What Cadillac Should do with its Future

[Jess]

I'd love to be a product manager for Cadillac. IF they have the engineering resources, then they should definitely launch an assault with a wide range of vehicles off the stellar Sigma platform instead of the upcoming Zeta platform. Keep the Sigma platform exclusive to Cadillacs and use the Zeta platform for the mainstream brands (Holden, Chevy, Pontiac, & Buick).

Instead of calling the CTS-based coupe, the CTC, they should call it the CSC for C-series Sport Coupe and CSW for C-series Sport Wagon. Do the same thing with the BLS-based coupe and call it the BSC for B-series Sport Coupe? How's that sound? Personally, I don't think a B-series range fits in with Cadillac's image.

1) They should keep the CTS in the entry-level luxury segment and offer both CSW, CSC coupe, & CSC convertible, along with a $40,000-50,000 long-wheel-base CTS-L sedan available with both 3.6L and 6.0L Corvette engines. Executives would love the CTS-L sedan with a 405hp 6.0L V-8!!

2) Then create a redesigned, bigger, longer STS and its long-wheel-base STS-L version to battle the 750i and 750iL. Beside the new 302 hp 3.6L engine, offer a range of more powerful V-8 engines. A much bigger, longer STS and even longer STS-L would attract more buyers. Look at the Audi A8 when a long-wheel-base A8-L model was added!! Sales shot up!!! The same can be said for the new Lexus LS-460-L. Then Cadillac could one-up the competition by offering an even longer version of the STS-L called the SLS with an extra 6 inches of wheelbase added. That would create a huge rear compartment for ottomans and reclining seats ala the Maybach 62.

3) Create a 5-series competitor called the FTS (F-series Touring Sedan) or LTS (L-series Touring Sedan) or MTS (M-series Touring Sedan). Then add a long-wheel-base (LWB) version along with a sleek sportwagon, LWB estate wagon, and coupe/convertible variants to battle the 5-series and 6-series range.

4) The SRX should not be dropped at all. It needs to be redesigned to look more massive, masculine, and more SUV-like. Right now, it's not tall enough. Look at how popular the BMW X-5 is, especially in V-8 form!!

[gm4life]

I like your thoughts but keep the DTS around too, and in FWD. I have a feeling I will get shot again for saying this but 2 RWD sedans, one RWD roadster and 2 RWD SUV's is enough...

[Drew Dowdell]

I like your thoughts but keep the DTS around too, and in FWD. I have a feeling I will get shot again for saying this but 2 RWD sedans, one RWD roadster and 4 RWD/AWD SUV's is enough...

BMW = 2 RWD roadsters, 3 RWD/AWD sedans,2 RWD/AWD wagons, 2 RWD/AWD coupes, 2 RWD/AWD convertibles, 2 RWD/AWD SUVs <with another on the way>, 1 mini-van on the way.

Mercedes Benz = 2 RWD roadsters, 4 RWD/AWD sedans, 1 wagon, 1 Minivan, 2 SUVs, 1 convertible, 1 coupe <I think I missed something>

Audi = 1 hatch, 3 Sedans, 1 SUV, 1 roadster, 1 convertible

Lexus = 4 sedans, 1 roadster, 3 SUVs

Is it any wonder that Cadillac is getting their ass handed to them in terms of sales when their product mix is 4 SUVS, 3 Sedans, and and ultra priced roadster?

Cadillac needs to match at least MB but preferably BMW, model for model.... except perhaps for the minivan part.

[gm4life]

They need a FWD car, like Lexus.

[CaddyXLR-V]

They need a FWD car, like Lexus.

No, your confusing what you want with what they need. Cadillac needs to be able to command higher prices for their cars, they Don't need FWD wanna-be luxury cars that can't compete with other cars it's size.

If money were no object(which for most people that buy luxury cars that is true), which is a better car, 760iL or a DTS?

Cadillacs goal should be to make a better car then other luxury makes, not a cheaper car.

