GMC minivan??

[BlkHhr104]

here

DETROIT — General Motors' GMC brand will roll out its first minivan in model-year 2009, according to sources close to the product.

Based on the automaker's Lambda architecture, the as-yet-unnamed minivan will be a sibling to the next-generation Chevrolet Uplander as well as a companion to the upcoming GMC Acadia crossover vehicle, Detroit-area suppliers familiar with the company's plans told Inside Line.

While the Acadia is aimed at upscale SUV buyers, including empty nesters and affluent younger couples, the GMC minivan will be targeted more at families. To some extent, it will help fill the void left by the discontinued Safari "midi" van.

GM hasn't officially announced the new minivan, but it is expected to begin production in early 2009. By that time, GM plans to discontinue three of its four existing minivans, including the Saturn Relay, the Buick Terraza and the Pontiac Montana.

That will leave the growing GMC-Buick-Pontiac retail channel with only a single minivan come 2009.

What this means to you: Is GMC trying to stretch the brand too far to cover "non-professional-grade" families?

[91z4me]

Buick should have the Minivan. GMC should be trucks, crossovers, and SUVs. If this is a traditional minivan it should move to the tri-shields.

[Northstar]

I think Buick should probably have it as well, as GMC and Chevy are too similar if they're the only ones getting minivans. However, I'm not entirely sure that BPG really needs one at all with the Enclave and Acadia.

Why does the article say BPG is growing? At least BP is downsizing, and GMC isn't growing much.

[ZL-1]

To some extent, it will help fill the void left by the discontinued Safari "midi" van.

185934[/snapback]

I find the quote interesting. Maybe Lambda allows for enough differentiation so the GMC looks more 'van' than 'minivan'.

EDIT - It can still be 'Profesisonal Grade': offer panel vans for professional duties...

Edited August 28, 2006 by ZL-1

[FAPTurbo]

GMC vans should be limited to RWD, workhorse vehicles, much like the Savanna.

Give Chevy the minivan. It stays more in character with the brand, and does not dilute the "Professional Grade" personality. A Buick minivan should be offered as well, for those families who have the cash, but have to cart the kids around.

[ehaase]

The decision has been made, so why get worked up about it? GM surely did not make its decision to give the van to GMC instead of Buick without a lot of focus group and market studies.

[Guest YellowJacket894]

Chevy and Saturn should have minivans. Other brands should just have to make due with what they've already got.

[Drew Dowdell]

Buick should have the premium minivan to take on the Town & Country. Buick and Chrysler are as natural enemies as Chevy and Ford.

Edited August 28, 2006 by Oldsmoboi

[Flybrian]

The decision has been made, so why get worked up about it? GM surely did not make its decision to give the van to GMC instead of Buick without a lot of focus group and market studies.

185966[/snapback]

I would really enjoy seeing proof of this. I'm not doubting you, Ehaase, but I do doubt GM's rationale behind this.

[Drew Dowdell]

The decision has been made, so why get worked up about it? GM surely did not make its decision to give the van to GMC instead of Buick without a lot of focus group and market studies.

185966[/snapback]

WE should be GM's focus group. We'd excitedly do it for free AND likely give answers based on better rational.... especially if we were allowed to fight it out forum style first.

[Camino LS6]

I agree with GM's decision, I don't think Buick and Pontiac sheould ever again have a minivan- I think it dilutes both brands. BPG should only have one minivan anyway and GMC is the natural choice.

Saturn should eventually get one as well. Three minivans spread evenly throughout GM's dealer networks makes sense to me. Buick,Pontiac,SAAB,Cadillac, and Hummer should remain tightly focused, and that means no minivans.

[ehaase]

WE should be GM's focus group. We'd excitedly do it for free AND likely give answers based on better rational.... especially if we were allowed to fight it out forum style first.

185976[/snapback]

No, we shouldn't, because most of us are not objective. Many here just want more products for their favorite brand, even if that's not best for GM as an entity.

I am probably the only person here who feels this way, but if cutting GM back to Chevrolet and Cadillac and nothing else would make GM more profitable and successful, I'd be for it. (And I don't claim to know what would be best.)

[sciguy_0504]

Yet another example of overlap (edit: if Saturn and Buick get one, that is), something GM does not seem to understand. Truely sickening. If this is true, I want professional grade RWD and economy cars, also.

