Why Does Reality Have to Suck?

[Cory Wolfe]

Why couldn't this have become reality? Why did J-bodies have to be so mediocre? Why doesn't Pontiac have a replacement for this? Why can't Pontiac put that body on Delta? Why can't Pontiac have a compact to go agains't the Civic Si? Why couldn't it have been this? Why does reality have to suck so much?

I hate reality... This Sunfire is the definition of my compact coupe dreams...

[Croc]

Well...IMO Pontiac should have a US Delta car. AFAIC it should be a sport wagon to go after the Mazda3 5-door. I'll draw up a pic of what I think it should look like in a few days...I like this thread...let's go with it...

[daves87rs]

Vipe, just buy a 03-05 Sunfire.... And you can go to the dealership and buy that very same GXP kit.... Though I'm not sure how much it is... There are a few people on jbody.org with GXP 'Fire...

[pow]

Thought this was going to be a Survivor rant... Anyhoo (is that even a word?), I wouldn't mind a rebodied Cobalt SS. Fit the Solstice body onto it, and I'm sure it'd be a hit.

[CARBIZ]

I was at a J-car show yesterday. These kids are very creative. For a very low price, you could buy an '04 or so GT and customize it. Some of these kids had spent $10 grand on their cars. One girl had a hot pink Sunfire with sparkles in the paint. Guys had their cars lowered. One guy had gull wing doors on a Cavalier coupe. And, hey - in Canada the Pursuit GT will best the Mazda.

[Cory Wolfe]

Delta wagon? Used Sunfire modded into GXP? Solstice bodied Cobalt SS? Pursuit GT? Not exactly what I expected... Anyways, I want this car to produced. Everything about it is just so perfect (except being a J-body). It is the type of vehicle Pontiac needs.. a performance oriented compact. Instead, Pontiac gets the Torrent and the Montana. So sad... Why, GM? Why? </whiny bitching rant>

[Bimmer325]

BV, Why don't you get yourself a Sunfire to replace your GA? You've been saying you'd like to sell it. B)

[the_yellow_dart]

Rice? or nice?

[the_yellow_dart]

I like this bodykit too...



and even though this kit is subtle, I still like it...

Edited October 10, 2005 by the_yellow_dart

[Cory Wolfe]

To answer your question... Both. It is definitely rice, but it looks nice for being rice. Pretty devilish, actually... :D

BV,

Why don't you get yourself a Sunfire to replace your GA?

You've been saying you'd like to sell it.

I'm sorry... I really don't want to downgrade. Getting a Sunfire would probably just make my problems worse. That and in stock form, it isn't as appealing as that GXP is. Also, an 03 would be a chore to find cheap enough... (though, with its crappy depreciation, it ought to be cheaper than that Civic I want in a few years :lol: )

[the_yellow_dart]

Ummm... IS lights on a Cav???



How about no taillights (WTF??)



still like this concept too...

[pow]

I don't think he wants the same car as his grandmother... :P

[Enzora]

Holy crap, a good looking Sunfire!

[Cory Wolfe]

Empowah... Not quite. She doesn't have it anymore. My cousin totalled it two years ago the first day he got his license. But basically, yes... I think the pre-03 Sunfires are too cutesy for me... :D

[Snate]

Anything "entry-level" for Pontiac should be based on Kappa....period. Pontiac isn't the volume division and shouldn't be trying to make a Civic competitor.

[Cory Wolfe]

Reality... Kappa isn't flexible enough. I thought this has already been explained... :blink:

[Snate]

Flexible? The only thing they need is a 2 door hardtop. It isn't the volume division...they don't need a 4 door sedan....even 4 seats isn't totally necessary.

