GME to invest $9B in Opel

[ZL-1]

Didn't you find the pedals too close together in the Corsa B?

I learned to drive on a diesel 5 door Corsa B. I'm 6-feet tall and my legs were constantly hitting either the steering wheel or the steering column. There was no way to sit comfortably in that thing...

Edited May 4, 2008 by ZL-1

[Oracle of Delphi]

Interesting that the vast majority of the German school system teaches British English though eh? I trust you found yourself fortunate to be taught at one which doesn't?

Although my mother is a German national, I was lucky in the fact that my Father was an American diplomat (Texan No Less), who taught me proper Texan 1st, then American. However my 1st language is and will always be German. I find it interesting that you find communicating on this forum so difficult, perhaps a good dose of American would help you get along better here. After all over 300 million Americans and only what? 30 million Brits? By the way is your 1st language Geordie? I've noticed a funny accent in your English.

[CARBIZ]

Pray, do continue. I was going to rent a movie for the BF and I tonight, but this is more entertaining.

[Oracle of Delphi]

Ellesmere Port by the way is a town; Cheshire is just the county it happens to be in.

I always did find the UK a backward and confusing place, you even drive on the wrong side of the road, perhaps the EU government will force you to change that soon. I hear Ireland, the Republic, not the English colony, is considering switching to the German side of driving. Das ist gut, Ja?

Edited May 4, 2008 by Pontiac Custom-S

[Croc]

I always did find the UK a backward and confusing place, you even drive on the wrong side of the road, perhaps the EU government will force you to change that soon. I hear Ireland, the Republic, not the English colony, is considering switching to the German side of driving. Das ist gut, Ja?

It'll certainly allow for greater commonality between autos across the world. Very few countries drive on the left side.

[Guest aatbloke]

Although my mother is a German national, I was lucky in the fact that my Father was an American diplomat (Texan No Less), who taught me proper Texan 1st, then American. However my 1st language is and will always be German. I find it interesting that you find communicating on this forum so difficult, perhaps a good dose of American would help you get along better here. After all over 300 million Americans and only what? 30 million Brits? By the way is your 1st language Geordie? I've noticed a funny accent in your English.

60 million. I'm proud of my country, but I do at least have respect for others.

[Guest aatbloke]

It'll certainly allow for greater commonality between autos across the world. Very few countries drive on the left side.

Some 30% or so of global car production is right-hand drive. Here's a map showing the countries which drive on the left in blue:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Countri...ft_or_right.svg

In any case, the cost to car development for adhering to the SAE standard in North American and the Euro-E standard used everywhere else is far, far greater than that to switch the steering wheel from one side to the other.

Edited May 5, 2008 by aatbloke

[Guest aatbloke]

I always did find the UK a backward and confusing place, you even drive on the wrong side of the road, perhaps the EU government will force you to change that soon. I hear Ireland, the Republic, not the English colony, is considering switching to the German side of driving. Das ist gut, Ja?

I'll ignore your constant stream of insults towards Britain and the British - it's more of a reflection on you than I. The UK and ROI have looked at switching several times over the past thirty years; the UK abandoned the idea because of the economic impact. I have many German connections in my family so your insults are wasted.

Since you are allegedly part German, you should by now understand that the EU doesn't mandate the rules of the road in any one country; however it does mandate vehicle safety legislation requirements.

[SuperSport623]

Some 30% or so of global car production is right-hand drive.

30<70

[Oracle of Delphi]

I'll ignore your constant stream of insults towards Britain and the British - it's more of a reflection on you than I. The UK and ROI have looked at switching several times over the past thirty years; the UK abandoned the idea because of the economic impact. I have many German connections in my family so your insults are wasted.

Since you are allegedly part German, you should by now understand that the EU doesn't mandate the rules of the road in any one country; however it does mandate vehicle safety legislation requirements.

The EU becomes more like the USA with every passing day, it won't be long now, before the EU government becomes more like the US Federal government and makes rules that the states (insert country of your choice here) must follow.

As for being Anti-British, nothing could be further from the truth. I am half German, which is why I love your Queen, nothing like having a German sitting on the English throne. Queen Victoria's consort, was Albert of Saxe-Coburg and GothaQueen, therefore Elizabeth is a patrilineal descendant of Albert's family, the German princely House of Wettin. Got to love that!

