Cadillac confirms CTS coupe for UK at London show

[Guest aatbloke]

From Auto Express:

Visitors to the show will be hard pressed to miss the muscular frame of Cadillac's new CTS Coupe concept.

The impressive, sporty derivative of the CTS executive saloon is the highlight of the American firm's stand. Whatsmore, it's ready to pounce on the UK market.

Cadillac confirmed the car is going into production and will hit our showrooms in RHD guise, with two engines on offer - a 3.6-litre direct injection V6 and an oil-burning 2.9-litre V6.

The standard saloon is also set to get diesel power, but prices won't be announced until later in the year, when the car arrives in the UK alongside a CTS estate.

Cadillac's fuel cell concept, the Provoq, also made the stands, giving visitors a chance to peer into the cabin and wonder if the SRX replacement will ever make it into production.

Edited July 24, 2008 by aatbloke

[Drew Dowdell]

So when does the oil burner go on sale? I've been pricing out cars and I definitely want a diesel. If the CTS doesn't get the diesel soon, I may go with the Alpha 159 or Peugeot 407 coupe.

[smk4565]

It takes them too long to get the coupe, wagon and diesel out. When the new 3-series came out, sedan, coupe wagon came out in the same model year and convertible followed about 9 months later. Cadillac moves too slow. They should have had a 50 state legal diesel on sale this summer, on 09 models at the latest.

[Robert Hall]

It takes them too long to get the coupe, wagon and diesel out. When the new 3-series came out, sedan, coupe wagon came out in the same model year and convertible followed about 9 months later. Cadillac moves too slow. They should have had a 50 state legal diesel on sale this summer, on 09 models at the latest.

We are talking about GM, though. BMW is small, nimble, and profitable. GM moves much slower.

Edited July 24, 2008 by moltar

[Paolino]

So when does the oil burner go on sale? I've been pricing out cars and I definitely want a diesel. If the CTS doesn't get the diesel soon, I may go with the Alpha 159 or Peugeot 407 coupe.

Go Alfa!

[Intrepidation]

It takes them too long to get the coupe, wagon and diesel out. When the new 3-series came out, sedan, coupe wagon came out in the same model year and convertible followed about 9 months later. Cadillac moves too slow. They should have had a 50 state legal diesel on sale this summer, on 09 models at the latest.

well one strategy is to intoduce a new variation each year to keep interest in the car. I don't know if that's what they were going for, or if they are just slow though (a little of column A, a little of coulmn B perhaps?).

[michaelv13]

It takes them too long to get the coupe, wagon and diesel out. When the new 3-series came out, sedan, coupe wagon came out in the same model year and convertible followed about 9 months later. Cadillac moves too slow. They should have had a 50 state legal diesel on sale this summer, on 09 models at the latest.

Wrong Sir! BMW sedan came in April 0f 2005 as a 2006 model, a month after European launch. The coupes and covertibles came in over a year later in August 2006 as 2007 models, that is when they dropped the 330i sedan to become 335i sedan, which joined as a 2007 model in September 2006. Get your facts straight. 2006 MY Coupes and convertibles for BMW 3er were the old style. And they JUST released the M3 for sale in first quarter of 2008, that spans about 3 years since the first 3 series surfaced.

[Intrepidation]

pwnt (again)

[Robert Hall]

well one strategy is to intoduce a new variation each year to keep interest in the car. I don't know if that's what they were going for, or if they are just slow though (a little of column A, a little of coulmn B perhaps?).

True..arguably a better strategy than introducing all at once.. very few cars (in NA at least) have multiple bodystyles anymore, and very few are introduced all at the same time.

[smk4565]

We are talking about GM, though. BMW is small, nimble, and profitable. GM moves much slower.

Cadillac said they were going to compete with BMW, time to step up to the plate and do it. They shouldn't make ads comparing the CTS or G8 to a 5-series if they aren't up to the task of taking on the Germans.

[smk4565]

Wrong Sir! BMW sedan came in April 0f 2005 as a 2006 model, a month after European launch. The coupes and covertibles came in over a year later in August 2006 as 2007 models, that is when they dropped the 330i sedan to become 335i sedan, which joined as a 2007 model in September 2006. Get your facts straight. 2006 MY Coupes and convertibles for BMW 3er were the old style. And they JUST released the M3 for sale in first quarter of 2008, that spans about 3 years since the first 3 series surfaced.

The sedan wasn't out as early as April, because I know someone that bought a 2005 330i in April and the 06 model wasn't coming until May or June. The sedan and wagon were 2006 models, I know the coupe and convertible were 2007 models, but they were just coming out at the time of the Pittsburgh Auto show which was February in 2006, by April 2006 dealers should have had them, so it was more of a 10 month delay. Even if it was a year, the CTS sedan was out last August, so it has been 1 year, and the coupe and wagon are still 8-10 months away.

