Auto Express announces revival of the Triumph brand

[tmp]

BMW to revive Triumph brand?

Look familiar?

[PurdueGuy]

Our pictures reveal what a modern Triumph car could look like, taking its styling inspiration from the classic TR4.

In other words, they decided to photoshop a solstice to pretend they had real news.

[SoCalCTS]

The front end is disgusting!

Let British cars die already. They were never that good to begin with and they dont deserve resurrection.

[LosAngeles]

The front end is disgusting!

Let British cars die already. They were never that good to begin with and they dont deserve resurrection.

Not every brand, but there were many greats in the bunch.

[ZL-1]

Saw a couple of Triumph bikes Sunday morning. Really cool looking things!

[cletus8269]

anyone else see that besides me?

[Guest aatbloke]

The front end is disgusting!

Let British cars die already. They were never that good to begin with and they dont deserve resurrection.

BL produced several real duffers, but cars such as Rover SD1 and Triumph Dolomite Sprint were terrific machines at the time.

[Argen]

BL produced several real duffers, but cars such as Rover SD1 and Triumph Dolomite Sprint were terrific machines at the time.

God, I still want a Dolly Sprint so badly. It's really annoying how Triumph decided to sell just about every other model they made here in the US, except the Dolomite family. But, then again we all know that the best car BL ever made was a beige Austin Princess with a brown vinyl roof. =P

[Robert Hall]

God, I still want a Dolly Sprint so badly. It's really annoying how Triumph decided to sell just about every other model they made here in the US, except the Dolomite family. But, then again we all know that the best car BL ever made was a beige Austin Princess with a brown vinyl roof. =P

Top Gear had an episode the other night about '70s BL cars...

This is a plausable BMW move, I had read they had considered reviving a British sports car brand rather than have a Z2 or smaller, cheaper sports car than the Z4. IIRC, BMW also owns the rights to other BL brands like Austin (and Austin-Healey?), Morris, Riley, and maybe Vanden Plas..

[Guest aatbloke]

God, I still want a Dolly Sprint so badly. It's really annoying how Triumph decided to sell just about every other model they made here in the US, except the Dolomite family. But, then again we all know that the best car BL ever made was a beige Austin Princess with a brown vinyl roof. =P

LOL the Princess wasn't really a bad car, in fact it was pretty sturdy in its day against the competition of the time and very spacious and futuristic looking; the same guy who designed it also penned the Allegro, Marina and the TR7. The six cylinder models were nice and torquey, but as comfortable as the hydragas suspension made them, the system wasn't well engineered.

The entire Dolomite range (with the exception of the meagre 1300cc base model) was basically Britain's BMW 3-series, and the Sprint was the world's first four-valves per cylinder production car. This was a massive opportunity wasted by BL, who could have developed Triumph into a fine executive marque. The same engines in the lower models were used in the Spitfire. For my money the Dolomite was the best car which BL ever produced.

Edited April 10, 2008 by aatbloke

[the_yellow_dart]

Is it wrong that this name now makes me think of boobies?

[thegriffon]

… the Sprint was the world's first four-valves per cylinder production car. …

Ahh, yeah, maybe if your world consists of a 10 acre site in Britiain. Duesenberg offered a DOHC 32V 8-cylinder in 1921, and I'm sure there were others (1919 Bugatti Type23 for example, a 1.45 L 16V DOHC engine).

[thegriffon]

Is it wrong that this name now makes me think of boobies?

Not as long as it helps you think well of it.

[Robert Hall]

Ahh, yeah, maybe if your world consists of a 10 acre site in Britiain. Duesenberg offered a DOHC 32V 8-cylinder in 1921, and I'm sure there were others (1919 Bugatti Type23 for example, a 1.45 L 16V DOHC engine).

Well, as James May on Top Gear put it last year, "We are Britain; we are the inventors of everything." Kind of like Al Gore and the Internet and pants.

