Who's Side Are You On? UAW Strike 07.

[giantshark18]

I personally blame the UAW 100%. Why is it they feel they are owed special wages and benefits compared to the rest of the American workforce?

[Camino LS6]

Well the jackasses have gone and done it now!

[Drew Dowdell]

If I had more time/money, I'd head up to whichever plant has the most media spotlight and stage an anti-Union protest.

[Camino LS6]

I think that maybe the domestics have had enough and are prepared to weather a strike to squash the union this time. The UAW had better just be making a show for its members with a short strike, because this time they will be the ones hurt by striking. I have a feeling the the discussions between GM, Ford, and Chrysler were not the usual pre-contract negotiation consultation. I think they have decided to draw a line in the sand.

[Dragon]

If I had more time/money, I'd head up to whichever plant has the most media spotlight and stage an anti-Union protest.

just make sure you spend some of that money on your own security. people's on the line's can become f@#king assholes. even when they are your "friends" the rest of the contract

[Dragon]

With the huge financial changes/realizations that have gone on over the last few years, I think/hope GM will hold fast this time. They know that they can't keep on going for much longer by bending to the UAW's demands. If the did, 15-20 years from now (thats being generous) there might not be a GM. It might hurt now to have a prolonged strike, but they will probably be a able to recover long term.

[Chris_Doane]

If I had more time/money, I'd head up to whichever plant has the most media spotlight and stage an anti-Union protest.

Mmm...you'd be killed to death though.

[CaddyXLR-V]

Mmm...you'd be killed to death though.

A suicide protester?

Who wants to volunteer to be sacraficed to bring more negative publicity to the UAW?

[Z-06]

If I had more time/money, I'd head up to whichever plant has the most media spotlight and stage an anti-Union protest.

Mr. Drew, forget your CTS-D if you do that.

[Robert Hall]

Mmm...you'd be killed to death though.

Yeah, those union barbarians would probably turn violent..

[wjfox]

I can't vote in this survey because of the way the choices are worded. I don't know that any one is to blame or 100% right. I tend to favor GMs position because I think there are very few other kinds of workers that can get 100% health care and I don't think its right to expect that when it isn't the norm for workers in our country, or in competitive, foreign based auto companies that assemble cars in the US.

I also acknowledge that its the Union's job to get the most it can for its workers. I'm hoping that the union / workers can take a longer term view and try to ensure job security for future generations. Because its much cheaper to produce goods else where and have them shipped to the US. I don't think the union will kill GM, not if GM is smart, and there are more and more signs (finally) of that being the case. But GM can and will assemble car elsewhere if their cost of production is too high here. Chinese Buick's anyone?

[bowtie_dude]

GMs survival depends on its ability to be flexible, an attribute that the UAW has no abundance of. Hopefully GM doesn't bend to the UAW strong-arming and mob tactics. The UAW leadership doesn't get it and the membership is too stupid to get it even when they're told. They just line up like lemmings following the leader off the cliff.

Gettlefinger: "They pushed us off the cliff."

No, you pushed yourselves off the cliff. Welcome to the rest of the American workforce, ladies and gentleman. Where you have to be SKILLED to earn a decent wage.

[Drew Dowdell]

No, you pushed yourselves off the cliff. Welcome to the rest of the American workforce, ladies and gentleman. Where you have to be SKILLED to earn a decent wage.

QFT!!

[Shantanu]

There's been a lot of shared sacrifice at GM. Tens of thousands of engineers, marketers, and finance guys have lost their jobs. Everyone else has seen major pay cuts, including the executives at the highest levels. The factory workers haven't budged an inch. Last year, those that left were paid to do so voluntarily. It's absurd of the UAW to come into this making demands for MORE MORE MORE, given how much GM has lost over the past few years. I think GM should just close the door on them permanently, and start training new temps.

[bowtie_dude]

There's been a lot of shared sacrifice at GM. Tens of thousands of engineers, marketers, and finance guys have lost their jobs. Everyone else has seen major pay cuts, including the executives at the highest levels. The factory workers haven't budged an inch. Last year, those that left were paid to do so voluntarily. It's absurd of the UAW to come into this making demands for MORE MORE MORE, given how much GM has lost over the past few years. I think GM should just close the door on them permanently, and start training new temps.

