09 Caddy CTS-V "flat out incredible"

[vrazzhledazzle]

The next-generation Cadillac CTS-V will have "a power level only described as unexpectedly high,” GM vice chairman Bob Lutz told Car and Driver. He described the vehicle as "flat-out incredible. I’ve never driven anything like that."

Based on the 2008 Cadillac CTS sedan, the new CTS-V os expected to arrive later this year as a 2009 model.

Specific details of the CTS-V's engine remain a mystery. Some sources say power will come from a 4.6-liter naturally aspirated V8, while others insist a supercharged V8 is in store for the hot CTS. Some sources even claim this car will share the "Blue Devil" Corvette's supercharged V8.

C&D says the 505 hp, 7.0-liter LS7 V8 that currently powers the Corvette is a distinct possibility, considering the previous-generation CTS-V is powered by the 400 hp 6.0-liter Corvette LS2 powerplant.

Recent spy photos have shown the 2009 CTS-V undergoing extensive testing at the Nürburgring track in Germany and elsewhere. Prototypes feature a new grille design and a massive lower air-intake — both sporting a sporty mesh finish in the familiar V-spec tradition.

Link: http://www.leftlanenews.com/cadillac-cts-v-future.html

I think Car & Driver is right, hopefully.

Edited April 19, 2007 by vrazzhledazzle

[gm4life]

I'd take one from the sounds of it. 500 horses out of a Cadillac? Sounds like music to my ears.

[Oracle of Delphi]

That's my next car in 09 or 10!

EDIT: Well maybe, I'm leaning to BMW's 530xi now.

Edited April 22, 2007 by Pontiac Custom-S

[Chris_Doane]

I'd take one from the sounds of it. 500 horses out of a Cadillac? Sounds like music to my ears.

Wait till you actually hear the motor. It's pure evil.

[Northstar]

Isn't there a sound clip of it somewhere? Seems like it was posted a while ago.

[91z4me]

Wait till you actually hear the motor. It's pure evil.

Did we get video when we heard it?

[Chris_Doane]

Did we get video when we heard it?

I didn't get video when I heard/saw it, no.

They drove it for 2 seconds and then put the cover back on.

[Northstar]

There is a video of it somewhere, though.

[Z-06]

There is a video of it somewhere, though.

Yeah it was on edmunds when they were testing at the Ring about 5 months ago.

[regfootball]

i'd rather it had the STSv's powertrain. or something like it.

[RBB]

Is it just me, or is that an intercooler behind the lower intake:

http://images.leftlanenews.com/content/5-oct18-cts.jpg

-RBB

[El Scorcho]

http://www.caranddriver.com/dailyautoinsid...llac-cts-v.html

Car and Driver has some more spy shots and a video of it lapping the Ring. I haven't watched it, so I'm not sure if it's what you guys are talking about.

[Drew Dowdell]

Listening to to that video two things stand out:

1. That doesn't sound like a Northstar start up. Northstars have a very distinct starter sound. I can always tell when a northstar is starting up without having the turn a look at the car. <same goes for honda 4cylinders and GM 3800s and various Fords>

2. the idle does NOT sound like an OHC engine. that's gotta be a pushrod under there.

[maxximus1]

i know this car is just a test mule, but i hope the final production car will only have tailpipes showing and not the actual muffler itself. i think it looks so tacky and unfinished when i see it like that.

Edited April 20, 2007 by maxximus1

[Z-06]

Listening to to that video two things stand out:

1. That doesn't sound like a Northstar start up. Northstars have a very distinct starter sound. I can always tell when a northstar is starting up without having the turn a look at the car. <same goes for honda 4cylinders and GM 3800s and various Fords>

2. the idle does NOT sound like an OHC engine. that's gotta be a pushrod under there.

Yeah it is definitely a pushrod. The initial grumble reminds me of my friend's LS6. It does seem to have a supercharger whine, although I may be wrong.

[Chris_Doane]

It's a blown LS motor.

[97regalGS]

It's a blown LS motor.

why that instead of the LS7?

[ZL-1]

why that instead of the LS7?

More power and more torque? That 'unexpectedly high' comment could mean 'higher than M5'. Edited April 22, 2007 by ZL-1

[Northstar]

why that instead of the LS7?

Cheaper.

[Chris_Doane]

why that instead of the LS7?

I dont know.

Like Northie said, probably mostly cost. The LS7 is assembled by hand at the Performance Build Center in Wixom. The "LSA" motor for the CTSv will be built in a regular engine plant.

[91z4me]

I dont know.

Like Northie said, probably mostly cost. The LS7 is assembled by hand at the Performance Build Center in Wixom. The "LSA" motor for the CTSv will be built in a regular engine plant.

Is that official or rumor?

[Chris_Doane]

Is that official or rumor?

Official, but, from a while ago. I assume it hasn't changed since then as I haven't heard otherwise.

