Is This Going on in Your Area?

[hyperv6]

In today's Akron Beacon Journel they reported a local Toyota Dealer [Ganley Toyota] had discovered 1995-2000 Tacoma pick up trucks with frames rusted through just in front of the rear spring mount. They included pictures and all.

They say Ganley found the first one last fall and now have 20 broken frame trucks on the lot. Toyota has sent in engineers and have been looking into this.

Here is the odd thing... The trucks are worth about $3,000- $5,000K and Toyota is paying over Blue Book for them. Some of these trucks have 200,000 miles and they are giving $11,000-$12,000 for these trucks.

I know companies will do some good will but if one dealer has 20 trucks already and of the 800,000 [Thier number because I don't really know] built in those 5 years this could get expensive for some good will.

I note also that a co-worker of mine has a 1990 Toyots that also is broken in the same place.

This may be worth watching as I have seen Toyotas rust out badly every where else but I have seldom seen a truck frame rust in half.

This could be a major black eye for Toyota if this is wide spread in the rust belt states.

No recalls and this is only being handeled if someone comes in and complaines.

[Camino LS6]

In today's Akron Beacon Journel they reported a local Toyota Dealer [Ganley Toyota] had discovered 1995-2000 Tacoma pick up trucks with frames rusted through just in front of the rear spring mount. They included pictures and all.

They say Ganley found the first one last fall and now have 20 broken frame trucks on the lot. Toyota has sent in engineers and have been looking into this.

Here is the odd thing... The trucks are worth about $3,000- $5,000K and Toyota is paying over Blue Book for them. Some of these trucks have 200,000 miles and they are giving $11,000-$12,000 for these trucks.

I know companies will do some good will but if one dealer has 20 trucks already and of the 800,000 [Thier number because I don't really know] built in those 5 years this could get expensive for some good will.

I note also that a co-worker of mine has a 1990 Toyots that also is broken in the same place.

This may be worth watching as I have seen Toyotas rust out badly every where else but I have seldom seen a truck frame rust in half.

This could be a major black eye for Toyota if this is wide spread in the rust belt states.

No recalls and this is only being handeled if someone comes in and complaines.

Damn!

My Uncle, who lives in Mass., has one of those trucks. Please let me know what happens with it so I can tell him about it.

[hyperv6]

Damn!

My Uncle, who lives in Mass., has one of those trucks. Please let me know what happens with it so I can tell him about it.

Tell him to call a dealer and complain if he has rust through. See if they react like Ganley.

The Paper is on the web they should have the story there.

[balthazar]

>>"The trucks are worth about $3,000- $5,000K and Toyota is paying over Blue Book... giving $11,000-$12,000 for these trucks."<<

Textbook definition of hush money.

My '94 Ford has 146K on it and was once (inadvertantly) driven thru ocean-flooded streets. There's a bunch of surface rust now where there wasn't (this occurred in '06), but the frame is still 100% up to spec as far as real rust/rot goes.

I thought when toyota trucks were going to "change everything" the implication was 'for the better'.

[hyperv6]

>>"The trucks are worth about $3,000- $5,000K and Toyota is paying over Blue Book... giving $11,000-$12,000 for these trucks."<<

Textbook definition of hush money.

My '94 Ford has 146K on it and was once (inadvertantly) driven thru ocean-flooded streets. There's a bunch of surface rust now where there wasn't (this occurred in '06), but the frame is still 100% up to spec as far as real rust/rot goes.

I thought when toyota trucks were going to "change everything" the implication was 'for the better'.

I understand the hush money idea. but with as wide wpread as this could be and havin a front page story on this documentng it. This could be nery expensive for Toyota.

[CARBIZ]

That's a very clever way of hiding the problem, though. The media may not have caught on at all, and Toyota gets to keep the customer since even if they hated their truck, nobody at Ford or GM would give them that kind of money on a trade.

