Drove an '06 Malibu LT for a week.

[NeonLX]

Keep in mind as you read this that I've been driving Chrysler products for decades now, though I had quite a few GM vehicles "back in the day"...

You guys probably remember my gushing over the Cobalt we rented last summer while on vacation. Well, this summer we rented the Cobalt's bigger brother, a 2006 Malibu LT, while our daughter attended a figure skating camp in Santa Fe, NM. We had the thing for a week and put on 1200 miles in all kinds of driving, from stop & go city stuff to mountain climbing. The Malibu was equipped rather well with power everything, remote keyless, killer sound system, sun roof, electric driver's seat, 3500 V6 and a host of other goodies. Here's what I thought of the thing:

1. Smooth & strong powertrain. The 3500 V6 develops great whacking gobs of power, especially once the revs climb. It didn't have spectacular tip-in like the old 3800s used to, but it would really deliver once you stuck your foot into it. Under full throttle, the thing felt as strong as some of the big-block V8s I used to drive.

And just like the Cobalt, the tranny shifted smoothly and responsively. One thing I noticed is that it seemed to hold the gears longer than you might expect--it would rarely upshift before 2500 RPM, even under light throttle.

2. Effortless high speed cruising. This car has some mighty tall gearing. We traveled from Santa Fe to Roswell and back again on one day of our trip, using Hwy 285. The speed limit is 75 MPH along most of the 200 mile stretch--so many people were driving 85 MPH or more. I set the cruise at 85 MPH where the tach registered a lazy 2300 RPM. Wish I had checked the gas mileage during this trip; the EPA says the Malibu is rated at 22/32 MPG with the 3500 V6 (wow!). Even at 85-90 MPH, the interior was very quiet with minimal road and wind noise (didn't hear even a light rustle from the sun roof).

3. Good ride & handling. The suspension is compliant but all the motions are well-controlled. Taking curves at high speeds causes little drama and I never once got the front tires to squeal. Front dive is almost non-existent, even under hard braking. I liked the "electric steering"--very easy turning in parking lots but plenty of feedback for the high speed stuff.

4. Comfortable interior. The seating is more upright than many contemporary sedans--something I like. The visibility is good too. Rear seat room is surprising, especially legroom. I like the fact that the rear seat bottom cushion is high off of the floor. This makes it feel more like sitting in a chair, rather than having to plop your arse down close to the floor with your legs jutting out in front of you.

5. Great sound system. I don't know how many watts get pushed through those speakers but they can be turned up LOUD. And everything sounds very clear.

6. BIG rear view mirrors on the outside of the car--bigger than either the Neon's or the Caravan's. Great visibility with no blind spots.

I only had one minor quibble with the car: I couldn't get quite enough of an angle with the bottom cushion of the driver's seat to support my thighs. I noticed this with the Cobalt we drove last year too. Both my cheap Neon and the Caravan have more comfortable driver's seats for my prefered driving position (pushed way back with the front of the bottom cushion tilted up). Even so, I was reasonably comfortable.

As you can tell, I was mighty impressed with this Malibu--and liked it even better than the Cobalt I gushed about last year. Depending on how these things price out, I wouldn't mind picking up a year or two old model with low miles next time I'm looking for a "second" car (a role currently filled by the Neon).

Edited July 18, 2006 by NeonLX

[CARBIZ]

None of this matters because:

a) the 3.5 is a pushrod engine not up to the snuff of the far superior Japanese engines in the Camry, Altima, etc.

b) electric steering is a BIG no, no - you must feel every crack on the pavement and put down your slurpy when you turn a corner!

c) too much hard plastic

d) are you high? the Malibu only has FOUR speeds and isn't even available

with a manual transmisson

Just thought I'd say that................................otherwise, good write up!

[AAS]

Nice write-up...

Did you eat at the "Cowgirl" in Santa Fe? They have the best baby-back ribs i've ever had. Can't wait to go back to NM (working in Los Alamos) and eat them again! I guess i'm more interested in your trip, than in the car (funny, I had a Malibu Classic last year and it wasn't that bad)... How did you like the weather? Did you drive through the Jemez mtns? The geography changes so much in that state, it's really nice.

[NeonLX]

Nice write-up...