[CARBIZ]

I'm glad I can just sit this one out and watch the fireworks.

[Guest aatbloke]

The EU becomes more like the USA with every passing day, it won't be long now, before the EU government becomes more like the US Federal government and makes rules that the states (insert country of your choice here) must follow.

As for being Anti-British, nothing could be further from the truth. I am half German, which is why I love your Queen, nothing like having a German sitting on the English throne. Queen Victoria's consort, was Albert of Saxe-Coburg and GothaQueen, therefore Elizabeth is a patrilineal descendant of Albert's family, the German princely House of Wettin. Got to love that!

The EU becomes more like the USA? You have got to be joking. The EU remains essentially a trading bloc with a common view to creating a unified economical state - hence the common currency which itself isn't ratified by all states. If you really are European you'll realise that while a USE is possible, that wouldn't even remotely begin to occur for generations to come, if indeed ever. There are too many political, cultural and historical hurdles to overcome, and the larger the EU becomes, the more remote the possibility of a USE in some form becomes, too. The proposed TCE five years ago was quickly overruled by several member states, and that was only intended to cement the current basic harmonisation such as what determines freedom, democracy, justice and human rights. It never even approached issues as complex as say direct taxation.

I'd hazard a guess that if I remarked that the USA was "backward", somewhere along the line I'd be branded as anti-American at the very least, and at the very worst receive threats of nuclear annihilation. I certainly don't appreciate my country being labelled as "backward", even if you are only taunting.

I'm glad you're in love with the Queen. I myself have never been a royalist.

Edited May 5, 2008 by aatbloke

[Guest aatbloke]

30<70

Mathematics is evidently your strong point. Submit a CV sometime and I'll consider bringing you in for interview.

[SuperSport623]

Mathematics is evidently your strong point. Submit a CV sometime and I'll consider bringing you in for interview.

hehehe thanks! i like you! you like me? cause i sure like you!

jesus your full of yourself arent you? your whole ""holier than thou" attitude is getting pretty annoying around here... how about you turn down the pompous dial down a few notches?

KTHXBYE

[Guest aatbloke]

hehehe thanks! i like you! you like me? cause i sure like you!

jesus your full of yourself arent you? your whole ""holier than thou" attitude is getting pretty annoying around here... how about you turn down the pompous dial down a few notches?

KTHXBYE

I wasn't joking. In our organisation we look for young people here who think off-the-wall with numeracy.

Edited May 5, 2008 by aatbloke

[Oracle of Delphi]

I'd hazard a guess that if I remarked that the USA was "backward", somewhere along the line I'd be branded as anti-American at the very least

Well I don't speak for all here, but from the looks of some of the post in this thread alone, I'd say that has happened already.

If that was your goal, you have succeeded with flying colors (colours). Try not to fight with the Americans to much. I bid you a fond adieu. :AH-HA_wink:

[Intrepidation]

I'm glad I can just sit this one out and watch the fireworks.

Sometimes it's better to sit back and watch the others duke it out.

This is great...I was wondering what to do while my 3D renders, and the entertainment in this thread is in full swing!

[Guest aatbloke]

Well I don't speak for all here, but from the looks of some of the post in this thread alone, I'd say that has happened already.

If that was your goal, you have succeeded with flying colors (colours). Try not to fight with the Americans to much. I bid you a fond adieu. :AH-HA_wink:

For your information, I'm married to one, have family there as well as property. I usually travel there every six weeks or so. Then again, I'm really not interested in what you have to say, whether you wish to blatantly slag off other countries such as mine or not, and I've no interest in talking to people who can't answer direct question as to their experience without referring to Wikipedia or some other online source (your "TS" Astra quip gave that away since the Australian public don't refer to it by Holden's generation code, and then you didn't even know Ellesmere Port was a town, ironic since GME has a pretty sizeable facility there) and then proceed to give me BS such as your childish line about the Corsa's 1.2 without any explanation as to your findings whatsoever, or which 1.2 in the Corsa you were referring to. I'm still waiting for you to explain the corporate structure as to how Holden controls GM-DAT as you claimed earlier - now that would have made for an interesting conversation piece.

Edited May 5, 2008 by aatbloke

[Guest aatbloke]

Sometimes it's better to sit back and watch the others duke it out.