[mute]

this sucker right here for me i love the way it looks good thing its getting built in my shop more or less

[Cory Wolfe]

Snate... that's retarded. Sorry. A two door, two seater isn't going to cut it. This is Pontiac, not Ferrari. While Pontiac needs to return to a performance image, it can't eliminate practicality. That isn't practical... at all. Pontiac atleast needs a 4 seat coupe and sedan. Preferably RWD, but there are NO platforms for that. Kappa isn't flexible enough... It needs to be heavily modified until it is basically a totally different platform to support two rows of seats. What other choices are there? Build a new platform? Sure... but GM has to be willing to do it. I don't think GM is. The only other choice is Delta. It wouldn't be the end of the world if it came down to this, either. Gm can do great things with FWD. You know it, I know it, we all know it. Torque steer is almost never a major problem. If it ever was, the GP GXP shows how to counteract it, additionally. After that, its all down to handling characteristics. Weight distribution is generally poor on FWD vehicles, being nose-heavy, yet the actual advantages of RWD over FWD are not by a large margain. Just look at test data. A Cobalt SS SC went through the Slalom faster than a CTS-V. What else can I say...?

[regfootball]

viper, that GXP pic at the beginning of the forum is a really nice looking sunfire. I think you would be on the path to duplicating that look with the matching body kit as was suggested, and i also thought GM or someone offered supercharger kits for the ecotec? beyond that, it would get darn costly and would make more sense to just pony up for the Cobalt SS with Stage 1 or II upgrades and enjoy that. Edited October 11, 2005 by regfootball

[Snate]

Retarded? Really how many sunfires were sold to real people, not fleets last year? Pontiac is a niche division....not a volume division. They do not need a 100K a year entry level car...thats why chevy exists. A more intelligent idea is to shrink the G6 and do like a Malibu/Impala thing with the G6 and Grand Prix....quite frankly I never understood why they didn't do that in the first place.

[Cory Wolfe]

You are not getting my point... I don't want another Sunfire. In case you don't know, they were identical to the Chevy version underneath with unique styling. Don't want that. Totally different is what I want. I also do not expect it to be a 100k per year car. I was just making the case for FWD. There is absolutely nothing wrong with it except for the close-minded extremists who whine and bitch. Nothing. I was also making a case for it having more than 2 seats and 2 doors. Retarded. You hear that? Retarded. Understand yet? Retarded. Need I say more? Also, just for your information... Pontiac is the third bestselling brand GM has. Niche? Hummer is niche... Saab is niche... but Pontiac? Nope... don't think so. Pontiac is supposed to be the sporting division, but eliminating sales for the sole purpose of eliminating sales (which is exactly what your retarded idea would do) is... You guessed it; Retarded! Pontiac needs a compact 4-seater coupe and sedan... FWD? RWD? I don't give a shit... Pontiac needs it and it has to be below the G6 (Grand Am) with the Grand Prix above it. All RWD... whatever. FWD... whatever. AWD... hopefully, but whatever. My motto: Only true Pontiac fans know what Pontiac needs.

[Sixty8panther]

I don't think he wants the same car as his grandmother... :P

[post="26606"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]

BV: Empowah... Not quite. She doesn't have it anymore. My cousin totalled it two years ago the first day he got his license....

I think he was talking aboutn your grandmother's Cobalt. :huh:

[Sixty8panther]

Pontiac needs a compact 4-seater coupe and sedan... FWD? RWD? I don't give a shit... Pontiac needs it and it has to be below the G6 (Grand Am) with the Grand Prix above it. All RWD... whatever. FWD... whatever. AWD... hopefully, but whatever.

[post="26968"]<{POST_SNAPBACK}>[/post]

I don't get you BV. You call me closed minded because I love RWD and 90% of the time despise FWD but you yourself have no real oppinion on it. That doesn't make sense. I hate to judge you harshly (tit for tat I guess) but someone who knows the driving dynamics of both is not going to say "Eh, ...whichever"

It's like saying you want to meet a girl who's a devout Christian, ...or Atheist, whichever. Polar opposites my friend.