I agree whole heartedly.

What makes these people think they have the right to have it so good? My wife works 10X harder than they and I do (but she also makes more than I do at the moment), yet they somehow deserve better pay, benefits, retirement and guaranteed work in the future? Sorry folks, thats not how this world works anymore.

If you have a problem with the executives getting bonuses and their pay, lets see you run a company like GM, make it profitable DESPITE all it has going against it and keep it afloat. Executives can make or break a company, the rank and file cannot.

[Northstar]

I agree with Shantanu, and thinking about it, if GM started temps with the hot products (CTS, Enclave, Acadia, etc.) it wouldn't lose that much because they have plenty of the other vehicles on the lots. If they started the new workers on the hottest products, and then moved on to the next most in-demand products and so on, there wouldn't be a whole lot lost, I don't think.

Only problem would be that the truckers have decided not to ship GM cars, either, so GM couldn't simply keep producing vehicles in Canada and Mexico and keep themselves afloat that way, too.

[PurdueGuy]

I support GM, and I support the workers. I do not support the UAW. I'm ready to see the day when manufacturing pay & benefits are determined by economics, not lobby groups. The workers don't deserved to be taken advantage of, but if the unions dissolved, things would balance out after a short period of chaos. Workers can walk from unfair jobs.

[A Horse With No Name]

There's been a lot of shared sacrifice at GM. Tens of thousands of engineers, marketers, and finance guys have lost their jobs. Everyone else has seen major pay cuts, including the executives at the highest levels. The factory workers haven't budged an inch. Last year, those that left were paid to do so voluntarily. It's absurd of the UAW to come into this making demands for MORE MORE MORE, given how much GM has lost over the past few years. I think GM should just close the door on them permanently, and start training new temps.

Again, quoted for truth but in reality gm is not going to get rid of the UAW. Not gonna happen.

Chris

[Northstar]

I support GM, and I support the workers. I do not support the UAW. I'm ready to see the day when manufacturing pay & benefits are determined by economics, not lobby groups. The workers don't deserved to be taken advantage of, but if the unions dissolved, things would balance out after a short period of chaos. Workers can walk from unfair jobs.

Exactly. No one would force them to stay at the job. I would bet at least half of them are willing to keep their jobs for a reasonable pay cut because it would still be the highest paying job they could get. Making $25-35 an hour to hand thing to a machine is ridiculous (I realize they do some more important stuff, but still, it is quite easy). What about people such as teachers that go to school for 4 years or more so they can teach these people's children so that their children can get decent jobs? The teachers could just as easily take a union job and make more money than they would be making through teaching, yet they go to school (paying big bucks) so that everyone else can benefit from it.

What I am trying to say is that by giving these people such high wages for what they do and such great benefits, it's setting a terrible example. Sure, we do need people like this, because otherwise we wouldn't have cars being made, but making $70k/year + having great benefits does not set a very good example for high school kids to go to college to become something that makes that same amount in the end. These workers should be making a good chunk of change so that they can support their family, but what did they do to deserve to have the best benefits of almost anyone and make quite a good paycheck? Fail out of school and become a scab?

I'm sorry if I offended anyone, but that's how I feel about assembly line workers making such good wages.

[gm4life]

Hire them back no Union. They keep asking for stuff GM can't give them. What idots. The tail has been wagging the dog way to long!

[4gm]

I've been laid off 3 times in my relatively short working life. I have no sympathy for these people. Especially knowing they're about to get some ridiculous signing bonus. There are so many people who would love to have their jobs with their wages.

[Drew Dowdell]

Why can't GM bus in outside help to keep a line or two running?

[regfootball]

i think gm figured out its about the customer.

the uaw never has. for that reason, its time to do whatever it takes to bust the union and send them packing for good.

america as a whole has so much venom for people who cannot play as a team. 95% of Americans are getting the shaft and have no tolerance for those who think they deserve more than what the rest of us are getting.

i actually am ok with GM shutting down for several months to bust the union if they can afford to.