Did you eat at the "Cowgirl" in Santa Fe?  They have the best baby-back ribs i've ever had.  Can't wait to go back to NM (working in Los Alamos) and eat them again!  I guess i'm more interested in your trip, than in the car (funny, I had a Malibu Classic last year and it wasn't that bad)...  How did you like the weather?  Did you drive through the Jemez mtns?  The geography changes so much in that state, it's really nice.

168559[/snapback]

We absolutely loved New Mexico. Yeah, it was hot--but the dewpoint temperatures were 25 - 35 degrees F so the humidity was very low. Where we live (WI) the dewpoints are generally in the 60-75 F range during the summer so it's ugly humid.

The sky in NM is incredible--right up there with the sky in Alaska (last year's trip).

My favorite face-stuffing place in Santa Fe was the Blue Corn Cafe & brewpub (near the corner of San Francisco & Water). The food is great (& inexpensive) and the homegrown beer is fabulous. We also ate at the Plaza Cafe where I had the best enchiladas ever. Also, Santa Fe brewing makes some incredible bottled beer. I really liked the Pale Ale and the Chicken Killer Barleywine--but watch out for the latter; it will rob your head in record time.

We drove up to the Santa Fe ski basin one day and really loved it up there. The temp when we left Santa Fe was 85 and when we got to the top of the mountain (elevation about 10,500 ft) it was 66 degrees. It felt great. And the Malibu's "electric" steering did a fine job on the twisty mountain road too!

[The O.C.]

None of this matters because:

  a) the 3.5 is a pushrod engine not up to the snuff of the far superior Japanese engines in the Camry, Altima, etc.

  b) electric steering is a BIG no, no - you must feel every crack on the pavement and put down your slurpy when you turn a corner!

  c) too much hard plastic

  d) are you high?  the Malibu only has FOUR speeds and isn't even available

    with a manual transmisson

 

  Just thought I'd say that................................otherwise, good write up!

168495[/snapback]

Actually CARBIZ, you hit the nail on the head...! Thanks for saving me the trouble!

<The O.C. ingoring the obvious sarcasm from CARBIZ>

[AAS]

...

My favorite face-stuffing place in Santa Fe was the Blue Corn Cafe & brewpub (near the corner of San Francisco & Water).  The food is great (& inexpensive) and the homegrown beer is fabulous.  We also ate at the Plaza Cafe where I had the best enchiladas ever.  Also, Santa Fe brewing makes some incredible bottled beer. I really liked the Pale Ale and the Chicken Killer Barleywine--but watch out for the latter; it will rob your head in record time.

We drove up to the Santa Fe ski basin one day and really loved it up there.  The temp when we left Santa Fe was 85 and when we got to the top of the mountain (elevation about 10,500 ft) it was 66 degrees.  It felt great.  And the Malibu's "electric" steering did a fine job on the twisty mountain road too!

168693[/snapback]

Cool... I'll have to keep all of that in mind!

[91z4me]

Sales have been awefull because it looks like a rental car.

Agree!

That is evok's first law - styling sells even the crappiest product.

168716[/snapback]

I guess now it has a name. I will be quoting evok's law quite often from now on.

[Flybrian]

I'm interested in Evok's other laws. I heard one of them corrolates smelling it to having dealt it.

[evok]

I'm interested in Evok's other laws. I heard one of them corrolates smelling it to having dealt it.

168726[/snapback]

Actually I only worked out the first one - still trying to quantify the others. A lot harder then I first thought. But I like your idea.

I do have the title - Return to Greatness.

I checked the USPTO site and it has not been trademarked.

[evok]

In all seriousness people buy a product based up three things:

1) Styling - can include vehicle attributes.

2) Reputation - can include brand image.

3) Price

That is it in a nut shell.

In the case up the Malibu - the vehicle does not have a positive reputation, is not exciting to look at so therefore the only thing that can drive sales is price.

So the point that was brought up earlier about the engine being pushrod is pointless. The total package driven by its styling is so lackluster there is very little reason to look at the vehicle if you are in the market unless you can get a good deal that is hard to turn down.

If GM put the Northstar or 3.6 in the current Malibu with a 6 speed stick or auto, does anybody really think sales would increase much if at all?