[balthazar]

>>"Duesenberg offered a DOHC 32V 8-cylinder in 1921"<<

...and it was still a feature of their engines thru '37.

[Camino LS6]

Top Gear had an episode the other night about '70s BL cars...

This is a plausable BMW move, I had read they had considered reviving a British sports car brand rather than have a Z2 or smaller, cheaper sports car than the Z4. IIRC, BMW also owns the rights to other BL brands like Austin (and Austin-Healey?), Morris, Riley, and maybe Vanden Plas..

There was also talk of a Healy revival a while back.

3 Guesses what platform it's based on.

By CaminoLS6

[Guest aatbloke]

Ahh, yeah, maybe if your world consists of a 10 acre site in Britiain. Duesenberg offered a DOHC 32V 8-cylinder in 1921, and I'm sure there were others (1919 Bugatti Type23 for example, a 1.45 L 16V DOHC engine).

Difference in culture here. When we refer to multivalves in this country, we refer to 4-cylinder engines as a general yardstick. What I meant was - and this is indeed the correct claim - that the Dolomite Sprint is accredited with having the world's first 16v engine in a mass-produced car.

The Bugatti Type 13/23's multivalve made it into 1,600 or so examples - a production car, but Bugatti were not mass-producers.

My world consists of far more than ten acres in the West Midlands - and far more than most American males are capable of giving credit for.

Edited April 11, 2008 by aatbloke

[Guest aatbloke]

Well, as James May on Top Gear put it last year, "We are Britain; we are the inventors of everything." Kind of like Al Gore and the Internet and pants.

If you're familiar with British humour, you'd know he was being highly sarcastic.

[Camino LS6]

My world consists of far more than ten acres in the West Midlands - and far more than any American I'm sure is capable of giving credit for.

Sweeping generalization, that.

[Guest aatbloke]

Sweeping generalization, that.

Indeed.

Edited April 11, 2008 by aatbloke

[Blake Noble]

By CaminoLS6

Am I the only one that finds it maybe slightly ironic that it has a license plate that reads "Tempest" on the bumper?

[Camino LS6]

Am I the only one that finds it maybe slightly ironic that it has a license plate that reads "Tempest" on the bumper?

Yeah, got my attention too.

But you know what?

I like this thing.

Of course, I've always had a soft spot for Healeys since trying to keep three Healey vintage racecars going for a few years. They can be fun, and the styling cues on this work for me.

[Robert Hall]

If you're familiar with British humour, you'd know he was being highly sarcastic.

I know... I love the dry British humour.

[SuperSport623]

I'm for it only if they bring back the Sprite:

That car is so cute it's ridiculous.

reminds me of this:

[thegriffon]

Difference in culture here. When we refer to multivalves in this country, we refer to 4-cylinder engines as a general yardstick. What I meant was - and this is indeed the correct claim - that the Dolomite Sprint is accredited with having the world's first 16v engine in a mass-produced car.

The Bugatti Type 13/23's multivalve made it into 1,600 or so examples - a production car, but Bugatti were not mass-producers.

My world consists of far more than ten acres in the West Midlands - and far more than most American males are capable of giving credit for.

If the various Bentleys, Dusenberg's Bugattis etc. are too low-volume for you, then there are still the 16V Lotus engines, which I believe were used in a number of vehicles before the Dolomite, and in relatively high numbers (several thousand at least).

[Guest aatbloke]

If the various Bentleys, Dusenberg's Bugattis etc. are too low-volume for you, then there are still the 16V Lotus engines, which I believe were used in a number of vehicles before the Dolomite, and in relatively high numbers (several thousand at least).

As I said, the Dolomite Sprint is widely accredited as being the first mass-produced car to use a multivalve 16v engine. Almost half a million Dolomites rolled off the old production line at Canley.

Edited April 11, 2008 by aatbloke

[Camino LS6]

I'm for it only if they bring back the Sprite:

That car is so cute it's ridiculous.

