toyota may be afraid

[loki]

business week article.

HERE

some of the politics, "media backlash" possibilities, history of the toy' invasion, and what their PR is trying to do about it

Edited February 25, 2007 by loki

[regfootball]

Here's Chrysler communications chief Jason Vines: "The thing I resent is Toyota wrapping themselves in the American flag," he says. "We still employ more people and contribute more to the economy."

Who cares what Detroit thinks? Well, strange as it sounds, Toyota does. Its executives may privately relish victory at the expense of General Motors (GM ), Ford (F ), and Chrysler (DCX ), but here's the truth: Toyota is afraid to be No. 1—or at least what that implies. And not just because one of its slogans is "Run scared." It's because the extra scrutiny could undo much of the hard work of the past 20 years. "We constantly need to think about the potential backlash against us," Toyota CEO Katsuaki Watanabe tells BusinessWeek in an exclusive interview. "It's very important for our company and products to earn citizenship in the U.S. We need to make sure we are accepted."

a bit of a sickening article but GM is starting to wise up and get savvy in this behind the scenes PR hogwash stuff.

it is clear that winning market share in the future will not be done with just good products, it will be done by f'ing with the public's heads and blowing politicians.

HEADING FOR THE HEARTLAND

Today, Toyota is the most respected car company in America. And yet to become the biggest-selling carmaker in the U.S., it needs to make serious inroads into the heartland, where imports are often considered un-American and the pickup truck rules the road. Nationally, Toyota has a 17.4% retail share. But once you break down the numbers by region, a more nuanced picture emerges. In the Midwest Toyota has just 11%, according to R.L. Polk & Co., which tracks car registrations. And in Texas, Toyota has a meager 5% share of the pickup market. Mike Foster will proudly tell you why. A 50-year-old homebuilder from San Antonio, he has 195,000 miles on his Ford F-150. "I've never owned a Japanese car of any kind," says Foster. "I believe in supporting American jobs. I know Toyota creates jobs here, but the money goes back to Japan."

toyota needs to know that the midwesterners and texans have stronger principles in this area and think more in terms of core values personally than east and west lefties do, although there are some factions of the midwest and such that are weakening as well.

Edited February 25, 2007 by regfootball

[Intrepidation]

And in Texas, Toyota has a meager 5% share of the pickup market. Mike Foster will proudly tell you why. A 50-year-old homebuilder from San Antonio, he has 195,000 miles on his Ford F-150. "I've never owned a Japanese car of any kind," says Foster. "I believe in supporting American jobs. I know Toyota creates jobs here, but the money goes back to Japan."

Quoted for truth.

Edited February 26, 2007 by Dodgefan

[balthazar]

Today, Toyota is the most respected car company in America.

Sounds like an interesting survey; anyone have a link to this piece of research?

[AxelTheRed]

Toyota spent the last twenty years bulldozing through the American auto industry, spearheading the import invasion, helping put the final nails in AMC's coffin, and then helping drive the Big Three to the edge of oblivion (not to mention the side effect of bringing the cities of Detroit and Flint to their knees) and now that they're almost to their primary goal of World's Biggest Automaker, they're AFRAID of it?

This is sickening PR bull$h!.

"Potential backlash" God I would LOVE to see that. I'd love to see people throwing away Toyotas for Fords and Chevys; Lexuses for Chryslers and Buicks. I'd sit there and watch it with a tub of popcorn...it would pure entertainment for me.

Edited February 26, 2007 by AxelTheRed

[FAPTurbo]

Toyota spent the last twenty years bulldozing through the American auto industry, spearheading the import invasion, helping put the final nails in AMC's coffin . . .

Because Toyota manufactured efficient and well built vehicles which appealed to customers? What were people supposed to buy? K-Cars?!...

As much as I tend to dislike Toyota, I give them credit where credit is due.

[AxelTheRed]

Because Toyota manufactured efficient and well built vehicles which appealed to customers? What were people supposed to buy? K-Cars?!...