GM should actually sue the UAW for disruption of the business and also because union labor creates slander within the eyes of the public, harming sales. GM would have a more positive image if they could shed the union.

[LS7]

It's ironic how several of the posters have come down hard on the UAW workers and their high wages but not management. It seems to be the American way of accepting such wealth with celebrety's, CEO''s etc. compared to their counterparts in other parts of the world. Are the people running GM, Ford and Chrysler auto enthusiast. Some are, but the majority come from business backgrounds that are years apart from anything automotive, yet they will get such inflated wages and bonus's.

When you see the poles, the former Big 3 are not making junks anymore. Sure there still will be some problems, but is it the workers fault if they are manufacturing a vehicle that the public does not want to buy? If the Big 3 still had their market share they had twenty five years ago, would any one be bastardizing the UAW workers.

It does not matter where we are employed, there is always deadwood. I know there is a lot of union people who we can classify as deadwood, but you will find it in non union workshops as well.

I think were the big unions have screwed up, was twenty years ago when they started to go overboard with human rights issues where as they should of been concentrating on the hiring agencies that supply the Temp workers to the work force. In the past the norm was always 90 days and you are full time employed. Today a lot of the temp workers are working over a year at a wage slightly above minimum if they are lucky and still not get hired on full time. This is where a lot of the new Japanese companies manufacturing in North America get their advantage. The former Big 3 still are getting a lot of their parts from the long established manufactures over here, where as the Japanese set up shop and bring along Asian companies who then hire through a Temp agency.

[PurdueGuy]

It's ironic how several of the posters have come down hard on the UAW workers and their high wages but not management. It seems to be the American way of accepting such wealth with celebrety's, CEO''s etc. compared to their counterparts in other parts of the world. Are the people running GM, Ford and Chrysler auto enthusiast. Some are, but the majority come from business backgrounds that are years apart from anything automotive, yet they will get such inflated wages and bonus's.

When you see the poles, the former Big 3 are not making junks anymore. Sure there still will be some problems, but is it the workers fault if they are manufacturing a vehicle that the public does not want to buy? If the Big 3 still had their market share they had twenty five years ago, would any one be bastardizing the UAW workers.

It does not matter where we are employed, there is always deadwood. I know there is a lot of union people who we can classify as deadwood, but you will find it in non union workshops as well.

I think were the big unions have screwed up, was twenty years ago when they started to go overboard with human rights issues where as they should of been concentrating on the hiring agencies that supply the Temp workers to the work force. In the past the norm was always 90 days and you are full time employed. Today a lot of the temp workers are working over a year at a wage slightly above minimum if they are lucky and still not get hired on full time. This is where a lot of the new Japanese companies manufacturing in North America get their advantage. The former Big 3 still are getting a lot of their parts from the long established manufactures over here, where as the Japanese set up shop and bring along Asian companies who then hire through a Temp agency.

Management probably does need its own "shake-out" and slim-down in areas.

I worked as a temp employee in a non-union major manufacturing plant for a year, and did not get hired (though they did call me about a month after I left). I did level 3 work at level 2 pay with no benefits, as did a number of people around me. Here's the thing: when people got frustrated & left their temp jobs, it had nothing to do with the money or job - it was still WAY better than any other job at the same skill level in the area. The reason most of them left was because they felt frustrated by the discrepancy between themselves and the "full time" workers. Why do these manufacturing companies hire temps for such long periods of time? BECAUSE OF THE UNIONS! To keep the unions at bay, they have to create the illusion of job security. They do that by avoiding layoffs of "full-time" employees. The reality of it is the temp employees were simply the lowest level of production employment, and thus were the first to be affected by layoffs. By the lowest level of employees consisting of "temp" employees, they didn't officially have layoffs, and those in "full time" employment felt more secure in their jobs. In fact, they were/are only as secure in their jobs as someone who has worked their way up from the bottom rung of employees. I watched as the good "temp" employees got hired one by one as the openings came. The only reason I didn't get a job offer sooner was because I was a lazy bum & didn't apply for a long time, until after the few/rare hiring waves went through. Good employees moved up, not so good ones didn't.

