2008 CTS Pricing Released

[kryptonics]

A Mercedes Benz E350 weighs in at 3740lbs, while the CTS weighs 3872lbs. I really don't see a problem here. Besides, if you want proof that GM knows how to build a light luxury car, just look at the XLR, which is significantly lighter than the SL550 and the SC430. I'm sure they know what they are doing and they are certainly not just throwing parts together. The CTS still has a good 51/49 balance...

Cadillac is offering something that the others don't, a larger car for the price of the compacts. If you are into checking out statistics, go with the BMW, but if you want a solid performer that you won't have to squeeze into, get the CTS. I don't understand how many times we have to stress the point that it's a 5 series size car for 3 series money... It's just an alternative, if you don't like it, then find something else. Don't complain how it doesn't cleanly fall into a segment, though I appreciate this discussion to a certain degree...

[EMan]

looks pretty decent to me! althought i would have thought a couple of items in the lux 1 and 2 packages would be standard on a lux car. the rainsense wipers, 6-cd, back-up sensors, etc.

EDIT: Universal home remote should be standard on every vehicle GM makes period.

i see most of these selling in the 42-47k range, perfect if you ask me.

is it asking too much for rear seat heaters? hmmmm?

I agree, I think that some of the options should be standard. Come on, the Rainsense wipers come standard on the Astra but not the CTS?

[autoeng]

fady,

The GMS prices are posted on www.cadillacforums.com under "2008 CTS Prices Released" on third page of post. I'm a GM employee and am thinking of ordering a 2008 CTS this week, fully loaded, Sunset Blue with grey interior. I'm trading in my 1999 Seville SLS.

[Sixty8panther]

Great value compared to the Competition, esp. those fugly Acura/Lexus.

[balthazar]

i wish people would stop harping about weights.

they increase the weight because they need to buy and use more cheap steel to offset those union pension expenses. they can't afford to use a lot of the high strength stuff.

they increase the weight so you get good crash ratings. when the $h! comes down, if a car isn't a five star car, people rip on it.

they add weight so it 'feels as if it were made of solid billet like a bmw'.

they add weight so the frame and suspension hold up under freeze thaw pothole cycles. Something the furrin manuf's don't address very well.

lastly, they add thicker steel so it doesn't ding badly like all those ricemobiles do. Last thing caddy or Gm wants is to have a rep for cheap thin sheetmetal that asian cars have. Show me a one year old Yaris that isn't already dented up. Lots of Hondas and stuff have real cheap sheetmetal.

"Thicker" relative to when?? I remember looking at a civic in the body shop about 10 years ago- hit in the rear corner. The 'sheetmetal' had ripped & crumpled EXACTLY like tin foil. It's irrepairable; ANY sheetmetal damage has to be replaced, not repaired. I'm not convinced unibodies have gotten any stronger; between building cars to 'do well' in crash tests, hiding inside numerous classes of vehicle test results, and measuring structural efficiency by how passengers are protected (not that there's anything wrong with that)... a LOT of substandard construction falls thru the cracks, IMO.

No, all the added weight is the tenderfoot crying for DVD/NAV and sunroofs and rear seat heaters and 'parking assist' and lane departure warnings and 28 air bags... all that enabling $h! that's adds the weight. Ever pick up a spool of wire?

[smk4565]

Cadillac is offering something that the others don't, a larger car for the price of the compacts. If you are into checking out statistics, go with the BMW, but if you want a solid performer that you won't have to squeeze into, get the CTS. I don't understand how many times we have to stress the point that it's a 5 series size car for 3 series money... It's just an alternative, if you don't like it, then find something else. Don't complain how it doesn't cleanly fall into a segment, though I appreciate this discussion to a certain degree...

One problem is some people don't want a car as big as the CTS. Most that are close to or live in a city want smaller. My mom drives alone all the time, and has no need for a car as big as the CTS, she likes the A4/3-series size. Cadillac misses out on a market there. Just like how the Jetta used to sell well, and it was a tiny car, but nicer than the other compacts. There is a market for small and nice and GM usually forgets about it. Plus in Europe, the CTS is a giant.