And Cadillac is missing a 3-series size car, with sedan, coupe, convertible styles, and they are missing a $90,000 sedan to go against the S-class, and the XLR needs a real update, not a bad refresh to add some non-functional vents on the side of the engine.

I don't have a problem with doing the sedan, and coupe and wagon follow 9-12 months later, to keep interest. But it has been a year; if I was a Cadillac dealer I would rather have all 3 at once, since the Euro luxury brands already have various body styles.

Edited July 24, 2008 by smk4565

[Drew Dowdell]

I hate to break it to you SMK, but we in Pittsburgh don't usually get the first of the hot launch cars.

[SAmadei]

True..arguably a better strategy than introducing all at once.. very few cars (in NA at least) have multiple bodystyles anymore, and very few are introduced all at the same time.

I seriously disagree. I feel the majority of car buyers are not looking to buy a car every year. The logic is not, "oh, I wanted the wagon, but it wasn't available, so I bought a sedan last year and bought a wagon this year... but I really want the coupe, and I'll get that next year."

Sedan, coupe and wagon buyers are different demographics... and in many cases, are not interchangeable.

The reason the sedan is first to market is that it sells the best and the logic is to get it out there to grab the lion's share of buyers first... however, I feel this is slowly self-defeating... Usually, the coupe is the halo-car. It has the most dramatic styling. The coupe grabs your heart and pulls you into the dealer's lot. Sure, you drive out with a sedan, as the logical part of your mind takes over.

With the strategy of release one each year, by the time the coupe or wagon is released in year three, its obsolete... its a has-been. Nobody wants it, and you're lucky to pull people into the dealer to look at it, let alone buy it. Plus you lose the 'halo-effect'. I would even go out on a limb and suggest that releasing the three variants would increase each variant's sales due to the 'halo-effect'... the sedan sales would increase due to sales to people who initially were attracted to the dealer by the coupe or wagon.

If your going to spend the money to have three variations, get them to market in year one... excite the buyer... entice the buyer ... with _choice_.

IMHO, the G8 ST could be genius... if the general public learns about it, and goes to the dealer to see it, they may not buy it... but buy a G8 sedan instead.

Plus, you're going to spend more money developing the car in the future, anyway... i.e., to oversimplify, lets say every year it costs 2% more to develop a car... engineers expect yearly raises. Lets say it cost $100 to develop a car. So if you drop all three forms in one year, it cost you $300 to develop it. OTOH, you offer a new one each year, the first costs $100, the second costs $102, the third costs $104.04... total is now $306.04.

I'd rather see this incremental improvement in drivetrains, as I believe buyers are more interchangeable in this aspect... a buyer looking for a manual may settle for an automatic... or would be more willing to trade up to a new, manual car later.

Just my thoughts, at least...

Stephen

[Northstar]

According to some, the wagon and coupe will be accompanied with an MCE of the sedan.

I think not debuting the wagon and coupe at the same time as the sedan would have been a bigger deal if the old CTS had wagon and coupe variants as well. The coupe and wagon obviously didn't get approved for production at the same time as the sedan, so they didn't make it to production at the same time, either, as a result.

[HarleyEarl]

What's an Alpha 159? Never heard of that brand.

[smk4565]

The coupe and wagon should have been green lighted at the same time, didn't they notice BMW did a coupe and wagon of the 3 and 5 series for the last 30 years or so. The coupe production starts May 2009, that is nearly 2 years after the sedan, and the coupe has the same interior, same powertrain. All it has different is a back up camera, and the touch release doors that the Corvette and XLR have. After the sedan has been out for 2 years, the coupe won't look like anything special.

I don't like staggering launches. The sedan should obviously come first, but coupe and wagon variants should come within 6 months.

[Drew Dowdell]

What's an Alpha 159? Never heard of that brand.

Alfa Romeo It was 8:40 in the morning and I hadn't had my tea yet.

[balthazar]

>>"All it has different is a back up camera, and the touch release doors"<<

Everything behind the A-pillar is unique; what's this crap about only the backup camera & door handles and it's the sedan??

It's pretty easy for bmw to pull a relatively mild re-do on a 2-dr sedan, 4-dr sedan and a wagon when those body shells have been engineered years ago (yet it still took the better part of 2 years from the 2-dr to the m3) , Cadillac did not have these bodies engineered already to just slap new sheetmetal stampings on, yet their timetable is still nearly identical to bmw's. IMO- it's bmw that's "behind" here- they had a head start.