[Robert Hall]

They use too much road salt in Ohio and other states in the Midwest and the NE, I'm sure that contributes to the problem. (I lived in the Akron and Cleveland area for 6 years, and saw what it did to cars...my Bronco started rusting when I lived there when it was less than 5 years old)>

Edited April 6, 2008 by moltar

[Guest aatbloke]

In today's Akron Beacon Journel they reported a local Toyota Dealer [Ganley Toyota] had discovered 1995-2000 Tacoma pick up trucks with frames rusted through just in front of the rear spring mount. They included pictures and all.

They say Ganley found the first one last fall and now have 20 broken frame trucks on the lot. Toyota has sent in engineers and have been looking into this.

Here is the odd thing... The trucks are worth about $3,000- $5,000K and Toyota is paying over Blue Book for them. Some of these trucks have 200,000 miles and they are giving $11,000-$12,000 for these trucks.

I know companies will do some good will but if one dealer has 20 trucks already and of the 800,000 [Thier number because I don't really know] built in those 5 years this could get expensive for some good will.

I note also that a co-worker of mine has a 1990 Toyots that also is broken in the same place.

This may be worth watching as I have seen Toyotas rust out badly every where else but I have seldom seen a truck frame rust in half.

This could be a major black eye for Toyota if this is wide spread in the rust belt states.

No recalls and this is only being handeled if someone comes in and complaines.

I lived near Cleveland for eight years and know a number of people in the newspaper media in Akron, Stow and Cleveland itself. The Beacon is known in the profession for some sensationalist reportage. My wife used to work for Ravenna-based RPC and certainly has some interesting stories to tell about the Akron paper.

It's quite possible that Toyota trucks have this kind of design flaw, and it's a bad one at that. However, it's good that Toyota are taking the issue so seriously. There are have been notable design flaws from other manufacturers over the years (Fiat and Audi both spring to mind) which weren't taken that seriously at all.

As someone else has pointed out, the amount of salt used in Ohio during the winter is phenomenal, and the state of the roads are some of the worst I have ever seen in the thirty-odd countries I've travelled to. This would be a massive catalyst in capitalising on a design weakness.

Edited April 6, 2008 by aatbloke

[Intrepidation]

I really wish the media would report this kind of major flaw, if only so that the masses would be enlightened to the fact that Toyota is not perfect, they make (sometimes serious) mistakes, just like every other company.

[CARBIZ]

All of the states in the north east, plus Ontario and Quebec use an insane amount of salt. Some of the salter trucks they use are not very well maintained and I've seen clumps of white salt left in places where the truck has stopped.

I am not aware of any rust problems on any vehicles since the late '80s. I have not heard of Toyota having a rust problem in the past 15 or so years. If this news is true, it is interesting, indeed. Having said that, if I was going to buy a vehicle in Ontario and planned to keep it more than 5 or 6 years, I would definitely have it rust-proofed, under coated or something. When you are driving along the expressway at 50 mph and you can hear the salt/sand blasting the undercarriage of your unprotected vehicle, it is not a pleasant feeling.

[Guest aatbloke]

All of the states in the north east, plus Ontario and Quebec use an insane amount of salt. Some of the salter trucks they use are not very well maintained and I've seen clumps of white salt left in places where the truck has stopped.

I am not aware of any rust problems on any vehicles since the late '80s. I have not heard of Toyota having a rust problem in the past 15 or so years. If this news is true, it is interesting, indeed. Having said that, if I was going to buy a vehicle in Ontario and planned to keep it more than 5 or 6 years, I would definitely have it rust-proofed, under coated or something. When you are driving along the expressway at 50 mph and you can hear the salt/sand blasting the undercarriage of your unprotected vehicle, it is not a pleasant feeling.

I remember back in the 70s where in the UK, you had to undercoat every car you bought otherwise you were likely to eventually fall through the floor. I remember my father undercoating both a Vauxhall Viva and a Hillman Avenger, and I did the same with an Austin Metro. I was laughing with a friend in Ohio when they said they used to have to do the same with their cars. It's amazing how far cars have come along since then, which is why this sort of news is so surprising.