Edited August 28, 2006 by sciguy_0504

[loki]

if it's going to try to replace the safari, RWD and AWD are musts... maybe a slightly stretched version would give, maybe more room inside than the safari had.

if the chevy and gmc are really good, - cause i love the lambdas ( the saturn the least, easily lol) - then that's fine, but i bet most of the market won't be interested in them (minivans) outside DCX, yota, and nissan by 2009.

but if this is real, time allways tells

[thegriffon]

Saturn will get a minivan, but not a Lambda, something shared with Opel and more in tune with the new brand character. And no, I don't mean the compact Zafira.

[Drew Dowdell]

No, we shouldn't, because most of us are not objective.  Many here just want more products for their favorite brand, even if that's not best for GM as an entity.

I am probably the only person here who feels this way, but if cutting GM back to Chevrolet and Cadillac and nothing else would make GM more profitable and successful, I'd be for it.  (And I don't claim to know what would be best.)

186013[/snapback]

Individually, yes we do have our biases, but as a group we come up with some well reasoned, well fought out, ideas.

My bias is towards Cadillac and Oldsmobile, so this doesn't affect me.

I just want to see the van in the area it can do the most good and make the most profit inside a B-P-G dealer.... and to me, that place is with Buick. There needs to be an upscale minivan, and even with Denali, Buick is still more upscale than GMC.

[Northstar]

While I think a Buick would be better, I don't see the need for anything more upscale than a Denali minivan, so I guess it's fine that GMC gets it instead.

[jbartley]

if Chrysler/Dodge can do it, so can GMC/Chevrolet.

(Saturn needs a euro-type minivan)

Buick & Pontiac need minivans, just as badly as Hummer needs a nice 4 door, FWD sedan. unrealistic at best.

C'mon people! There are going to be people who want a nice minivan w/o the minivan look. Something smaller than the acadia, with those nifty sliding doors, but would REFUSE to consider a chevy, so why not set them up with a nice GMC?

Edited August 29, 2006 by jbartley

[GMTruckGuy74]

Something smaller than the acadia, with those nifty sliding doors, but would REFUSE to consider a chevy, so why not set them up with a nice GMC?

Wow .... somebody that actually GETS it. I'm impressed!

[red]

I question the justification of this decision...what's the real target market anyways? Or is it just another one of those "well, this retail channel needs this product, so let's give it to them regardless of brand positioning, goals, overlap, image, etc." I'm expecting some mildly enhanced Uplander that somehow meets the needs of some fantasy market that won't ever step in a PBGMC dealership. Or maybe things have changed...

[PurdueGuy]

+1 toward Buick instead of GMC. A Denali minivan just seems... not at all right. I can see GMC with a minivan with a more utility design - not that it wouldn't be made compatible with families, but that it would be function over form inside, and simple, classy looks outside. Special cargo-related design features (stock and/or OEM aftermarket) for the inside would further justify it being a GMC.

[Dsuupr]

With the Denali series (not that I'm for a Denali Minivan), and GMCs current trend to go upscale, I could see a minivan working for them. I also agree that it would fit Buick better to have an upscale minivan to compete with the Town & Country.

Edited August 29, 2006 by Dsuupr

[ehaase]

I also agree that it would fit Buick better to have an upscale minivan to compete with the Town & Country.

186292[/snapback]

I do not wish to offend the Buick fans here, as I respect a few of them, but Buick probably does not have much of an upscale image anymore among the general public. A GMC Sorrano (rumored name) Denali minivan may sell at a higher price and in higher quantities than a Buick minivan would.

Buick first needs to rebuild its image with a good powerful RWD sedan, but that's not coming until at least 2011.

[american_revolution_2005]

I would like to see this. I am not 100% with the idea but just see what it brings. It may turn out great but all I can hope is that it doesn't look like an Uplander or Relay or SV6. Those things were ugly and many people thought so as well. GM shouldn't try to crossover a minivan with an SUV. That is a crossover's job. The minivan should look good but more like a normal minivan. I really think Pontiac should bring back the sporty Montana as it was before the SV6. If you drive into my town, you don't see Uplanders, SV6s, Ventures, you see the old sporty Montana. I know many people who wanted to buy a new one but then they saw what had replaced their van, many said it was awful. I counted the number of Montanas in my neighbourhood. There are about 15 or more Montanas in my neighbourhood. This should tell GM that they had a great seller on their hands. It was sporty, conventional, big enough for those who wanted a sporty car but had a bigger family, and it was also very affordable. Toyota also used this similarily in their ad campaigns in 2004, they stated some like, a car that seats 7, 260 hp minivan?, and they used things to show its sportiness and capability. They sold like crazy here as well. It may be the Toyota brand name but I think this is a great formula to work with.