Another recent example is the Cadillac SRX for 07. Does anyone here really think the money spent on the interior will increase sales all that much? Without updating the exterior styling on the volume vehicle, sales will be flat for 07. Few will look at the 07 because of the interior redo no matter how good it is. So without dramatic styling, a mediocre reputation in that segment, GM will have to use price to attract interest. If GM would have invested more in a dramatic front end for the vehicle, maybe the rest of the shortcomings would be overlooked. Much as what happened with the CTS and second generation Escalade.

I can use many examples where the rest of the vehicle was crap, used antiquated powertrain, front wheel drive, but ultimatly the vehicle was successful because of great styling.

Just look at Chrysler in the 90s.

[intrigued]

evok, if you need any help/advice on Itellectual propert matter message me asI work in an IP firm.

[NeonLX]

I don't know what this says about us but both my wife and I like the looks of the Malibu. OK, I have to admit that I prefer the looks of a G6, but styling aside, the Malibu seems like a better package for the money. But then again, I'm one of those old timers who places value high on the list of things to look for in a car.

[evok]

evok, if you need any help/advice on Itellectual propert matter message me asI work in an IP firm.

168761[/snapback]

Thanks - so does my wife.

Edited July 19, 2006 by evok

[ocnblu]

"The vehicle does not have a positive reputation..." Your negative spin can easily be reversed. Why is your opinion law?

[Croc]

"The vehicle does not have a positive reputation..."  Your negative spin can easily be reversed.  Why is your opinion law?

168839[/snapback]

If it can be easily reversed, then please show us your research indicating the Malibu has a positive image, that the public at large finds its design appealing, fresh and innovative, and that the Malibu is considered by the public as a desirable vehicle.

I would be fascinated by this proof since sales are not setting the world on fire, JD Powers APPEAL data does not reveal great enthusiasm on the part of the public, and car reviews from every major auto publication have been tepid.

[ocnblu]

Exhibit 1: the original post in this thread. Why am I even explaining this to you? Mr. NeonLX is representative of the customer this car is aimed toward. And I am certain he's not the only person in America who likes the car.

You are doing now what you admonished me for doing months ago... defending a fellow member who does not need to be defended. I will thank you to stay out of this. Don't be hypocritical.

[evok]

You are doing now what you admonished me for doing months ago... defending a fellow member who does not need to be defended.  I will thank you to stay out of this.  Don't be hypocritical.[/b]

168849[/snapback]

Croc is correct.

"I would be fascinated by this proof since sales are not setting the world on fire, JD Powers APPEAL data does not reveal great enthusiasm on the part of the public, and car reviews from every major auto publication have been tepid."

I have nothing to defend. There is plenty of data that supports my statements.

It is you that needs to prove me wrong.

Which you cannot do unless you use anedotal stories or unsupportable opinion. Which is also know as spin. Don't BS me. Please.

Edited July 19, 2006 by evok

[ocnblu]

Okay, back from the JD Power Consumer Center website. The car does well vs. the competition in several categories. I sampled a Malibu LT 2.2L against an Altima 2.5S, a Camry CE, an Accord LX and a Fusion SE. The Malibu is a solid, quality car let down only by its front end design, and even that is subjective. The car has a history of good scores for quality, extending from the last generation car.

[CARBIZ]

I'm with Blu on this one: those that own the Malibu generally like it. These people do not care about standard transmissions, soft plastics, etc. They like the fuel economy, the general ride and smoothness of the vehicle and, of course, the PRICE. You can get a Malibu around here for the price of a Corolla. Not a bad proposition, IMO

[nomadder]

Last year while looking for a car I wanted a mazda 3. Took on for a test drive but found the footwheel to small. Next I looked at an altima but I live half way up a ski hill and found the 4 underpowered. The 6 was out of our budget. Next we went with the Vibe thinking it would replace our 93 villager quite handily but the dealer would not bite on the price.(dispite a long term Buddy was the salesman). So he steered me over to this fleet return 2004 Malibu LT. I hated the front end of this car so I took it out under protest, Man was I impressed. It took me up the hill to my place way better than any other car I drove that summer with the gas milage way surpassing my expectations(35-40). The price on this car was way below the other cars I was looking at. 15000 can!!! So I bought it. I have been so impressed I am now looking for a Maxx to replace my 99 alero.

