Through the needle

[ocnblu]

Just for speculation and entertainment purposes, what would you like to see from Chrysler in the years to come? Although I am not supporting the idea, I will post my lineup based on the rumor that Chrysler = cars, Dodge = trucks, and Jeep = SUVs.

Chrysler:

Compact coupe and sedan, FWD, with 1.8L, 2.4L, 2.4L light-pressure and 2.4L high-pressure turbos. Direct injection on all gas engines. AWD available with the high-pressure turbo engine in an SRT-4 model for both bodystyles. Small diesel engine available. Hybrid model available. 6 speed manual and 6 speed conventional automatic transmissions. TSX/WRX competitor with American flavor.

Compact hatch/wagon. Same powertrain options as above.

Midsize sedan/convertible. Romantic styling, not as polarizing as the current Sebring. Killer (in a good way) interior. 4 cylinder diesel and hybrid options. 2.4L light-pressure turbo DI and 3.5L DI V6 options, with 2.4L DI standard. 6 speed automatic. FWD if it must, but I'd like to see RWD/AWD.

Fullsize 300, RWD/AWD sedan/wagon. Evolutionary styling with a serious interior. 3.5L DI standard, 4.0L DI, diesel and hybrid options. Optional 5.0L Hemi DI V8 with cylinder deactivation standard. Hybrid assist available on Hemi. 6 speed automatic.

Dodge:

Truly compact pickup truck. A modern-day Rampage, FWD/AWD. Regular cab and extended cab. Same platform (suitably beefed up) and drivetrains as Chrysler compact car, but with funky, baby-Ram styling cues. Trim levels target everyone from youth to retirees who don't want a huge truck, but need occasional utility.

Dakota midsize truck, just a bit smaller than today's. 2.4L DI standard, with 6 speed manual and automatic transmissions. 4.0L DI V6 optional. Diesel from 300 sedan optional. Hybrid assist option on 4.0L. Regular, extended and crew cabs available.

Ram pickup. All current bodystyles remain. Light-duty diesel available. 4.0L DI V6 standard. 5.0L and 6.1L Hemi DI V8 optional with cylinder deactivation. Hybrid assist available on Hemi engines. Heavy-Duty Rams become diesel-only, with updated Cummins engine.

Caravan. Short and long-WB versions. FWD/AWD. 2.4L DI standard on SWB version. 4.0L DI optional. Hybrid assist optional on 4 and 6 cylinder versions. Diesel optional. Wide range of trim levels, including 2-seat work panel version.

Sprinter. All current work- plus passenger versions available. Mini motorhome cutaway version available. All diesels. Two engine sizes available.

Jeep:

Patriot. Same platform as compact Dodge pickup above. 2.4L DI standard. Diesel and hybrid versions available. High ground clearance package optional.

Wrangler. Traditional through and through. Straight axles. 2.4L DI standard, with 4.0L DI optional. Diesel optional. Six speed manual and automatic transmissions. 4-door replaces Liberty in lineup.

Green Jeepster. 2 door bodystyle with removal top. Smaller than Wrangler. Four-wheel independent long travel suspension, driver-adjustable from street-safe to trail-ready in minutes. 2.4L DI with hybrid assist, only engine. 6 speed manual and automatic transmissions. Low-gloss, plastic, easily-replaced outer body panels.

Cherokee. 2 and 3-row extended versions available. 4.0L DI V6 standard. 2 diesels optional, from Sprinter van. 5.0L DI Hemi with and without hybrid assist available on 3-row models. Manual and automatic transmissions. Rubicon-ready, yet still street comfortable, as per tradition.

OK, there I go. Does that seem realistic and acceptable, even desirable? Post your responses if you want.

Edited February 24, 2008 by ocnblu

[Farkas]

I think Chrysler should keep the T&C. It sells just as well as the Caravan, and in its current form, looks better than the Caravan.

Other than that, I agree with what you have to say, especially the diesel part.

[A Horse With No Name]

Agree with the diesel part, but the Patriot just needs to die.

Chris

[CMG]

Sorry, but these threads are too stupid.

[ehaase]

I think Dodge needs to keep the Charger and Challenger. I'd move the Journey over to Chrysler, keep the Town and Country instead of the Caravan, and not bring back the SWB minivan. I think I would have a smaller number of engines than listed above, maybe two gasoline and one diesel or hybrid per car. Otherwise, that lineup looks fine.