[Camino LS6]

Floors and body panels rotting out are one thing, but a frame (especially on a pickup) is another thing entirely.

I read about this on another board and it seems that the cab actually detached from the frame on one of these trucks as it was rounding a turn.

Scary.

[mustang84]

Taken recently at an auction...frame cracked on site.

[regfootball]

wow, and toyota has a golden legacy........?

[Guest aatbloke]

Cracked frames aren't the sole problem of Toyota. While a design flaw such as that described earlier is poor, the amount of winter salt used in Ohio and north-east States will soon develop a fault into a very serious problem. In the picture taken, there's no note of the history of the particular vehicle, and no note of how well - or how abused - the vehicle as been treated.

Edited April 8, 2008 by aatbloke

[Intrepidation]

I would like to take a moment to point out what the strength of a real frame is....

[Croc]

Cracked frames aren't the sole problem of Toyota. While a design flaw such as that described earlier is poor, the amount of winter salt used in Ohio and north-east States will soon develop a fault into a very serious problem. In the picture taken, there's no note of the history of the particular vehicle, and no note of how well - or how abused - the vehicle as been treated.

As someone who has spent the majority of his life in the snow belt, no, this isn't an issue of road salt. If that were the case, a lot more vehicles would look like that.

The vehicle in the picture is late-model, meaning it has seen no more than 10 winters. Judging by the overall appearance of it, probably much fewer than that.

If the frames crack like that, it is the sole problem of Toyota as I have never seen anything like that before.

[balthazar]

Agree with Croc; a vehicle's frame is the strongest (after the engine block) component of a vehicle- no manner of abuse short of purposely grinding on a well-engineered frame is going to cause it rot thru/break in half within a reasonable span of years, and by that for a BOF vehicle, I am talking about 30 years minimum. And salt is not the cultprit either, or there would be widespread examples of this on a wide range of BOF vehicles in these regions. Jersey uses a lot of salt, too, and I have never seen/heard of that sort structural 'manfunction' before. The logical explaination is Toyota either skimped on the coating by design or manufacture, or the metallurgy is bad- other reasons may play a minor contriuting role, but there is a major flaw there to start with.

[Daryl Z71]

This isn't going to stop anyone from buyin their junk it never does. The morons that are so loyal to Toyota seem like the just don't care and they buy the crap anyway. I also love how this isn't plastered all over the news but if it were a Ford, Dodge, or Chevy it would be everywhere. Im done trying to convince people to buy American vehicles because they don't want to listen. I guess theyll just learn when our economy is in the &#036;h&#33;ter and we have no jobs and the Japs rule the country!

[Guest aatbloke]

As someone who has spent the majority of his life in the snow belt, no, this isn't an issue of road salt. If that were the case, a lot more vehicles would look like that.

The vehicle in the picture is late-model, meaning it has seen no more than 10 winters. Judging by the overall appearance of it, probably much fewer than that.

If the frames crack like that, it is the sole problem of Toyota as I have never seen anything like that before.

Once again I am misquoted. I didn't say it was merely an issue of road salt. What I did say was that large quantities of road salt will very quickly exascerbate a design flaw, whether be engineering or finishing. It's a design fault which is clearly the case here, but nobody can judge the way a particular vehicle has been treated either just from looking at a single photograph. As I said in my original thread, kudos to Toyota for taking the matter seriously; I've seen other manufacturers (such as Audi and Fiat) turn a blind eye in these cases.

Edited April 8, 2008 by aatbloke

[Guest aatbloke]

The logical explaination is Toyota either skimped on the coating by design or manufacture, or the metallurgy is bad- other reasons may play a minor contriuting role, but there is a major flaw there to start with.

This was exactly my point. But this could happen to any car manufacturer - they are businesses after all, and all weigh up economics with every other aspect of developing a motor vehicle.

Edited April 8, 2008 by aatbloke

[Cory Wolfe]

My local Toyota dealer's back lot...

