'07 Tundra Camshafts Snapping

[Angry Dad]

May as well say it since the "other" GM site shut down the subject.

The subject is the "other site".

Just how much credibilty has that site lost with so much sponsorship from Toyota dealers?

Yeah there's a bunch of you that cross over and I'll say what I think, that other site seems to have more than it's fair share of Toyota trolls (aka, salesmen spotting rumors to sell their own stuff)

Yeah they are fairly thin skinned about people taking shots at the "immaculate ones" and some people get pretty nasty but there are some that can't take it when stuff goes wrong like what is so common these days with the Tundra.

Myabe they should just change their name to Inside Motor Trend?

BTW, I won't hide it, I post under the same moniker over there too, what are they gonna do?

[regfootball]

they don't allow much on the other site. doesn't surprise me. they have no edge and no relevant perspective. but they do post more stories.

[plane]

May as well say it since the "other" GM site shut down the subject.

The subject is the "other site".

Just how much credibilty has that site lost with so much sponsorship from Toyota dealers?

Yeah there's a bunch of you that cross over and I'll say what I think, that other site seems to have more than it's fair share of Toyota trolls (aka, salesmen spotting rumors to sell their own stuff)

Yeah they are fairly thin skinned about people taking shots at the "immaculate ones" and some people get pretty nasty but there are some that can't take it when stuff goes wrong like what is so common these days with the Tundra.

Myabe they should just change their name to Inside Motor Trend?

BTW, I won't hide it, I post under the same moniker over there too, what are they gonna do?

?????

I've never seen any Toyota commercials at Saturnfans.

[Z-06]

but they do post more stories.

What kind? Stories about Wagoner and Lutz are not good and that the owners of the website can save GM with a plan?

[rosserman]

I actually have a friend who works in the huntsville, alabama engine plant. I asked him about this issue and he told me the same exact thing that toyota is saying about the casting defect. He did also mention to me that if you spin the engine over 6500 rpm the cams will come apart "with the quickness". I find that interesting in itself. He also seemed confident that ther problem had been adressed by the vendor.

[Drew Dowdell]

He did also mention to me that if you spin the engine over 6500 rpm the cams will come apart "with the quickness".

That may be why they are replacing entire engines..... there may be collateral damage

[Oracle of Delphi]

May as well say it since the "other" GM site shut down the subject.

The subject is the "other site".

Just how much credibilty has that site lost with so much sponsorship from Toyota dealers?

Yeah there's a bunch of you that cross over and I'll say what I think, that other site seems to have more than it's fair share of Toyota trolls (aka, salesmen spotting rumors to sell their own stuff)

Yeah they are fairly thin skinned about people taking shots at the "immaculate ones" and some people get pretty nasty but there are some that can't take it when stuff goes wrong like what is so common these days with the Tundra.

Myabe they should just change their name to Inside Motor Trend?

BTW, I won't hide it, I post under the same moniker over there too, what are they gonna do?

What site are you talking about?

[Angry Dad]

What site are you talking about?

The one where I post as "Buickman",

That seems to be totally enraptured with getting mentions in other media,

Of course it's GM (?) Inside News

[regfootball]

GM-i? hey, that sounds like a model designation.

The Buick Lucerne GMi.

LOL

GM-i, you can read 10 pages of posts and not get much out of a topic on there.

[toesuf94]

I bet the guy in the commercial with the 100,000,000 ton cargo container hanging off the cliff is changing his drawers knowing that he was one 'metalurgical failure' from taking a bigger plunge than marriage!

[cletus8269]

i'd still love to see that commercial live... i know there had to be a duramax off screen pulling that yota back across that pad...

[Z-06]

The one where I post as "Buickman",

That seems to be totally enraptured with getting mentions in other media,

Of course it's GM (?) Inside News

How does it feel to carry the burden of that Hallowed name?

[mustang84]

GM-i? hey, that sounds like a model designation.

The Buick Lucerne GMi.

LOL

GM-i, you can read 10 pages of posts and not get much out of a topic on there.

I never really liked GMI that much...way too many overlapping forums. If you have an article on Ford, Chrysler, Toyota, etc. you have to jump through hoops to figure out which section to post it in. Not to mention that there are so many members but hardly ever anything but speculation and hot air posted. The bickering is worse, trolls abound, advertisements engulfing the site (I hate those damn pop up windows), Google Bot, and so many fanboys.

Although, Blue Oval Forums is worse when it comes to trolls...the same five or six trolls post non-stop BS and nobody ever bans them.

Edited June 2, 2007 by mustang84

[capriceman]

I deal with millions of alloys of metal a day and for a cam to shred at 6500 rpm is more serious then what they played it off as. I don't know how they made them but normally its Extruded steel or Forged If its high performance. If they casted them than shame on them. Its the cheapest way and it has no tinsel strength. Plus I'm wondering what alloy they used. Gallium? Any way This Is a huge problem. And should of been spotted before on dealer lots Shame on Toyota for not testing vehicles enough. I guess this is why the claim fastest drawing board to drive way time in the industry. You cant take shortcuts in the Autos industry.

Edited June 2, 2007 by capriceman

[balthazar]

Of course cast iron camshafts have a tensil strength... but they are not subjected to stretching/bending forces, so whatever that value is, it's not tested to any degree. Vibration is another, still minor matter.