Or rename it: Cadillac, the Standard of the World, if you can't afford a BMW or Mercedes.

[97regalGS]

They need a FWD car, like Lexus.

um, no. you are like a broken record.

[ClassyEldo]

In my opinion, the "Alphabet Soup" names stink! Where is creativity? Sport model versions can certainly join in the letter monikers, but there need to be some recognizable names--consumers relate to those and associate them too much with Cadillac's lineage and image. Well, this subject has been beat to death, but I'm still not giving up, and I'm registering a "vote" as a consumer as someone who prefers real names, e.g. Escalade!

[gm4life]

No they need a FWD DTS it wast the BEST selling Cadillac in 2006. Even beating out the "hot selling" CTS.

[CaddyXLR-V]

No they need a FWD DTS it wast the BEST selling Cadillac in 2006. Even beating out the "hot selling" CTS.

Fleet? 70+ year old buyers? That's definately what Cadillac needs more of.

Cadillac sells better than Rolls Royce or Bentley, but that that doesn't make them better cars. Just think, Cadillac USED to be a competitor to both of those companies. Now what does it compete with? BMW? Don't think so, not when Cadillac's similarly sized cars have to be sold at a 30% discount. Don't worry, once the DTS is gone, you can still get a Lincoln like you want.

[gm4life]

Rolls Royce hahaha, that is Bentley, S-Class and 7 Series fighters. Anyone who buys a Rolls wouldn't consider a car under 100K! I want RWD but within reason. It is amazing how performance orientanted some people are. I am a huge supporter of the new CTS, the new G8 and hoping we get the RWD Park Avenue in my sig in the USA. So seriously, give it up and let me say this FWD or RWD it has to priced right like it is now and people right now they buy it because of value won't and old farts who want FWD won't. Then they will just go spend the same amount of money a Lexus, BMW or Audi etc. Fleets are good just no to rental compaines. And I have seen alot of people under 60 in the new DTS's in my town. I also have seen alot of 30 somethings in new Lucerne CXS's! FWD with a new platform and 6spd automatic, along with a STS replacement like SLS to go after the 7 Series is my vote. Let the DTS remain in it unqiue spot and let the CTS battle 3 Series on price and 5 Series on performance and size. Having said all that I don't think 1 FWD Caddy is unreasonable at all. Then you can count on more people that will buy FWD to get an Avalon or Lexus ES 350. So seriously I see the whole performance point but in a car like that it is not the point. Look at the GXP GP great handling and this is something they can give the performance DTS with a 325hp V8 and a 6spd. auto I would be you would be suprised with a complete redesign *(not like the one in 2006)* how many they could sell. Prolly closer to 100K units. Sometimes performance isn't the only thing on a buyers mind especially a Cadillac buyer.

Edited May 27, 2007 by gm4life

[ehaase]

Since the G and W bodies are being discontinued and since GM can't afford to develop another FWD platform (a Lambda derivative would be too heavy), the only way Cadillac would ever get a FWD car is with a super stretched Epsilon II, which I don't know is possible.

[Drew Dowdell]

What about AWD for all but the lowest of the low of the DTS. Improve the Lucerne enough to take over the bulk of the FWD buyers.

I think it's possible that people will still go for it, I know a guy who just traded his Maxima in on a Lucerne CXL V6 because he liked that it was quieter and smoother than his Max.

He's 37 years old.

I drove it yesterday... and while the engine doesn't have the zing of the 3.6, it's not at all underpowered. It is vault like quiet. After spending an hour or two driving it around, I got into my CTS to drive home..... the CTS suddenly sounded loud and raucous!

[Paolino]

What about AWD for all but the lowest of the low of the DTS. Improve the Lucerne enough to take over the bulk of the FWD buyers.

I think it's possible that people will still go for it, I know a guy who just traded his Maxima in on a Lucerne CXL V6 because he liked that it was quieter and smoother than his Max.

