LAIAS: 2009 Lincoln MKS

[Drew Dowdell]

Link to Article and Pics at Autoblog

For the past two decades, the only thing consistent about Ford's Lincoln division has been its inconsistency. To put it lightly, the brand has struggled to find it's place in the automotive landscape. The vehicles from Ford's premium domestic division haven't had a coherent look since the early '80s. Several of its models, such as the LS and the Navigator, have sold well at times, but the absence of a Lincoln DNA hasn't helped. In 2006, North American Design chief Peter Horbury set about changing all that. He gave his team the task of examining past Lincolns to determine what set them apart.

The first new model intended to set Lincoln on it's path to rebirth is the 2009 MKS, which is making its debut in production form at the LA Auto Show later today. The MKS first appeared as a concept at the 2006 Detroit Auto Show. It's based on the same platform as the Ford 500/Taurus, which originated at Volvo under the S80/XC90. When the concept first appeared it was reasonably well received as a pleasant if not daring design for the marque. Subsequently, Horbury's team began its quest for the soul of Lincoln and came up with a list of seven elements that would be part of future Lincoln designs. Most of these appeared on the 2007 MKR concept that we saw in Detroit. While most of the MKS was already locked in for production, after the show Ford management made the decision to adopt one of most prominent elements from the new MKR concept, its grille.

[Z-06]

OK I guess.

[loki]

the 3.7L will beat 90% of the ~3.5L's now... wonder how powerful the DI/turboed version will be....

the pics of it look good. not as stunning as the cts though

[bowtie_dude]

Azera front + Kia Rio rear = BAD. Completely unoriginal and borderline ugly. Lincoln is a joke, just like Chrysler.

[Flybrian]

This car's hallmark is clearly the engine. The exterior - while nice - is not flagship material in any way, shape or form. I don't understand the insistance on outmoded door buttons.

I will also add that certain photos I'm about to post make it look strikingly LaCrosse-like in profile.

[The O.C.]

Well, I'll see this car tomorrow.....so final judgements must wait.

I think taken in isolation, this looks pretty good. However, it's very apparent in the front-overhang that this car is FWD-based.....and from reading the specs, it looks like FWD will be standard with AWD optional......I just can't get my arms around any Lincoln being FWD. I also can't get my arms around the vertical taillights. That's a Cadillac trait in my mind....hasn't Lincoln typically used horizontal taillights?

Funny how much this car looks like a copy of the new Jaguar XF......LOL......

Interior is nice overall......but after the CTS' artistic display of the HVAC and radio/nav controls, this Lincoln center stack looks WAY boring. Perhaps if they would have cascaded the wood trim down the center stack, instead of black plastic, it would have looked nicer.

It's a nice car...and I hope it does well for Lincoln. I'm sure, price-wise, it will cause some serious cross-shopping with CTS....and may even take a few sales.....but I don't see this MKS EVER doing for Lincoln what the first-generation CTS did for Cadillac.

....and that's sad....because that is just what Lincoln needs right now. Not a reskinned and rebadged Taurus!

[Flybrian]

It's a nice car...and I hope it does well for Lincoln. I'm sure, price-wise, it will cause some serious cross-shopping with CTS....and may even take a few sales.....but I don't see this MKS EVER doing for Lincoln what the first-generation CTS did for Cadillac.

Doubtful even there. The CTS appeals to a completely different expectation and mindset when it comes to luxury sedans. STS vs MKS? Most certainly more likely.

[Drew Dowdell]

Acura TL front + split waterfall grill + Amanti tail lights

[Cory Wolfe]

It's not bad, but certainly not flagship worthy. Nothing about it shines, it's just decent all over. Again, though, not bad by any means.

[regfootball]

Doubtful even there. The CTS appeals to a completely different expectation and mindset when it comes to luxury sedans. STS vs MKS? Most certainly more likely.

MKS = gives town car buyers something new, provides upgrade from MKz. Provides a better alternatives to some Japanese lux sedans like Lexus ES, Honda RL and TL. Buick, DTS and STS buyers will cross shop this. Volvo buyers might even consider this.