To be honest, I never liked the Sprite. The Healeys I used to maintain were 100-4s.

[RedVee]

As I said, the Dolomite Sprint is widely accredited as being the first mass-produced car to use a multivalve 16v engine. Almost half a million Dolomites rolled off the old production line at Canley.

But not "almost hald a million" Sprints, I'd wager.

From the dim, dark recesses of my memory......

I believe the correct honour for the Dolmite Sprint engine is that is/was the first 16v 4 cylinder without DOHC. I'd guess the Dolly Sprint was sohc (could it have been ohv? dont think so, but?).

There was some special valve gear to operate the 4 of them. For some reason the term 'finger gear' comes to mind.

Alfas and Fiat etc had DOHC with 2valve/cyl at the time, and Triumph had the opposite. I think Alfa went to Twin Spark before going to 16v on their venerable dohc.

Gee guys this is all memory stuff, but I think I'm around the facts if not right on them.

BTW I'd love to see Triumph come back. Could be a great niche brand if they are at least fairly affordable. Could be a product line like Pontiac and Saturn could offer with the will power to do it. Kappas, Alphas with some DeltaII's and a dash of Zeta. All with good looks and driveability. Brum brum brum instead of Zoom zoom zoom?

[Guest aatbloke]

But not "almost hald a million" Sprints, I'd wager.

From the dim, dark recesses of my memory......

I believe the correct honour for the Dolmite Sprint engine is that is/was the first 16v 4 cylinder without DOHC. I'd guess the Dolly Sprint was sohc (could it have been ohv? dont think so, but?).

There was some special valve gear to operate the 4 of them. For some reason the term 'finger gear' comes to mind.

Alfas and Fiat etc had DOHC with 2valve/cyl at the time, and Triumph had the opposite. I think Alfa went to Twin Spark before going to 16v on their venerable dohc.

Gee guys this is all memory stuff, but I think I'm around the facts if not right on them.

BTW I'd love to see Triumph come back. Could be a great niche brand if they are at least fairly affordable. Could be a product line like Pontiac and Saturn could offer with the will power to do it. Kappas, Alphas with some DeltaII's and a dash of Zeta. All with good looks and driveability. Brum brum brum instead of Zoom zoom zoom?

No, not all were Sprints, but it was the first application of a multivalve 16v unit in a mass-produced car; the Dolomite as a model range was mass-produced to the tune of almost half a million. You're correct, the Sprint's engine was a single overhead camshaft arrangement, and differentiated it from twin-cam Ford and Vauxhall rivals of the day.

[Argen]

LOL the Princess wasn't really a bad car, in fact it was pretty sturdy in its day against the competition of the time and very spacious and futuristic looking; the same guy who designed it also penned the Allegro, Marina and the TR7. The six cylinder models were nice and torquey, but as comfortable as the hydragas suspension made them, the system wasn't well engineered.

The entire Dolomite range (with the exception of the meagre 1300cc base model) was basically Britain's BMW 3-series, and the Sprint was the world's first four-valves per cylinder production car. This was a massive opportunity wasted by BL, who could have developed Triumph into a fine executive marque. The same engines in the lower models were used in the Spitfire. For my money the Dolomite was the best car which BL ever produced.

I also find it strange that, despite the Princess being futuristic, BL decided to give it a normal boot instead of a hatcback.

I'm not sure I'm totally comfortable with BMW reviving Triumph. I do love Triumphs and I'd appreciate seeing another company with that sort of sporting enthusiasm, but I'm not exactly a fan of BMW. BMW has this typical German luxury snottiness about it and frequently has very little regard for its customers' happiness. I will admit that I am fond of older BMWs, but it's much for the same reason that I like old Triumphs. They both used to be rugged, lively little cars that were engineered well and you could be proud to own. Good engineering used to mean perfectly tuned suspensions and finely machined parts. Unfortunately, now BMW thinks that good engineering is about putting twenty computers in every car which think they know how to drive better than you do. Then there's the old complaint about the change in nationality. To be fair, very few cars are purely from one country or another nowdays, but there's something just wrong about a company like MG spouting off about British tradition when it is now almost totally Chinese.