I'd like to see the BTS at about 183 inches long, that gives them slightly more size than the other compacts, but still small enough for cities and Europe and small car fans. The CTS can stay about the size it is, or grow and inch then they need a nice car that is 198 inches long, and 203 if they do a long wheel base version. Once they get that sorted out, upgrade the 08 CTS's interior, add a V8 and more content they will be all set. If they can pull that off by 2011 they could have a good future.

I actually prefer the size of a CTS to that of a 3-series, but a lot of people like really small. Car Magazines will compare the CTS's performance to the 3-series, and the size will probably hurt the CTS, thus it will start getting weak reviews, and that american = bad, foriegn = good, perception gets reinforced, and I am sick of that.

[pow]

"Thicker" relative to when?? I remember looking at a civic in the body shop about 10 years ago- hit in the rear corner. The 'sheetmetal' had ripped & crumpled EXACTLY like tin foil. It's irrepairable; ANY sheetmetal damage has to be replaced, not repaired. I'm not convinced unibodies have gotten any stronger; between building cars to 'do well' in crash tests, hiding inside numerous classes of vehicle test results, and measuring structural efficiency by how passengers are protected (not that there's anything wrong with that)... a LOT of substandard construction falls thru the cracks, IMO.

No, all the added weight is the tenderfoot crying for DVD/NAV and sunroofs and rear seat heaters and 'parking assist' and lane departure warnings and 28 air bags... all that enabling $h! that's adds the weight. Ever pick up a spool of wire?

It's true NHTSA doesn't account for structure in their crashes, but all manufacturers have the sense to engineer cars that do well in IIHS and E-NCAP tests, which indeed give ratings for structure. The strength of passengers cells have significantly improved over the years, and as you can tell from measurements, they deform far less.

I think the advances in unibody strength can easily be seen in pics like these...

Same 31-mph, 3,300 lb barrier, old Stratus, new Caliber:

[kryptonics]

One problem is some people don't want a car as big as the CTS. Most that are close to or live in a city want smaller. My mom drives alone all the time, and has no need for a car as big as the CTS, she likes the A4/3-series size.

Well, that's my point, then they can go with one of the competition's fine choices. Personally, I'm looking for a 5-series sized car for a 3-series price, and the CTS works out perfectly for me. It may not be as detailed and finely detailed as the 5 series, but it doesn't cost as much either. Cadillac will eventually get a small compact, but I think most people in the compact market will probably go with the 3-series because it's already near perfect... Cadillac just offers a choice, just like how the CLS is just an alternative to the E class. It exists for style alone. The CTS exists not only as Cadillac's entry model, but as a choice for people who would like a slightly bigger car at that price point.

Edited July 21, 2007 by kryptonics

[balthazar]

>>"I think the advances in unibody strength can easily be seen in pics like these..."<<

Those 2 are sequential generations of the same segment vehicle from the same manufacturer. It's illustrates your point but they are not far enough removed from each other timewise to address the long-term weight gain in cars (my point).

[pow]

>>"I think the advances in unibody strength can easily be seen in pics like these..."<<

Those 2 are sequential generations of the same segment vehicle from the same manufacturer. It's illustrates your point but they are not far enough removed from each other timewise to address the long-term weight gain in cars (my point).

Are twelve years or three generations enough?

So yes, there's a gain of 450 lbs, and there's a corresponding gain in unibody strength as well...

[balthazar]

Is that a Neon & a Neon?

No- 12 years is not enough, things have been 'on the cheap' for a long time now, esp RE the steel in modern cars; can you give me 25?

When the Rabbit came here around 1980, it weighed 1900 lbs. The current R32 weighs almost 3600. Sure; I know there's a bigger engine (tho was the '80's 4-banger an iron block?) and maybe AWD, but just how much of that nearly doubling in weight for a car roughly the same size comes from creature comforts and how much from structural safety improvements ??