[pow]

Around here, GMC is much, much more upscale than Buick.

[BlkHhr104]

Well who says this, if it is real minivan will have a Denal varient, the Canyon does'nt, and will the Acadia have a Denali varient?

[z28luvr01]

I've always though the idea of a GMC minivan would be rather interesting. GMC's more expressive design language might make for a minivan that the average man (and a rap star or two) actually wouldn't mind being seen in. I agree with Camino in that GMC is the best place for it in the B-P-G channel. It allows Buick and Pontiac to remain tightly focused on their missions (something they'll need to be able to do in order to survive), while it exploits the loyalty that GMC buyers have to the nameplate. Also, what this does is give GMC some additional sales volume that further ensure that it won't be going anywhere anytime soon.

[Dragon]

put down the minivan idea and back away slowly

[jbartley]

Wow  .... somebody that actually GETS it.  I'm impressed! 

186145[/snapback]

haha, well now if everyone else would "get it" too.

did no one see this coming? this has been common knowledge since the beginning of time? (ok ok the beginning of lambda)

[prototype66]

I think I already covered this with the Trailblazer sketch thingie, PM missed the mark again

[GMman]

I think what eveyone is really confused about here, is the fact that GM is providing GMC with yet another vehicle, while BUICK is sitting quitely in the corner waiting for the ENCLAVE and RWD Lucerne. I like the GMC brand too, but I question their relevance anymore, in light of the fact that all of their vehicles are rebadged somethings. That whole "upscale" comment struck me as weird. I look at BUICK as being more 'upscale' than GMC...

Face it. GM is stuffing products in the GMC showroom and starving Buick. That pisses me off.

[Brougham-Holiday]

I think Buick is too upscale for a minivan, a full size wagon on a rwd platform would be the best. I also think GMC needs to back away from the upper market Buick/Cadillac lines.

[CreativeVision]

I agree with GM's decision, I don't think Buick and Pontiac sheould ever again have a minivan- I think it dilutes both brands. BPG should only have one minivan anyway and GMC is the natural choice.

Saturn should eventually get one as well. Three minivans spread evenly throughout GM's dealer networks makes sense to me. Buick,Pontiac,SAAB,Cadillac, and Hummer should remain tightly focused, and that means no minivans.

185982[/snapback]

How is GMC the "natural" choice for a minivan? You state for multiple other GM brands that they should remain tightly focused and not dilute the brand, and yet you think it is okay for a brand that has always been "Professional Grade" and very much based on strong trucks and brute force to have a family minivan? Wow...that doesn't dilute a brand does it? Sure its still somewhat trucky in a sense, but come on! The only natural place for a minivan in GM's lineup would be Chevy and Saturn of yesteryear(as they mature and head toward a European presence, it doesn't fit anymore). I could see the argument for Buick as they are trying to attract younger buyers now, but it still doesn't seem to fit the reality of who actually buys Buicks.

[z28luvr01]

... you think it is okay for a brand that has always been "Professional Grade" and very much based on strong trucks and brute force to have a family minivan? 

186669[/snapback]

That's yet another reason why a GMC minivan makes sense. The marketing campaign for it practically writes itself. Imagine a commercial showing a minivan performing all these outlandish tasks and standing up well to abuse that workers commonly dish out to their trucks, then a voiceover saying something like "If a minivan can survive all of this, it'll have no problem surviving your family".

Also, with a GMC minivan, GM gets a clean-slate attempt at selling a minivan. By now the public at large believes that Chevy, Buick, Pontiac, and Saturn can't provide a good minivan. GMC has no such stigma.

[wjfox]

I agree with several of the opinions here that Chevrolet, and Buick should get the mini vans, not GMC. That would position the same basic vehicle upscale and not so upscale. To me GMC just doesn't fit with a mini van.

