Production Camaro Close to Concept; 500 HP?

[NOS2006]

CamaroZ28.com:

http://web.camaross.com/forums/showthread.php?t=495391

*Note that they're not afraid of the Camaro and Corvette crossing..

Edited January 12, 2007 by NOS2006

[NOS2006]

Autoblog: Have you guys arrived at a final decision for the top powertrain?

Ed Peper: No, not yet. We will have a V8, a couple of V6s -- you know, we'll have a fuel efficient V6 and we'll have a high performing V6 and we will have a high performing V8 but we haven't settled on the engine in that yet.

Autoblog: 500 horsepower appears to be the magic number with the musclecars that the other manufacturers are coming out with, so is that your target?

Ed Peper: Certainly we haven't made a decision yet, but it's in our scheme – it's in our scheme of thoughts, yes.

Edited January 12, 2007 by NOS2006

[loki]

aftermarket's 500hp?...like how the last SS's came out of SLP?

do-able.

everyone hoping 3-valve is a sure thing?

other----

is this old or is this new fodder for the 2 v6's thing... cause if it's just 2 different 3.6L's, WTF!!!!

[76ChevyTrucker]

It maybe a 3.6 and then something else, perhaps a new V6 engine in the works? Although I'm kinda curious about the no two V8s thing. If you only have one V8, then what about the guy who WANTS a V8 Camaro, but DOESN'T want a 500hp Camaro.

[Northstar]

I wouldn't be surprised if he's just talking the first model year. I don't expect the Camaro to have a 500HP engine until the second model year, so it would make sense to have a 260HP V6, 300+HP V6, and ~420HP V8 to start things off.

[76ChevyTrucker]

Yeah, that would make sense because by then you could get the ragtop models flowing off the line well and then be able to bring out the SS badges and the 500 horsepower mule.

[hyperv6]

First off this was a given as with the Blue Devil HP will be up and weight will be down. GM only cares that the Vette is the best performer.

The same Z06 enigne would not be a problem in a Camaro as it would never perform the same as the Vette due to more weight and bigger car in general.

It has been clear that 500+ HP will find it's way into the future Caddy CTS and Camaro. The new Shelby 500 made the 500 HP mark required in some limited Camaro edition.

In fact I expect B Devil 600+ HP engine is in play too as Lutz does not want any of these cars to be scond in HP and performance. The Devil coul easily just get a little more boost. I have seen reports 700+ in a production form has been achieved in testing so this engine may only be a start and can grow if needed.

HP was never an issue as Lutz has had Power Trains back on these engines.

Few have spoken about it but the new V8 engines that are coming for these cars are going to blow many minds. The LS2 was nothing compared to what is coming. Too many forget about the CTS some in the press drove last August that had a wide power band, a sound form Italy and if I recall 7,000 Redline. They were not shown the engine but raved about what they drove. It also was not a V series car.

Bottom line is the LS2 is a great engine and what is coming is going to be better and Lutz is not affraid to use them either.

GM new out look is lap time not HP ratings with the Vette. As long as it is first to the line other will share in the engines. It only has to be Americas best performing car.

[ZL-1]

Too many forget about the CTS some in the press drove last August that had a wide power band, a sound form Italy and if I recall 7,000 Redline. They were not shown the engine but raved about what they drove. It also was not a V series car.

was that the new V8 or a blown V6?

[hyperv6]

was that the new V8 or a blown V6?

Per the writer he said it was a V8 and they thought it was mulitvlave. I was thinking this might be the new 3 or 4 valeve in the block cam??

If I recall they said it was in the mid 400 HP range. We now know that GM may do a 430 HP V8. Could this be the engine.

Too little is said and everyone is just watching the car and not getint much on drivetrain.

Scott S has all ready stated that the V8 in the Camaro has not been seen yet. So I expect a suprise.

[ZL-1]

Per the writer he said it was a V8 and they thought it was mulitvlave. I was thinking this might be the new 3 or 4 valeve in the block cam??

