for the future of GM. And a couple of thousand movie posters can't hurt, either.— Kelly Toepke, News Editor

So it's just a movie Decipticar... not anything real..

[siegen]

What this means to you

I read the article, why do I now need someone to tell me "what it means to me"? Is the average consumer so stupid as they cannot develop their own opinion of what they have just read, and they need the editor to tell them?

Sorry don't mean to be off topic but it's a big peeve of mine whenever I see that in articles/reviews. And unfortunately it's rampant.

As far as the article contents. I am not surprised at all. I figured the wheels, accents, and other "flare" was just for show, but it turns out the whole body may be a little different on the production model. It may have those RWD-eque proportions yet! lol

[haypops]

I read the article, why do I now need someone to tell me "what it means to me"?

"what it means to me" = executive summary. That should make you feel better.

[balthazar]

>>"Is the average consumer so stupid as they cannot develop their own opinion of what they have just read, and they need the editor to tell them?

...And unfortunately it's rampant."<<

This is the wretched, unfortunate current state of modern 'journalism'. Leading the reader by the {eyeball} "is what our readers want". So much garbage...

[GXT]

Erm, GM is testing FOR production vehicles, Toyota isn't.

Hmmmmm....yep, still NOTHING like the Volt, which was what I asked for.

Actually, you wrote:

"I ask you, where's the others plug in's @? I don't see any being tested on the roads...."

And apparently Toyota is testing them on the road. Since 2007. GM? I think they are shooting for the end of this year or early next year.

Regarding the range, that is a trade off for price. If it is appropriate to up the range then I imagine Toyota will. GM's process for deciding on the 40 mile range was questionable (that is me being overly generous) and the cause of much of the expected pricing and availability issues. Hopefully Toyota will do better.

Edited September 5, 2008 by GXT