Fly again is spot on. This was never meant to duel the CTS. Lincoln is positioned itself below caddy these days.

Not every luxury sedan needs to shred pavement like the BMW's. This package is a nice blend of euroasian bland luxury and tradtional lincoln style. It immediately is Lincoln's best product and has a long life cycle of updates planned.

I hate how much the interior still reminds of my 500. The shifter and console area sucks. The front looks like my old Diamantes mated with a grand am. But I do like the new front. Ford was wise to redesign it before production.

Truth is, I LOVE the CTS, but I would totally shop the MKs myself because its more commodious and still looks elegant. I bet it handles well enough for me. Twin Force and powershift would rule.

Some might argue that Lincoln's current lineup can attract more buyers at retail than Caddy now. MKx sells well. The MKs should do well out of the gate. MKz has done well. STS and SRX are not busting sales charts for caddy. XLR barely sells. If you are a Lincoln+Merc dealer, you are doing better than standalone caddy dealer for sure.

Edited November 14, 2007 by regfootball

[RJB]

The biggest downfall of this car is...FWD!!This is where the CTS will trump it everytime in my book, that and the CTS is a far far better looking car inside and out.

[Windy-57]

I kinda like this car. Yes, the taillights are stolen from a Maserati, but I kinda like that too. However, as mentioned, this is nowhere near a luxury flagship model for a number of reasons, but particularly I would point to the lack of a V8. So you can all stop comparing this to Cadillacs now and start comparing it to what its true competiton will be...Buick.

[Robert Hall]

Looks like a nice car..but 272 hp is not flagship material...

[Drew Dowdell]

OMG! IT will NEVAR outhandLE teh 3-series! Lincoln is teh suxors! OF course it competes with Teh 3-series since teh prise is teh same

[bowtie_dude]

Acura TL front + split waterfall grill + Amanti tail lights

Yes!

[K.C.]

I had to chuckle at the comparison of the MKS to the STS. There really is no comparison between the two. Even though the STS is dated (I still love it tho), it is worlds more sophisticated than the MKS on its Volvo chassis thats front wheel drive biased.

[RJB]

I kinda like this car. Yes, the taillights are stolen from a Maserati, but I kinda like that too. However, as mentioned, this is nowhere near a luxury flagship model for a number of reasons, but particularly I would point to the lack of a V8. So you can all stop comparing this to Cadillacs now and start comparing it to what its true competiton will be...Buick.

The LaCrosse or the Lucerne?

[pow]

OMG! IT will NEVAR outhandLE teh 3-series! Lincoln is teh suxors! OF course it competes with Teh 3-series since teh prise is teh same

No, this is more an ES350 competitor, something the MKZ can only dream of doing.

[regfootball]

so funny all the backlash considering this car is better than 90% of the rolling piles of $h! that are in everyone's garage now.

i can't recall what the power figures are going to be for the twinforce version of this car....like 370 or something.

again, this car was not conceived to duel a 5 series. But to be a decent alternative to say, an ES Lexus...sure.

Audi, Volvo and Saab and Honda have been selling luxury cars for years built on FWD platforms. Not ideal, but they still maintain a decent standing in the lux car pecking order. Look at Acura, the RL (really lame, with SHAWD!) TL (totally lame or thoroughly lame, take your pick) RDX (really dumb Xover) and MDX (just mildly dumb crossover). All front drive. Not to mention the Canadian exclusive EL (extremely lame).

[ZL-1]

I think the front end looks nice, but why does that rear end remind me of the Chevrolet Nubira?

[Drew Dowdell]

so funny all the backlash considering this car is better than 90% of the rolling piles of $h! that are in everyone's garage now.

You know why I don't like this car? One reason:

We could have had that.

That would get me to jump ship from GM. That would get Chrysler 300C owners to jump ship. That could likely even get non-snob E-class and GS owners to jump ship. Even if it didn't have all the cool concept stuff and suicide doors or weird trunk. Just keep the outside shape and styling, put it on the DEW98 platform. Profit.

[scharmer05]

You know why I don't like this car? One reason:

We could have had that.

Thats a pretty cool 300C.