[loki]

you missed the Phoenix engines... but whatever. overall, sounds possible...

[cire]

Other than Jeep=SUVs, I am not really too fond of the "lineup based on vehicle type" brand strategy. I do believe that Jeep should be the only Chrysler LLC division to sell traditional SUVs since that vehicle segment is shrinking and Jeep has an established reputation for this type of vehicle. I believe that Dodge should be leaned on to provide the most sales volume by being positioned as the mainstream, mass market division (the products should receive sporty designs to make them stand out in the market and reinforce the traditional, sporty Dodge image). This would allow Chrysler LLC to take the Chrysler brand upmarket with brand appropriate near luxury products selling in a lower volume at higher prices (and hopefully profits). I think the company could utilize their current LY platform, consolidate all truck based products onto modified versions of the same platform (like Nissan does with their truck based products), and work with Nissan or Mitsubishi or both to develop and share front wheel drive platforms.

This is how I would configure the lineups:

DODGE: Sporty, affordable, mass market division.

* Hornet: Subcompact FWD 3-door and 5-door car built on a platform shared with Mitsubishi or Nissan to save costs.

* Rebel: Subcompact FWD/AWD crossover built on Hornet platform.

* Stealth: Compact FWD sedan and coupe built on platform shared with Mitsubishi or Nissan to save costs.

* Caliber: Morph next generation into a proper FWD/AWD compact crossover based on Stealth platform.

* Intrepid: Midsize FWD sedan and coupe built on a platform shared with Mitsubishi or Nissan to save costs.

* Magnum: Midsize FWD/AWD crossover built on Intrepid platform with optional 7 passenger capacity (like current Dodge Journey).

* Caravan: FWD/AWD minivan built on Intrepid platform.

* Charger: Large RWD/AWD sedan based on LY platform.

* Challenger: Sporty RWD coupe based on LY platform.

* Dakota: Shrink next generation into a proper RWD/AWD compact pickup. Uses shortened Ram platform to save costs.

* Ram: Continues in lineup as full-size RWD/AWD pickup. Shares modified versions of platform with Dakota and Jeep products to save costs.

JEEP: Traditional SUV niche division.

* Wrangler: Compact 3-door and 5-door RWD/AWD SUV available in softtop and hardtop configurations.

* Liberty: Midsize 5-door RWD/AWD SUV.

* Cherokee: Large 5-door, 7 passenger RWD/AWD SUV.

* All Jeep products would be built off a modified platform shared with the Dodge Ram and Dakota to save costs.

CHRYSLER: Near luxury niche division.

* Concorde: Elegant RWD/AWD midsize sedan, wagon, and coupe-cabrio built on modified LY platform.

* Chronos: Elegant RWD/AWD midsize crossover built on modified LY platform.

* 300: Large RWD/AWD sedan and wagon built on LY platform.

* Pacifica: Large RWD/AWD 7 passenger crossover built on LY platform.

I think this is all that they would need to recover. After they are healthy again, they could expand the brands or develop/resurrect some specialty vehicles (sub-Wrangler products for Jeep, Viper and/or Demon for Dodge, sub-Concorde products for Chrysler).

[regfootball]

dodge:

chrysler:

jeep:

[CMG]

dodge:

chrysler:

jeep:

reg's most intelligent post was this:

[Satty]

Dodge: Whatever small cars Nissan allows them to rebadge

Jeep: Whatever fine 4wd vehicles Mahindra can legalize

Chrysler: The finest vehicles China has to offer

[Blake Noble]

Dodge: Whatever small cars Nissan allows them to rebadge

Jeep: Whatever fine 4wd vehicles Mahindra can legalize

Chrysler: The finest vehicles China has to offer

It would have to be at this point I hope that Chrysler Corp. takes that metaphorical .22 gauge shotgun and blows its pretty little metaphorical head off.

[CMG]

Wow, you guys musta had desires for women that flocked in bunches to MoPar owners, no other way to see how your posts make any sense...

:AH-HA_wink:

[Satty]

I'm looking at it from the standpoint of someone who kinda sorta nearly understands the business world and what companies like Cerebrus do. I have had bad experiences with Chryslers in the past ('87 Dakota and '96 Sebring vert) and have been very underwhelmed by their recent offerings compared to the competition. I wouldn't buy any brand new Chrysler over a new Chevy or Ford or Toyota. Even the Wrangler, which I've been on-and-off in love with doesn't seem like a better vehicle than the FJ Cruiser.