If I recall they said it was in the mid 400 HP range. We now know that GM may do a 430 HP V8. Could this be the engine.

Too little is said and everyone is just watching the car and not getint much on drivetrain.

Scott S has all ready stated that the V8 in the Camaro has not been seen yet. So I expect a suprise.

That's interesting, because what first struck my mind when I read the thread was NG Northstar. Due to market perceptions, I don't see non-V CTS models using a cam-in-block engine. Could it be a NG Northstar that will make it to the CTS to go against the 550i? I could see such a car become a reality as soon as the NG (or a very heavily revised) more upscale STS debuts...

EDIT: re the Camaro, is the rear track on the concept convertible the same as last year's coupe?

Edited January 13, 2007 by ZL-1

[hyperv6]

That's interesting, because what first struck my mind when I read the thread was NG Northstar. Due to market perceptions, I don't see non-V CTS models using a cam-in-block engine. Could it be a NG Northstar that will make it to the CTS to go against the 550i? I could see such a car become a reality as soon as the NG (or a very heavily revised) more upscale STS debuts...

EDIT: re the Camaro, is the rear track on the concept convertible the same as last year's coupe?

Could be NG star??

They had no ideal waht the engine was and it was in a standard CTS so the car really was not a clue. I think GM was just wanting there reaction.

What ever it was they were more impressed with it than the two turbo Kappas they just drove.

You got to just love what have I got under my hood games from the factory.

[AAS]

It maybe a 3.6 and then something else, perhaps a new V6 engine in the works? Although I'm kinda curious about the no two V8s thing. If you only have one V8, then what about the guy who WANTS a V8 Camaro, but DOESN'T want a 500hp Camaro.

Exactly... I want a V8, but 500 hp is pushing it.

[hyperv6]

Exactly... I want a V8, but 500 hp is pushing it.

I think the V8 they speak of is a 400+ HP model. But the V6 will be very important and if the 300HP DI 3.6 is offered it will be a great option for those wanting to save money and gas. Keep in mind we know the V8 will not be a LS2 so it will be a more high feature engine.

The 500+ V8 will come a year later in a limited model just as the Shelby 500 is and did. I expect 500+ as they will never just match Ford on HP. Look for the Z06 to move up too.

[FAPTurbo]

Exactly... I want a V8, but 500 hp is pushing it.

[schuby87]

I can 100% guarantee that the new camaro will not have any engine available the first year that is greater then a 5.3L. At the Autoshow this week (sorry I cant say who or where, because of where I work) I picked up some information to the tune of that it will have a 4.6, 4.8, or possibly the 5.3 during the first year. GM is planning on doing the same thing with the Camaro that they did with the GTO. Introduce it with a smaller displacement engine and see what types of problems they will have with the frame and etc. then they will fix those problems and introduce a more powerful engine. If you dont believe me, and are going to the autoshow, notice the 5.3 on display next to the Camaro (its not a coincidence)

As for the Camaro crossing with the Vette, I dont think that will be a problem, expecially when the LS9 comes out.

Edited January 18, 2007 by schuby87

[Dragon]

http://www.leftlanenews.com/2006/06/23/for...model-possible/

In an interview with Mr. Shelby himself, Edmunds managed to get further details. Shelby said GM "better not dream" of having more horsepower than the Mustang with the new Camaro.

Well Mr. Shelby, GM has dreamed. The ball in your court.

[Sixty8panther]

My prediction

90% possibility: one V6

100% possibility: at least two diff. V8s, if not four.

I'd like a base Camaro V8.

Back in summer of 1967 when my old '68 Camaro was assembled in Van Nuys

it only had three options.

( Base V8 hardtop )

- Automatic

- Power Steering

- A/C

The car was a little over $2700 back then with these three options.