As much as I tend to dislike Toyota, I give them credit where credit is due.

I was making a point. They're afraid now after all they've done? Its ridiculous.

[Guest YellowJacket894]

And in Texas, Toyota has a meager 5% share of the pickup market. Mike Foster will proudly tell you why. A 50-year-old homebuilder from San Antonio, he has 195,000 miles on his Ford F-150. "I've never owned a Japanese car of any kind," says Foster. "I believe in supporting American jobs. I know Toyota creates jobs here, but the money goes back to Japan."

Give that guy a f@#king prize. I can't say it much better than that myself.

[BrewSwillis]

Because Toyota manufactured efficient and well built vehicles which appealed to customers? What were people supposed to buy? K-Cars?!...

As much as I tend to dislike Toyota, I give them credit where credit is due.

They did not do that! That's the misconception. Toyota, and all the other Asians, started out with dirt cheap alternatives.....and Americans can't resist things that are dirt cheap, no matter where they are made. The only "appeal" to customers was the price. Toyota and Honda did not start making quality products till the mid to late 80's......and alot of their 80's models would rust out in like 4 years.

Toyota has an undeserved long time reputation for quality. They may have passed the Big 3 in the 90's, but the Big 3 are back on par, and will never be forgiven for slipping under Toyota for that short period of time.

Toyota still sells cars due to lower price, although not as much as they used to (due to their quality "free pass" in the media), by loading their cars with standard options and pricing them against more stripped down Detroit competition......which is due to their unfair business practices allowed by the US government.

[Intrepidation]

They did not do that! That's the misconception. Toyota, and all the other Asians, started out with dirt cheap alternatives.....and Americans can't resist things that are dirt cheap, no matter where they are made. The only "appeal" to customers was the price. Toyota and Honda did not start making quality products till the mid to late 80's......and alot of their 80's models would rust out in like 4 years.

Toyota has an undeserved long time reputation for quality. They may have passed the Big 3 in the 90's, but the Big 3 are back on par, and will never be forgiven for slipping under Toyota for that short period of time.

Toyota still sells cars due to lower price, although not as much as they used to (due to their quality "free pass" in the media), by loading their cars with standard options and pricing them against more stripped down Detroit competition......which is due to their unfair business practices allowed by the US government.

Even though the Camry sells at a premium compared to similarly equipped domestic midsizers...They sell of perceived quality not lower price.

[BrewSwillis]

Even though the Camry sells at a premium compared to similarly equipped domestic midsizers...They sell of perceived quality not lower price.

Check the standard safety features, extra gears on the transmission, expensive engine technology, etc. Toyota will still offer more for your money, due to unlevel competition. Just ask the car magazines.

[Flybrian]

I respect Honda much more than I do Toyota for reasons that are just plain obvious.

[CARBIZ]

Every time the hoary subject of Japanese superiority is raised, someone HAS to mention the K-car.

Look, boys and girls: the K-car when judged against its peers of the day, was a decent car. In Canada, where cars barely make it to 8 years for being eaten alive by rust, I can tell you that we still see the odd K-car rattling around. There are absolutely no Tercels from the same time period: all the lift gates rotted out.

I am sick and tired of people rubbing Citations and K-cars in our faces when the truth is the Civics and Tercels of the same period were POS, too. Anemic and under powered, unless you drove a stick. I drove my roommate's 1973 Datsun 210 (with a stick) and then rented a 1982 Datsun 210 with automatic - still under powered, tiny and tinny. They were base cars, no a/c, now power windows, nothing.

Let's just agree to forget the '80s - everybody built crap in the '80s. But the problem is that all these so-called experts are basing their opinions on what Detroit built 20 years ago!

[Intrepidation]

Every time the hoary subject of Japanese superiority is raised, someone HAS to mention the K-car.

Look, boys and girls: the K-car when judged against its peers of the day, was a decent car. In Canada, where cars barely make it to 8 years for being eaten alive by rust, I can tell you that we still see the odd K-car rattling around. There are absolutely no Tercels from the same time period: all the lift gates rotted out.