[daves87rs]

My local Toyota dealer's back lot...

Wow-that's not good....

[balthazar]

Once again I am misquoted. I didn't say it was merely an issue of road salt. What I did say was that large quantities of road salt will very quickly exascerbate a design flaw, whether be engineering or finishing. It's a design fault which is clearly the case here, but nobody can judge the way a particular vehicle has been treated either just from looking at a single photograph.

Granted, but minor contributing factors such as road salt and the 'treatment' of the truck (& by extension it's frame) are distantly secondary to the main issue here. There are a thousand possible atmospheric factors that all road vehicles potentially and/or actually face in use......... but the VAST majority of them do not break in half doing so. Mentioning road salt comes off as defensive.

This was exactly my point. But this could happen to any car manufacturer - they are businesses after all, and all weigh up economics with every other aspect of developing a motor vehicle.

I only wish when it happens to General Motors, the media/public at large treated the issue the same way you are, above.

While a design flaw such as that described earlier is poor...

'Inexcusable' would be a far more appropriate assessment.

[Guest aatbloke]

Granted, but minor contributing factors such as road salt and the 'treatment' of the truck (& by extension it's frame) are distantly secondary to the main issue here. There are a thousand possible atmospheric factors that all road vehicles potentially and/or actually face in use......... but the VAST majority of them do not break in half doing so. Mentioning road salt comes off as defensive.

I only wish when it happens to General Motors, the media/public at large treated the issue the same way you are, above.

'Inexcusable' would be a far more appropriate assessment.

Here's what I said: a significant flaw in design or manufacture in the use of steel in a vehicle will be seized upon and exascerbated by excessive amounts of road salt. I didn't say road salt is the root cause, or is the overriding factor. However, as bad a flaw as it is, I give Toyota kudos for taking the issue seriously.

I am not a teenager. I don't buy into petulant and childish arguments over brands, or companies for that matter, originating from different countries. I have no cult-like allegiance to any one brand and I cast the same approach to everything on the market; I've worked in and around the motor industry for over 25 years in a number of different countries, including the USA. Anyone stupid enough to pay too much attention to the media - over any subject - is going to be misinformed. They're out to sell stories ultimately. I give Toyota and GM equal credence. Both are successful motor manufacturers - but they're businesses first and foremost. Neither are omnipotent, and neither are better than anybody else.

Edited April 9, 2008 by aatbloke

[Sixty8panther]

I've owned 25+ year old BOF junkbox beaters that had rotted body mounts, rotted floors,

rottted wheel wells, rotted/rusted through lower door panels/rockers/rear quarters & all

sorts of other rust issues but I've never heard/seen anything this bad in any vehicle,

including those lightweight (& cheap) Datsun/Isuzu/Mazda/Toyota pickups from the 1970s.

[A Horse With No Name]

I lived near Cleveland for eight years and know a number of people in the newspaper media in Akron, Stow and Cleveland itself. The Beacon is known in the profession for some sensationalist reportage. My wife used to work for Ravenna-based RPC and certainly has some interesting stories to tell about the Akron paper.

It's quite possible that Toyota trucks have this kind of design flaw, and it's a bad one at that. However, it's good that Toyota are taking the issue so seriously. There are have been notable design flaws from other manufacturers over the years (Fiat and Audi both spring to mind) which weren't taken that seriously at all.

As someone else has pointed out, the amount of salt used in Ohio during the winter is phenomenal, and the state of the roads are some of the worst I have ever seen in the thirty-odd countries I've travelled to. This would be a massive catalyst in capitalising on a design weakness.

I've seen Body on Frame cars split in half because of body rust here...including very sadly a red on red 66 GTO...

Chris

[A Horse With No Name]

...and oh, &#036;h&#33; is this gonna cost toyota BIG bucks....

Glad that they seem to want to do the right thing, but...damn...from a financial standpoint...wow...