[Drew Dowdell]

Thats a pretty cool 300C.

Considering that this was a 2002 concept and the 300c came out as a 2005 in early 2004.... Lincoln could have beaten Chrysler to the punch because they already had the platform ready to go.

[thegriffon]

By way of Comparison:

Premium Sedans	   Pass.  Cargo Total  Weight	 Wheelbase   Length	  Width	  Height
Buick Lucerne		108.0  17.0  125.0  1707 3764  2936 115.6  5161 203.2  1874 73.8  1473 58.0
Buick Park Avenue (new)				  1875 4134  3009 118.5  5175 203.7  1899 74.8  1480 58.3
VW Phaeton		   108.0  13.0  121.0  2187 4822  3001 118.1  5175 203.7  1903 74.9  1450 57.1
BMW 730Li			111.0  18.0  129.0  1910 4211  3128 123.1  5179 203.9  1902 74.9  1484 58.4
Lincoln MKS		  105.9  18.4  124.3  1872 4127  2867 112.9  5185 204.1  1927 75.9  1565 61.6
Audi A8L 3.2 FSI	 106.8  14.6  121.4  1740 3836  3074 121.0  5192 204.4  1894 74.6  1455 57.3
Mercedes Benz S350L  109.4  16.3  125.7  1925 4244  3165 124.6  5206 205.0  1872 73.7  1473 58.0
Jaguar XJ8 L				16.4		 1714 3779  3160 124.4  5215 205.3  1942 76.5  1455 57.3
Buick Park Avenue	112.1  19.1  131.2  1714 3779  2891 113.8  5253 206.8  1897 74.7  1458 57.4
Toyota Century						   2050 4519  3025 119.1  5270 207.5  1890 74.4  1475 58.1
Cadillac DTS		 113.2  18.8  132.0  1818 4009  2936 115.6  5274 207.6  1901 74.8  1464 57.6

BTW, the estimated price for the 270 hp MKS is close to that of the 275 hp Lucerne CXS.

[thegriffon]

No, this is more an ES350 competitor, something the MKZ can only dream of doing.

It's most direct competition is the Buick Lucerne CXS, and despite the slight power disadvantage and the greater weight, I can see people preferring the MKS. Next closest will be the Cadillac DTS, but with more power and a higher price, that's a step up from the base MKS.

[VenSeattle]

It's most direct competition is the Buick Lucerne CXS, and despite the slight power disadvantage and the greater weight, I can see people preferring the MKS. Next closest will be the Cadillac DTS, but with more power and a higher price, that's a step up from the base MKS.

If not the CXS, the Lucerne Super will MSRP around $38k. The MKS has some appeal over the Lucerne, especially with AWD available. I'll have to see the MKS in person. I wasn't impressed with the new Volvo S80 in the flesh, so I'll have to hold off to form a stronger opinion.

No, this is more an ES350 competitor, something the MKZ can only dream of doing.

Lincoln's direct competitor for the ES350 is the MKZ. They're the same size (length within an inch; Same weight; interior volume close... MKZ has a larger trunk), same class, and the interior material quality between the ES & MKZ are on par. Both have features the other lacks, such as the MKZhas LED lights, AWD, and now SYNC. The ES350 has... a Lexus badge on a Camry platform (which is Fusion's direct competitor.)

As for Buick, the LaCrosse replacement will more than likely be Buick's direct competitor to the MKZ and ES350.

[pow]

If not the CXS, the Lucerne Super will MSRP around $38k. The MKS has some appeal over the Lucerne, especially with AWD available. I'll have to see the MKS in person. I wasn't impressed with the new Volvo S80 in the flesh, so I'll have to hold off to form a stronger opinion.

Lincoln's direct competitor for the ES350 is the MKZ. They're the same size (length within an inch; Same weight; interior volume close... MKZ has a larger trunk), same class, and the interior material quality between the ES & MKZ are on par. Both have features the other lacks, such as the MKZhas LED lights, AWD, and now SYNC. The ES350 has... a Lexus badge on a Camry platform (which is Fusion's direct competitor.)