I am sick and tired of people rubbing Citations and K-cars in our faces when the truth is the Civics and Tercels of the same period were POS, too. Anemic and under powered, unless you drove a stick. I drove my roommate's 1973 Datsun 210 (with a stick) and then rented a 1982 Datsun 210 with automatic - still under powered, tiny and tinny. They were base cars, no a/c, now power windows, nothing.

Let's just agree to forget the '80s - everybody built crap in the '80s. But the problem is that all these so-called experts are basing their opinions on what Detroit built 20 years ago!

We owned 2 K-cars: an Aries wagon and a Reliant sedan. They were good little cars, and were bullet-proof as far as reliability was concerned. We got rid of the Aries because it rusted out, and we needed a car with more room (the back seats are not kid-friendly over 10 yrs). The engine was kept and put in a Spirit. I think the only time it ever broke down was at a gas station. The Reliant was sold/traded for the white `87 Shadow 2.2L Turbo. For their time they were good. I still know of 2 or 3 of them that people own, and one for sale that I see everyday on my way to and from school at a dealership.

[haypops]

Toyota needs to know that the midwesterners and texans have stronger principles in this area and think more in terms of core values personally than east and west lefties do, although there are some factions of the midwest and such that are weakening as well.

It really is more complex than that.

My son in-law was going to lease a Dodge Dakota for my eldest of 9 grand kids, but the advertised price was for mid-Westerners only. So it isn't so much that you people have stronger principles than us Hollywood types as much as you get a better deal. That said Southern California is Chevy's biggest sales area. So not only do we lefties have a better tan, but obviously better values too.

Over at the Ford forum there is an interesting thread on Navistar.

http://www.cheersandgears.com/forums/index...showtopic=15740

This Waranville, IL (part of the Midwest) company is doing more harm to Ford than Toyota or us left cost lefties could ever manage.

My vehicles -- '99 Pontiac GrandAm, "96 GMC Sonoma, 2006 Newbalance 992

Edited February 26, 2007 by haypops

[BrewSwillis]

QUOTE(regfootball @ Feb 25 2007, 11:40 AM) *

Toyota needs to know that the midwesterners and texans have stronger principles in this area and think more in terms of core values personally than east and west lefties do, although there are some factions of the midwest and such that are weakening as well.

It really is more complex than that.

My son in-law was going to lease a Dodge Dakota for my eldest of 9 grand kids, but the advertised price was for mid-Westerners only. So it isn't so much that you people have stronger principles than us Hollywood types as much as you get a better deal. That said Southern California is Chevy's biggest sales area. So not only do we lefties have a better tan, but obviously better values too.

Japanese automakers topple Big Three market share in Calif.

For the first time ever, Californians bought more cars and trucks from Japanese automakers than domestic ones in 2006, according to the California Motor Car Dealers Association. By the end of the week, state residents will have bought 938,839 Japanese brand vehicles and 859,206 from the Big Three.

That gives Japanese automakers a 44.8 percent share of the California market, compared with 41.0 percent for the American nameplates. Nationally GM, Ford and Chrysler have a 53.9 percent share of the U.S. market, while Japanese brands have a 34.8 percent share.

http://www.leftlanenews.com/2006/12/27/jap...share-in-calif/

[haypops]

For the first time ever, Californians bought more cars and trucks from Japanese automakers than domestic ones in 2006, according to the California Motor Car Dealers Association. By the end of the week, state residents will have bought 938,839 Japanese brand vehicles and 859,206 from the Big Three.

I guess that means Chrysler and/or Ford aren't holding up there end as Chevy says we are their biggest coustomer.

[AxelTheRed]

Completely off topic, but reading this thread got me wishing that America had more major automakers.

[haypops]

Completely off topic, but reading this thread got me wishing that America had more major automakers.

