Pontiac G8/Holden Commodore Confirmed

[monaroCountry]

For those that might bad the VE based Pontiac G8, and claim that it resembles the Cadillac Catera

Cadillac Catera

Side

Interior

Front

Holden VE and soon to be Pontiac G8

Side

Interior

Front

[Northstar]

MonaroCountry - Nice pics, can you post more or link to them?

[ToniCipriani]

Isn't the Lumina a better representation of what we're going to get, since it's LHD?

[Robert Hall]

Isn't the Lumina a better representation of what we're going to get, since it's LHD?

Just reverse the interior pics, and you have a Lumina..it's just a Commodore with LHD and different badging, I assume?

Take the Lumina SS and put a Pontiacish nose, and that should be the G8...as shown in Motor Trend several months ago..

I think this can work..if Saturn can have some Americanised Opels, then Pontiac can have some Americanised Holdens..RWD sport sedans is something they are certainly known for.

Edited January 15, 2007 by moltar

[Robert Hall]

GM didn't the have $$$ or time to develop a car like the commodore for the NA separately.

Exactly...with the development $$$ going to to the '08 Malibu and CTS (and the '09 Impala and Camaro), GM probably didn't have much to spend on Pontiac...

Edited January 15, 2007 by moltar

[DetroitNut90]

I don't get what all the fuss is about? I love the Commodore SS as is (well, like Fly, I think the interior could be improved a bit). Sure it's not as racy or sumptuous as other Pontiacs, but it sure beats the hell out of the G6. It's sexy. In any color. As noted, with minor changes this will make more of a Pontiac than some of you might think.

[z28luvr01]

That white head-on shot is aesome. I love those fender arches.

[Robert Hall]

I like what I've seen of the Commodore SS...

I think that any 'controversy' stems from that a lot of people on here are so used to Pontiac building overstyled FWD sedans and the idea of a modern, RWD V8 sports sedan with understated styling branded as a Pontiac is something they can't grasp...

[MisterMe]

...

I think that any 'controversy' stems from that a lot of people on here are so used to Pontiac building overstyled FWD sedans and the idea of a modern, RWD V8 sports sedan with understated styling branded as a Pontiac is something they can't grasp...

One of the reasons that the Commodore will be shipped to NA is because its production lines will be shut down otherwise. It seems that the Aussies are not buying Holdens as they did in the past. They are buying Japanese brands Down Under just like we are in North America. Do you have an equally insulting explanation for our Australian friends' buying preferences?

[ehaase]

http://www.leftlanenews.com/2007/01/15/g8-...e-like-styling/

[AAS]

http://www.leftlanenews.com/2007/01/15/g8-...e-like-styling/

According to a new report by trade publication Automotive News, the G8 will get front end styling similar to the popular Solstice roadster. The car will have unique styling from the A-pillar forward, the report said.

Interesting... Both that it's speculated that the design differences will be so different from the Holden version, and that it might look like a Solstice. It's tough for me to imagine a big Solstice sedan.

[hyperv6]

Does it really matter as we will have complainers no matter what. Pontiac just needs to do what they have to do and people will get used to it as it will not be a total failure despite what some feel. The only thing worse than a car designed by committee is one designed by uncertain public opinion.

Pontiac may have had a Aztec or two but what car company hasn't. We just need to sit back and trust Lutz on this as he has only a few mistakes in his long time in the industry. Many of the mistakes were not all of his doing either. Lack of money at GM and Chrylser played a bigger part.

I feel it is safe you will see sheet metal and some interior changes. Not all will be pleased but what could they do to please all as most Pontiac fans can't agree on what they want.

[Northstar]

That'd be very cool if it had a Solstice-inspired front end

[Intrepidation]

http://www.leftlanenews.com/2007/01/15/g8-...e-like-styling/

I think slapping a Solstice-like front end may f@#k the looks of the car up...just keep it the way it is.

Also, the Catera looks like a big fat Cavalier with an interior that's almost as ugly....look at how far spread the gauges are!

[91z4me]

That'd be very cool if it had a Solstice-inspired front end

You sure about that?

[Intrepidation]

You sure about that?

Ew...destroyed the car.

[balthazar]

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y174/jescam/photo1.jpg

Looks like a damned bmw from the side. Please no.

And isn't that nearly the same 4-spoke steering wheel the malibu dumped last year?

Not bad, but overall: very underwhelming. A sedan-ized Solstice front clip may save it, tho that's a very narrow tightrope to walk....

[Northstar]

You sure about that?

No offense, but that's not a very good chop. I doubt the grills will be that big.