[Intrepidation]

I'm looking at it from the standpoint of someone who kinda sorta nearly understands the business world and what companies like Cerebrus do. I have had bad experiences with Chryslers in the past ('87 Dakota and '96 Sebring vert) and have been very underwhelmed by their recent offerings compared to the competition. I wouldn't buy any brand new Chrysler over a new Chevy or Ford or Toyota. Even the Wrangler, which I've been on-and-off in love with doesn't seem like a better vehicle than the FJ Cruiser.

Well as far as I know the Wrangler hasn't suffered body rips yet.

[CMG]

Well as far as I know the Wrangler hasn't suffered body rips yet.

Some people LIKE engine bays cracking...?

[Intrepidation]

Here's my take:

Chrysler

• Sebring (Short term) Replace the current front fascia with one like that of the SEMA concept, revise the tail lights out back, and get rid of that black plastic on the C-pillar. Substantially improve the interior materials used, design is fine but the materials need to be much better. Put sound deadening material and work on reducing the 2.4's noise and harshness. Make the 6-speed standard. Drop the 2.7, replace it with the 3.5 as the Touring. Limited shout get the 4.0, 250 hp brings the numbers more in line with the rest of the class. Move it upmarket with standard alloys(Long Term) Redesign on shortened LY architecture, with new more powerful, more efficient Phoenix V6 engines, add Hybrid.
• 300: Redesign on LY with more focus on sleekness and elegance instead of gangster styling. Phoenix V6's and Hemi V8. Base model will have at least 5-speed automatic standard, alloys. Add Hybrid.
• Pacifica: Brought back but redesigned and priced better, more space efficient, more sporting than the T&C. Phoenix Engines and a Hybrid
• Town and Country: Refreshed with lessons learned from the VW...better handling, more elegant out back and much better interior design and materials.
• PT Cruiser: Redesign as an marketed as a premium compact. Not retro. 2.4/6 speed standard. Light Pressure turbo version optional.
• Aspen: Dropped
• Crossifre: Redesign inspired by FirePower, build it off the Viper platform too. More sales of platform means the expensive can be paid off better, and therefore more profitable. make it a GT with the Hemi not the V10. This will be the new halo car.

Dodge

• Caliber: New, vastly improved interior, CVT replaced by 4-speed automatics and 6-speed for the R/T. Rear end tweaked. engines refined to make less noise and harshness. Add sedan model.
• Avenger: (Short Term) Redesigned interior with more emphasis on actual design, vastly improved materials and color choices. 2.4L should receive same refinements as Sebring. 4-speed standard, 6-speed optional. 2.7/6 speed. 3.5 replaced by 2.4 turbo from SRT4 (alternative could be 4.0 v6). (Long Term) Redesigned on Shortened Ly. Take 2 of mini Charger looks. Driver Oriented cockpit. Hybrid
• Charger: Redesigned on LY. New V6 family, Hybrid, offer Hemi in low volume. Design should be an evolution of current one, still mean looking but more sleek.
• Challenger: Just released, add Phoenix V6's when available.
• Journey: 2.4/3.5/4.0 6-speed optional on 2.4, standard on the other engines. Add Phoenix engines when available. Redo interior, retune suspension to be more sporty. Add Hybrid
• Caravan: Redo interior, retune suspension, redo back end.
• Nitro: Drop, Liberty can pick up the slack.
• Durango: Redesign with new interior and better driving Dynamics. IRS, Hybrid V6 and V8s. Small diesel from Ram.
• Dakota: Redesigned with more fuel efficient engines, better styling, improved interior. Make use of innovations seen on the Ram. Diesel Hybrid
• Ram. Just released, no updates needed.
• Viper: Redesign to be be lighter, more fuel efficient but still very powerful. Better interior.

Jeep

• Compass: Drop
• Patriot: New interior, 2.0 refined with 5-speed manual or 4 speed automatic. 2.4L refined, 5-speed manual or 6-speed automatic. 2.4 light pressure turbo.
• Liberty: Retune suspension for better on road prowess without loosing off road prowess. Base engine gets 5-speed autmatic as an option. Add 4.0 V6. Replace with Phoenix engines when available.
• Wrangler: Redo interior, Add more powerful engine (4.0 and/or diesel)
• Grand Cherokee: Redesign, better interior, on road manners, but keep off road prowess. Add diesel Hybrid. Make optional 3rd row.
• Commander: Drop

Edited March 3, 2008 by Dodgefan

[LosAngeles]

I'll play:

Mopar needs to melt down all remaining 2.7 V-6es in the world and make more reliable engines out of them.