[evok]

Not on the APPEAL list for 06 and it never has been:

http://www.jdpower.com/corporate/news/rele...pdf/2006100.pdf

50% in 2005 to Fleet:

http://www.fleet-central.com/af/stats2005/cars_web.pdf

Sales Jan -June 06 vs 05:

89,827 vs. 100,863

Sales Jan -June 2000

115,511

These are direct measurements of what the general public thinks and has thought.

Successful IQS and Dependability ratings have not altered the appeal of the vehicle to the public.

The public has spoken with their wallet.

[evok]

I'm with Blu on this one: those that own the Malibu generally like it.  These people do not care about standard transmissions, soft plastics, etc.  They like the fuel economy, the general ride and smoothness of the vehicle and, of course, the PRICE.  You can get a Malibu around here for the price of a Corolla.  Not a bad proposition, IMO

168890[/snapback]

And sales are still down year after year and heavily fleeted.

How does that compare to the Camry? or Accord? or Altima?

It all goes back to my earlier post today!

1) It has little appeal to the mass market on style.

2) Chevrolet/Malibu does not have a bullet proof reputation to drive sales or interest.

3) GM resorts to deals and rebates to give the cars away at a lesser lesser rate and fleet the hell out of it.

Edited July 20, 2006 by evok

[Flybrian]

No one is denying that the Malibu is a good car. It certainly is economical with good power, a decent interior, reliable, good build quality, highly configurable, and a good value. Unfotunately, that's about all it is - a good car, not a great one, and the driving force in getting people to purchase a Malibu is typically that its a good deal.

There's nothing wrong with that if that's what you're aiming for, but Chevrolet doesn't need to have the same vision as Kia, Hyundai, and Toyota. Chevrolet needs to be something more. Values like the Malibu and Impala get people to buy, but stylish and appealing values get people to trade their non-GMs in.

[evok]

No one is denying that the Malibu is a good car. It certainly is economical with good power, a decent interior, reliable, good build quality, highly configurable, and a good value. Unfotunately, that's about all it is - a good car, not a great one, and the driving force in getting people to purchase a Malibu is typically that its a good deal.

There's nothing wrong with that if that's what you're aiming for, but Chevrolet doesn't need to have the same vision as Kia, Hyundai, and Toyota. Chevrolet needs to be something more. Values like the Malibu and Impala get people to buy, but stylish and appealing values get people to trade their non-GMs in.

168920[/snapback]

Well said -

[Croc]

You are doing now what you admonished me for doing months ago... defending a fellow member who does not need to be defended.  I will thank you to stay out of this.  Don't be hypocritical.

168849[/snapback]

Thanks for the laugh. This was/is a discussion on the Malibu, not an interpersonal dispute. As such, I am free to comment however I choose to, Bill.

I'm with Blu on this one: those that own the Malibu generally like it.  These people do not care about standard transmissions, soft plastics, etc.  They like the fuel economy, the general ride and smoothness of the vehicle and, of course, the PRICE.  You can get a Malibu around here for the price of a Corolla.  Not a bad proposition, IMO

168890[/snapback]

Well, I would certainly hope the people who own the Malibu like it...otherwise that would be pretty stupid to spend that significant of an amount of money on something they did not like (no matter how Blue Light Special of a deal it was) wouldn't it?

Even Aztek owners liked their vehicles (an assertion that is supported by JD Powers statistical data)...all 45 of them, at least.

[MyerShift]

Hey!

I take exception to "total crap"!!!

Sure, Chrysler had some quality issues in the early `90's- mainly concerning trransmissions, headgaskets, and a/c systems, but no one is perfect.

Chrysler had guts to really turn styling around with its cab-forward architecture, and this revolutionary design set a trend that is continuing today in automakers such as Honda with their "radical" new Civic.

What I really love is that the Neon caught most with their pants down in the U.S. Its 132hp/132lb-ft engine was snappy with the 5-speed. No Civic EX could touch it. Even if the 3-speed automatic in the Neons was antiquated, it sure was a hell of lot more reliable than the atrocious Ultradrive transmission Chrysler foisted upon us.

What hath Chrysler wrought?.. Quite a bit, actually

[Croc]

yea, that was his point...it was crap, but stunning and stylish crap. hence, it sold.