Chris

[balthazar]

>>"Here's what I said: a significant flaw in design or manufacture in the use of steel in a vehicle will be seized upon and exascerbated by excessive amounts of road salt. I didn't say road salt is the root cause, or is the overriding factor. However, as bad a flaw as it is, I give Toyota kudos for taking the issue seriously."<<

I know what you said, I read the original & the restatement of it on pg 1. Nor did I claim you said salt was the root cause. Once again, to even mention salt here as a contributor on a new vehicle is irrelevant since we agree: it's not even as much as an 'overrriding factor'. I just don't see the point of mentioning it at all WRT to the topic here... unless it's toyota that's the source....

chris :>>"I've seen Body on Frame cars split in half because of body rust here...including very sadly a red on red 66 GTO..."<<

Was the Goat only 3 years old when you saw it split in half?

[Guest aatbloke]

>>"Here's what I said: a significant flaw in design or manufacture in the use of steel in a vehicle will be seized upon and exascerbated by excessive amounts of road salt. I didn't say road salt is the root cause, or is the overriding factor. However, as bad a flaw as it is, I give Toyota kudos for taking the issue seriously."<<

I know what you said, I read the original & the restatement of it on pg 1. Nor did I claim you said salt was the root cause. Once again, to even mention salt here as a contributor on a new vehicle is irrelevant since we agree: it's not even as much as an 'overrriding factor'. I just don't see the point of mentioning it at all WRT to the topic here... unless it's toyota that's the source....

chris :>>"I've seen Body on Frame cars split in half because of body rust here...including very sadly a red on red 66 GTO..."<<

Was the Goat only 3 years old when you saw it split in half?

Road salt will exacerbate such a design fault, as would any usage beyond the car's intended design limits. It isn't irrelevant.

[Camino LS6]

My local Toyota dealer's back lot...

My god!

BV: are all of those turn-ins for this issue?

If so, Toyota really stepped in it this time. Incredibly, unbelieveably, bad.

What a mess, as much as I hate Toyota they really did make a solid compact truck for many years. This is going to wound them deep.

[Blake Noble]

Hmm ... I think I finally have a good reason to stop at the Toyota dealership in Richmond.

[Guest aatbloke]

"they really did make a solid compact truck for many years"

You're not kidding. The HiLux diesel was reknowned for its longevity and strength. Top Gear paid testament to this a few years ago when they bought a 1988 model with nigh on 200K miles on it, and tried to destroy it - and failed.

Part 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lrk6vsb77xk

Part 2:

Part 3:

[Blake Noble]

"they really did make a solid compact truck for many years"

You're not kidding. The HiLux diesel was reknowned for its longevity and strength. Top Gear paid testament to this a few years ago when they bought a 1988 model with nigh on 200K miles on it, and tried to destroy it - and failed.

Part 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lrk6vsb77xk

Part 2:

Part 3:

I watched that a few months ago. I will not lie, that is quite impressive.

[Camino LS6]

Did a little surfing and the problem seems to be widespread.

I also saw a couple of pics: Holy swiss cheese,Batman! I've never seen frames rusted so badly! What amazed me was that the exterior panels and nearby sheetmetal looked great!

How the hell does that happen?

I know one thing, I'd take a look underneath before I rode in a Tacoma. The rust I saw was so bad I don't know how the truck hadn't already collapsed under its own weight!

What I haven't been able to find is any sort of explanation of how/why this happens.

[Camino LS6]

Toyota should out themselves on this and call the news organizations. They need to get these trucks off of the road ASAP, before someone dies as a result of this. Judging by the pics I saw, a few hundred pounds in the bed should be enough to fold some of these trucks up like a piece of paper.

I'd bet there are lawyers salivating at the prospect as we type.

[Blake Noble]

I just read this post from another forum. Apparently, it does not take much to make a Tacoma's frame rot away to nothing.