We just need to wait and see. As long as making it into a Pontiac doesn't make it ugly, I see no reason why it won't be best-in-class. There's not much competition.

[NINETY EIGHT REGENCY]

Funny he said that..

From Autonews:

New Pontiac G8 May Have Front-End Styling Drawn From The Solstice

DETROIT -- If General Motors expands Pontiac's U.S. product line with a sedan from its Holden subsidiary in Australia, the car would arrive in 2008 with front-end styling drawn from the Pontiac Solstice, a U.S. industry source says.

A story in a Melbourne, Australia, newspaper last week said the Pontiac would be based on the rear-wheel-drive Holden Commodore SS. The new car likely would have unique sheet metal from the A-pillar forward.

The redesigned Commodore debuted last year and was developed on GM's new global rwd vehicle architecture. The upcoming Chevrolet Camaro and Impala will share that architecture. The new Pontiac would be slightly longer and wider than the 2007 Grand Prix.

The Pontiac would be called the G8, according to the story in the Herald Sun.

GM Vice Chairman Bob Lutz did not confirm the plan but told the newspaper: "It's such a logical thing to do. The volume range is 30,000 to 50,000," depending on price. Lutz said details will be revealed next month at the Chicago Auto Show.

Edited January 16, 2007 by NINETY EIGHT REGENCY

[ocnblu]

Oh, that sounds promising! A front end inspired by Solstice... I am thinking it may translate into something like a 70 1/2 Firebird, with the single element headlamps and all... now I can't wait to see it!

[NINETY EIGHT REGENCY]

Funny you should say that:

1971 Pontiac Firebird commercial:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mkG4nKKFsFI

The Solstice was influenced by that Firebird.

Edited January 16, 2007 by NINETY EIGHT REGENCY

[balthazar]

I don't know that the Solstice was in fact inspired by the '71 'bird, but it's a great inspiration either way. Both the 'bird & the Solstice have strong traditional Pontiac design cues- which is why the Solstice is so striking on the road.

[sciguy_0504]

EDIT: here it is: http://web.camaross.com/forums/showthread.php?t=483451

And some "real world" pics of it as well: http://web.camaross.com/forums/showthread.php?t=476049

Thanks for the links, especially the real world photos. They have changed my mind to an extent. IMO, if you look past the front the car is sexy and aggressive, I like it. I still believe the front end is a let down, though. The design is too 90's and bland for me. It's almost like the last-gen Camry in SE trim. This is the front I'm talking about, not the entire car (just to get that point across). The black interior is beautiful, so much better than the orange/black that we have all seen, and the best in any midsize car offered by GM today. All in all, a front end redesign would go a long way.

[91z4me]

No offense, but that's not a very good chop. I doubt the grills will be that big.

We just need to wait and see. As long as making it into a Pontiac doesn't make it ugly, I see no reason why it won't be best-in-class. There's not much competition.

Wanna try and do better?

Put Solstice cues on a Commodore on the cheap. Best I could do with my skills.

[Northstar]

Wanna try and do better?

Put Solstice cues on a Commodore on the cheap. Best I could do with my skills.

I'm just saying if it was high quality and looked like it belonged (they aren't just going to slap on the Solstice's grills and call it a day - I bet they're more angular) then it wouldn't look so bad.

Those real-world pics look very good, though the front is definitely the weakest part.

[macadamianut]

After just driving a 300c through 6000 miles of the US I am not sure that it will be a competitor for the Commodore. 300c is a tourer with a softer nature than the commodore. Even in Omega trim the Commodore is a sportier ride. Loved the 300c as it was economical, powerful and generally comfortable. The Commodore, while actually as big as the Chrysler in the interior, is an aggressive, fun and comfortable car. The car that would compete with the Chrysler would be the Statesman. Not sure you will get that. The commodore would compete against the Charger. The Charger has awful styling, went way too far with the hips on the side.

I agree that the Commodore should not be called a G8. Different car altogether. Pick another non-numeric name and it would go better. I also hope they dont overstyle the front as they did to Monaro to make the GTO. That was a real dud look compared to the original. Saw a few GTOs over there and they did look dated. You cant take a model at the end of its product life and dress it as a new generation car in a new market. The lesson for GM would be to get the VE to the States pronto while it s still fresh!

As a last thought, the Commodore interior is classier than the 300c, but not as visually appealing. I loved the way the 300c dash illuminated!

PS If you guys thought the GTO drove well, wait for the HSV's.