The unions have created their own problem in the manufacturing industry's dependence upon "temp agencies." If the factories could employ people as needed without fear of union, they would hire more people "for real."

Edited September 25, 2007 by PurdueGuy

[CaddyXLR-V]

It's ironic how several of the posters have come down hard on the UAW workers and their high wages but not management. It seems to be the American way of accepting such wealth with celebrety's, CEO''s etc. compared to their counterparts in other parts of the world. Are the people running GM, Ford and Chrysler auto enthusiast. Some are, but the majority come from business backgrounds that are years apart from anything automotive, yet they will get such inflated wages and bonus's.

When you see the poles, the former Big 3 are not making junks anymore. Sure there still will be some problems, but is it the workers fault if they are manufacturing a vehicle that the public does not want to buy? If the Big 3 still had their market share they had twenty five years ago, would any one be bastardizing the UAW workers.

It does not matter where we are employed, there is always deadwood. I know there is a lot of union people who we can classify as deadwood, but you will find it in non union workshops as well.

I think were the big unions have screwed up, was twenty years ago when they started to go overboard with human rights issues where as they should of been concentrating on the hiring agencies that supply the Temp workers to the work force. In the past the norm was always 90 days and you are full time employed. Today a lot of the temp workers are working over a year at a wage slightly above minimum if they are lucky and still not get hired on full time. This is where a lot of the new Japanese companies manufacturing in North America get their advantage. The former Big 3 still are getting a lot of their parts from the long established manufactures over here, where as the Japanese set up shop and bring along Asian companies who then hire through a Temp agency.

I didn't think this thread had anything to do with management. I thought the title said "Who's Side Are You On? UAW Strike 07" That's like saying the guy you work with is lazy and doesn't do much, so your going to be lazy and not do much either.

[makfu]

Hire them back no Union. They keep asking for stuff GM can't give them. What idots. The tail has been wagging the dog way to long!

For me this is pretty simple equation (that is driven by practical concerns). I have an order for an 08 CTS that has been delayed for a whole host of reasons (namely availability of the manual transmission and wood packages). This, for me, is the final straw. If the Union isn't back on the job by next Monday morning, I am cancelling my order and I will never return to GM or any UAW populated shop.

It's a damn shame too, because I was really looking forward to getting my new CTS, but I am not willing to put up with further delays and I am not willing to support Union on this issue. They were wrong to go on strike and they are wrong to believe they have a right to force GM to continue to pay wages and benefits that put them at an outrageous cost disadvantage especially if GM agreed to job guarantees, etc.

My patience with Detroit, both Union and GM, is nearing an end. I will be just one more fraction of a point of market share lost by GM. I hope both parties are pleased with their performance.

-Mak

08 FE3 CTS with 6 on the floor on order (soon to be a BMW if the UAW doesn't get back to work).

[Imaj]

I support neither, both sides are to blame

[makfu]

I support neither, both sides are to blame

The UAW didn't have to go with the nuclear option. Hopefully this is just a political ploy by Gettelfinger to help sell the membership.

That said, I don't think this will be over quickly. I think GM, along with all the analysts, was caught badly off-guard, believing that Gettelfinger understood just how precarious the situation really is. I believe GM went back to the table to try and keep talks going, but I don't think they will reach a settlement quickly just because the Union didn't declare an impasse.

I have generally been pretty neutral regarding the UAW and Unions, recognizing their value in protecting members from employer exploitation. That said, Unions in recent times have proven largely ineffective and, in more than a few cases, badly corrupt. Yes, years of GM mismanagement has played a part in this situation, but there is no escaping the fact that neither the UAW nor GM can survive more than a very short strike.

The UAW and its members would be foolish to think GM will blink, because just as the UAW is in no position to ask for anything, GM is in no position to grant anything. Econ 101, if a company cannot make money and it is more financially viable to terminate a company’s operations, then you close the doors and go home. With years of losses, only 19 billion in market capitalization and 200 billion in assets, how long before a raider / private equity firm walks in and parts the company out, once it collapses financially due to an extended strike? What will the Union do then?