[trinacriabob]

No one is denying that the Malibu is a good car. It certainly is economical with good power, a decent interior, reliable, good build quality, highly configurable, and a good value. Unfotunately, that's about all it is - a good car, not a great one

168920[/snapback]

True. The price point for the amenities is what makes it sell. I've rented a few. Its body structure is definitely taut though the E.P.S. hits people in different ways...I like it, I know you commented that you DIDN'T like it (once upon a post). I think the seating fabrics are absolutely horrendous, though. The seat itself wasn't that comfortable either after a longish drive.

A little 2.2 EcoTec LT with a couple of nice options is truly a good buy. And if it can turn over 200,000 miles, like the EcoTec is supposed to, all the better.

[CARBIZ]

Evok, again you ASTOUND us with your amazing facts, taken out of context, of course.

So, the Malibu's sales are down a WHOPPING 12% in the 6 months of this year while in its 3rd year of sales of this platform, against a brand new Impala, newer G6 and the all new Fusion - if we must compare domestics, at least. Oh, and GM is cutting back on fleet sales, which you jumped in with the Malibu at 50%.

I don't see this as all bad. If the Malibu is only down 12% in this market, then I would say it was holding its own. Now, if GM lets this car go 5 or 6 years without a major refresh (like the last time) then shame on them. We are losing a lot of sales to the Impala, which is similarly priced in V6 form. Impala sales are up at our store.

Anyway, as usual, the point is being lost as everyone WHO KNOWS BETTER are jumping in and saying that anyone who likes the Malibu is an idiot and should have bought the Camry because it is better.

BULL&#036;h&#33;.

[evok]

Evok, again you ASTOUND us with your amazing facts, taken out of context, of course.

  So, the Malibu's sales are down a WHOPPING 12% in the 6 months of this year while in its 3rd year of sales of this platform, against a brand new Impala, newer G6 and the all new Fusion - if we must compare domestics, at least.  Oh, and GM is cutting back on fleet sales, which you jumped in with the Malibu at 50%.

  I don't see this as all bad.  If the Malibu is only down 12% in this market, then I would say it was holding its own.  Now, if GM lets this car go 5 or 6 years without a major refresh (like the last time) then shame on them.  We are losing a lot of sales to the Impala, which is similarly priced in V6 form.  Impala sales are up at our store.

  Anyway, as usual, the point is being lost as everyone WHO KNOWS BETTER are jumping in and saying that anyone who likes the Malibu is an idiot and should have bought the Camry because it is better.

   BULL&#036;h&#33;.

169120[/snapback]

Chevy only sells and has sold app. 100-125k/yr Malibu's to retail customers over the life of the 380 program. Subsidized mind you.

And how does that compare to the Camry?

Dare I mention the carryover Classic P90 when the 380 was launched? The 380 sales are a lost worse and now are heavily inflated because of fleet now that the Classic is out of production. The vehicle has been a bust since initial release. And I said that on this board at that time years ago. I was being kind to the 380 Mailbu in comparing the sales by ignoring the Classic. Factoring the Classic into this discussion only makes the argument work in my favor.

And expect the 380 to live on when the 385 is released next year. GM is going to try the dual Classic/Malibu again. Maybe this time it will work.

So Carbiz go back and look at this big picture. It is a little more complex than your little persective in your little dealer.

The 380 program has been a bust since launch.

And I will not address your inclusion of the G6. I have already show that the G6 compared to the Grand Am has not been a sales success using data since 2000.

It is you my friend who are full of it. If I need a deal on undercoating or Lo Jack, or a faux convertible roof, I will be sure to seek your imput but not on this topic.

Edited July 20, 2006 by evok

[NeonLX]

One other consideration here: the Malibu (and other domestic offerings) have a real uphill battle on their hands when it comes to the automotive press. I've always said that a person could dredge up an old outhouse, affix a chrome "H" to the door and the automotive presstitutes would come running from all directions for the chance to test the new, latest hip offering from Honda. They'd gush about its "rustic styling" and any wind getting through the cracks between the boards would be attributed to the outhouse's "efficient HVAC system". The two-hole seating would be described as "ergonomically correct" and the overwhelming odor from "the basement" would be characterized as a "lovely refreshing aroma that permeates the interior".

However, if said outhouse wore a Chevy bowtie or a Phord oval, it would be dissed for being exactly what it is--a stinky old sh*tbox.