I live in New Hampshire and bought a new 2005 Quad Cab Tacoma in September 2005. My truck has only seen two very mild winters worth of salted road conditions. I wash the under body of my truck frequently. This spring I noticed that surface rust is breaking out all over my truck’s frame, at the weld joints, on the flat surfaces of the frame and anywhere something is bolted to the frame. I have talked to the service department at Toyota of Nashua, NH where I bought the truck and they state that no other customers have brought this problem to their attention as yet. I am a mechanical engineer and I design and work with metals, undercoating and painted finishes all the time. Based on my experience, it is my opinion that a properly paint two-year-old truck frame should not have this much rust breaking through the paint on the frame as mine does. All Toyota advertisements I have always seen, stress the durability and extremely long service life expectancy of their vehicles. The entire reason I bought my Toyota was based on their long-standing track record of high quality and customer satisfaction. Working with the dealership we escalated this situation to the New England District Service & Parts Manager trying to get Toyota to repair the rust break through problem. I presented the idea that there may be a Toyota design problem with the undercoat and paint system specified for the 2005 Tacomas and or that the coating materials were not applied correctly to my specific truck. The New England District Service & Parts Manager is basically stating that all frames start to rust eventually and that Toyota has no obligation to repair the frame rust even thought the truck is only two years old. My local dealership is now saying this problem is in the hands of New England District Service & Parts Manager and if I am not satisfied with their response I may have to go through the arbitration process with corporate Toyota USA to get this rust problem addressed and corrected. Is anyone else experiencing similar frame rust problems with their 2004 or new Tacoma’s?

Link: http://forums.off-road.com/toyota-tacoma/2...ma-you-too.html

Oh, yes. Here's the kicker: this post was made back in August of last year.

[Blake Noble]

More news: Toyota has extended the rust warranty on these Tacomas to 15 years.

Toyota had begun receiving a few reports from customers that excessive corrosion was occurring on the frames of some older Tacoma pickups, specifically 1995 to 2000 models. The Japanese automaker determined that during this half decade of production, some Taco frames may not have received the kind of corrosion protection from the factory that's needed to withstand harsh climes, especially ones where salt is used to deice roadways. While there is no recall and Toyota says that the number of instances where it has found rust go beyond the surface of the frame to penetrate the metal is small, the automaker is pulling an unorthodox move and doing something about anyway.

Toyota is extending the rust perforation warranty on all 1995-2000 Tacoma pickups, some 813,000 units, to 15 years from the original date of purchase, AND you don't have to be the original owner, or the second or the third even. Anyone who owns a Tacoma from this era and finds rust perforation on the frame can have his or her truck officially inspected for rust damage, in which case Toyota will either repair or buy back the truck regardless of its condition. Owners will start receiving letters by mid-March, and those who don't can visit a dealership for a free inspection.

Now if you'd excuse us, we need to start shopping for a used 1995-2000 Toyota Tacoma in Syracuse, NY.

That article was dated March 8th.

Link: http://www.autoblog.com/2008/03/07/toyota-...ps-to-15-years/

[Blake Noble]

This isn't related to frame rot problems as it is related to general Tacoma problems. I read it and it made me laugh my ass off.

My truck with key on, listening to radio while waxing my tacoma(2000) 4wd. and it was resting in first , while outside cleaning the truck, it started to try to start on its on. it was jumping forward my house at every engine turn i jumped in the truck turned the key off, nothing.. it was still on it's on tring to start, so i pushed in the cluch took out'' the key ( it was still turning over, that was frighting!, i then put it into reverse to see if it would go ahead and start, it did , but the starter was still engaging, and would not stop . i tried evey thing , finally was able to remove the negative terminal, that killed it. well thing is it does this 3 out of 5 times every time i attempt to drive it.

:rotflmao:

Here is the page which that came from. There is also a nice, brief story at this page of a later model Tacoma breaking in half over a Wal-Mart parking lot speed bump.

http://www.consumeraffairs.com/automotive/toyota_tacoma.html

Edited April 10, 2008 by YellowJacket894

[CARBIZ]

Interesting reading. I think I will forward this to the Toyota Star. It certainly ranks a little higher in the realm of problems than the gas tank sensor problems GM (and Nissan and Ford) experienced in Ontario 5 years ago (that turned out to be Petro Canada's fault, BTW) that they splashed all over the front page.