I think we are witnessing the final violent death throes of the American auto industry and the end of any meaningful organized labor in North American manufacturing. Toyota, Honda, BMW, Mercedes, Hyundai and Nissan don't pay UAW wages and benefits and they certainly don't guarantee employment and product investment. GM, Ford and Chrysler are nearing the end of the road. If you want to get an idea of where that road ends, take a look at the history of the British domestic auto industry.

-Mak

08 FE3 CTS with 6 on the floor on order (soon to be a BMW if the UAW doesn't get back to work).

[Brougham-Holiday]

I support GM but there is no way I could expect these employees to want any contract that doesn't create job security. I think it would do GM great PR to open more plants here then over seas because for the short term loss of cash, they would have the long term gain of looking like an American hero. Look at how Toyota and such have turned the volume up on having plants here.

[Fletch Radford]

I agree whole heartedly.

What makes these people think they have the right to have it so good? My wife works 10X harder than they and I do (but she also makes more than I do at the moment), yet they somehow deserve better pay, benefits, retirement and guaranteed work in the future? Sorry folks, thats not how this world works anymore.

If you have a problem with the executives getting bonuses and their pay, lets see you run a company like GM, make it profitable DESPITE all it has going against it and keep it afloat. Executives can make or break a company, the rank and file cannot.

Out of curiosity what does your wife do? is she a nurse? And have you ever worked in a production facillity or a plant and I am not just talking on the line, what is your point of reference?

[Coffeeman]

I think GM should fire all UAW!!! ASAP

[Fletch Radford]

I agree with Shantanu, and thinking about it, if GM started temps with the hot products (CTS, Enclave, Acadia, etc.) it wouldn't lose that much because they have plenty of the other vehicles on the lots. If they started the new workers on the hottest products, and then moved on to the next most in-demand products and so on, there wouldn't be a whole lot lost, I don't think.

Only problem would be that the truckers have decided not to ship GM cars, either, so GM couldn't simply keep producing vehicles in Canada and Mexico and keep themselves afloat that way, too.

Guess what that is exactly what they are doing, because I work for Delphi and right now just about all my parts (for steering columns) are going to Mexico.

[Drew Dowdell]

Considering that GM is one of the largest companies in the world.... Wagoneer is one of the lowest paid CEOs by comparison.

[PurdueGuy]

I think GM should fire all UAW!!! ASAP

There are laws that protect unions from that sort of thing.

[Fletch Radford]

I think GM should fire all UAW!!! ASAP

Something needs to be clarified here, this strike is affecting other UAW workers here too, sure the GM workers are on strike and the Ford and Chrysler workers are watching closely, but alot of UAW workers who did settle their contracts (Delphi) without a strike (sure there were threats, but NO ACTUAL STRIKE) that are now being laid off because of this, so when you decide to slam the workers (which in itself is wrong unless you have actually done the work, hearsay does not count) please clarify that it is the GM workers that you wish to hurl your wrongful accusations to.

[Drew Dowdell]

but there are conspiracy laws also. The teamsters <who have no direct beef with GM in this matter> and the CAW <same as the teamster, but untouchable by the US government> should be brought up on conspiracy charges.

[Fletch Radford]

Considering that GM is one of the largest companies in the world.... Wagoneer is one of the lowest paid CEOs by comparison.

Until recently look at the product they have been offering the consumer, unless you are a die hard GM fan (like myself and others on this site) what has Rick had to offer and really how much of that credit goes to Bob.

[Cremazie]

Ok, am a part of a union, I am for the union ideal, That's about it. This GM v.s. UAW is b.s. GM is just holding it together and the UAW wants more.. unacceptable. The union is likely unfair to harder working workers, and doesn't entice someone to get any education.

Where I work it is very similar. After 4 years of schooling I am making the same as a guy that greases pumps. (basically adds oil to all our pumps daily). His training was a 1 day safety course on site. Is that fair? I think not, nor do I think that the UAW is fair to its own workers, and definitely not fair to GM (The hand that is feeding them). GM is feeding the union lobster while GM is eating canned beans. I mean come on!