I think there's still hope for you. Someone needs to give you a deathride in a Firebird/Camaro/Mustang. Too bad I didn't buy that 1999 Trans Am WS6, 6-speed a while back. Being a Pontiac guy you'd respond better to that than my Camaro. I'd drive down there to Penn. and waste 3 gallons of gas withough leaving the parking lot. Once you fully understand why it is that you can't compete in drifting without RWD or Rear biased AWD and why it is that all BMWs, Musclecars and sports cars are RWD you'll be a lot more oppiniated yourself.

I was just making the case for FWD. There is absolutely nothing wrong with it except for the close-minded extremists who whine and bitch. Nothing.

LMFAO!!! :lol: Edited October 11, 2005 by Sixty8panther

[deftonesfan867]

I giggled when I saw the pics of that black Cobalt....is that wrong??

[Cory Wolfe]

I don't get you BV. You call me closed minded because I love RWD and 90% of the time despise FWD but you yourself have no real oppinion on it. That doesn't make sense. I hate to judge you harshly (tit for tat I guess) but someone who knows the driving dynamics of both is not going to say "Eh, ...whichever"

It's like saying you want to meet a girl who's a devout Christian, ...or Atheist, whichever. Polar opposites my friend.

I disagree. Polar opposites makes it sound like there is a world of difference between them. There isn't. Just look test data. As I said... a few FWD cars beat the CTS-V and BMW M3 in the slalom. Cobalt SS SC and Mini Cooper S. The Grand Prix GXP beat the GTO. If RWD were that much better... all of this wouldn't have happened.

As for my opinion on FWD. For performance, it isn't as good a RWD, but for practicality and that sort of stuff, its better. When applying all plusses and minuses for each... I think they're even matched, overall, IMO. I prefer RWD over FWD... but AWD over both. I don't bash it, unjustly, like you though... And I defend it. That's where I stand on FWD.

Also, that's not why I call you close minded. :rolleyes:

I think there's still hope for you. Someone needs to give you a deathride in a Firebird/Camaro/Mustang. Too bad I didn't buy that 1999 Trans Am WS6, 6-speed a while back. Being a Pontiac guy you'd respond better to that than my Camaro. I'd drive down there to Penn. and waste 3 gallons of gas withough leaving the parking lot. Once you fully understand why it is that you can't compete in drifting without RWD or Rear biased AWD and why it is that all BMWs, Musclecars and sports cars are RWD you'll be a lot more oppiniated yourself.

Who gives a fuck about drifting? I know why FWD can't compete in it. It's a no brainer. As I've said before, the biggest advantage RWD has over FWD is the ability to drift, do smoky burnouts, and shit like that. Both of which is almost impossible in a FWD car (burnouts can be done, but not wild ones like you would do in your Camaro). Still, this kind of shit isn't why people buy cars and it isn't important.

And who's to say I haven't riden in a Firebird before? My one cousin had one as well as my aunt who gave her's to her son. Never driven them, but I had some fun rides in them. But, I've had fun rides in FWD cars as well...

LMFAO!!!  :lol:

Glad you're finding the truth to be funny.

[CARBIZ]

While burn outs are fun, high insurance rates and speeding tickets are not. Twenty years ago, I was impressed with burnt rubber and squealing tires. Now, ride, handling and fuel mileage are more important - and I believe those things are more important to the "average" driver. It is nice to have fun, but if gas prices stay where they are, we will probably see a repeat of the early '80s where FUN was a convertible Dodge 600 with 90 hp. The Cobalts/Civics of the world will always outsell and outclass the RWD, gas guzzling dinosaurs out there. When (not if) the fossilized Washington gets off its arse and gets serious about fuel economy again, RWD will die a quick and sudden death. It may have advantages on the track or with towing, but there they end.

[Cremazie]

this sucker right here for me i love the way it looks good thing its getting built in my shop more or less

[post="26813"][/post]

man, that car is truly a j-body.. look at the fit of the doors "like oh my god"
lol

[Cory Wolfe]

This isn't that bad of a Sunfire...




Also, this isn't that bad of a Cavalier...




Another Sunfire...

Edited October 12, 2005 by blackviper8891