The end of the "black-tie era" is near

[Northstar]

Some info I have received seems to indicate this, at least in the Lambdas. Expect the Chevy Lambda to launch without a black tie radio, and expect all '09 MY Lambdas to not have black-ties. I would still expect the '09 Malibu to have it most likely, but the phase out is certainly starting. So, for new '09 MY and up vehicles, expect none to have black tie radios.

----------------

Click here to see what the future holds for GM's post-blacktie era radios. Integration, here we come!

-Flybrian

[gm4life]

What is a black tie radio. Sorry to sound like an idot. (I can be good at that tho!)

[scharmer05]

What is a black tie radio. Sorry to sound like an idot. (I can be good at that tho!)

The GM black tie radio is the radio that is in basically every new GM product out right now.

[Newbiewar]

What is a black tie radio. Sorry to sound like an idot. (I can be good at that tho!)

GM has blacktie radios from everything to cobalt to the Escalade

with execptions being the utility vans, i think the uplanders, and equinox(maybe refresh might have given new radios)

[silverss/sc]

At least the black tie radios looked good . I love the one in my cobalt ss .

Hopefully the new stuff really truely is more integrated and unique looking .

[rueben44]

Problem is GM needs a radio for each brand. At least change the outside cover a bit like Mazda did and does but no from Buick to Saab to Chevy they all look the same. Sad!

[Newbiewar]

At least the black tie radios looked good . I love the one in my cobalt ss .

Hopefully the new stuff really truely is more integrated and unique looking .

the current ones were pretty good... always easy for customers to use... featured 6sets of 6 presets, for a total of 36 saved radio stations, mix-match AM FM XM radio, often times, matted with a 6 cd changer in dash, very user friendly, with large centered crome accented volume control, and without marking most users automatically found the manual adjust for the antenna frequency. Most people really appreciated them, as well as being very well lit up... but i think the new Buick lacross features a different radio design and maybe this is a preview of what we will see in future GM vehicles

[Newbiewar]

Problem is GM needs a radio for each brand. At least change the outside cover a bit like Mazda did and does but no from Buick to Saab to Chevy they all look the same. Sad!

even the escalade looked the same as the cobalt...

[gm4life]

Oh I love that radio setup. The DTS doesn't have one!

[Robert Hall]

What is the big knob in the middle? volume? The most recent GM rentals I drove had older style radios..('05 Grand Prix, '04 Impala, '05 Monte Carlo).

[VenSeattle]

LaCrosse never had the Black Tie and never will

[Drew Dowdell]

I never understood what was so offensive about them....

[Robert Hall]

I never understood what was so offensive about them....

They look fine to me, lots of functionality and features.. other mfgrs have also had a common head unit shared amongst many models..Chrysler did it also--everything from the Intrepid to the Viper used the unit that's in my Grand Cherokee...

Though a premium brand like Cadillac should at least have bespoke knobs and trim on the head unit..

[daves87rs]

I kinda liked the "black Ties".....THough As long as it is a good radio.....

[PurdueGuy]

The "black tie" radios are a great design, it seems there are only 2 problems with them, and neither has to do with the radio itself exactly:

-it's not integrated, you can see a rectangle around it

-it's in everything

At least they didn't design a crappy radio & put it in everything. lol

[Intrepidation]

What is the big knob in the middle? volume? The most recent GM rentals I drove had older style radios..('05 Grand Prix, '04 Impala, '05 Monte Carlo).

It is the volume...pressing it will turn the radio on or off.

The black ties are very easy to use but their time has come...I'm tired of seeing them from everything from an Aveo to a 9-3...I look forward to integration.

The best use of the black tie radio that made it look integrated is the Saturn Sky

[Clownzilla]

I like the black ties but they need to have variety to them, or at least make them look like they go with the vehicle. My SAAB 9-5 possibly has the worst black tie integration I have ever seen!

[pow]

Black-ties vary in their quality and integration. The buttons on the 9-5's seem better damped and higher grade than, say, the Cobalt's. And the SKY and the Acadia (those with climate control) integrate them pretty damn well.

Without climate control:

Edited October 3, 2007 by empowah

[Dsuupr]

I like the idea of an "old" fashion radio. It makes it easier to replace later. Though I do agree the integrated one in the CTS looks MUCH better, I prefer the option of replacement when the car gets older.