My '64 Catalina 4-dr sedan has less than 20 lbs of plastic in it, it's 213" overall with a full frame & heavy-gauge sheetmetal and weighs only 3770 dry. The mercedes 2-seat roadster must have 500 lbs of plastic in it & an aluminum block/heads and it weighs 4400. I'm the only one I've ever read who rags on it.

Either damn ALL cars today for being obese, or none at all and shut up & hit that in-dash 6-CD player and 19 speaker system !!

[pow]

Either damn ALL cars today for being obese, or none at all and shut up & hit that in-dash 6-CD player and 19 speaker system !!

Or just compare within segments. Entry-lux sport sedans range from 3200 to 4100 lbs.

[pow]

BTW, does anyone know if these prices include destination?

[gm4life]

Sounds pretty resonable to me. I am back after a two week trip from Iowa to Oregon!

[Northstar]

BTW, does anyone know if these prices include destination?

Nope. See this press release:

2008 Cadillac CTS Readies for Launch

DETROIT - The dramatically designed new 2008 Cadillac CTS will launch in late-August with a higher level of technology, luxury and performance. With many new standard features and a long list of new options, the all-new 2008 CTS, Cadillac's most affordable product, also delivers compelling value.

"Cadillac's recent renaissance and the breakout success of the original CTS provided a springboard for our team to reach higher with the all-new 2008 CTS," said Jim Taylor, Cadillac General Manager. "The result is a car we feel is more desirable in every way, including the value it offers to luxury sport sedan buyers."

The 2008 CTS launches in the U.S. in late-August at a base MSRP of $32,990, including $745 Dealer Freight Charge. (The 2007 CTS with the 3.6-liter V6 engine carried a base MSRP of $33,530, $540 more than the new 08 model with the same engine.)

The all-new 2008 CTS includes the following standard features that represent significant upgrades from the prior model, including:

* 263-hp, 3.6-liter engine (previously 258-hp, and optional)

* All-new redesigned cabin with handcrafted accents (previously unavailable)

* 17-inch wheels and tires (previously optional)

* BOSE 8-speaker sound system (previously optional)

* The acclaimed Stabilitrak stability enhancement system (previously optional)

* Tire pressure monitoring (previously optional)

* Underhood strut tower brace for improved structural rigidity (previously unavailable)

* Polished aluminum exhaust tips (previously unavailable.)

In terms of optional equipment, the all-new 2008 CTS includes a level of new features and technologies more commonly found on more expensive luxury vehicles. These new options include electronic features at the forefront of the industry and performance and luxury equipment that compete at the highest level, including:

* 3.6-liter Direct Injection engine with 304-hp and a 25% reduction in hydrocarbon emissions.

* 6-speed Automatic Transmission with Driver Shift Control

* All-Wheel Drive, with active torque transfer

* 40 gigabyte Hard Disc Drive that can store audio tracks "ripped" from CDs or flash drives, and enables a "Time-Shift" feature that can pause and replay live radio content

* Navigation system with 3D mapping of major US landmarks and real-time traffic and weather data

* USB and Auxiliary ports for the seamless integration (and battery charging) of MP3 players such as iPods.

* High Intensity Discharge headlamps with Adaptive Forward Lighting that follows vehicle steering, with LED light pipes.

* Keyless Access

* BOSE 5.1 Digital Surround Sound

* Authentic Sapele wood trim

* UltraView sun roof with power sunshade.

[smk4565]

I'd like to see a V8 option, not a V-series either. But if they are going to make it 5-series size and weight, I think they need a 400 hp V8 to put in it.

I'd liked to see the base model scrapped too, and just start it at $35,000 with Lux 1 and seating package standard, then in 2010, push it up market, I'd rename it to STS though, and call the BTS the CTS.

[smk4565]

I hope they don't get content with their 304 hp engine. Infiniti has 330 hp, they had 306 3 years ago, Lexus has 306 hp, BMW 300 hp/300 lb-ft and all those cars are hundreds of pounds lighter. This is a tough class, Cadillac needs continous improvement.