The reason that Terraza didn't set any fires wasn't because it was in a Buick dealership, its because in was a big schnozed rework of a vehicle that was dull and uncompetive in the first place. The interior was ok and well though out with in the limits of the platform. But the outside is so ugly, who'd take the time to get to know the inside. Especially when Chysler offers Stow N Go, and Toyota offers a minivan period. (My suspicion is that minivan buyers put more trust in Toyota reliability than average car buyers.)

Someone said Buick is too upscale for a minivan. I disagree. If Chrysler isn't then Buick isn't and in Europe, Mercedes Benz offers the Vito, whichi s a biggish mini van. If MB isn't too upscale for a mini van, Buick certainly is not. But GM needs to get the product right, and then a Buick (and Chevy) dealership can sell it.

Someone else mentioned that Saturn should have a more Europena van or people mover option. I agree 100%. In June I rented an Opel Zafira in Italy and I thought 1000 times, Saturn needs this car. It seats seven in a pinch, but isn't much longer than a Cobalt / HHR. It could compete with the Mazda5 and give some product differentiation to the different GM brands.

If GM is FIANLLY leveraging its global resources, like it appears they are begining to do (GTO, Epslion) then they should consider bringing the Zafira over or building it here.

[ZL-1]

The marketing campaign for it practically writes itself. Imagine a commercial showing a minivan performing all these outlandish tasks and standing up well to abuse that workers commonly dish out to their trucks, then a voiceover saying something like "If a minivan can survive all of this, it'll have no problem surviving your family".

186679[/snapback]

Interesting idea!

I wonder what Opel minivan Saturn will get... If not the Zafira, then:

a) Meriva (corsa-based)?

b) A new "Sintra", based off EpII and smaller than the Lambda models?

[Dragon]

you think it is okay for a brand that has always been "Professional Grade" and very much based on strong trucks and brute force to have a family minivan?

My last two companies have bought minivans instead of their cousin panel vans because they use it to not only move equipment, but also sometimes use the full seating capacity to move employees. So there is definitely a “professional” market out there for it.

Hell, I've seen what smallish families can do to a minivan. I have no doubt some families NEED a professional grade minivan too.

[GMTruckGuy74]

Someone said Buick is too upscale for a minivan. I disagree. If Chrysler isn't then Buick isn't and in Europe, Mercedes Benz offers the Vito, whichi s a biggish mini van. If MB isn't too upscale for a mini van, Buick certainly is not. But GM needs to get the product right, and then a Buick (and Chevy) dealership can sell it.

DOes LEXUS sell a minivan? NOPE! They sell the RX-330, which Buick will offer the Enclave to compete against it. I wouldn't consider what's sold in Europe as a basis for what should be sold in NA... and Chrysler needs the Town & Country as it's their bread & butter (much like the pickups & suvs are GM's bread & butter).

I agree that the old Saturn would have benefited from a Lambda-based minivan; but with the focus now on a more Opel-based lineup, and I've said this in the past, I'd like to see GM offer something that no other GM division offers.

My vote is still for GMC to get the minivan, and I agree with many of the posters here who have already acknowledged this and supported the arguement with good evidence (that commercial sounds great z28luvr01. All you GMC haters will just have to deal with it!

[BuddyP]

I don't think it matters who get's the minivan as long as they don't flood each brank with one (ie. Chevy, Buick, Pontiac, Saturn, GMC). Chevy can have one and either GMC or Buick can have one. That's it. Personally, the GMC van would probably look better than a Buick anyway so I saw stick with GMC>

[GMTruckGuy74]

I like the GMC brand too, but I question their relevance anymore, in light of the fact that all of their vehicles are rebadged somethings.

Relevance? Umm, the fact that GMC is a HUGE cash cow for General Motors. That's their relevance, and the fact that many people prefer the styling of the GMC models over their Chevy counterparts. More Denali models are sold than Escalade models. At my son's football practice, I have only seen one Escalade SUV and I've seen at least 4 Yukon Denali models. I live in a golf course community and there are more Denali's in driveways than Escalades, and the same can be said for Tahoes.