[Robert Hall]

It is the volume...pressing it will turn the radio on or off.

In that photo, it looks like the volume is the knob at the top right (looks like a volume symbol on it). I'm talking about the big button in the center...a tuning knob?

[prototype66]

I like the radio but I do not like the flat finish . It looks cheapo.

[K-1]

In that photo, it looks like the volume is the knob at the top right (looks like a volume symbol on it). I'm talking about the big button in the center...a tuning knob?

Big button is Volume, On/Off. The button with the musical note is the tuner.

[aaaantoine]

It's a good looking head unit, but since integrated is the wave of the future , GM better adopt it so the critics have one less thing to pick at.

[Cadavillac]

Why is/was it called the "black tie?" Something I've always wondered about...

[Robert Hall]

Why is/was it called the "black tie?" Something I've always wondered about...

Maybe because some versions of it have a shiny black ('piano black') finish?

[shesellschevys]

Why is/was it called the "black tie?" Something I've always wondered about...

I think they introduced "black tie" when they added the MP3 auxillary input jack - just to give the radio an "upgraded" or sophisticated name.

I have the black tie in my Avalanche and love it. These radios integrate very well into the dashboards of all of the vehicles, so hopefully they're just losing the name 'black tie' but they're still keeping the great functionality.

The DAT products don't have the black tie radios (Aveo & Optra) - just the Cobalts and 'up'.

~ janette

[aaaantoine]

Why is/was it called the "black tie?" Something I've always wondered about...

It was named as such because it's designed to look good in any interior, just like a black tie looks good in any environment. It was purposely designed to span all models until they could develop the coming integrated designs. This, apparently, was the plan all along.

Edited October 3, 2007 by aaaantoine

[Intrepidation]

It's a good looking head unit, but since integrated is the wave of the future , GM better adopt it so the critics have one less thing to pick at.

Full integration allows for more unique designs as opposed to center stacks that all look the same (Malibu, Aura). Like them or not, at least the Camry and Accord have unique interiors compared to other cars in their respective brands.

Why is/was it called the "black tie?" Something I've always wondered about...

Mainly because the center power/volume knob and the buttons on either side of it somewhat resemble the shape of a tie.

I think they introduced "black tie" when they added the MP3 auxillary input jack - just to give the radio an "upgraded" or sophisticated name.

I have the black tie in my Avalanche and love it. These radios integrate very well into the dashboards of all of the vehicles, so hopefully they're just losing the name 'black tie' but they're still keeping the great functionality.

The DAT products don't have the black tie radios (Aveo & Optra) - just the Cobalts and 'up'.

~ janette

They do not integrated well into all vehicles...some are pretty good while some are horrible.

I beg to differ about the DAT products.

[aaaantoine]

I like the idea of an "old" fashion radio. It makes it easier to replace later. Though I do agree the integrated one in the CTS looks MUCH better, I prefer the option of replacement when the car gets older.

Now that I think about it, the only reason you would replace the head unit is if

A: It breaks, or

B: A new format becomes the mainstream and you're stuck with the old CD/AUX combo.

In regards to A: If the broken parts can be replaced without ruining the dashboard, fine. Else, it's another reason to pay a mechanic.

In regards to B: As soon as the integrated systems start to include a fully-functional add-on port that is NOT strictly for iPods, I will fully accept them.

Otherwise, I agree with Dsuupr.

[cfch3399]

Let's not forget that these radios were a massive improvement over the previous ones. And I do find them to be attractive, with great feel, but functionally dependent on the version.

The one on a LaCrosse worked better than the one in an Ion.

Problem that GM misapplied them. The G6 should have gotten one instead of the ugly radios they put on there, while Deltas should have gotten something different. How is it that you get the same looking radio in a 15K car and a 30k car?

[regfootball]

the layout of the blacktie is ok, but it looks mega cheap. cheap glossy plastic and a cheap display.

[momolos]

I bet that even the intergrates radios will all look the same in every car that GM will be selling.

Nothing unique to every car.

[ToniCipriani]

Just keep it to Chevy and the Daewoos. Anything north of Chevy should have their own.

But anything is better than the red colour Malibu radio I have.