As for Buick, the LaCrosse replacement will more than likely be Buick's direct competitor to the MKZ and ES350.

True, but to make up for the MKZ's lack of luxury and equipment, Lincoln prices it significantly lower than the ES350, which starts at $37,490 with leather. The MKS looks like a compelling alternative to the ES350, in that it's priced similarly but offers more interior space, kinda like how Ford positions the Taurus as a Camry V-6 alternative.

[VenSeattle]

True, but to make up for the MKZ's lack of luxury and equipment, Lincoln prices it significantly lower than the ES350, which starts at $37,490 with leather. The MKS looks like a compelling alternative to the ES350, in that it's priced similarly but offers more interior space, kinda like how Ford positions the Taurus as a Camry V-6 alternative.

Taurus can go up to $35k+ fully loaded with memory seats, AWD, etc. It's clearly competing in size/class with the Avalon.

The MKZ isn't lacking really anything in luxury compared to the ES350 except perception... oh yeah, and the ES350 is over priced.

[CSpec]

The exterior is pretty sleek, but the interior seems pretty drab and unimaginative. I see this needing a new interior within a couple of years, or maybe Ford will just keep giving it small enhancements for 35 years.

[Guest YellowJacket894]

Did Ford ... did they secretly buy Oldsmobile or something? Slap a rocket badge on the front, and you could pass this off as some half-assed Cutlass concept, at least from the front.

That aside, it's a solid car, pretty nice. No Cadillac (or even Chrysler) competitor as it should be, but it's not bad. It's just a Taurus named after a famous president.

Myself? I'm waiting for this:

[smk4565]

I like the exterior look of it. The interior looks too similar in shape and style to the Taurus and Volvo S80. Being a front driver, it won't win any handling awards, I am not sure what the turbo will make, but what will the point be, even with awd, it will still be front heavy and probably torque steer.

They do offer some good technology for the price like adaptive cruise control, adaptive headlights, push button start, capless gas tank. But I think this will only appeal to current Lincoln/Mercury buyers or the Bonneville/Aurora/Seville/300M etc crowd that likes roomy and front drive. This car is way better than the Lucerne, but that isn't saying much. The big front drive car segment is shrinking fast, this may appeal to some of the old die hard fans of it, but that is about it.

Built on the Taurus DE3 platform is a huge downside.

Edited November 15, 2007 by smk4565

[Cory Wolfe]

so funny all the backlash considering this car is better than 90% of the rolling piles of $h! that are in everyone's garage now.

i can't recall what the power figures are going to be for the twinforce version of this car....like 370 or something.

again, this car was not conceived to duel a 5 series. But to be a decent alternative to say, an ES Lexus...sure.

Audi, Volvo and Saab and Honda have been selling luxury cars for years built on FWD platforms. Not ideal, but they still maintain a decent standing in the lux car pecking order. Look at Acura, the RL (really lame, with SHAWD!) TL (totally lame or thoroughly lame, take your pick) RDX (really dumb Xover) and MDX (just mildly dumb crossover). All front drive. Not to mention the Canadian exclusive EL (extremely lame).

So funny for someone like you to talk about backlash when you don't have an unbiased bone in your body. C&G needs a Reg filter, that rids of all the idiocies and only shows the few things worth reading of yours.

As others have mentioned, Lincoln needs a real flagship, not some mildly luxurious sedan built on an also ran platform devoid of much style beyond a grill that isn't even Lincoln's. I put this on the same level as the Lucerne, which, isn't a compliment. Neither are terrible vehicles, but... They don't deserve much praise. Perhaps a blurred compliment here or there. For Lincoln's sake, I hope it sells. I'm sure they'll be some old Continental owners ready to buy... if they haven't died.

[regfootball]

oh really? honda is god because they can't sell any RL's which have no power, no style, cost too much and are front wheel based as well? tell me how the RL is a market star? tell me why when you look at acura's sales lately they are great big negatives. tell me why the MDX costs 10 grand more than the lambdas. tell me why the rdx is close to 40k yet only packs a 4 cylinder turbo that outconsumes many of GM's full sized products.

because the mks is a viable alternative to the ES lexus ? or the lower content a6's or all the glorified hondas.

because the twinforce v6 with powershift will nudge 400hp with one of the segments first dual clutch trannies?

because the mks is better than what's in your garage? I don't suspect you'll be owning an M3 any time soon.