And get off your "rebadge" kick. Um, same could be said for many of your precious Buicks (do you remember the '80s?). GMCs and Chevys have always shared many parts over the last 80/90 years.... and they've always sold without a bunch of customers leaving to buy Toyota, Nissan, or Honda trucks (900,000 pickup trucks were sold last year - how many Buicks TOTAL were sold?).

I think what eveyone is really confused about here, is the fact that GM is providing GMC with yet another vehicle, while BUICK is sitting quitely in the corner waiting for the ENCLAVE and RWD Lucerne.... Face it.  GM is stuffing products in the GMC showroom and starving Buick.  That pisses me off.

I can empathize with your statement. GMC has been starved for the last couple of years while Chevy got specific truck models (SSR, Avalanche). But you must realize GM doesn't see the need for Buick to have more than 3 or 4 models in the "new" Buick., and a minivan isn't being considered.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

We need to clarify something right now people - the fact that Pontiac, GMC, and Buick are no longer INDIVIDUAL divisions. For the 21st century, GM has regrouped them as ONE, single division. I will admit that having two Lambda crossovers on the same lot does confuse me, but I'm sure the PRICING structure will definitely separate the two per customers needs. We have to adjust and compare the "new" B-P-G to the Chevy lineup - Pontiac would offer the sporty cars (Camaro, Malibu, Impala & Monte Carlo SS), Buick offers the family cars (Malibu, Impala <non-SS>), and GMC covers the truck line.

[BuddyP]

The more I think of it, and maybe it was already noted, why is there a need for a minivan since the lambda's release? It's a 3rd row seat, FWD van that actually looks decent. Why make another 3rd row, FWD vehicle?

[Petra]

I question the need for GM to make a 2nd Minivan at all.

[Mule Bakersdozen LS]

Buick should have the Minivan.  GMC should be trucks, crossovers, and SUVs.  If this is a traditional minivan it should move to the tri-shields.

185935[/snapback]

I absolutely, totally agree. It just makes sense that Buick gets the minivan-take Ford and Mercury and Dodge and Chrysler for example. You don't see Jeep with a minivan, right? (oops...I better not give them or GMC any ideas for a Epsilon II or Zeta-based wagon-I hope neither of the above ever happen or are truly thought up-I'm sure the Sorrano might look really nice, but I'm still fully against it, but I guess we'll have to deal with it.)

[PurdueGuy]

The more I think of it, and maybe it was already noted, why is there a need for a minivan since the lambda's release? It's a 3rd row seat, FWD van that actually looks decent. Why make another 3rd row, FWD vehicle?

186845[/snapback]

Because there are still many customers who want a minivan, not a crossover. Sure, the lambda's are 95% minivan, but many people will still see them as SUVs, and will want a minivan instead. The sliding door is a good feature, even if it does have a "soccer mom" stigma attached.

[rkmdogs]

No, we shouldn't, because most of us are not objective.  Many here just want more products for their favorite brand, even if that's not best for GM as an entity.

I am probably the only person here who feels this way, but if cutting GM back to Chevrolet and Cadillac and nothing else would make GM more profitable and successful, I'd be for it.  (And I don't claim to know what would be best.)

186013[/snapback]

Well there are two of us,then ehaase!

Most of the participants on this web are too young, immature, and have an axe to grind to be objective!

Some of the people here however, would make a good sounding board for

future ideas, provided their interests are identified prior, and their degree of

expertise in a given area is known.

THAT is the resource potential that GM is wasting!

[mikehamm45]

anyone else in here think they were going to read about a G6 areo package?

[Flybrian]

Sorry! Try it again

[Dragon]

Sorry! Try it again

186931[/snapback]

+1

[ponchoman49]

Please tell me the new 09 minivans aren't going to look like that puke on wheels thing on the main page! Gosh the current one looks 10 times better and i'm not a huge fan of those either.

[haypops]

The more I think of it, and maybe it was already noted, why is there a need for a minivan since the lambda's release? It's a 3rd row seat, FWD van that actually looks decent. Why make another 3rd row, FWD vehicle?

186845[/snapback]

Honda seems to do very well with the Pilot+Odyssey.

Each addition to the linup has advantages and disadvantages. I think many of us are diregarding the latter. Buick's brand would be more negativley impacted than GMC's by the inclusion of a minivan. The positives are probably the same for both. Buick will do just great with the Enclave which is the best looking Lambda or crossover segment offering.