Unfortunate article quote.

[Drew Dowdell]

From CNBC

Before pulling out of bear territory, investors generally need to see undeniable signs of a bottom--something that hasn't happened yet despite the howls of pain emanating from Wall Street.

[CARBIZ]

Bears scare me........

[daves87rs]

[Z-06]

Invest with the bears and sell with the bulls.

[K.C.]

From CNBC

Loved it!

[K.C.]

Bears scare me........

Why do bears scare you?

[Croc]

I wouldn't have gotten it without your subtitle, but DAMN that's some crazy double entendre going on there!!

[ltdaniels]

don't know how that got past the editors..

[CARBIZ]

Why do bears scare you?

Because I am 46, still have a 32" waist, bust my ass at the gym and most of my peers have defected to the leather bars. I refuse. I am not going to age gracefully. I am going to go kicking and screaming into the night. One by one, my 40-something friends have ballooned out and now hang out in leather bars.

I dunno what is happening to us. Thirty years ago, when I first 'came out' bears were a rarity. (Hey, I just realized that this June will be my 30th year of being a card carrying, fully licensed queer! Wow!) Maybe it is our McDonald's eating, Dynasty watching generation, that has literally gone to seed, but I don't remember seeing so many bears around back then. Back then, the sterotypical queer (remember the 'clone?') had a moustache, good pecs and abs, wore jeans, a black T-shirt and close cropped hair. Now, I realize those guys would all be in their 60s by now, but why has my generation fallen apart?

[Paolino]

Because I am 46, still have a 32" waist, bust my ass at the gym and most of my peers have defected to the leather bars. I refuse. I am not going to age gracefully. I am going to go kicking and screaming into the night. One by one, my 40-something friends have ballooned out and now hang out in leather bars.

I dunno what is happening to us. Thirty years ago, when I first 'came out' bears were a rarity. (Hey, I just realized that this June will be my 30th year of being a card carrying, fully licensed queer! Wow!) Maybe it is our McDonald's eating, Dynasty watching generation, that has literally gone to seed, but I don't remember seeing so many bears around back then. Back then, the sterotypical queer (remember the 'clone?') had a moustache, good pecs and abs, wore jeans, a black T-shirt and close cropped hair. Now, I realize those guys would all be in their 60s by now, but why has my generation fallen apart?

Happy Birthday! Wow, in April I turn 11

As for bears... well, you don't have to be overweight to be called a bear. You just have to be hairy. How about Tom Katt? He's a bear... :AH-HA_wink:

[K.C.]

Because I am 46, still have a 32" waist, bust my ass at the gym and most of my peers have defected to the leather bars. I refuse. I am not going to age gracefully. I am going to go kicking and screaming into the night. One by one, my 40-something friends have ballooned out and now hang out in leather bars.

I dunno what is happening to us. Thirty years ago, when I first 'came out' bears were a rarity. (Hey, I just realized that this June will be my 30th year of being a card carrying, fully licensed queer! Wow!) Maybe it is our McDonald's eating, Dynasty watching generation, that has literally gone to seed, but I don't remember seeing so many bears around back then. Back then, the sterotypical queer (remember the 'clone?') had a moustache, good pecs and abs, wore jeans, a black T-shirt and close cropped hair. Now, I realize those guys would all be in their 60s by now, but why has my generation fallen apart?

Happy Birthday Carbiz. I am 42. I bust my ass in the gym, and am hairy, masculine, and am a bear. Bears are all fat. That is a misconception. Now, there are chubs, and thats a whole nother story that I know nothing about because they stand no chance with me. I am just not attracted to them. Originally, the bear culture celebrated masculinity and I think that any furry gay man who celebrates masculinity is a bear. There's nothing to be afraid of. We don't bite, unless you want us to. hehe.

[Cory Wolfe]

Well, isn't that lovely.

As for the bear aspect... I take pride in shaving and trimming and my friends call me anorexic, but I'm really not.

[04monteintimidator]

i wonder if there would be less howls of pain if there was a lubricated market...

[Cory Wolfe]

Well, some get pleasure from pain. It may be intentional.

[jcgable]

Brilliant!

[jcgable]

Well, isn't that lovely.