Dodge should be well-catered to by Caliber, Avenger, Challenger, Charger, Ram, Dakota, and Sprinter. The only additions would be the Hornet, a Caliber sedan loosely looking like the hatch (should come off quite butch), an AWD SRT-6 Avenger, and to keep the Magnum around. NO SUVs, not even a Ramcharger!!

Chrysler brand could use a more luxed-up 300, Sebring, and T&C. Again, SRT-6 treatment for the Sebring:

http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2384396440030961650fRBRMd

Firepower perhaps replaces Viper. And a four-place rear-drive personal luxury coupe would set the party off right.

And Jeep? How about a V-8 in that Wrangler 4-door? At least turbocharge the V-6, sheesh. The Compass would make an interesting AWD 2-door (think Paris-Dakar rally). Patriot is irrelevant in the wake of the new Liberty. Consolidate GC and Commander into one REAL full-sizer to compete with Land Cruiser, Range Rover, Tahoe, and Armada

[!!!TED!!!]

I feel the need to comment on cire's lineup...

This is how I would configure the lineups:

DODGE: Sporty, affordable, mass market division.

* Hornet: Subcompact FWD 3-door and 5-door car built on a platform shared with Mitsubishi or Nissan to save costs.

OK, sounding good!

* Rebel: Subcompact FWD/AWD crossover built on Hornet platform.

subcompact crossover? Nah, whats the point?

* Stealth: Compact FWD sedan and coupe built on platform shared with Mitsubishi or Nissan to save costs.

OK again, but people will be upset with the name being used on something other than a sports car

* Caliber: Morph next generation into a proper FWD/AWD compact crossover based on Stealth platform.

This could work! Something Rouge-esque

* Intrepid: Midsize FWD sedan and coupe built on a platform shared with Mitsubishi or Nissan to save costs.

Yep! Something that would compete with Camcord head on

* Magnum: Midsize FWD/AWD crossover built on Intrepid platform with optional 7 passenger capacity (like current Dodge Journey).

Eh? This should be the next gen Journey than. Why muck up the Magnum name again?

* Caravan: FWD/AWD minivan built on Intrepid platform.

Yes!

* Charger: Large RWD/AWD sedan based on LY platform.

Yep, but this would be a good time to change the name

* Challenger: Sporty RWD coupe based on LY platform.

Maybe do a REAL Charger (think Duke boys style) after the Challenger runs its course.

* Dakota: Shrink next generation into a proper RWD/AWD compact pickup. Uses shortened Ram platform to save costs.

Yes, good idea!

* Ram: Continues in lineup as full-size RWD/AWD pickup. Shares modified versions of platform with Dakota and Jeep products to save costs.

Yes!

JEEP: Traditional SUV niche division.

* Wrangler: Compact 3-door and 5-door RWD/AWD SUV available in softtop and hardtop configurations.

Yes!!!

* Liberty: Midsize 5-door RWD/AWD SUV.

I would make this the Cherokee. Rob Nardelli actually mistakenly called the Liberty a Cherokee in his speach at the New York Autoshow, so maybe he knows something.

* Cherokee: Large 5-door, 7 passenger RWD/AWD SUV.

Grand Cherokee!

* All Jeep products would be built off a modified platform shared with the Dodge Ram and Dakota to save costs.

Yep!

CHRYSLER: Near luxury niche division.

* Concorde: Elegant RWD/AWD midsize sedan, wagon, and coupe-cabrio built on modified LY platform.

* Chronos: Elegant RWD/AWD midsize crossover built on modified LY platform.

Hmmm...ya, I can see this happen.

* 300: Large RWD/AWD sedan and wagon built on LY platform.

How about naming this: New Yorker, or maybe 5th Avenue? Something with a little heritage and soul.

* Pacifica: Large RWD/AWD 7 passenger crossover built on LY platform.

I think this is all that they would need to recover. After they are healthy again, they could expand the brands or develop/resurrect some specialty vehicles (sub-Wrangler products for Jeep, Viper and/or Demon for Dodge, sub-Concorde products for Chrysler).