My first car was '63 Studebaker. My last car before I left my parents home for my present home in California was a '73 AMC hornet bought after splitting the cost of new '71 AMC Hornet wagon for my older brother. When I got settled in California, the first car that I bought was '69 AMC Rambler American for $450. Several years later I bought a very used DJ-5 (mail Jeep) and then later a stunning AMC Jeep CJ7 that even my teen age daughters thought was cool.

As a child there was a Packard repair shop down the street from my Uncle's house. Good times -- good times.

[Oracle of Delphi]

If Toyotas are so good, where are all their cars that are 20, 30 and 40 years old? There are pleanty of 60's, 70's and 80's American cars out there, but where are the Toyotas of that era? I guess they just rusted away!

[siegen]

There are pleanty of 60's, 70's and 80's American cars out there

Restored, unused, or taken extremely good care of. 60's and 70's American cars are collector cars, Toyota's are not.

[CARBIZ]

NOT THAT I AM DEFENDING TOYOTA (gasp!), but it is a little unfair to compare how many 35 year old vehicles are still on the road. Firstly, because GM/Ford sold a helluva lot more than Toyopet/Datsun, etc. Secondly, why are there so many Cadillacs from the '60s on the road, yet almost NO station wagons from the same era? Were the Cadillacs built that much better, or were they just cared for better and treated with more respect? There was a time when the big Chevy, Ford and Pontiac wagons (we had a '66 Pontiac wagon when I was a kid) absolutely polluted the streets. Where are they now? In the same vein, why are Mopar muscle cars going for insane money at the auctions, yet Camaros are generally more reasonable? Answer: GM sold something like 200k Camaros in a good year while the Dodge/Plymouth mid-size muscle cars never broke 100k and they were treated as "beaters" (Dukes of Hazzard anyone) until very recently.

As I have said, let's just agree to forget the '80s and focus on what GM and Toyota are doing now.

[Robert Hall]

Restored, unused, or taken extremely good care of. 60's and 70's American cars are collector cars, Toyota's are not.

Yes, but not really relevant to today's car sales... the # and percentage of '90s vehicles still on the road is a more relevant statistic, since the '60s-70s vehicles would be more likely collector cars than daily drivers, and '90s cars are still seen in large quantities.

Edited February 28, 2007 by moltar

[bowtie_dude]

Yes, but not really relevant to today's car sales... the # and percentage of '80s and '90s vehicles still on the road is a more relevant statistic, since the '60s-70s vehicles would be more likely collector cars than daily drivers..

At this point most vehicles from the 80s, unless they have been taken special care of, have rusted out. Toyotas, Hondas, Chevys, Fords, Buicks, Olds, etc etc ALL look like trash.

GM, for the most part, had gotten reliability back under control by the mid-90s and I see many many GMs on the road from the mid-late-90s still running great.

However, set foot inside one of these decade-old cars and there you see the difference.

[A Horse With No Name]

My first car was '63 Studebaker. My last car before I left my parents home for my present home in California was a '73 AMC hornet bought after splitting the cost of new '71 AMC Hornet wagon for my older brother. When I got settled in California, the first car that I bought was '69 AMC Rambler American for $450. Several years later I bought a very used DJ-5 (mail Jeep) and then later a stunning AMC Jeep CJ7 that even my teen age daughters thought was cool.

As a child there was a Packard repair shop down the street from my Uncle's house. Good times -- good times.

My Grandfather always bought Studebakers and my dad's first car was a 50 Studebaker coupe.

My other grandfather had a really cool 54 Hudson Hornet.

The CJ7 is one of the greatest American Automotive designs.

I remember the AMC wagons my neighbors had when I was a kid.

Suddenly I feel very sad and very nostalgic about old American cars.

Chris

[gm4life]

I respect Honda much more than I do Toyota for reasons that are just plain obvious.

I agree if I had to buy an import it would be a Honda duh! The current Accord still runs circles around the 'new' Camry. Toyota is busting into a somewhat 'set' market people in the mid west like me, have strong values and like American stuff. I live in Iowa that is about as mid-west as you can get eh?