No one said this car was Jesus Christ on a stick. Go back and read, I already said this car is not meant to compete with BMW or mercedes.

step back long enough to digest the message in the post before you go off with personal $h! again. you cannot seem to post without taking jabs at people and that is pure bull$h!. so cut the fricking punk crap already and grow up. grow some balls.

when i comment on something its about the cars, i don't use posts to direct comments at people like you seem to make sport of.

Edited November 15, 2007 by regfootball

[Intrepidation]

You know it's funny how so many are calling this an ES competitor like it's a good thing. Thing is, the ES isn't Lexus' flagship, it's entry level along with the IS, the MKS is the flagship for Lincoln. Not good.

They need the MKR.

[Drew Dowdell]

This isn't a Lincoln flagship, but neither is the MKR.

A Lincoln flagship needs to be big, needs to be RWD, and needs to have a V8 or twinforce standard.

[Cory Wolfe]

oh really? honda is god because they can't sell any RL's which have no power, no style, cost too much and are front wheel based as well? tell me how the RL is a market star? tell me why when you look at acura's sales lately they are great big negatives. tell me why the MDX costs 10 grand more than the lambdas. tell me why the rdx is close to 40k yet only packs a 4 cylinder turbo that outconsumes many of GM's full sized products.

because the mks is a viable alternative to the ES lexus ? or the lower content a6's or all the glorified hondas.

because the twinforce v6 with powershift will nudge 400hp with one of the segments first dual clutch trannies?

because the mks is better than what's in your garage? I don't suspect you'll be owning an M3 any time soon.

No one said this car was Jesus Christ on a stick. Go back and read, I already said this car is not meant to compete with BMW or mercedes.

step back long enough to digest the message in the post before you go off with personal $h! again. you cannot seem to post without taking jabs at people and that is pure bull$h!. so cut the fricking punk crap already and grow up. grow some balls.

when i comment on something its about the cars, i don't use posts to direct comments at people like you seem to make sport of.

I only take the poster into account when it's needed. Whenever you stop with the unrelenting bias and hypocrisy, I'll stop noticing. I only call it like I see it. I'm not the only one.

Going back to the MKS, which was the main point of interest in my post, not you... It doesn't matter what you say. This is supposed to be Lincoln's flagship. No matter how you spin it, it's a pathetic excuse for a flagship. No one here is saying the RL is any better. You can bash it all you want, but at the end of the day, how can you sit here and defend the MKS? It's nonsense. I'm sure it'll make many people happy and will please a number of Lincoln/Mercury faithfuls. However, as has been the main point in this thread... It's not special. It's not flagship material regardless of not being a BMW fighter. I'd argue that the old Lincoln LS was much more of a flagship than this thing will ever become. It had style, luxury, and a deserving platform. Again, spin it however you want, but as I said... The MKS is simply a mildly luxurious sedan built on an also ran platform devoid of much style beyond a grill that isn't even Lincoln's. If you can legitimately tell me it's a deserving flagship or an exceptional vehicle, I'm afraid my comments are just.

[Drew Dowdell]

it's only a flagship if you consider Lincoln to be a Buick equivalent.

I don't think that's the direction Lincoln should take. They should aim for the luxurious side of Mercedes Benz.

[Member55]

They should be able to sell ~20K units a year, considering a relatively low investment this vehicle required that might not be a bad number.

[InvictaMan]

You know why I don't like this car? One reason:

We could have had that.

That would get me to jump ship from GM. That would get Chrysler 300C owners to jump ship. That could likely even get non-snob E-class and GS owners to jump ship. Even if it didn't have all the cool concept stuff and suicide doors or weird trunk. Just keep the outside shape and styling, put it on the DEW98 platform. Profit.