[CaddyXLR-V]

Until recently look at the product they have been offering the consumer, unless you are a die hard GM fan (like myself and others on this site) what has Rick had to offer and really how much of that credit goes to Bob.

That's Bob's position. He was put their by Rick, because he is good at that position. It's not the CEO's job to do everything, it's his job to put the right people in the right places for them to do everything.

[Fletch Radford]

but there are conspiracy laws also. The teamsters <who have no direct beef with GM in this matter> and the CAW <same as the teamster, but untouchable by the US government> should be brought up on conspiracy charges.

For what? conspiring against the American worker, you might as well throw the Canadian government in there for offering free health care, since Canada has recieved alot of new buisness from GM lately (ex: the Camaro).

[Petra]

On the one hand, the UAW's insistence that it is entitled to job security, health care, and above-average wages is infuriating.

On the other hand, if GM had said "No" to the UAW's demands 25 years ago, they might not be in this predicament.

In the end, I'd say that both are to blame equally. Concession is simply not in the UAW's vocabulary, and anybody who was expecting them to take a hit for the team was only fooling themselves. And GM doesn't have the guts to call the Union's bluff. Nearly 40 years of caving, and you think they're going to change tactics now? In the end, it is all leading to one sad, familiar conclusion. I'd love to see some drastic change as much as the next person, but I just don't think it is realistic.

[Drew Dowdell]

For what? conspiring against the American worker, you might as well throw the Canadian government in there for offering free health care, since Canada has recieved alot of new buisness from GM lately (ex: the Camaro).

you couldn't go after the CAW... .but yes they could go after the teamsters.

[sophie]

I agree whole heartedly.

What makes these people think they have the right to have it so good? My wife works 10X harder than they and I do (but she also makes more than I do at the moment), yet they somehow deserve better pay, benefits, retirement and guaranteed work in the future? Sorry folks, thats not how this world works anymore.

If you have a problem with the executives getting bonuses and their pay, lets see you run a company like GM, make it profitable DESPITE all it has going against it and keep it afloat. Executives can make or break a company, the rank and file cannot.

WHAT DOES YOUR WIFE DO? IF YOU NEVER WORKED FOR A FACTORY LIKE GM HOW DO YOU KNOW HOW HARD WE WORK?

THIS IS NOT ABOUT MONEY! YOU PEOPLE GET ON HERE THINKING YOU KNOW EVERYTHING ABOUT THE UAW PEOPLE AND GM.

YOU KNOW NOTHING! GENERAL MOTORS WOULD EAT YOU PEOPLE ALIVE. I LOVE MY JOB GM/UAW I OWN ONLY GM TRUCKS AND CARS. BUT WHEN YOUR COMPANY HAD 250,000 PEOPLE IN THE 80'S AND NOW 73,000 PEOPLE SOMETHING IS WRONG

YOU PEOPLE THAT SAY GM/UAW PEOPLE ARE NOT SMART MUST OF US HAVE COLLEGE DEGREE,S GO FIGURE

GET A GRIP DON'T HATE US FOR MAKING A CHOICE TO WORK FOR GENERAL MOTORS THEY WERE HIRING PEOPLE A COUPLE YEARS AGO YOU HAD TO TAKE A TEST AND PASS IT WHICH A LOT OF PEOPLE DIDN'T PASS WHO SMARTER NOW.

[regfootball]

i advocate keeping work here as much as possible.....but considering GM's competition has advantages GM can't seem to muster it would be nice to see the playing field leveled....here and across the world. the world issues are bigger and harder to skin, but it would help GM greatly to be able to dump the union and be able to be more flexible with plants and employees.

one benefit for having the union is a more predictable way to budget for labor costs and the changes for the term of the contract. also, i do think union people tend to stay in their jobs longer and that could mitigate costly turnover.

i really think part of this is GM and UAW realizing that it could be mutually beneficial for them to coexist still and then find a way to push the UAW on the transplants. the downside to this is hyundai and the koreans could really start dumping more cheap cars here but i do think it would help to stem japanese expansion here. If anything it would help swing marketshare back to the US company. Toyota / honda etc. do not invest in as many workers here.....so the impact of losing say, a toyota plant is more justified in my mind. those same folks working there could or should be building vehicles for US companies, IMHO.