[scharmer05]

Now that I think about it, the only reason you would replace the head unit is if

A: It breaks, or

B: A new format becomes the mainstream and you're stuck with the old CD/AUX combo.

In regards to A: If the broken parts can be replaced without ruining the dashboard, fine. Else, it's another reason to pay a mechanic.

In regards to B: As soon as the integrated systems start to include a fully-functional add-on port that is NOT strictly for iPods, I will fully accept them.

Otherwise, I agree with Dsuupr.

Don't forget that as these cars become more and more integrated, it is going to cost more time and more money to change anything about the audio system. Some people aren't happy with crappy paper Delco speakers. Bose? Give me a break. It sounds decent, but not anywhere near where I or many others would like it to be. You wouldn't believe all the trouble I had to go through to upgrade my Impala's audio system. Even with buying special, expensive wiring harnesses, I still lost my door chime. My Suburban was such a pain that I ended up just adding a iPod adapter and not messing with the rest.

I wouldn't mind integration if they would put in a couple of pre-outs for a subwoofer and a 4 channel amp, and put in a decent equalizer. Do you know how much better any audio system can sound with simply a 5 or 7 band equalizer in it rather than a 2 or 3 channel? Hell, the early 90's Chevy pickups have a 5 band in them. Late 90s Pontiacs had a 7 band in some vehicles. Why shouldn't every vehicle have something like that in it. Adding just a couple of these little things to these new integrated radios would make a lot of Music lover's day.

[CARBIZ]

....and some of us have been there, done that: spent $2k (back when $2k was a lot of money) having Alpine speakers, a cross-over, amps and bazookas put in my car, only to have someone spend the night in the back of it, ripping everything out of it.

No, thanks. Give me a solid factory unit any day. Even the Cobalt LT's base stereo is decent, and for $300 the Pioneer upgrade is pretty damned good. Not likely to attract the curiousity of crack addicts or jealous kids.

The integrated units give a lot of easy upgrades, like speed compensated volume, XM and steering wheel controls, all at a decent price. Works well for the majority of people who lease said vehicles, too.

Warranty troubles? No. Dash fires? No. Sudden electrical gremlins? No.

Maybe I was more patient when I was 26 than I am at 46.

[Sixty8panther]

I never understood what was so offensive about them....

Some people on this forum get their panties all in a bunch over stupid things

like the texture of the dashboard grain, gaps in the airbag & center console

and even radios & a few HVAC buttons. I personally would buy a car with or

without a radio if it was the right product...

[Cory Wolfe]

Some people on this forum get their panties all in a bunch over stupid things

like the texture of the dashboard grain, gaps in the airbag & center console

and even radios & a few HVAC buttons. I personally would buy a car with or

without a radio if it was the right product...

Speaks the one that refuses to buy the Camaro solely because of the existance of a B-pillar. Yeah, we're the ones that get our "panties all in a bunch over stupid things". Get a life, Sixty8.

Anyways, I'm glad. The black-tie radios were good looking units but a square can only work with so many interior designs. Integrated radios always look better. The only thing against it is the difficulty with replacing. However, with todays stereos, who really needs to replace them? Stock systems today are generally fine.

[sciguy_0504]

LaCrosse never had the Black Tie and never will

It looks better, IMO, without black tie. The thinking behind black tie was good but the execution was horrible. The Cobalt should not have the same controls as the Escalade. Period. No excuses. Now, GM could design a head unit/HVAC controls with the same basic design but change things for each brand (ie Lambdas). It saves money and raises the perception of quality for each brand.

[G. David Felt]

Over all the Black Ties were nice units for the most part, but as you do go upstream, you should get a better unit and one that is better integrated into the over all interior layout.

Personally I think BOSE is over rated, but still is a big step up from basic delco speakers. I hope GM does realize that in higher end auto's people expect everything to be higher end including GM needs to put in HD Stereo heads as standard in Caddy!

[Sixty8panther]

BV:

Converting a sedan to a hardtop is a little more tricky than upgrading a stereo.....well it used to be anyway.,

[Sixty8panther]

BV:

Converting a sedan to a hardtop is a little more tricky than upgrading a stereo.....well it used to be anyway.,

[Cory Wolfe]

BV:

Converting a sedan to a hardtop is a little more tricky than upgrading a stereo.....well it used to be anyway.,

But think of this way. How many people here who want to purchase a Camaro are going to suddenly change their minds because of the radio it has or the interior plastics? I bet no one.