This is great...I was wondering what to do while my 3D renders, and the entertainment in this thread is in full swing!

If I were you I'd have a game of snooker instead.

[SuperSport623]

i think this is the first time theres been a battle of wits where ive sided with PCS

aatbloke... do you ever get tired of your constant barrage of belittling insults? cause my patience is wearing mighty thin, as are most of my comrades here.

[Croc]

[Guest aatbloke]

i think this is the first time theres been a battle of wits where ive sided with PCS

aatbloke... do you ever get tired of your constant barrage of belittling insults? cause my patience is wearing mighty thin, as are most of my comrades here.

As is mine. You might think it clever to put down other countries - PCS's "Geordie" and "backwards" remarks weren't exactly pleasant, and I'm not even from Tyneside - but I do not. I asked him with civility what his findings were with the mk4 Astra and the Corsa, and what did I get in return? "I could walk faster than the Corsa 1.2" while fumbling with some very basic facts about the product which were irrelevant to the question being asked of him. Terrific. I'm looking for some interesting automotive conversation - particularly with the European products which this section of the forum is allegedly devoted to - and not half-arsed flippancy.

Edited May 5, 2008 by aatbloke

[FUTURE_OF_GM]

Before I retire! :AH-HA_wink:

Funny... You seem to be the only person that insists CPF will take Lutz place.

God help us if that happens... At least we'll have a few good used cars to buy while CPF runs the corporation into the ground. What a poser...

[cyclonic]

You know cyclonic as much as I dislike Holden and the way they do things, they do produce their own product, unlike Vauxhall which are rebadged Opels with a Holden mixed in for good measure. In that regard, Holden has my respect. Opel says jump, Vauxhall asks how high? Not so with Holden, not even when GM says jump!

I understand what you're getting at PCS and I do agree too. I feel for Vauxhall, but understand that Opel produces damn good product - I for one am very happy with my 05 Corsa C.

Vauxhall is fortunate to be able to tap into the product stream from the GM world. I do think it still exists as a brand purely for cultural and historical reasons (just like Holden does). If it weren't for that, well, we could see Chevrolet as a truly global brand in some senses (even though it mostly is).

Holden has been very lucky to have the ability to produce its own product for its own market first, then be able to tailor it for export if needed. However with the economies of scale changing and manufacture of local product becoming more expensive, combined with the decline in sales of large cars here, Holden needs to change and adapt.

Still, i'd love a HSV 427 in my driveway...

Edited May 5, 2008 by cyclonic

[Guest aatbloke]

Vauxhall is fortunate to be able to tap into the product stream from the GM world. I do think it still exists as a brand purely for cultural and historical reasons (just like Holden does). If it weren't for that, well, we could see Chevrolet as a truly global brand in some senses (even though it mostly is).

Opel used to be more global than it currently is - the marque was withdrawn from North America in the 1970's, withdrawn from the UK in 1985, and withdrawn from Japan just a few years ago. Likewise, Vauxhall disappeared from North America in 1972, and African and European markets in the mid-1980's.

It makes economic sense to badge the products according to what buyers are familiar with in respective markets. However that doesn't equate necessarily to where vehicles are built; in the past, Spain has built the Corsa with Vauxhall, Opel, Chevrolet and Holden badges on it; in the UK, the Astra, Frontera and Vectra have been built with similar badging, while Vivaro production for Vauxhall and Opel marketing is also manufactured there. In the States, the Chevrolet Venture was rebadged as the Opel and Vauxhall Sintra, built in America and exported for corresponding markets.

Personally, I'd like to see a return to the 1970's, when in the UK we were offered both Opel and Vauxhall, with vehicles based on the same platforms but offering quite different personalities, in similar fashion to VAG's and PSA's marques today.

Edited May 5, 2008 by aatbloke

[Camino LS6]

You know cyclonic as much as I dislike Holden and the way they do things, they do produce their own product, unlike Vauxhall which are rebadged Opels with a Holden mixed in for good measure. In that regard, Holden has my respect. Opel says jump, Vauxhall asks how high? Not so with Holden, not even when GM says jump!

Which is one of the things I love best about Holden. Their independent spirit has yielded the most desireable products (for me) in the GM universe of late.How incredibly resourceful they are, even with limited backing.