Unfortunately the Japanese use all sort of manipulation to steer positive advantages for themselves globally and top that off with our own politicians giving the farm to the out of towners.....

[sophie]

Exactly. No one would force them to stay at the job. I would bet at least half of them are willing to keep their jobs for a reasonable pay cut because it would still be the highest paying job they could get. Making $25-35 an hour to hand thing to a machine is ridiculous (I realize they do some more important stuff, but still, it is quite easy). What about people such as teachers that go to school for 4 years or more so they can teach these people's children so that their children can get decent jobs? The teachers could just as easily take a union job and make more money than they would be making through teaching, yet they go to school (paying big bucks) so that everyone else can benefit from it.

What I am trying to say is that by giving these people such high wages for what they do and such great benefits, it's setting a terrible example. Sure, we do need people like this, because otherwise we wouldn't have cars being made, but making $70k/year + having great benefits does not set a very good example for high school kids to go to college to become something that makes that same amount in the end. These workers should be making a good chunk of change so that they can support their family, but what did they do to deserve to have the best benefits of almost anyone and make quite a good paycheck? Fail out of school and become a scab?

I'm sorry if I offended anyone, but that's how I feel about assembly line workers making such good wages.

I WANT TO KNOW WHO MAKES 70,000 A YEAR WHAT YOU PEOPLE DON'T UNDERSTAND IS WE UAW PEOPLE

DONT MAKE 70,000 AND WE DO PAY FOR SOME OF OUR BENIFITS. AS FOR THE WORK IF YOU THINK ITS NOT HARD THINK AGAIN. WE DONT WHAT MORE MONEY AND WE DONT WANT OUR BENIFITS FREE

WE JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE WE HAVE SOME TYPE OF HEALTH CARE WE DO NOT GET EVERYTHING FREE. MYSELF (UAW WORKER) GO TO THE SAME DENIST AS A GENERAL MOTORS NON UAW PERSON AND THEY CAN GET SO MUCH MORE DONE AND NOT PAY 1 CENT FOR IT BUT IF I GET THE SAME STUFF DONE ITS NOT COVERED. WHAT STOPPED ANYONE OF YOU PEOPLE FROM GETTING A JOB WITH GENERAL MOTORS YOU PEOPLE COULD NOT PASS THE TEST YOU HAD TO TAKE. DONT HATE US BECAUSE WE MADE A GOOD CHOICE FOR OUR FURTURE. MOST OF US HAVE COLLEGE DEGREE'S MAYBE YOU SHOULD MAKE DIFFERENT CHOICES IN YOUR LIFE BEFORE YOU GO SLAMMING ANYONE ELSE. GET A LIFE STOP CRYING ABOUT STUFF YOU HAVE KNOW CLUE ABOUT. RETIREES HAVE WORKED ALL THERE LIVES FOR GM THEY EARNED THERE PAY CHECK WHEN YOU PEOPLE WORK 10 TO 12 A DAY AND DO THE SAME THING OVER AND OVER AGAIN THAT MEANS LIFTING 50, 60 POUND EVERY 1MIN. A HOUR DONT TELL US WE DONT WORK HARD I HAVE SEEN PEOPLE COME IN THINKING ITS SO EASY AND THEY DONT EVEN MAKE IT A WHOLE DAY.

[gm4life]

Generally the Union workers are paid to much for what they do. When I can go over to a Toyota factory and find out they make thousands less a year I would say most UAW workers are over-paid. And just so you know its not hard to put a bolt on a car.

[Coffeeman]

Ok, am a part of a union, I am for the union ideal, That's about it. This GM v.s. UAW is b.s. GM is just holding it together and the UAW wants more.. unacceptable. The union is likely unfair to harder working workers, and doesn't entice someone to get any education.

Where I work it is very similar. After 4 years of schooling I am making the same as a guy that greases pumps. (basically adds oil to all our pumps daily). His training was a 1 day safety course on site. Is that fair? I think not, nor do I think that the UAW is fair to its own workers, and definitely not fair to GM (The hand that is feeding them). GM is feeding the union lobster while GM is eating canned beans. I mean come on!