For thousands of toyota camshafts to be snap-prone; either the metallurgy is all wrong/cheaped out, the manufacturing/machining is all wrong... or the shipment of camshafts was in that 40' box container in the tundra commercial, and seconds after the toy 'pulled' the container back up, the cable snapped and the load dropped to the base of the cliff... and toyota dusted them off and installed them.

Nah... that's not what happened- a silver-painted cardboard 'container' would not support the weight of cases of camshafts...

[regfootball]

I deal with millions of alloys of metal a day and for a cam to shred at 6500 rpm is more serious then what they played it off as. I don't know how they made them but normally its Extruded steel or Forged If its high performance. If they casted them than shame on them. Its the cheapest way and it has no tinsel strength. Plus I'm wondering what alloy they used. Gallium? Any way This Is a huge problem. And should of been spotted before on dealer lots Shame on Toyota for not testing vehicles enough. I guess this is why the claim fastest drawing board to drive way time in the industry. You cant take shortcuts in the Autos industry.

you're absolutely right. camshaft issues is a huge deal. trust me, i used to read the sho site every night and wonder to myself, 'when will i need a new motor'....because of a supposed manufacturing or design defect. even though i had no issues and no one i knew did, there was enough about the topic of improperly manufactured camshafts that made me know it was serious sh1t and that you had to at least worry about it.

why GM and Ford are not all over this in their ads somehow is beyond me.

if i were a turdra owner, i would be asking them to buy it back. maybe that's why there was that used turdra at the one GM dealer that was talked about on another topic. Maybe his cam snapped already!

are the tundra cams hollow tube shafts or solid?

Edited June 2, 2007 by regfootball

[Camino LS6]

Three strikes and you're out.

Toyota STILL can't build a real full-size pickup.

No long-time domestic truck buyers who hear of this will ever consider a Tundra as an option. Say goodbye to conquest sales,Toyota.

Good.

[ocnblu]

Every potential vehicle buyer needs to hear about this.

[Oracle of Delphi]

Well I left GMI and came here, there are many things that need to be corrected there. The list is to long to go through, those that go there know all to well the problems on that site.

[ToniCipriani]

Wow... 4 pages of posts, nothing from toyoguy yet. He must be hiding in a hole right now.

[Drew Dowdell]

Wow... 4 pages of posts, nothing from toyoguy yet. He must be hiding in a hole right now.

Yes... I think we need his comments in here. *warms up the phaser banks*

[76ChevyTrucker]

Hmm, a camshaft snapping.....that sounds like either one HELL of a cheap chunk of metal, or one HELL of a strong timing belt.

[regfootball]

Wow... 4 pages of posts, nothing from toyoguy yet. He must be hiding in a hole right now.

no, he's busy cleaning up shreds of metal from the engine bay. or trying to figure out why the new Xb and Xd get such poor gas mileage.

Edited June 13, 2007 by regfootball

[ponchoman49]

I deal with millions of alloys of metal a day and for a cam to shred at 6500 rpm is more serious then what they played it off as. I don't know how they made them but normally its Extruded steel or Forged If its high performance. If they casted them than shame on them. Its the cheapest way and it has no tinsel strength. Plus I'm wondering what alloy they used. Gallium? Any way This Is a huge problem. And should of been spotted before on dealer lots Shame on Toyota for not testing vehicles enough. I guess this is why the claim fastest drawing board to drive way time in the industry. You cant take shortcuts in the Autos industry.

Tinsel strength is a great way to describe Toyotas new Cam in the 5.7 liter V8.

[GMman]

The people who bought a tundra deserve to have their camshaft break in half. I hate toyota.

[AAS]

Tinsel strength is a great way to describe Toyotas new Cam in the 5.7 liter V8.

I guess only engineers and those that deal with metals etc. would catch that mistake, and consequently get that joke... And here I was, about to correct his spelling!

[regfootball]

just curious, how come castings have less strength?

I know the cams on my sho i think were forged, but that did no good because they splined the sprockets to the tube and press fit them. that was a bad design.

[Vettribution87]

I always believed that forging was stronger because you essentially have a greater density of molecules for a given item then with casting.

Casting (as far as I know) is melting the metal to a fluid state and pouring it into a mould to create a part.

Forging is more like heating the metal to a soft but still solid state and squishing it into a desirable shape by pressing it into a mould.

The down side to forging would be increased mass, which may need to be taken into account when making a part that rotates at great speed.

Another example of forging is in the development of swords used by Japanese Samurai of previous centuries.

These swords were impeccably strong because the blacksmith that made them would have got a fairly large piece of metal and heated it to a soft, malleable state, before folding it inward to create a cutting edge.

The blacksmith would continue the cycle of heat & fold hundreds of times over a period of 6 months.

After this, the sword produced would have a virtually un-dullable cutting blade that would seldom break.

[balthazar]

The sword-making proceedure outlined above also involved hammer-welding, which hardens metal many times over what straight forging will accomplish. It's not an apples-2-apples comparison.

Castings in IC engines --when well-engineered-- have a decisive advantage over forgings: they are more flexible, ie; less subseptible to vibration-based cracking/failures, whereas forgings are more brittle in addition to being somewhat heavier (and more expensive to produce).

[Intrepidation]

Katanas are regarded as the best swords in the world, due to their extreme strength and flexibility. European and other swords are more brittle, and because of the lack of flex, will break under stress far sooner than a katana. Some speculate that the Excalibur was created using the method that was used to create a masterwork katana.