He's 37 years old.

I drove it yesterday... and while the engine doesn't have the zing of the 3.6, it's not at all underpowered. It is vault like quiet. After spending an hour or two driving it around, I got into my CTS to drive home..... the CTS suddenly sounded loud and raucous!

That's cause the CTS is a piece of &#036;h&#33;.

Seriously though, I'm going to assume there will be a quiettuned 3.6L in the Lucerne next year when the 3800's are gone, so that'll be nice.

I would love to have a DTS-length car stay in the lineup... but it has to be more competitive. Sorry, but no more 4-speed autos in Cadillacs.

[gm4life]

I agree no more four speed autos. It needs a to be more refined and must have a 6spd. auto with a revamp platform.

[97regalGS]

I agree no more four speed autos. It needs a to be more refined and must have a 6spd. auto with a revamp platform.

you've hit the nail on the head. there is no revamped platform. so unless you want to pull one out of your a$$, get off the DTS on FWD forever kick. it ain't gonna happen.

[ehaase]

And some folks need to get off the Lucerne on FWD forever kick also, because it will go on Zeta as there will be no large FWD platform for the Lucerne either. GM is reducing the number of platforms.

[Oracle of Delphi]

I agree no more four speed autos. It needs a to be more refined and must have a 6spd. auto with a revamp platform.

In 2 years you will be saying, "I agree no more six speed autos. It needs to be more refined and must have a 8spd. auto with a revamp platform.".

[gm4life]

I am not getting off it, because it just doesn't the sales don't merit radically changing such a popular model.

[ehaase]

The DTS/Deville sold far better back in the 1960's, 1970's, and 1980's when it was RWD.

[Hollingsworth]

I am not getting off it, because it just doesn't the sales don't merit radically changing such a popular model.

What makes you think that sales won't be just as high if the DTS were rear wheel drive? Do the 70+ crowd really care if a car is RWD or FWD, as long as it's silent, smooth, and conservatively styled?

Edited May 28, 2007 by Hollingsworth

[Flybrian]

As I've said before, DeVille sells well regardless of drivetrain configuration because its simply a better car than its closest competitor - the Town Car.

[gm4life]

I know that Fly, but you still want FWD? Right? :AH-HA_wink: Actually Deville sales in the late 80's and early 90's were excellent I am talking like over 120,000 units a year. (Guess what they were FWD!) And look at the Fleetwood they didn't sell enough so it got the axe. I think if we got a RWD DTS it would suffer the same fate the Fleetwood and Roadmaster did. The CTS has been sucessful because it is in a different market segment same with the STS. A would be a traditional car like the Fleetwood was and prolly flop because of higher pricing and people would say why not get a BMW, Lexus or Audi... (For the same cost!) Thats why the DTS needs to stay FWD with a 6spd. auto and new styling with a new platform. It has a unqiue area of the market.

[balthazar]

Actually Deville sales in the late 80's and early 90's were excellent I am talking like over 120,000 units a year. (Guess what they were FWD!)

Actually Deville sales in the late 70's were even more excellent I am talking like over 205,000 units a year. (Guess what they were RWD!)

The percentage of DTS buyers who's #1 reason for picking this Cadillac over a number of RWD competitors has to be a strict minority- it's just not that deciding a factor for the vast majority of consumers here. In other words gm4life, you are greatly over-estimating the importance of which wheels are driven. Another factor to consider is the comparison of Deville/DTS sales vs. CTS sales since '02- one has been steadily climbing and the other has been slowly dropping. Even that, I will not hold up as evidence for FWD vs. RWD- because I cannot claim that is the fact and I also don't believe it.

The DTS sells for what it is as a complete package, not for a single engineering arrangement. Keep the majority of the advantages/features/style/room/quality in place and you can guarantee the same (or possibly even better) numbers even tho it might be RWD. I'd absolutely bank on that.