Oh sheesh! That thing is about as attractive as Darth Vader in drag. And nearly as dated. On the MKS — the interior is a feast of plastic. And fit and finish... check out the wrinkled, poor application of the leather dash at the driver's side air vent. Definitely a better execution of exterior style and proportion than the Taurus and Sable, more viable than the dinosaur they call the Town Car.

[Micah Pie]

I think the front end is killer. All these new Lincoln front ends and concept front ends ROCK! A design like that... and Oldsmobile would still be right up there with chevy!

[Intrepidation]

I only take the poster into account when it's needed. Whenever you stop with the unrelenting bias and hypocrisy, I'll stop noticing. I only call it like I see it. I'm not the only one.

Going back to the MKS, which was the main point of interest in my post, not you... It doesn't matter what you say. This is supposed to be Lincoln's flagship. No matter how you spin it, it's a pathetic excuse for a flagship. No one here is saying the RL is any better. You can bash it all you want, but at the end of the day, how can you sit here and defend the MKS? It's nonsense. I'm sure it'll make many people happy and will please a number of Lincoln/Mercury faithfuls. However, as has been the main point in this thread... It's not special. It's not flagship material regardless of not being a BMW fighter. I'd argue that the old Lincoln LS was much more of a flagship than this thing will ever become. It had style, luxury, and a deserving platform. Again, spin it however you want, but as I said... The MKS is simply a mildly luxurious sedan built on an also ran platform devoid of much style beyond a grill that isn't even Lincoln's. If you can legitimately tell me it's a deserving flagship or an exceptional vehicle, I'm afraid my comments are just.

Completely agree.

[balthazar]

The MKR concept was pure poetry, gorgeous. It's what Lincoln needs. In comparison, this MKS (from pics) is a huge letdown, but compared to much of it's intended segment, it's seems quite capable. It's not going to shake things up, tho.

Has Lincoln called the MKS it's 'flagship', or is it assumedly so due to it's position in the marque?

[NOS2006]

Front end looks pretty good, interior is still pretty boring even with the sculpture in the upper IP, and rear and body are very boring. Hit or miss I'm sure. Just pretty bland and they should be looking to wow the entire competition. Look at the CTS and take notes, Lincoln.

[Member55]

Front end looks pretty good, interior is still pretty boring even with the sculpture in the upper IP, and rear and body are very boring. Hit or miss I'm sure. Just pretty bland and they should be looking to wow the entire competition. Look at the CTS and take notes, Lincoln.

Lincoln is getting sales on cheap. Considering the situation that might be a responsible thing to do. If they get lucky MKZ/MKX/MKS combined will sell ~100K units, that's about the same as what CTS/STS/SRX are doing for a while now. I bet that assuming a similar volume Lincolns trio is more profitable.

[sciguy_0504]

It looks pretty good. Very classy and elegant. I don't think it will "save" Lincoln, though. It will help but Lincoln needs a lot more...like the MKR.

[regfootball]

Lincoln is getting sales on cheap. Considering the situation that might be a responsible thing to do. If they get lucky MKZ/MKX/MKS combined will sell ~100K units, that's about the same as what CTS/STS/SRX are doing for a while now. I bet that assuming a similar volume Lincolns trio is more profitable.

i think it's recongnizing what market is available to them, realizing the prices that they can get, and building enough car to sell them at enough profit and volume to keep the dealer doors open.

what people are so lame to forget is that lincoln's lineup as it is now was not conceived to duel MB/BMW/Cadillac and was all conceived under the premise of Jaguar as the premeir Ford luxury brand. It's probably been intentionally positioned to be somewhere between Buick and Volvo and Acura and quite honestly its not law for them to have an M5 equivalent or an XLR equivalent, etc. I think L/M sales were up on the newer models last i checked. So if they sell the expected volume, make the sales, make profit and keep the dealerships healthy.......and there is only a limited market of top dollar luxury cars, if this keep Lincoln existing rather than dying, then you all will just have to accept it.

Yeah they left the LS die on the vine and did not replace it. that was wrong to do but i think they are working on it. give it time.

last I checked Lincoln has put out 3 new models in the last 2 years. Caddy has only put out 1 i think. Acuras sedans are graying. Look how ancient the DTS is and how it won't be fixed till like 2010.