Oh....come on....don't get me start on fairness.

[capriceman]

How Many people here have actually worked on a assembly line?

I take it few have.

Its one of the worst jobs I have ever had. Sitting there for 10 hours a day doing the same exact thing 3 times a minute. it is suicidal. I only could stand it for 2 years before quiting. I stared off Welding rear axles on Caddy's then stamping hoods, then mounting doors before i finally couldn't take it. Its not as easy as you think its not like oh well i forgot a srew on that door they wont notice. everything has to be perfect. While things have changed over there years one thing hasn't that there still crappy 40-70 k a year jobs. Its not enough in this economy to live great. Its enough to buy a house in suburbia and have a newer car and that about it. No 100 ft yachts and Bentley's that all of you fantasize UAW workers have. The union started because workers wanted to feel safe and know there job will be there tomorrow. While I admit the UAW has stepped the line with several issues they are still entitled to Demand better working conditions and Benefits. Then after you slaved 8-10 hour day's 5-6 days a week for 30+ years then you can quit and are still payed a little and have health coverage for your 70,000 hours of work put into that company to help them turn a profit.

Another thing is to remember happy workers means higher quality. If you have a bunch of average workers that dont care for there job quality becomes lost.

It just makes me angry that all of voice your opinion because your pissed off that you cant have what a union member has.

Yes I am part of a Union.Yes I made 148,000 last year but i have 2 degrees and a journeymen' card, a &#036;h&#33; load of certifications and over 10 years experience. Also working on a Electrical engineer degree but we will see how that goes. What I do in one week would probably take most off you over a month to do. I work with machines that cost more than your house. I am a master machinist, master welder and am SAE Certified. Last week I clocked more than 70 labor intensive hours. What did you Clock 40 sitting in a office at a water cooler talking about why unions suck?

All you guys care about is the company on this site. In case you forgot a Company is run by workers. Its not like you can take workers out of the picture. Just try to get that through your thick skulls. And if you cant handle the union topic ignore it and continue your apathetic life.

[CaddyXLR-V]

How Many people here have actually worked on a assembly line?

I take it few have.

Its one of the worst jobs I have ever had. Sitting there for 10 hours a day doing the same exact thing 3 times a minute. it is suicidal. I only could stand it for 2 years before quiting. I stared off Welding rear axles on Caddy's then stamping hoods, then mounting doors before i finally couldn't take it. Its not as easy as you think its not like oh well i forgot a srew on that door they wont notice. everything has to be perfect. While things have changed over there years one thing hasn't that there still crappy 40-70 k a year jobs. Its not enough in this economy to live great. Its enough to buy a house in suburbia and have a newer car and that about it. No 100 ft yachts and Bentley's that all of you fantasize UAW workers have. The union started because workers wanted to feel safe and know there job will be there tomorrow. While I admit the UAW has stepped the line with several issues they are still entitled to Demand better working conditions and Benefits. Then after you slaved 8-10 hour day's 5-6 days a week for 30+ years then you can quit and are still payed a little and have health coverage for your 70,000 hours of work put into that company to help them turn a profit.

Another thing is to remember happy workers means higher quality. If you have a bunch of average workers that dont care for there job quality becomes lost.

It just makes me angry that all of voice your opinion because your pissed off that you cant have what a union member has.

Yes I am part of a Union.Yes I made 148,000 last year but i have 2 degrees and a journeymen' card, a &#036;h&#33; load of certifications and over 10 years experience. Also working on a Electrical engineer degree but we will see how that goes. What I do in one week would probably take most off you over a month to do. I work with machines that cost more than your house. I am a master machinist, master welder and am SAE Certified. Last week I clocked more than 70 labor intensive hours. What did you Clock 40 sitting in a office at a water cooler talking about why unions suck?

All you guys care about is the company on this site. In case you forgot a Company is run by workers. Its not like you can take workers out of the picture. Just try to get that through your thick skulls. And if you cant handle the union topic ignore it and continue your apathetic life.

If the jobs suck so bad, why don't they just find a new job, and let workers in China deal with it?