As for the bear aspect... I take pride in shaving and trimming and my friends call me anorexic, but I'm really not.

Twink! :AH-HA_wink:

[K.C.]

As an aside, I think its interesting that gays, as an oppressed group, oppress each other with the twinks putting down the bears and the bears putting down thw twinks. There's really nothing wrong with each group, but I think there's too much emphasis placed on the differences between the groups.

[jcgable]

As an aside, I think its interesting that gays, as an oppressed group, oppress each other with the twinks putting down the bears and the bears putting down thw twinks. There's really nothing wrong with each group, but I think there's too much emphasis placed on the differences between the groups.

Agreed, especially when not that much difference exists with the exception of personal style and body shape.

[CARBIZ]

It's a false assumption (hope?) that gay people would be any less judgemental or cliquish than any other group. In our increasingly crowded world, we as a species are in deep $h! until the powers that be realize that any given group will naturally want to exclude others. Trying to force 'unnatural' groupings is being done at our own folly.

There is nothing wrong with everyone learning to get along, but to believe that everyone is just going to mix and mingle like one happy cocktail party is naive. Study any group of people at any gathering and they will always gravitate to their own kind. No amount of social engineering is going to change that. We can learn tolerance, even grudging respect, but there will always be that sense of 'us and them.'

Having been around gay bars and clubs for nearly 30 years now, I have to say, like the auto market, the gay world is far more fractured than it used to be.

[K.C.]

I'm far from naive, especially about people. I'm aware that I am only responsible for my actions and no one elses. I choose not to gravitate "towards my own kind" just because they are homos. I actually dislike most gay people I meet on a daily basis. I gravitate towards people I respect, and there's damn few gay people I respect because most that I have met are judgemental, catty, too loose lipped about their sexuality, or too damn caught up at acting feminine and showing off their gay vibe that I just want to retch. I dont think that everybody will get along. But since I am responsible for my actions and I can get along with anyone if I choose. It starts with one person making the decision to accept people for who they are, and giving them the freedom to be who they are. I personally cannot stand twinks and queens. I've never met one I respected, call it learned prejudice, but I don't begrudge them the right to act like they want to act, and I can get along with them in casual conversation and be respectful to their right to act as they choose.

Kellen-Casey (also known as the "homphobic homo" by the man I am currently dating.

[Cory Wolfe]

My friend is a self proclaimed homophobic gay man.

[The O.C.]

Well, isn't that lovely.

As for the bear aspect... I take pride in shaving and trimming and my friends call me anorexic, but I'm really not.

I saw those pics of you that you posted.....and it looked like you have been working on building up some muscle...! I wouldn't call you anorexic......

As for me, I used to trim my arm hair, chest and tummy hair.....not shave, but trim. Then, my bf told me he liked it and to let it grow back out....LOL.....so I did....but I'm not what you'd call a "bear" at all.....

I don't like "bears" per se.....but I do like my bf's hairy legs and slightly hairy chest and stomach......I think he looks better with it, than if he shaved.....

(edit: when I say "don't like" bears I mean not attracted to them....I have nothing against them as people, etc.....just realized my comment came out sounding the wrong way....)

Edited March 19, 2008 by The O.C.

[K.C.]

I saw those pics of you that you posted.....and it looked like you have been working on building up some muscle...! I wouldn't call you anorexic......

As for me, I used to trim my arm hair, chest and tummy hair.....not shave, but trim. Then, my bf told me he liked it and to let it grow back out....LOL.....so I did....but I'm not what you'd call a "bear" at all.....

I don't like "bears" per se.....but I do like my bf's hairy legs and slightly hairy chest and stomach......I think he looks better with it, than if he shaved.....

(edit: when I say "don't like" bears I mean not attracted to them....I have nothing against them as people, etc.....just realized my comment came out sounding the wrong way....)

You don't gotta worry about it sounding the wrong way. I'm the only "bear" here (that has admitted to being one), and I don't get all bent out of shape by being told that someone's not attracted to a man belonging to the same subculture that I do. We all have certain aspects of men that crank our tractor.

[The O.C.]

We all have certain aspects of men that crank our tractor.

"crank our tractor?"

[K.C.]

"crank our tractor?"

hehe. Yeah.