[Intrepidation]

I think the Charger would be a better competitor for the Commodore since it has a sportier suspension setup.

[georgejetson]

I think the Charger would be a better competitor for the Commodore since it has a sportier suspension setup.

Specifically, the Charger R/T with the Road and Track package -- or an SRT-8.

[Robert Hall]

Looks like a damned bmw from the side. Please no.

The side profile is the best view of the Commodore..and the rear. Looks 1000% better than the current Grand Prix, IMHO.

[macadamianut]

The side profile is the best view of the Commodore..and the rear. Looks 1000% better than the current Grand Prix, IMHO.

The thing that doesn't come across in pics is that in the real world the commodore is BIG. Looks as big as a 7 seies. The Statesman is even bigger, looks longer than 300c but not as chunky. I don't really like the tail lights of the Holdens but the HSV's are well done. The car can look either elegent or ferocious, depending on the spec. I have driven Omegas and one SS v8. The SS was excellent, Omega good too! Love to drive a HSV. I still wonder if they are the right car for the time. If they have an LPG version like Falcon I will be buying one as its time for a new car this year. The 300c wasn't too bad on fuel for a big V8. It has a slightly rough idle at times and I guess that is the cylinder deactivation. That would be a great car to put on lpg too.

The new Chev (Caprice I think) has a rear that reminded me of Statesmans (very similar), the front was very old fashioned. I bet GM will make the next Caprice either a rebadged Statesman or start engineering the next one on Zeta!

On the subject of rear ends, I hope Chrysler tidies up the rear of the 300c, It could be better as it doesn't relly go with the rest of the car which is the only retro styled car I like.

I was really disappointed with the Mustangs in while in the States, they lack something, originality I guess.

I do agree that Commodore is best from the side. Hope the Pontiac uses HSV tail lights and does something (subtle) to the front to link it with Pontiac. Why are they persisting with the twin Kidneys, why not style in the Pontiac V, way better!

[Tailfin61]

I scanned through this thread and didn't see this point mentioned, but I thought originally the proposed G8 was to replace the Bonneville, not the Gran Prix. Based on the sales volume that I think was mentioned of 30-50K that would seem more fitting since the GP sells over 100K annually. Is the G6 supposed to pick up the rest of the volume? Is the 30-50K figure mentioned because that's all they have the capacity to build for the north american market? Or under the new P-B-GMC model does GM expect PONTIAC to have an overall lower volume like BUICK is expected to? Any thoughts?

[Northstar]

The GP probably only sells 30-40k to retail customers, it's primarily a fleet car.

[Guest YellowJacket894]

The Solstice was influenced by that Firebird.

I don't know that the Solstice was in fact inspired by the '71 'bird, but it's a great inspiration either way. Both the 'bird & the Solstice have strong traditional Pontiac design cues- which is why the Solstice is so striking on the road.

Balt's right. The Solstice was actually inspired by the Chevy-powered Cheetah one-off of the sixties. Look up a photo of it on Google sometime.

[CSpec]

Balt's right. The Solstice was actually inspired by the Chevy-powered Cheetah one-off of the sixties. Look up a photo of it on Google sometime.

Good call:

[Guest YellowJacket894]

Good call:

Yup. That's the car. (I could've made a good trivia question out of this.)

I remember Franz stating he drew inspiration from this car in a interview for either Motor Trend or Car & Driver. You can how it influenced the coupe -- the rear window and so on. Good thing the proportions of the Cheetah didn't carry over to the Solstice -- they're way exaggerated.

[MisterMe]

I scanned through this thread and didn't see this point mentioned, but I thought originally the proposed G8 was to replace the Bonneville, not the Gran Prix. ...

You are right and wrong. The G8 is supposed to replace both the Grand Prix and the Bonneville in somewhat the same way that the Buick Lucerne replaced both the LeSabre and the Park Avenue.

[hyperv6]

You are right and wrong. The G8 is supposed to replace both the Grand Prix and the Bonneville in somewhat the same way that the Buick Lucerne replaced both the LeSabre and the Park Avenue.

They are replacing the GP and Bonnie with this car. I see the G6 changing and moving up with some new models coming in.

I really expect RWD and AWD will be the norm at Pontiac witrh only a small FWD being offered later. A lot depends on a Small RWD platform for a new Kappa and sedan. If approved they is so much they could do with this.

[GMTruckGuy74]

While I think the Holden Commodore SS needs some Pontiac styling up front, if it was offered here for sale back in November, I might have been driving that instead of my AURA (don't get me wrong, I love my AURA and its styling, but that G8 is a mighty fine looking car too).