[evok]

I've always said that a person could dredge up an old outhouse, affix a chrome "H" to the door and the automotive presstitutes would come running from all directions for the chance to test the new, latest hip offering from Honda. They'd gush about its "rustic styling" and any wind getting through the cracks between the boards would be attributed to the outhouse's "efficient HVAC system".  The two-hole seating would be described as "ergonomically correct" and the overwhelming odor from "the basement" would be characterized as a "lovely refreshing aroma that permeates the interior".

169145[/snapback]

Well I will dispel another myth.

http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/sedan/...ison/index.html

http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/oneyea...evrolet_malibu/

[NeonLX]

{SHRUG} So what am I missing? The Accord comes out on top in the test from the first link (though the Camry got ditched to 4th).

And to me, they sounded pretty lukewarm in the Malibu Maxx write up, kind of a "damning with faint praise" sort of deal.

Or maybe I'm just being too hard on them--I unsubscribed from both Honda & Driver and Murder Trend many years back. I'm such an old crumudgeon.

[evok]

{SHRUG} So what am I missing?  The Accord comes out on top in the test from the first link (though the Camry got ditched to 4th).

And to me, they sounded pretty lukewarm in the Malibu Maxx write up, kind of a "damning with faint praise" sort of deal.

Or maybe I'm just being too hard on them--I unsubscribed from both Honda & Driver and Murder Trend many years back.  I'm such an old crumudgeon.

169154[/snapback]

The article on all the vehicles was fair and if you have driven any or all of them you would agree.

There was no spin.

[CARBIZ]

Neon, you're not missing anything. It is the car "journalists" - a jaded lot by any standards, who don't get it.

Let's look at the opening statement, dripping with disdain that sets the tone for the rest of the Maxx write up,"this isn't a performance vehicle." Then we move rapidly to the words "average" and my favorite..."couldn't it have a bit more personality?"

These guys just don't get it. The holier-than-thou attitude that many of these so-called auto critics take is disgusting. I shouldn't just pick on car critics because lately I am getting suspicious about "professionals" from so many different vocations who protect their turf and bitch about their own petty fiefdoms. Give a guy a piece of paper from University and suddenly he is an expert. Studies are bull&#036;h&#33;, but you can yank out a study for nearly anything to support nearly anything.

SIGH.

We were just told that another myth has been dispelled. How is that so? From CR's sickening defense of the Avalon and other recent Toyota disasters to the New York Time's outrageous diatribes against GM - the evidence is all around us: Japan Inc. gets a free ride.

And now, just because Hyundai has FINALLY raised itself out of the basement of the outhouse they have been mucking around in for the past 20 years, the automotive press is already salivating about the next Big Thing. The pack mentality of the press is odious.

I JUST WISH THAT ONCE, ONE OF THEM WOULD HAVE AN ORIGINAL THOUGHT.

[evok]

CARBIZ you sound like a fool and here is why:

First link I posted

"Maybe our fourth-place Camry LE test car was just having a bad day. Or maybe the pedestal America's best-selling sedan has been preening itself on isn't as lofty as we've thought. At low speeds, its five-speed automatic lurched on downshifts. The concrete-induced tire-whirr decibels were two settings higher than any of us remembered, and its stopping feel recalled the heyday of cable braking. Demerits against a car that otherwise gives vanilla a good name, being erstwhile quiet as a librarian with laryngitis, comforpedic riding, and as solid as a poured-concrete foundation."

As I pointed out it goes both ways as I pointed out earlier.

Edited July 20, 2006 by evok

[NeonLX]

The article on all the vehicles was fair and if you have driven any or all of them you would agree.

There was no spin.

169155[/snapback]

Thanks for the enlightenment. It's good to hear that the automotive journalists are fair & objective, just like their counterparts in the "liberal" news media.

[CARBIZ]

Personal attacks aside, the topic of discussion was the Accord and the Malibu. The Maxx article was predictable - I could have written it myself. NeonLX mentioned that Honda could put an H on a turd and sell it; then you dragged up an article that automatically puts Honda as #1. CASE CLOSED.

Experts in the field cannot see beyond their own myopic view of the world. At ever turn we are being crushed by them. Experts have gotten us into Iraq. Experts tell us the automobile is evil, yet 76% of the people drive to work every day. Experts tell us immigration is good; then we have class wars in our streets.