[Guest aatbloke]

Which is one of the things I love best about Holden. Their independent spirit has yielded the most desireable products (for me) in the GM universe of late.How incredibly resourceful they are, even with limited backing.

I agree, but their primary market is Australasia, so while they develop their larger models by themselves, their smaller products have traditionally been brought in from Europe and Japan - and lately, Korea.

[PurdueGuy]

Personally, I'd like to see a return to the 1970's, when in the UK we were offered both Opel and Vauxhall, with vehicles based on the same platforms but offering quite different personalities, in similar fashion to VAG's and PSA's marques today.

I can't help but read that as being jealous of the situation that exists between Chevy & Pontiac in the states. Or perhaps you're just not a fan of Vauxhall being little more than Opel UK...

[Guest aatbloke]

I can't help but read that as being jealous of the situation that exists between Chevy & Pontiac in the states. Or perhaps you're just not a fan of Vauxhall being little more than Opel UK...

Quite honestly I didn't even think of Chevrolet or Pontiac when I made the comment, because I see those two marques as diversfying into two very different animals. But why on earth would I be jealous? I'm 41 years of age, not 16!

I'm saying I'd like to see a similar situation to the 1970's, an exciting time for Vauxhall in my opinion with its Chevette HSR and VX 4/90. While Opels and Vauxhalls back then were based off the same platform, they had very distinct personalities as is the case with VAG and PSA marques today - for example, Seat and VW or Peugeot and Citroen. I think it would enhance GM's position in Europe, but unfortunately the economics of the situation prevail and GME is only just recovering from a bad patch over the past few years.

[cyclonic]

I can't help but read that as being jealous of the situation that exists between Chevy & Pontiac in the states. Or perhaps you're just not a fan of Vauxhall being little more than Opel UK...

Heheh, now you're just PICKING a fight! I'm gonna sit on the counch and get comfy.

[Camino LS6]

You know, I really want to spend some time in Europe - especially the UK. However, given the automotive climate and fuel prices, I doubt I could be happy there very long.

[Guest aatbloke]

You know, I really want to spend some time in Europe - especially the UK. However, given the automotive climate and fuel prices, I doubt I could be happy there very long.

When you do, look me up, we'll have to do a pint and a ploughmans!

[Camino LS6]

When you do, look me up, we'll have to do a pint and a ploughmans!

As long as I can have my pint chilled. :AH-HA_wink:

My family background is mostly UK, with a touch of German and I am quite interested to research my geneology onsite.

[Camino LS6]

Should I come into a quantity of money, I think it would be great fun to ship my own Australian-built, American-branded Pontiac G8 ST to the UK to research my past. Tooling around Scotland and Ireland would be a hoot!

Imagine the reactions of the locals.

[Guest aatbloke]

As long as I can have my pint chilled. :AH-HA_wink:

My family background is mostly UK, with a touch of German and I am quite interested to research my geneology onsite.

No problem, most beer taps these days are linked to computers for stock inventory purposes and some even keep each type of beer at precise temperatures. A pint of Caffrey's Irish Ale always goes down a treat.

Make the G8 a ute to carry all your souvenirs. A Vauxhall version of that would be welcome too, assuming Mr Parfitt is listening.

Libraries are a great source for genealogical research, as are church and parish records. A lot of the International Genealogical Index is also online these days, so you don't have to sit in the library trawling through miles of microfiche.

[cyclonic]

This is becoming rather interesting: aatbloke and Camino are having a love-in on one side of the couch whilst PCS sits on the far end. Getting ready to throw a bratwurst, no doubt!

To get back to topic, i'm happy that Opel has been given a cash injection and allowed to develop more product. Please let a new Calibra happen, a sporty diesel and a localised version of the GRWD platform (geez where's Santa?!).

Out of interest: who has the better plastics source? GME? GMNA? GMDAT?

[Camino LS6]

No problem, most beer taps these days are linked to computers for stock inventory purposes and some even keep each type of beer at precise temperatures. A pint of Caffrey's Irish Ale always goes down a treat.

Make the G8 a ute to carry all your souvenirs. A Vauxhall version of that would be welcome too, assuming Mr Parfitt is listening.