[gm4life]

Actually some good points were made above. Take this into consideration if it were to go RWD wouldn't that jack the price up and thus being one less reason for picking the DTS. Value is not a bad thing even in the luxury market (I know it sounds funny!) For like the low 50's you can have a loaded one Nav and all and a loaded 5 Series climbs closer to 70K and the DTS is still bigger and a 7 Series starts at like 70K stripped.

Edited May 29, 2007 by gm4life

[NOS2006]

I have a feeling the DTS and STS will end production in.. oh, say about 2 model years, and will be replaced by an all-new Cadillac. You know, kind of how the G8 is supposed to be replacing the Grand Prix and Bonneville (although the Bonne's been out of production for a few years already).

[emh]

Personally, I don't think a B-series range fits in with Cadillac's image.

Yes it does, and this is the biggest hole in Cadillac's lineup (not that there aren't other missing pieces, but this is the most costly one in terms of attracting newer generations of buyers to Cadillac). There's nothing wrong with having a well-designed, well-equipped, sport-luxury sedan/coupe/convertible with an excellent powertrain. Luxury and image is no longer defined by size...

[cire]

I think if Cadillac wants to compete in the same luxury arena as BMW and Mercedes, it needs to go completely rear wheel drive. BMW and Mercedes customers have become accustomed to this setup and will never consider Cadillac if they retain a front wheel drive vehicle in their lineup. Cadillac also needs to discontinue using four speed automatics in their products; the competition have already moved way beyond this. I also prefer model names to alpha/numeric model designations, but I do not think Cadillac will return to model names (model names do not convey the Euro-luxury image that Cadillac seems to be chasing). I think the 2008 CTS is a big step in the right direction for Cadillac to achieve its goal of becoming truly competitive in the luxury market; Cadillac just needs to expand on this base.

Here are some product ideas for Cadillac to compete in the luxury market:

* Market the 2008 CTS as an affordable competitor to the 5 Series and E Class. GM has impressed me by keeping the current CTS on the market for only 5 model years (2003-2007). It shows that they are no longer content to let their products grow stale in the market place. I only hope this is a trend that they can and will continue.

* Bring out more variations of the 2008 CTS (coupe, convertible, wagon). I understand that GM is already considering and/or working on this.

* Develop a smaller rear wheel drive sedan, coupe, convertible, and wagon to compete with the 3 Series and C Class.

* Eliminate the STS and DTS and develope a large rear wheel drive sedan (maybe a large four door convertible too) that will directly compete with the 7 Series and S Class.

* Keep the XLR roadster and redesign it on a timely basis.

* Develop a smaller and more affordable rear wheel drive roadster for the brand.

* Keep the SRX crossover, but redesign it to look more like a crossover and less like a tall station wagon (wagons will be offered elsewhere in the lineup).

* Develop a smaller crossover (I heard this is already in the planning stages).

* Keep the Escalade SUV and SUT around as long as they sell well. I would eliminate them from the lineup as soon as sales start to dwindle. Truck based vehicles do not fit in a luxury marque's lineup, especially in a fuel conscious society. This would also justify GMC's existence by allowing it to offer upscale truck based products (Denali trim levels).

* I believe these suggestions might help Cadillac to win over a younger customer base.

As far as large front wheel drive sedans; I believe there is still a market for them. I do not believe that a luxury marque can upgrade their public image by including them in their lineup. Buick is still an ideal brand to offer this kind of product. Finding a platform would be a problem with the next Impala going rear wheel drive, though. Keeping a platform going or developing a new large front wheel drive platform just for Buick is not cost effective. As much as I like the exterior design of the current Lucerne (although I hate the name, the antiquated 3.8 liter V6 engine/4 speed auto transmission combo, and I think the interior design lacks emotion), it appears to be a dying breed at GM. I don't think there is room at Chevrolet, Saturn, or Saab (Pontiac and Cadillac need to be entirely rear wheel drive) for a large front wheel drive sedan.

Edited July 30, 2007 by cire