Edited April 23, 2007 by Chris_Doane

[ZL-1]

Official, but, from a while ago. I assume it hasn't changed since then as I haven't heard otherwise.

And have you heard anything regarding power/torque numbers?

[dado]

Official, but, from a while ago. I assume it hasn't changed since then as I haven't heard otherwise.

LSA? is that engine based on ls3 or?...does it has a supercharger.

[Chris_Doane]

500+ hp. Blown.

[CSpec]

The LSA is one of a family of supercharged smallblocks. The Blue Devil engine is one of them. I dunno if the others are still around though.

[ZL-1]

500+ hp

Aha, so there might be, for example, a 550hp tuning for that engine in the CTS-V so GM can advertise the 'we have more hp than M5' line.

[Chris_Doane]

Aha, so there might be, for example, a 550hp tuning for that engine in the CTS-V so GM can advertise the 'we have more hp than M5' line.

I didn't say that, no.

[jbartley]

most excellllllent!

[deanh8]

Yeah that definitely sounded like an LSx starting up

[ZL-1]

I didn't say that, no.

I know: I was just crossing your '500hp+' post with Lutz's 'unexpected power' comment and doing some speculating. I'm thinking GM will not pass on the opportunity to outpower the M5 and M6 with both the CTS-V and the Blue Devil. Edited April 28, 2007 by ZL-1

[nightwave]

Also, it's (relatively) easy to get more power out of a supercharged engine; just crank up the boost. So, should BMW's power jump in a year or two, they'd be able to turn up the power quickly.

At least that's my view on it.

[eldiablobanshee]

And already he’s talking smack, warning a certain Teutonic competitor that unless the next M5 is substantially better, the CTS-V “will suck the doors off” the competition.

When a big wig from a company tells its top competitor witch makes a great handling 500 bhp sedan, that if the replacement is only slightly better its going to get its doors blown off , he is definitely got more than just a 550 bhp sedan in his back pocket. My money is on a 600+ bhp blue devil engine, since the blue devil will be low production the CTS-V this will spread the development cost of the engine.

[Mikko O]

Love the video. I'd agree that this is a Corvette pushrod motor, and probably the LS7.

A 500hp family rocket ship.!!

[91z4me]

Love the video. I'd agree that this is a Corvette pushrod motor, and probably the LS7.

A 500hp family rocket ship.!!

500+ hp. Blown.

[autoeng]

My bet is that the motor will be the LSA, a 6.2L, supercharged, small block. Looking at the pictures, you can see the bulge added to top of the hood. If it was the LS7, it would fit under the hood without the power bulge. It will be similar to the next supercharger LS9 expected in the super Vette. I've also read that the LSA in the CTS will be available with either a manual or automatic transmission.

[Chris_Doane]

And already he’s talking smack, warning a certain Teutonic competitor that unless the next M5 is substantially better, the CTS-V “will suck the doors off” the competition.

When a big wig from a company tells its top competitor witch makes a great handling 500 bhp sedan, that if the replacement is only slightly better its going to get its doors blown off , he is definitely got more than just a 550 bhp sedan in his back pocket. My money is on a 600+ bhp blue devil engine, since the blue devil will be low production the CTS-V this will spread the development cost of the engine.

No chance of that or the LS7.

It's the LSA.

Edited April 30, 2007 by Chris_Doane

[dado]

No chance of that or the LS7.

It's the LSA.

What is the differences between lsa engine an ls9 engine? Is it a different block or?

[Chris_Doane]

What is the differences between lsa engine an ls9 engine? Is it a different block or?

One has more power than the other.

Pretty sure its the same block.

I dont know what the technical differences are.

Edited April 30, 2007 by Chris_Doane

[dado]

One has more power than the other.

Pretty sure its the same block.

I dont know what the technical differences are.

Is there any chance that new cts-v will have supercharged V8 DOHC (ultra or northstar) engine?

[91z4me]

Is there any chance that new cts-v will have supercharged V8 DOHC (ultra or northstar) engine?

No, Chris just stated that the OHV Gen IV LSA is the powerplant.

[eldiablobanshee]

even if it is going to have the LSA i am still putting my money on it having over 600 bhp

[Chris_Doane]

even if it is going to have the LSA i am still putting my money on it having over 600 bhp

And you'd be 100% wrong.

[dado]

And you'd be 100% wrong.

And how about 550 HP? Is it a safe bet? Edited May 2, 2007 by dado

[91z4me]

And how about 550 HP? Is it a safe bet?

450+ hp is a 100% safe bet. Anything above that we can't be for sure on.

[dado]

450+ hp is a 100% safe bet. Anything above that we can't be for sure on.

Well if next cts-v is going against m5, amg 63 etc then 450+ or even 500 hp will not be enough..

[Chris_Doane]

And how about 550 HP? Is it a safe bet?

500+ hp. Blown.