Libraries are a great source for genealogical research, as are church and parish records. A lot of the International Genealogical Index is also online these days, so you don't have to sit in the library trawling through miles of microfiche.

Yes, I've been through quite a few resources in my searching already. The Presbyterian Church in Ireland should have some answers for me. As should the MacDonald clan on Skye.

I plan to take part in a DNA project they sponser.

Oh, and the Ute version is a given where I'm concerned. :AH-HA_wink:

[Oracle of Delphi]

(your "TS" Astra quip gave that away since the Australian public don't refer to it by Holden's generation code, and then you didn't even know Ellesmere Port was a town, ironic since GME has a pretty sizeable facility there)

In case you haven't figured it out, I work for GM, so of course I know Holden's generation codes. I also know where Ellemere Port is just as I know Vauxhall Motors is headquartered in Luton, never been there either and have no plans on ever going there.

My plans this summer include a trip to Scotland, where my niece is getting married to a Scot, his family is very active in Scottish independence, I'm interested in seeing that up close, so it should make for an interesting trip. Oh by the way I'm driving there, I will be in a HSV GTS, which has been modified somewhat to include the steering wheel in the German driving position.

It's bright red, if you can catch me, please be sure to say hello, I shouldn't be hard to miss, you will hear my engine before you ever see me. :AH-HA_wink:

Edited May 5, 2008 by Pontiac Custom-S

[Camino LS6]

In case you haven't figured it out, I work for GM, so of course I know Holden's generation codes. I also know where Ellemere Port is just as I know Vauxhall Motors is headquartered in Luton, never been there either and have no plans on ever going there.

My plans this summer include a trip to Scotland, where my niece is getting married to a Scot, his family is very active in Scottish independence, I'm interested in seeing that up close, so it should make for an interesting trip. Oh by the way I'm driving there, I will be in a HSV GTS, which has been modified somewhat to include the steering wheel in the German driving position.

It's bright red, if you can catch me, please be sure to say hello, I shouldn't be hard to miss, you will hear my engine before you ever see me. :AH-HA_wink:

Now, I'm very jealous.

[Guest aatbloke]

Oh by the way I'm driving there, I will be in a HSV GTS, which has been modified somewhat to include the steering wheel in the German driving position.

Should be a rarity then being a left-hooker. I trust you recently abandoned plans to take your Pontiac? Make sure you post some pictures of the vehicle for us all to see.

I also know where Ellemere Port is just as I know Vauxhall Motors is headquartered in Luton, never been there either and have no plans on ever going there.

I'm not too surprised.

My plans this summer include a trip to Scotland, where my niece is getting married to a Scot, his family is very active in Scottish independence, I'm interested in seeing that up close, so it should make for an interesting trip.

Sounds superb, I'm half Scottish myself.

Edited May 5, 2008 by aatbloke

[Oracle of Delphi]

Croc, u bust me up man! :rotflmao:

[Camino LS6]

This is becoming rather interesting: aatbloke and Camino are having a love-in on one side of the couch whilst PCS sits on the far end. Getting ready to throw a bratwurst, no doubt!

The topic being discussed is everything. :AH-HA_wink:

Still... a love-in ?!

Nah.

<---- ducks flying meat food product.

[Oracle of Delphi]

This is becoming rather interesting: aatbloke and Camino are having a love-in on one side of the couch whilst PCS sits on the far end. Getting ready to throw a bratwurst, no doubt!

Ewwwwwww, I feel dirty!

[CARBIZ]

Hey, where'd you get my baby pic from??? I'm reporting you to my agent! I still charge for that.

[Croc]

Hey, where'd you get my baby pic from??? I'm reporting you to my agent! I still charge for that.

I just googled "angry toddler" and got a blog reporting on an art exhibit called "End Times" featuring photos of toddlers right after their lollipop was taken away. No joke.

[cyclonic]

I just googled "angry toddler" and got a blog reporting on an art exhibit called "End Times" featuring photos of toddlers right after their lollipop was taken away. No joke.

I remember there being quite a bit of hoo-haa over that.

I mentioned sporty diesels earlier in the thread. - I forgot that you can build an Astra SRi diesel (couple, wagon and hatch) on the Vauxhall website.

You feel dirty PCS? Heheh I thought you WERE dirty! Still left hooker GTS.. nice!