I want the 21st century version of that... basically a BASE MODEL Hardtop

(crank windows are okay so long as all four drop down sight unseen) with

whatever the smallest/cheapest V8 motor they have will be, say a 4.9 liter

with DOD, REAL manual trans. (5sp okay, 6 would be nice) and a few other

basic features would be great. traction control w/ off mode, ABS & a MP3

compatible CD player will do nicelly.

I do not want a sunroof, I do not want T-tops... both of those are stuid &

lame compared to a true pillarless hardtop. I also have no use/desire for

some "high-perf" V6. F*** that... either give me an Atlas I6, or just a super

cheap V6 If I'm paying for anything extra it better have 16 valves & EIGHT

big holes bored into the block!

[Sixty8panther]

More of my oppinionated rambling/educated guessing.

If there IS a V6 it will be becasue one will be forced induction & the other N.A.

I for one would be happy buying a Turbocharged Ecotech powered Camaro.

Even better would be a modern day veersion fo the B.O.P. 215 V8. No even

aluminum per-se but like a 3.0 liter V8 and then a bunch of optional LS motors.

i.e.

~ base hardtop: $22,000 with a mini-V8 (200 cu. in.) 210 HP, 225 TRQ

~ Rally Edition: (RS pckg is cosmetic and unrelated) $24K w/ high-perf. 200 cu. in. (275 HP, 240 TRQ)

~ Z/28: $27,000 with a high perf. 4.9 liter V8 (302 cu. in.) 360 HP, 340 TRQ

~ SS: $29,000 with an LS2 V8 (400 HP, 415 TRQ)

~ ZL-1: $42,000, hardtop only & no cosmetic B.S. over the base hardtop! (under-rated LS7)

also.... a mini inline six would be a fantastic thing!!!

Think Atlas but 65% of the size inside & out.

Inline Sixes can be made to run smoothly with DOD and

so can baby- V8s. If anything the Camaro should be V8

only with varying levels of DOD, VVTi & DI.

A V6 is useless in terms of DOD, so why even bother???

(I'l probably be stuck buying a damn V6)

[Northstar]

I can 100% guarantee that the new camaro will not have any engine available the first year that is greater then a 5.3L. At the Autoshow this week (sorry I cant say who or where, because of where I work) I picked up some information to the tune of that it will have a 4.6, 4.8, or possibly the 5.3 during the first year. GM is planning on doing the same thing with the Camaro that they did with the GTO. Introduce it with a smaller displacement engine and see what types of problems they will have with the frame and etc. then they will fix those problems and introduce a more powerful engine. If you dont believe me, and are going to the autoshow, notice the 5.3 on display next to the Camaro (its not a coincidence)

As for the Camaro crossing with the Vette, I dont think that will be a problem, expecially when the turb LS9 comes out. Thats right, turbo LS9........

No greater than 5.3? I find this hard to believe...

The 4.8 is iron block only, is it not? They wouldn't use that. The Northstar is too big and heavy, and by the time the Camaro comes, the Northstar will be almost out of production, so why would they use it for one year?

The 5.3 is a truck engine, and not suitable for the Camaro. A reworked one might be okay, but this still doesn't make sense at all. The GTO only got a new engine because the LS2 wasn't available when it was introduced. GM didn't say "oh, let's put the LS1 in there the first year, then later we'll add the LS2." If the LS2 was available from the start, it would have been in the car from the start. In addition, the 5.3 doesn't make much more power than the 3.6DI, and will get much worse fuel economy. I see no reason why GM would pay to have the 5.3 validated for the Camaro only to drop it a year later.

The LS9 is turbocharged now? Last I heard it was supercharged.

[AAS]

No greater than 5.3? I find this hard to believe...

The 4.8 is iron block only, is it not? They wouldn't use that. The Northstar is too big and heavy, and by the time the Camaro comes, the Northstar will be almost out of production, so why would they use it for one year?