[prototype66]

but if there is no rear passenger center arm rest or 12 cupholders that cradle your big gulp in comfort then 4 GET IT !

[silverss/sc]

No, thanks. Give me a solid factory unit any day. Even the Cobalt LT's base stereo is decent, and for $300 the Pioneer upgrade is pretty damned good. Not likely to attract the curiousity of crack addicts or jealous kids.

Alpines own Sema show car , which was a Pontiac G5 used the stock black tie head unit . They said it was one of the best factory units they had seen and saw no reason to change it . Unless u really dispise its looks , the black tie radios will support a pretty healthy car full of aftermarket speakers . GM has an adapter now that will even let you control your Ipod thru the factory radio controls and steering wheel controls and display ipod info on the factory radio screen . Theres really no need for me to ever replace the factory HU in my Cobalt , which is pretty cool imo .

[ocnblu]

I find the Black Tie radios to be excellent, I really like the one in my truck, and with the redundant controls on the steering wheel, I don't need anything else. My radio has a matte black finish, not shiny. I am not sure I've seen a Black Tie radio with a shiny finish. It's just a radio, people, and a damned good one at that. WHO CARES?

[loki]

Don't forget that as these cars become more and more integrated, it is going to cost more time and more money to change anything about the audio system. Some people aren't happy with crappy paper Delco speakers. Bose? Give me a break. It sounds decent, but not anywhere near where I or many others would like it to be. You wouldn't believe all the trouble I had to go through to upgrade my Impala's audio system. Even with buying special, expensive wiring harnesses, I still lost my door chime. My Suburban was such a pain that I ended up just adding a iPod adapter and not messing with the rest.

I wouldn't mind integration if they would put in a couple of pre-outs for a subwoofer and a 4 channel amp, and put in a decent equalizer. Do you know how much better any audio system can sound with simply a 5 or 7 band equalizer in it rather than a 2 or 3 channel? Hell, the early 90's Chevy pickups have a 5 band in them. Late 90s Pontiacs had a 7 band in some vehicles. Why shouldn't every vehicle have something like that in it. Adding just a couple of these little things to these new integrated radios would make a lot of Music lover's day.

considering 90% of people don't mess with the stereo, or know how to properly use an EQ, that's why it's been re-dumbed down to a bass and treble.

people that want better than ok sound always go after market some how. didn't the recent civics have radio deletes? with all the stuff GM integrates into the stereo, they should go back and be able to make a hideaway unit that takes care of that and a small interface for the dash, leaving enough room for at least a 1-din sized radio.

it's the whole specialization / jack of all trades. OEM stuff is getting better, no doubt... but still can't match a moderately priced unit from a name brand.

gm should have a special focus group for audio integration, made up of at least a few well known people in the industry/competetions.

i remember seeing/reading something about the mach systems ford used and gm answered back with monsoon. like that, but better.

[OshKoshBerJosh]

Just to set the record straight. The Escalade does not have the black tie radio. It uses the radio controls from the STS. Additionally, the DTS and SRX share common radio controls, but share them with no other vehicle. The XLR is stuck with an older version of the nav radio right now. No Cadillac currently sold in the US uses the black tie radio.

I think the BLS, not sold in the US. does. But that's it.

[Robert Hall]

I've put aftermarket CD player head units and upgraded the speakers in older cars that had AM/FM cassette units originally ('87 Mustang, '88 Bronco) but with newer vehicles, I go for the best available factory system and stick with it..I don't like the unintegrated look of aftermarket units, and I like the factory features like steering wheel controls, etc that I would lose if I put in an aftermarket unit. I'm not as picky about car audio as I am about home audio, I guess.

[scharmer05]

I've put aftermarket CD player head units and upgraded the speakers in older cars that had AM/FM cassette units originally ('87 Mustang, '88 Bronco) but with newer vehicles, I go for the best available factory system and stick with it..I don't like the unintegrated look of aftermarket units, and I like the factory features like steering wheel controls, etc that I would lose if I put in an aftermarket unit. I'm not as picky about car audio as I am about home audio, I guess.

Except that you don't have to lose your steering wheel controls. Just another harness. Most aftermarket radios come with a remote as well.