[Camino LS6]

http://ttora.com/forum/showthread.php?t=95993

Everything you wanted to know about this.

I just read all 20 pages, it's bad... really.really, bad.

One poster quotes a Toyota regional rep as saying they expect to buy back half of the production Tacomas over these years (800,000 units), at a cost of about 4 billion dollars.

There is also talk that later model years may be affected with particular suspicion placed on the '01s.

All I can say is DAMN!

If you follow the link and don't want to read it all scan through for the pics, especially those at the end.

[Intrepidation]

And yet no word of this on the news...

[Camino LS6]

Also photos of dozens of the trucks in dealer back lots, with "Do not drive" stickers plastered on them.

I don't think this will stay completely quiet too long, it's just too big.

[cletus8269]

hmm i think this calls for an owned video like the one from the nissan altima fire thread a while back hehe

[Guest aatbloke]

http://ttora.com/forum/showthread.php?t=95993

Everything you wanted to know about this.

I just read all 20 pages, it's bad... really.really, bad.

One poster quotes a Toyota regional rep as saying they expect to buy back half of the production Tacomas over these years (800,000 units), at a cost of about 4 billion dollars.

There is also talk that later model years may be affected with particular suspicion placed on the '01s.

All I can say is DAMN!

If you follow the link and don't want to read it all scan through for the pics, especially those at the end.

It's good that Toyota are putting their money where their mouth is and taking the issue so seriously. The P&L hit will have some rumblings with their stock prices, but it won't be terminal.

Edited April 10, 2008 by aatbloke

[Cory Wolfe]

My god!

BV: are all of those turn-ins for this issue?

If so, Toyota really stepped in it this time. Incredibly, unbelieveably, bad.

What a mess, as much as I hate Toyota they really did make a solid compact truck for many years. This is going to wound them deep.

I can't say for sure, but there's atleast a dozen or more Tacomas of the same vintage sitting there.

[A Horse With No Name]

>>"Here's what I said: a significant flaw in design or manufacture in the use of steel in a vehicle will be seized upon and exascerbated by excessive amounts of road salt. I didn't say road salt is the root cause, or is the overriding factor. However, as bad a flaw as it is, I give Toyota kudos for taking the issue seriously."<<

I know what you said, I read the original & the restatement of it on pg 1. Nor did I claim you said salt was the root cause. Once again, to even mention salt here as a contributor on a new vehicle is irrelevant since we agree: it's not even as much as an 'overrriding factor'. I just don't see the point of mentioning it at all WRT to the topic here... unless it's toyota that's the source....

chris :>>"I've seen Body on Frame cars split in half because of body rust here...including very sadly a red on red 66 GTO..."<<

Was the Goat only 3 years old when you saw it split in half?

It had the benifit of sitting in a farmers field for 30 plus years. I think I told you before about the guy who collected like 600+ Pontiacs from the 60's and let them all rot in a field around here? That was one of those cars.

My only point was that no car is ultimately immune...and that Ohio cars seem to rust like no where else. Outside of the Library the other day I saw an IROC Z from the late 80's that was rusted almost up to the rear window. However, I'd guess that Z would be on the road about another 20 years when it finnally was as bad as these Toyotas.

Chris

[A Horse With No Name]

It's good that Toyota are putting their money where their mouth is and taking the issue so seriously. The P&L hit will have some rumblings with their stock prices, but it won't be terminal.

They are trying to do the right thing but the important thing is to learn from your mistakes. I remember Toytoas rusting Badly when I was in high school in the 80's, seems like in some ways they never did learn.

[SuperSport623]

this is disgusting!

dealers storage lot

more:

[balthazar]

Now that we can all see examples of the nature & extent of the damage, "doing the right thing" would be to immediately issue a nationwide recall, not slog thru a hush-hush snail-mail postcard campaign; there a real potential for dangerous accidents & fatalities here!