The 5.3 is a truck engine, and not suitable for the Camaro. A reworked one might be okay, but this still doesn't make sense at all. The GTO only got a new engine because the LS2 wasn't available when it was introduced. GM didn't say "oh, let's put the LS1 in there the first year, then later we'll add the LS2." If the LS2 was available from the start, it would have been in the car from the start. In addition, the 5.3 doesn't make much more power than the 3.6DI, and will get much worse fuel economy. I see no reason why GM would pay to have the 5.3 validated for the Camaro only to drop it a year later.

The LS9 is turbocharged now? Last I heard it was supercharged.

My sentiments exactly... why downgrade to the 5.3 if the LS2 is available and applicable (made for a sports car etc.)?

[schuby87]

I was also disappointed when learning this information, but what I said about the 4.8L is how it is displayed in GM databases, at least for the first production year. It really sucks, because there is sooooo much I would like to say about the new Camaro but it isn't worth my job. If you could see what we have at work, you would definitely believe me.

As for the LS9, wait till you see this thing, its crazy. Top mounted intercooler between the heads.......mmmm mmmm.

Edited January 18, 2007 by schuby87

[Chris_Doane]

The LS9 is not a turbo.

[evok]

The LS9 is not a turbo.

Don't know of many turbos packaged between the cylinder banks.

[Northstar]

A roots-type supercharger is typically between the cylinder banks. How would a turbo fit between the cylinder banks?

[schuby87]

A roots-type supercharger is typically between the cylinder banks. How would a turbo fit between the cylinder banks?

Its more ontop then it is between (the turbo isn't there, the intercooler is), but thats all I can really say. This is all proprietary information, so I cant really elaborate anymore about the LS9 system and how it works, but I really wanted to share what I found out about the Camaro.

Edited January 18, 2007 by schuby87

[hyperv6]

Well according to Mr Settlemire the engine in the Camaro has not been seen yet so we can not and will not know what V8 it will have when we have not seen the engine yet.

He has already said it is not a LS2 based engine.

So don't get too excited and stay tuned we will now more in the near future.

Also since Scott knows more than anyone here about the new Camaro. He also has indicated that we will see the higher performance engine after the intro.

Check out The Fbodfathers post on Camaroz28.com. This will be the most accurate up to date info anyone has on this topic. Anyone giving more would be in risk of losing their job at GM.

[AH-HA]

1. It is a turbo

2. The intercooler is ontop/between the heads

3. Thats why the SS Corvette has that hoodscoop

Dude, it's supercharged. :AH-HA_wink:

You should know better than to talk about something you don't know about and look foolish.

[Chris_Doane]

1. It is a turbo

..kids these days.

You get partial credit though....the bump in the hood is from the intercooler assembly that is integrated into the intake manifold.

Edited January 18, 2007 by CD/BP

[schuby87]

WOW, you guys are right. I just talked to someone and it is a supercharger. I didn't get to take a good look and automatically assumed that the intercooler ment turbo. Thanks for all the corrections so I dont go around looking like a gomer. Let me try this again....

1 Not a turbo

2 Roots style supercharge

3 Pancake style intercooler

I may have gotten the facts wrong on this, but I am fairly certain that my info on the Camaro still holds true.

[Nick]

I still don't understand the reasoning behind using a roots style setup when a twin-screw is superior...

Edited January 18, 2007 by Nick

[NOS2006]

C'mon, Schuby, you saw the intercooler on my supercharged car!

[Chris_Doane]

I like pancakes.

[schuby87]

C'mon, Schuby, you saw the intercooler on my supercharged car!

I was distracted by all the yellow. AHHH the YELLOW!!!

[mightymouse]

you mean like this right?

Scott doesn't elaborate because it's a secret. He knows ....

Anyone at GM that can pull data from the Holden database knows.

Some things are meant to be suprises! Don't worry it won't suck.

[Camino LS6]

you mean like this right?

Scott doesn't elaborate because it's a secret. He knows ....

Anyone at GM that can pull data from the Holden database knows.

Some things are meant to be suprises! Don't worry it won't suck.

Now there's a post I can believe in.