[ocnblu]

Well, I think our Liberty is still sold as Cherokee in other parts of the world. It was an excellent name, I don't have a clue why they wanted to squander all that recognition and goodwill here in the US.

[!!!TED!!!]

Well, I think our Liberty is still sold as Cherokee in other parts of the world. It was an excellent name, I don't have a clue why they wanted to squander all that recognition and goodwill here in the US.

Yes!

Australia gets it as the Cherokee!

http://www.drive.com.au/Editorial/ArticleD...ArticleID=37809

And the UK as well

http://www.carpages.co.uk/jeep/chrysler-je...ee-06-09-07.asp

And most other aprts of the world.

[cire]

I feel the need to comment on cire's lineup...

You did raise some valid points in your response to my proposed lineup:

DODGE:

* Rebel: I kind of envisioned this as a sort of Scion fighter with styling influenced from the Kahuna Concept (but without the faux wood side treatments). Since the U.S. market seems to be infactuated with crossovers, I thought this might be a valued addition to the lineup; basically, a subcompact product with greater utility. In retrospect, I agree that it might not be such a great idea or even a necessary addition; the Hornet 5-door might provide enough utility for this segment.

* Stealth: I chose this name because of its sporty image. I envisioned Dodge's compact sedan and coupe to have sportier styling than a Corolla, Civic, Cobalt, Sentra, Focus, etc. I do agree that people might have a problem with the name being attached to a sporty FWD compact sedan and coupe. I would settle for the resurrection of the "Shadow" or "Aries" monikers as well; just as long as they don't call it "Neon" (that name is too cutesy and doesn't possess any sporty intentions).

* Magnum: Again, I envisioned the next generation Journey to be a sportier design that fits Dodge's sporty brand image. "Magnum" seemed to fit the sportier styling that I envisioned better than "Journey". On the other hand, they should continue with Journey if the current generation is successful and builds positive market recognition with the public. If the Journey isn't successful, then I think they should call the sportier next generation design Magnum.

* Charger: I think the current generation has firmly established the "Charger" moniker as a large sedan model in the market. I would love to see the next generation utilize the styling theme from the Charger R/T Concept, which would give this sedan an even sportier appearance. I don't think they should lose the current market recognition they have built in the name by changing it to a coupe. If they could maybe spin off a coupe version with the Charger R/T Concept styling theme, they could save marketing dollars by calling both the sedan and coupe "Charger" and retiring the "Challenger" moniker.

JEEP:

I agree with you that the Liberty should be renamed Cherokee. That is the name that Jeep uses in the rest of the world; why not utilize it in the U.S.? I am not personally fond of the "Grand Cherokee" moniker (it just seems too late 80's or early 90's to me; it also sounds more like a luxury trim level for the Cherokee than a moniker for a fullsize flagship product). I personally prefer a Wrangler (compact), Cherokee (midsize), and Commander (fullsize) lineup for Jeep. The "Grand Cherokee" name might have too much market recognition to drop and the "Commander" moniker might be too tarnished to use at this point, regardless of my personal preferences. If using "Grand Cherokee" for the fullsize product is more beneficial to Jeep, then they should continue to use it (although I still don't like it).

CHRYSLER:

* 300: I agree with you about the "300" moniker. I know this moniker has some great history and heritage with the Chrysler brand and also has a lot of current market recognition, but I think it is too sterile (and Euro/Japanese wannabe) for the brand's flagship cars. I don't agree with resurrecting the "New Yorker" or "Fifth Avenue" monikers; they just seem too old fashioned and out of place in today's market. If I was going to discontinue the "300" moniker, I would either resurrect the "Imperial" moniker for the large cars or I would call the midsize cars "LeBaron" and use the "Concorde" name on the large cars.

* Compact Vehicles (Sedan, Coupe-Cabrio, & Wagon): I would also would like to see Chrysler bargain with Nissan to use a modified version of their FM platform to develop an upscale RWD compact sedan, coupe-cabrio, and wagon. If they did this, the compact cars could be called "LeBaron", the midsize cars could be called "Concorde", and the large flagship cars could be called "Imperial".

Just some additional thoughts and ideas, although I doubt much, if any of it would become a reality. I did enjoy your feedback to my proposals. You submitted some thoughtful and intelligent counterpoints.