[Fady]

fady,

The GMS prices are posted on www.cadillacforums.com under "2008 CTS Prices Released" on third page of post. I'm a GM employee and am thinking of ordering a 2008 CTS this week, fully loaded, Sunset Blue with grey interior. I'm trading in my 1999 Seville SLS.

Thanks, just checked it out... priced one out at just over $40k instead of 45k... of course the bluetooth kit will be add'l too, hmm, am i outta my league, maybe i should settle for a chevy lol (1st yr out of college in a full time job... so im not ur typical caddy shopper, but i love this car...that or i can wait to c the lease offers).

Edited July 22, 2007 by Fady

[Drew Dowdell]

I hope they don't get content with their 304 hp engine. Infiniti has 330 hp, they had 306 3 years ago, Lexus has 306 hp, BMW 300 hp/300 lb-ft and all those cars are hundreds of pounds lighter. This is a tough class, Cadillac needs continous improvement.

300hp not enough?

Step into our 500hp model over here.

[Nick]

I hope they don't get content with their 304 hp engine. Infiniti has 330 hp, they had 306 3 years ago, Lexus has 306 hp, BMW 300 hp/300 lb-ft and all those cars are hundreds of pounds lighter. This is a tough class, Cadillac needs continous improvement.

The BMW is underrated, too. Owners tend to find they make closer to 315 or so...

[smk4565]

Thanks, just checked it out... priced one out at just over $40k instead of 45k... of course the bluetooth kit will be add'l too, hmm, am i outta my league, maybe i should settle for a chevy lol (1st yr out of college in a full time job... so im not ur typical caddy shopper, but i love this car...that or i can wait to c the lease offers).

Just wait a year or two and get is used, after a year Cadillacs usually drop 8-10,000 in price. Although I hope they can correct their resale value problems. Until they do it is almost nuts to buy a new Cadillac when year old models are drastically cheaper. I'd like a Cadillac for my next car also, but my car should be good for another 4 years.

I've heard now the 335i is underrated also, it makes 272 rear wheel horsepower I think, I forget the nexact number, but there was no way the car only lost 25 hp or so through the drivetrain, 315 probably is more accurate. I am a V8 fan, although a twin turbo V6 making 375 hp would be awesome in the CTS. Gas mileage matters, maybe they should follow BMW's twin turbo idea. I don't like pushrods so I wouldn't get a V-series, plus 500 hp isn't really usable, where as 375 puts them in E550 and 550i range.

Edited July 23, 2007 by smk4565

[autoeng]

I went to my Cadillac dealer last night and ordered one. They didn't have the pricing list yet, but I had my copy with the options I wanted. (6DP69 3.6L SIDI, 89U Crystal Red, Gray/Ebony interior, PDQ Premium Luxury Collection and Y42 18" All-Season Tire Performance Package) Since they didn't have the pricing yet, I just agreed to pay the GMS price on the invoice. I was the first person to order one from this dealer. They also had a 2008 STS on the lot. Beautiful car! Now the wait starts.

[gm4life]

Congrats on the new CTS. We can't wait for pics!

[97regalGS]

parts together. The CTS still has a good 51/49 balance...

Cadillac is offering something that the others don't, a larger car for the price of the compacts. If you are into checking out statistics, go with the BMW, but if you want a solid performer that you won't have to squeeze into, get the CTS. I don't understand how many times we have to stress the point that it's a 5 series size car for 3 series money... It's just an alternative, if you don't like it, then find something else. Don't complain how it doesn't cleanly fall into a segment, though I appreciate this discussion to a certain degree...

Great value compared to the Competition, esp. those fugly Acura/Lexus.

Once again, I see that things haven't changed much. Both of these comments are so totally oout of place with what Cadillac 'used' to be, and what they, hopefully, stive to be in the future - Standard of the World.

Never should a Cadillac be considered 'great value'. Want value, buy a Chevy or GTO that is still languisihg on a dealer lot.