Experts are only protecting experts and protecting their own jobs. Under the category of you-can't-challenge-me-because-I'm-an-expert, the government hires these idiots and hides behind them WHEN IT SUITS THEM

But I digress.

You prove my point at every turn. Just once, I'd like to see an automotive expert drive a car and judge it by what it is supposed to do, how much it will cost to buy and who is going to buy it AND KEEP THEIR OWN DAMNED PREJUDICES OUT OF IT. And even when the Maxx doesn't disappoint them, they have to cleverly inject their poison into the article with wise cracks and cheap shots

Until a thousand Avalons blow up on the same day at the same time, the media will apologise and mewl at everything Japan (and BMW) builds. They will keep telling us that GM and Ford are &#036;h&#33; because they won't build a 6 cylinder 6 spd manual mid size sedan and because the Cobalt doesn't have DVD navigation.

And people will convince themselves that buying a Honda built in Ohio is the same as buying a Ford built in Michigan. And when we are all working at Wal-Mart for $5 an hour, who the F**k will be left to pay for these rags that pay these guys wages?

[steps off soapbox, puts it away. Over to you for predictable response.]

[evok]

Thanks for the enlightenment.  It's good to hear that the automotive journalists are fair & objective, just like their counterparts in the "liberal" news media.

169185[/snapback]

For the most part they are right on the money when they critique a vehicle.

But let us not forget - these magazines are not TRADE publications but entertainment.

ENTERTAINMENT for auto enthusiasts.

And BTW - that last statement of your had me ROTFLMAO.

It was so ignorant it was funny and I had to laugh.

i.e. Fox News, Hannity, Rush, etc.

[NeonLX]

For the most part they are right on the money when they critique a vehicle.

But let us not forget - these magazines are not TRADE publications but entertainment.

ENTERTAINMENT for auto enthusiasts.

And BTW - that last statement of your had me ROTFLMAO.

It was so ignorant it was funny and I had to laugh.

i.e. Fox News, Hannity, Rush, etc.

169195[/snapback]

Heh. Sounds like you and I agree on that point re: the so-called liberal media (sometimes my sarcasm is a little too low key).

Sorry, I'm kinda crabby today--storm came through last night and blew down a tree in our yard, which fell on top of the garage & pulled the power line out of the house...jeez!

Edited July 20, 2006 by NeonLX

[enzl]

Personal attacks aside, the topic of discussion was the Accord and the Malibu.  The Maxx article was predictable - I could have written it myself.  NeonLX mentioned that Honda could put an H on a turd and sell it; then you dragged up an article that automatically puts Honda as #1.  CASE CLOSED.

  Experts in the field cannot see beyond their own myopic view of the world.  At ever turn we are being crushed by them.  Experts have gotten us into Iraq.  Experts tell us the automobile is evil, yet 76% of the people drive to work every day.  Experts tell us immigration is good; then we have class wars in our streets.

Experts are only protecting experts and protecting their own jobs.  Under the category of you-can't-challenge-me-because-I'm-an-expert, the government hires these idiots and hides behind them WHEN IT SUITS THEM

  But I digress.

 

  You prove my point at every turn.  Just once, I'd like to see an automotive expert drive a car and judge it by what it is supposed to do, how much it will cost to buy and who is going to buy it AND KEEP THEIR OWN DAMNED PREJUDICES OUT OF IT.  And even when the Maxx doesn't disappoint them, they have to cleverly inject their poison into the article with wise cracks and cheap shots

  Until a thousand Avalons blow up on the same day at the same time, the media will apologise and mewl at everything Japan (and BMW) builds.  They will keep telling us that GM and Ford are &#036;h&#33; because they won't build a 6 cylinder 6 spd manual mid size sedan and because the Cobalt doesn't have DVD navigation.

  And people will convince themselves that buying a Honda built in Ohio is the same as buying a Ford built in Michigan.  And when we are all working at Wal-Mart for $5 an hour, who the F**k will be left to pay for these rags that pay these guys wages?

  [steps off soapbox, puts it away.  Over to you for predictable response.]

169187[/snapback]

Hard truth is that the Accord and Civic - the first two Hondas that come to mind--are better PRODUCTS than the comparable Chevy models...