Now, nobody think that I'm against German cars. After all, I own an old A4 and like it very much. But I use it as a daily driver and not as a weekend plaything which is what any modern Triumph should be.

[Guest aatbloke]

I also find it strange that, despite the Princess being futuristic, BL decided to give it a normal boot instead of a hatcback.

I'm not sure I'm totally comfortable with BMW reviving Triumph. I do love Triumphs and I'd appreciate seeing another company with that sort of sporting enthusiasm, but I'm not exactly a fan of BMW. BMW has this typical German luxury snottiness about it and frequently has very little regard for its customers' happiness. I will admit that I am fond of older BMWs, but it's much for the same reason that I like old Triumphs. They both used to be rugged, lively little cars that were engineered well and you could be proud to own. Good engineering used to mean perfectly tuned suspensions and finely machined parts. Unfortunately, now BMW thinks that good engineering is about putting twenty computers in every car which think they know how to drive better than you do. Then there's the old complaint about the change in nationality. To be fair, very few cars are purely from one country or another nowdays, but there's something just wrong about a company like MG spouting off about British tradition when it is now almost totally Chinese.

Now, nobody think that I'm against German cars. After all, I own an old A4 and like it very much. But I use it as a daily driver and not as a weekend plaything which is what any modern Triumph should be.

The Princess was given a boot because at the time it was designed, regular 3-box saloons were the preferred set-up in the segment; by 1982, when the car was re-hashed as the Ambassador, it was given a hatchback in keeping with the growing trend. Ford's Sierra was also launched that same year, and the Vauxhall Cavalier (J-car) received a hatchback option in the previous year.

[SimonDavid]

But not "almost hald a million" Sprints, I'd wager.

From the dim, dark recesses of my memory......

I believe the correct honour for the Dolmite Sprint engine is that is/was the first 16v 4 cylinder without DOHC. I'd guess the Dolly Sprint was sohc (could it have been ohv? dont think so, but?).

There was some special valve gear to operate the 4 of them. For some reason the term 'finger gear' comes to mind.

Alfas and Fiat etc had DOHC with 2valve/cyl at the time, and Triumph had the opposite. I think Alfa went to Twin Spark before going to 16v on their venerable dohc.

Gee guys this is all memory stuff, but I think I'm around the facts if not right on them.

BTW I'd love to see Triumph come back. Could be a great niche brand if they are at least fairly affordable. Could be a product line like Pontiac and Saturn could offer with the will power to do it. Kappas, Alphas with some DeltaII's and a dash of Zeta. All with good looks and driveability. Brum brum brum instead of Zoom zoom zoom?

The first Lotus Cortina was 1964 wasn't it? 16 valves 4 cylinder

Personally Id love to see Triumph come back but not sure what's in it for BMW - how would it stretch their range? Who would buy a TR who wouldnt buy a "Z2"?

[TKR]

The first Lotus Cortina was 1964 wasn't it? 16 valves 4 cylinder

Personally Id love to see Triumph come back but not sure what's in it for BMW - how would it stretch their range? Who would buy a TR who wouldnt buy a "Z2"?

The original Lotus DOHC engine (as fitted in the Cortina and Escort) was only 2 valve per cyl. The 4 valve DOHC BDA was not fitted until 1969 or 70 if I recall.

Triumph really was the gem in the BL group. We had a S1 2000 (manual) when I was learning to drive and it was (in it's day - late 60's) a comfortable, easy to drive, smooth touring sedan. Nice memories.

[Duncan]

Is it wrong that this name now makes me think of boobies?

I'm thinking that's not gonna hurt anyone's impression of the brand.