You guys that think that Cadillac should be a deal just don't get it. It's a Luxury product. Does anyone need a Rolex or a TAG when they can get a Timex for $10?

It should really be, I can get a 5 Series for BLS prices(the alpha BLS not that thing we have now.)

[NOS2006]

I went to my Cadillac dealer last night and ordered one. They didn't have the pricing list yet, but I had my copy with the options I wanted. (6DP69 3.6L SIDI, 89U Crystal Red, Gray/Ebony interior, PDQ Premium Luxury Collection and Y42 18" All-Season Tire Performance Package) Since they didn't have the pricing yet, I just agreed to pay the GMS price on the invoice. I was the first person to order one from this dealer. They also had a 2008 STS on the lot. Beautiful car! Now the wait starts.

I was able to sit in a lot of them and I've got to hand it to you for going and getting a PDQ w/ 18" wheels. This is probably one of the nicest cars on the market. Very comfortable, very functional, and very sexy. Congratulations!

[Flybrian]

I went to my Cadillac dealer last night and ordered one. They didn't have the pricing list yet, but I had my copy with the options I wanted. (6DP69 3.6L SIDI, 89U Crystal Red, Gray/Ebony interior, PDQ Premium Luxury Collection and Y42 18" All-Season Tire Performance Package) Since they didn't have the pricing yet, I just agreed to pay the GMS price on the invoice. I was the first person to order one from this dealer. They also had a 2008 STS on the lot. Beautiful car! Now the wait starts.

Woo! Congratulations and keep us updated!

[Northstar]

I am a V8 fan, although a twin turbo V6 making 375 hp would be awesome in the CTS. Gas mileage matters, maybe they should follow BMW's twin turbo idea. I don't like pushrods so I wouldn't get a V-series, plus 500 hp isn't really usable, where as 375 puts them in E550 and 550i range.

"I don't like pushrods so I wouldn't get a V-Series" is a ridiculous statement. That engine will be a gem. That's like saying you drove a Ford with an OHC engine and didn't like it so now you won't consider a GM with a OHC engine

375HP is more than anyone really needs. 500 is way more than anyone needs, but how is 500 "not really useable" and 375 is somehow the right number since that's where the competition is at?

I think the CTS will get the UV8 a couple model years after introduction. That will solve the big horsepower gap.

[NOS2006]

Quite honestly, if I were older (30s just because I want a Camaro right now) I'd probably splurge on a CTS-V Coupe if they come out with a V in coupe form (CTC-V?). It's amazing. Seriously, I absolutely love them after sitting inside them for about 3 hours today.

[ZL-1]

I'd like to see a V8 option, not a V-series either.

I agree that a mid-range V8 option would broaden the CTS's appeal, but it would also be the death sentence of the current STS. I don't see that option arriving until GM sorts out the STS/DTS issue.

[autoeng]

A friend of mine used to be the plant manager at Lansing. I contacted him and he put me in touch with a guy at the plant who is going to let me know what day it's scheduled to be built. I hope to know in the next week. In the mean time, I've downloaded the owners manual and the navigation system manual and have read through most of them already. Didn't know it will have speech recognition capabilities!

[NOS2006]

A friend of mine used to be the plant manager at Lansing. I contacted him and he put me in touch with a guy at the plant who is going to let me know what day it's scheduled to be built. I hope to know in the next week. In the mean time, I've downloaded the owners manual and the navigation system manual and have read through most of them already. Didn't know it will have speech recognition capabilities!

Yeah, it's really an amazing car. I was out at Lansing yesterday and I'll be out there again all day tomorrow screwing around with some of the CTS's sitting on the lot. It would be really cool if I were to sit in your car before you and not even realize it lol. I won't get it dirty!

[The O.C.]

1) You have never even driven the new CTS to compare...

2) No way are the BMWs the same price with equal options...A BASE BMW usually equals a fully loaded Caddy of the same size. Check engine power, etc.