[smk4565]

>>"All it has different is a back up camera, and the touch release doors"<<

Everything behind the A-pillar is unique; what's this crap about only the backup camera & door handles and it's the sedan??

It's pretty easy for bmw to pull a relatively mild re-do on a 2-dr sedan, 4-dr sedan and a wagon when those body shells have been engineered years ago (yet it still took the better part of 2 years from the 2-dr to the m3) , Cadillac did not have these bodies engineered already to just slap new sheetmetal stampings on, yet their timetable is still nearly identical to bmw's. IMO- it's bmw that's "behind" here- they had a head start.

The 3-series sedan and coupe do not share any body panels, so they are unique bumper to bumper, not A-pillar to bumper like the CTS and G35. BMW not only changed the styling from the previous generation to the current, but they gave it a new platform also. The CTS still has Sigma 1 from the 2003 model (which came out early 2002). The 3-series coupe/convertible came out 1 year after the sedan/wagon, and the M3 was 1 year after the coupe.

The CTS coupe has the same interior, same front end look, same (less than a BMW or Infiniti) performance, and a different C-pillar and trunk. Whoppee. It is not more different than the G6 coupe is to the G6 sedan or Cobalt sedan/sedan. At the end of the day, it is basically the same car, so I can't get excited or call this a "new" Cadillac.

If Cadillac were cutting edge and had such great products they wouldn't be in 4th place in their own country, and a non-factor in the rest of the world.

I was a lifelong Cadillac fan, I had hopes in 2004-2005 that they would be able to challenge the Germans, but the products just aren't good enough, and I have about given up on them.

[Drew Dowdell]

Sunday morning... it's beautiful out. Perfect time for an pwning.

The previous 3-Series was on the E46 starting for the 1998 model year. The coupe and wagon followed a year later and the M another year after that. Total years for the E46 in production was 1998 - 2006. 8 years on a single platform. The basic body shells of sedan, coupe, convertible, and wagon were already available for BMW to work with when they started the E90 program. This is what Balthy is pointing out.

The previous CTS began in 2002 and lasted till 2007 as just a sedan on the Sigma platform. In 2008, the CTS moved to the improved and enlarged Sigma II platform that was based on the already improved STS variant of Sigma I. Two years after the introduction of the sedan, brand new coupe and wagon variants will be introduced. Cadillac had no prior shells to base these on and had to develop them from scratch.

So, Balthy is right, Cadillac is currently moving faster than BMW in it's platform development.

[Robert Hall]

Sunday morning... it's beautiful out. Perfect time for an pwning.

The previous 3-Series was on the E46 starting for the 1998 model year. The coupe and wagon followed a year later and the M another year after that. Total years for the E46 in production was 1998 - 2006. 8 years on a single platform. The basic body shells of sedan, coupe, convertible, and wagon were already available for BMW to work with when they started the E90 program. This is what Balthy is pointing out.

I don't follow your logic here...the E90 is not an updated E46, so the body shells for the E90 are not updated E46 shells, they were new development. You guys are arguing trivial points.

Remember, BMW is a small company with a focused lineup. Besides Cadillac, GM has to spread it's resources across making FWD generics and trucks and SUVs as well...so they are going to be moving a bit slower.

Edited July 27, 2008 by moltar

[Drew Dowdell]

I don't follow your logic here...the E90 is not an updated E46, so the body shells for the E90 are not updated E46 shells, they were new development. You guys are arguing trivial points.

Remember, BMW is a small company with a focused lineup. Besides Cadillac, GM has to spread it's resources across making FWD generics and trucks and SUVs as well...so they are going to be moving a bit slower.

When you've done something before, you know how to do it again. E90s are not clean sheet designs.

[thenewdamage]

I ran across this artists rendition slideshow of the 2010 CTS coupe. Kinda cool.

slideshow

Ever since I became addicted to Top Gear I have this urge to pronounce 'coupe' as 'coo-pay' in the British style, lol.

[Chris_Doane]

I ran across this artists rendition slideshow of the 2010 CTS coupe. Kinda cool.

slideshow

Ever since I became addicted to Top Gear I have this urge to pronounce 'coupe' as 'coo-pay' in the British style, lol.

Those are official GM pics of the CTS coupe concept car.

[thenewdamage]

Those are official GM pics of the CTS coupe concept car.

Thats a beautiful car. Would love to see that as a CTS-V or CTS4. :hot:

[Chris_Doane]

Thats a beautiful car. Would love to see that as a CTS-V or CTS4. :hot:

Well...the production coupe isnt really far off. I shot pics of a prototype with no camo a while back:

http://www.autoweek.com/apps/pbcs.dll/arti.../308189885/1065