Considering how Jac Nasser starved the company and how inept bill F was running it initially, you have to accept that this is all they get for now and like GM it will take time to rebuild the lineup.

I would venture to say the MKs will have as many takers as the new CTS. they will be for different reasons, but 60,000 of CTS sales is no better or worse than MKs sales. In light of what they had to work with and if they sell that many, I doubt they would whine about that over at Ford.

Edited November 16, 2007 by regfootball

[Member55]

i think it's recongnizing what market is available to them, realizing the prices that they can get, and building enough car to sell them at enough profit and volume to keep the dealer doors open.

what people are so lame to forget is that lincoln's lineup as it is now was not conceived to duel MB/BMW/Cadillac and was all conceived under the premise of Jaguar as the premeir Ford luxury brand. It's probably been intentionally positioned to be somewhere between Buick and Volvo and Acura and quite honestly its not law for them to have an M5 equivalent or an XLR equivalent, etc. I think L/M sales were up on the newer models last i checked. So if they sell the expected volume, make the sales, make profit and keep the dealerships healthy.......and there is only a limited market of top dollar luxury cars, if this keep Lincoln existing rather than dying, then you all will just have to accept it.

Yeah they left the LS die on the vine and did not replace it. that was wrong to do but i think they are working on it. give it time.

last I checked Lincoln has put out 3 new models in the last 2 years. Caddy has only put out 1 i think. Acuras sedans are graying. Look how ancient the DTS is and how it won't be fixed till like 2010.

Considering how Jac Nasser starved the company and how inept bill F was running it initially, you have to accept that this is all they get for now and like GM it will take time to rebuild the lineup.

I would venture to say the MKs will have as many takers as the new CTS. they will be for different reasons, but 60,000 of CTS sales is no better or worse than MKs sales. In light of what they had to work with and if they sell that many, I doubt they would whine about that over at Ford.

Cadillac deserves almost as much criticism as Lincoln these days. Clearly Lincoln is down because of lack of investment, on the other hand GM made a huge investment in Cadillac just to end up with no 3-series competitor, no 7-series competitor and two cars competing with 5-series of which one is not good enough to do the job and the other one nobody even knows it's competing with 5-series.

[titan]

I think the front end is killer. All these new Lincoln front ends and concept front ends ROCK! A design like that... and Oldsmobile would still be right up there with chevy!

I agree 100%. Styling wise, this car is a home run, IMO. The interior is very, very nice also. Features like the huge sunroof and powerful engine will help sell this car. This will be a sporty car, especially in AWD form. It's funny how much criticism this car is getting for being the "flagship." As the nicest sedan in Lincoln's lineup, this car is the flagship by default; like the M is for Infiniti. And just as the Q will debut in another year or so, Lincoln is rumored to have a full size RWD flagship in the works with an all all new V8.

[gm4life]

Well I hate to disagree, FWD or AWD this thing is great looking. I think it is one of the sharpest cars out there. Smooth lines big Lincoln front end, refined interior, great profile nice detail touches. And I want one, almost as much as a DTS now that is saying something... But if the prices push much over 42K for a loaded one, they won't sell very well. But I really do think it is sweet looking and if I had the money would consider getting one! Size wise what are they close too anyone know? The interior is sweet, too I like it as much as the new CTS actually. I need to give Ford credit where credit is do. Your right this is not a flagship car tho.

Edited November 19, 2007 by gm4life

[enzl]

The MKS is a stopgap product...a way to fill the Chicago plant's volume & a way to put a car out that ducks, in essence, much of the competition. It's a large car, FWD/AWD, when most of the competition in this space are going RWD with smaller vehicles.

Will it have the enthusiasts salivating-No. But it might just capture a piece of the market that Lincoln was giving away, regardless. To me, Acura, Infiniti & Buick have all had sedans in this space, selling decent volumes. Infiniti replaced the I35 with nothing, Acura moved the RL too far upmarket and Buick has the Lucerne covering ground that was once held by 2 sedans, so it may not be a bad strategic move.

We've got a F-L/M showroom, so I'm sure we'll get a good idea about this one rather quickly.