3) Why the 3 series "outsells" is because most are used in taxi fleets around the world. Been to Europe lately? They are a common car and most are sold as base models, not the "luxury" versions we see in NA. In some countries it is the ONLY BMW model you can buy...You will never see a new CTS as a taxi...Taxis = fleet sales...

BMWs are good cars...But you can't price compare them the same...

Dude....why don't you check N/A sales numbers......

Through May '07 (latest figures I have) retail sales

BMW 3-Series 58,300

BMW 5-Series 27,625

CTS 20,343

No BMW taxis over here......

[The O.C.]

OK, I went ahead and looked through the option packages. To get parking sensors you have to get Level 2 Luxury, which I'm assuming requires the Level 1 Luxury. It's a $350 stand-alone option in the 3er. The nav system is a bit pricey, too... it's more expensive than any rival's system. But then again, there's always OnStar T-B-T.

GM is still too confusing with it's option content. Why can't they follow BMW's lead? For example.....

328i or 335i (powertrain choice)

Premium package

Sport package

Cold Weather package

Premium Sound package

That's IT...!

Then, you've got a selection of individual options to choose from (Nav, Adaptive cruise, power sunshades, etc.)

Why is the CTS order guide SO COMPLICATED?

[The O.C.]

i wish people would stop harping about weights.

they increase the weight because they need to buy and use more cheap steel to offset those union pension expenses. they can't afford to use a lot of the high strength stuff.

they increase the weight so you get good crash ratings. when the &#036;h&#33; comes down, if a car isn't a five star car, people rip on it.

they add weight so it 'feels as if it were made of solid billet like a bmw'.

they add weight so the frame and suspension hold up under freeze thaw pothole cycles. Something the furrin manuf's don't address very well.

lastly, they add thicker steel so it doesn't ding badly like all those ricemobiles do. Last thing caddy or Gm wants is to have a rep for cheap thin sheetmetal that asian cars have. Show me a one year old Yaris that isn't already dented up. Lots of Hondas and stuff have real cheap sheetmetal.

Why does GM have to build a 4,100 lb CTS just to get it to "feel as solid" as a 3,500 lb BMW or Mercedes?

[The O.C.]

No, all the added weight is the tenderfoot crying for DVD/NAV and sunroofs and rear seat heaters and 'parking assist' and lane departure warnings and 28 air bags... all that enabling &#036;h&#33; that's adds the weight. Ever pick up a spool of wire?

But the point is.....new GM cars are coming in much heavier than their competition....and the competition is offering the same features that "add weight."

[Z-06]

But the point is.....new GM cars are coming in much heavier than their competition....and the competition is offering the same features that "add weight."

Yeah the weight is a concern. GM should now make efforts to save this weight. A 10-15% more weight is about 7-10% drop in fuel economy assuming same everything. That is a perceptible number if you compare GM's fuel economy to the competing cars in its segment.

I can understand the argument of CTS being a 5 series fighter, but yet it is about 250 lb heavier than it. The E63 AMG weighs 4035 lbs. Wonder how much the CTS-V will weigh.

[regfootball]

i thought i read the new c class is almost the same weight as the cts. i will dbl check that.

re: the v8. i'd prefer a northstar version in the cts-v. not that the small block is bad, but i like the sound and feel of overhead cam. i wouldn't mind a small performance drop in comparison. i.e if the cts-v does 0-60 in 4 seconds I can live with a 4.3-4.4 time. we all forget how much the sts-v powertrain is praised in all facets, even if its not as much of a brute. the next northstar v powerplant will have lots more displacement so it should fall into the brite category at some point i assume.

remember, caddy widened the cts track 2 inches. that's what, like 3% increase? 3% increase in size over say 3700 pounds = at least another 100 pounds. WB stayed the same. Look at all the beefed up structure and extra wiring. bigger brakes, etc.