You can rant and rave about the media elites, the pro-Japanese bias or the price of tea in China, but it all comes down to the fact that these 'better mousetraps' have captured their rightful audience in the marketplace. You wanna drive a Chevy instead?...you can..that's what makes America a beautiful country. Just don't sit there and use the Malibu as evidence that GM's product is equivalent. And as far as the media goes, Honda & Toyota have 20+ years of equity to build off of when being reviewed today....GM has 20+ years of mediocrity to contend with...just as sexual equality, racism & a host of other preconceived notions have taken time to change, the perception of American products will too...just don't expect anyone in the press to have a Pity-Party for GM....the disdain and utter indifference that was displayed in their products for years has finally been exercized...but now they've got to play catch-up. Innovation shouldn't be a dirty word up at the RenCen.

...when's the last time GM came out with a segment busting product or an original idea?...they've followed the Germans into euro-sports sedans, the Japanese into appliance-like quality, Chrysler with minivans and Ford with pony-cars....

I just don't understand how you can expect people to plunk down 20K+ of their hard earned cash in the hopes that GM has finally caught on....it's just against plain common sense to do so....I know we're all fans, but without a compelling USP (unique selling point), GM product is DOA (see Evok's diatribes for USP explanation)

[Intrepidation]

I've not driven the current gen Malibu, a probably never will. I simply don't like the exterior.

I drove a previous gen one and hated it, the plastic "stitching" on the steering wheel dug into my hands, the materials, though many of them soft, squeaked when pressed on, the gas peddle was overly sensative, teh steering was to light and the brakes were mushy. This sorta irrlelavant, since this thread pertains to the current gen car, just felt like saying something

Just out of curiousity, does the current gen car still have these issues?

[NeonLX]

Just out of curiousity, does the current gen car still have these issues?

169201[/snapback]

Not the one I drove. Actually, I also drove a Maxx LT & a different Malibu LT sedan last year and neither of these had any of the issues you described either.

If I had to buy a good family sedan right now, I'd get either a Cobalt, Malibu or G6. If I was looking at a minivan however, I'd get another SWB Mopar like the one we've got.

[evok]

169187[/snapback]

see enzl's post - I am done diatribing for one day.

[Intrepidation]

Not the one I drove. Actually, I also drove a Maxx LT & a different Malibu LT sedan last year and neither of these had any of the issues you described either.

If I had to buy a good family sedan right now, I'd get either a Cobalt, Malibu or G6.  If I was looking at a minivan however, I'd get another SWB Mopar like the one we've got.

169206[/snapback]

Grand Caravan + Stown`n Go = hard to beat. If I had to have a minivan, that would be the one for me.

[DetroitNut90]

Grand Caravan + Stown`n Go = hard to beat. If I had to have a minivan, that would be the one for me.

169213[/snapback]

Stow n' Go itself blows our Venture out of the water.

[Mr.Krinkle]

And as far as the media goes, Honda & Toyota have 20+ years of equity to build off of when being reviewed today....GM has 20+ years of mediocrity to contend with...

169199[/snapback]

out of that whole thing, maybe even ever that is the most concise and meaningful point youve made. and if i was to believe that, then i would say the review of the malibu is a clear indication of a warming up again.

its hard to deny that point but at the same time its pretty evident the turnaround is well on its way. wish the same could be said for Ford...but even that too remains to be seen.

i think a lot of people who were life long gmers or domestics in general that "switched" over felt like they were putting the family dog down.

it wasnt what they wanted necessarily, just didnt really have a choice.

these latest offering though are once again fodder...and maybe there isnt a true media bias, but its hard to look at a clear sky and say it isnt blue.

[CARBIZ]

BTW, Stown'n Go ain't Chrysler's. They had a 2 year contract to use it and now other manufacturers will have it, too. Hopefully, GM will put it in the next generation BUT keep in mind the gas tank has to shrink by 4 gallons, the spare tire has to move - all is not warm and fuzzy with stowable seats.

[Flybrian]

Well I will dispel another myth.

http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/sedan/...ison/index.html

http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/oneyea...evrolet_malibu/

169151[/snapback]

I would like to add that generation of Camry was a pile of crap.

[ocnblu]

Remember, any GM vehicle must be a proportionally bigger piece of crap than its Japanese competition.