I used to be into the new Pontiacs (had a '95 T/A, '99 G/A GT1 sedan and a '00 G/P GT sedan). But the only Pontiac I wanted after 2003 was the Bonneville GXP, which was way out of my price range (and now gone). Saturn has caught my eye and as you can see, I bought two of them this past year. I'm still a die-hard Pontiac fan, but need the styling to bring me back. The current G/P is a joke, the G6 is alright (I prefer the AURA more), and the G5 is way to small for my needs (especially since it's not offered in sedan form).

macadamianut, do you have any pictures you could post of the HSV taillights? Or a link? I'm interested in seeing what they look like.

[Robert Hall]

macadamianut, do you have any pictures you could post of the HSV taillights? Or a link? I'm interested in seeing what they look like.

Looking at the pic on the HSV website, they look like Mazda 6 taillights, but flush.

http://www.hsv.com.au/index_eseries.asp

[ZL-1]

Why not use Calais tail lights? They look kinda Grand Prix-ish (providing some styling continuity) and it wouldn't be that expensive to redesign the rear bumper to the SS-look, would it?

Edited January 22, 2007 by ZL-1

[gm4life]

While I think the Holden Commodore SS needs some Pontiac styling up front, if it was offered here for sale back in November, I might have been driving that instead of my AURA (don't get me wrong, I love my AURA and its styling, but that G8 is a mighty fine looking car too).

I used to be into the new Pontiacs (had a '95 T/A, '99 G/A GT1 sedan and a '00 G/P GT sedan). But the only Pontiac I wanted after 2003 was the Bonneville GXP, which was way out of my price range (and now gone). Saturn has caught my eye and as you can see, I bought two of them this past year. I'm still a die-hard Pontiac fan, but need the styling to bring me back. The current G/P is a joke, the G6 is alright (I prefer the AURA more), and the G5 is way to small for my needs (especially since it's not offered in sedan form).

macadamianut, do you have any pictures you could post of the HSV taillights? Or a link? I'm interested in seeing what they look like.

You could have gotten the must more affordable gas savvy SLE in 2005 with the same styling... There all over used with low miles or higher if you wish. And pricing ranges...

[Dragon]

holden gto

[GM Oshawa]

holden gto

Don't be surprised to see the RWD Impala , Buick, Cadillac and the G8 to join the lineup of the Home of the Camaro at the Oshawa Flex Plant.

[Guest YellowJacket894]

Cadillac? Interesting.

[Robert Hall]

Cadillac? Interesting.

My guess is the most likely NA Zeta-based models will include the Impala, Camaro, G8, next Lucerne, and next DTS..

[GM Oshawa]

My guess is the most likely NA Zeta-based models will include the Impala, Camaro, G8, next Lucerne, and next DTS..

YOU are one Smart Man " Moltar" These cars were mentioned to us as future Oshawa products in our Jan. GMS team meeting. NOTHING is on paper. Just talked about!

With the current Impala sales staying Surprisly STRONG there could be an overlap in build RWD and FWD Impala. Could the RWD car have it's name changed to the Caprice ????????

IF things stay on track One new vehicle will be introduced every six Months. The Impala firts.

[Dragon]

Don't be surprised to see the RWD Impala , Buick, Cadillac and the G8 to join the lineup of the Home of the Camaro at the Oshawa Flex Plant.

oh. we won't be. we pretty much know its a forgone conclusion the Impy, Buick and G8 would be going to shwa seing as its been pretty widely reported the Impala, G8, Lucerne and DTS would be staying there.

[titan]

YOU are one Smart Man " Moltar" These cars were mentioned to us as future Oshawa products in our Jan. GMS team meeting. NOTHING is on paper. Just talked about!

With the current Impala sales staying Surprisly STRONG there could be an overlap in build RWD and FWD Impala. Could the RWD car have it's name changed to the Caprice ????????

IF things stay on track One new vehicle will be introduced every six Months. The Impala firts.

No. There isn't room for the new Malibu, new RWD Chevy sedan flagship above it, and the current FWD Impala.

[Robert Hall]

No. There isn't room for the new Malibu, new RWD Chevy sedan flagship above it, and the current FWD Impala.

They might keep the FWD Impala as an Impala Classic or something for 6 months to a year after the RWD model comes out, though...like they did with the previous Malibu...(that is, if they can build Zetas and Ws at the same time)>

Edited January 24, 2007 by moltar

[Chicagoland]

"Impala Classic"? ewwww

How about "Biscayne"? That was the fleet only big Chevy till 1972.