Edited August 9, 2007 by regfootball

[Northstar]

I built a CTS on kbb.com a few minutes ago, and some of the options seem pretty dumb, unless it's just KBB's site. For example, a moon roof when you order the Luxury collection is cheaper than if you order the luxury level one and luxury level two package, even though level one and level two give you more luxury options. How can a moon roof have two different prices depending on what other options you get?

Also, I just realized if you get NAV it's actually cheaper depending on what options you want. If you don't want NAV and get everything it has, it actually ends up being more... Premium Luxury collection includes lux 1, lux 2, wood trim, seating package, and moon roof for $8165. If you don't want NAV but you want all the other stuff, you have to pay $1000 for lux 1, $2025 for level 2, moon roof $1450, $2200 for the seating package, and both wood trim packages for $645, and you are required to get a $1000 radio upgrade with 5.1 surround sound (included in Premium Luxury collection) = $8320 without the NAV system.

Very odd...

[Flybrian]

Why does GM have to build a 4,100 lb CTS just to get it to "feel as solid" as a 3,500 lb BMW or Mercedes?

Where the hell does everyone keep pulling this 4,100lb figure out of as if its a realistic base curb weight for the RWD CTS?

2008 BMW 335i - 3605lbs - BMWUSA.com

2008 Mercedes C350 - 3615lbs - Winding Road

2008 CTS (3.6 DI Auto) - 3874lbs - GM Ordering Guide

Heavier? Certainly.

Obese? Hardly, especially considering the CTS is dimensionally larger than the BMW or Mercedes. Perhaps a more interesting question is how compact sedans like the 3er and C-Class today weigh nearly as much as my father's Bonneville with its overbuilt chassis, fullsize dimensions, and cast iron block V6. Compared to four years ago, all of those three sport sedans have grown by ~200lbs apiece. Everyone just acts like the Caddy is a pig because of some early-quoted approximate fully-optioned AWD curb weight.

And in interesting note about the 'solidity' of the Bimmer...

Much of the lightening in the BMW seems to have been stripped from the NVH bin and we have to admit that we appreciated the silencer effect in the Mercedes cabin, particularly as the day’s drive wore on.

---Winding Road

[Northstar]

4100 lbs is probably with AWD.

[97regalGS]

Where the hell does everyone keep pulling this 4,100lb figure out of as if its a realistic base curb weight for the RWD CTS?

2008 BMW 335i - 3605lbs - BMWUSA.com

2008 Mercedes C350 - 3615lbs - Winding Road

2008 CTS (3.6 DI Auto) - 3874lbs - GM Ordering Guide

Heavier? Certainly.

Obese? Hardly, especially considering the CTS is dimensionally larger than the BMW or Mercedes. Perhaps a more interesting question is how compact sedans like the 3er and C-Class today weigh nearly as much as my father's Bonneville with its overbuilt chassis, fullsize dimensions, and cast iron block V6. Compared to four years ago, all of those three sport sedans have grown by ~200lbs apiece. Everyone just acts like the Caddy is a pig because of some early-quoted approximate fully-optioned AWD curb weight.

And in interesting note about the 'solidity' of the Bimmer...

since i'm too lazy, car to add the 535i and E350 weights?

[pow]

C&D got 4032 lbs for a 3.6 DI manual RWD on their scales. A C350 automatic in the same issue weighed in at 3671. Both had panoramic glass roofs.

[97regalGS]

Dude....why don't you check N/A sales numbers......

Through May '07 (latest figures I have) retail sales

BMW 3-Series 58,300

BMW 5-Series 27,625

CTS 20,343

No BMW taxis over here......

3 series and 5 series are both 'newer' than CTS, which is on it's last legs, so those numbers are skewed somewhat. no way 08 cts will come close to 3series, but watch out 5series(and don't read in to that, that bmw buyers will be running to caddy dealers in mass pandemonium to get a cts, cause that won't be happening. some will, but don't expect a stampede.)

[Flybrian]

since i'm too lazy, car to add the 535i and E350 weights?

2008 BMW 535i w/Steptronic - 3703lbs

2008 Mercedes E350 - 3740lbs