NADA's CEO is Concerned About Consumers Being Priced Out

So true, Auto companies have got to find a way to get basic starter auto's out for people in college and right out of college, otherwise we are truly headed to a cast system.

14 minutes ago, dfelt said:

So true, Auto companies have got to find a way to get basic starter auto's out for people in college and right out of college, otherwise we are truly headed to a cast system.

Absolutely.

Not everybody has a family income of 100k. It isn't uncommon for younger people to start making 30k out of college with monster loans.

24 minutes ago, William Maley said:

The average monthly payment is hovering at $538

Seriously? This is average? ?

24 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

Absolutely.

Not everybody has a family income of 100k. It isn't uncommon for younger people to start making 30k out of college with monster loans.

Seriously? This is average? ?

Yeah...I don't know how people manage big car payments...especially with big mortgages. 

46 minutes ago, A Horse With No Name said:

Yeah...I don't know how people manage big car payments...especially with big mortgages. 

Totally agree, I saved up for 3yrs to buy my Escalade and still financed 1/3 of the price. Mortgage, car loans, student loans, regular credit cards, home costs, maintenance, costs have gotten out of control in comparison to income.

There definitely won't be any big car payment for me until the mortgage debt is under 500k lol.

I remember a decade ago, when the politicians and the greenie folk were scolding the Detroit Big3 CEOs why do they keep on producing gas guzzling SUVs and the Detroit Big3 CEOs defended themselves by saying that that is what the consumers want.

The politicians and the greenie folk all said bullshyte on that and forced FoMoCo, GM and Chryco. to produce smaller more economical cars...

This is how Obamas new mileage standards came to be...

THIS is how we got small displacement 4 bangers with turbos in our cars.

THIS is how FoMoCo. got the name ecoboost from...

https://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/19/business/19emissions.html

Quote

 

One ranking industry official said that the administration wanted to get the new mileage rules in place before General Motors made a decision on a bankruptcy filing, which could happen by the end of this month. The new rules also provide some certainty for Chrysler, which is already under bankruptcy protection, so that it can plan its future models.

To meet the new federal standards, auto companies will have to drastically change their product lineups in a relatively short time.

The companies have declined so far to comment on the costs involved in meeting a fleet standard of 35 miles a gallon. For starters, the automakers will probably have to sharply reduce the number of low-mileage models, like pickup trucks and large sedans.

The president’s decision will also accelerate the development of smaller cars and engines already under way.

 

As you coud see, a decade later and the consumers NEVER gave two shytes about what greenies and politicians cared for...

I am not a fan of the new CAFE standards put in several years ago.

The real issue is keeping up with the Joneses when it comes to everything, not just cars.  I cannot blame the president of NADA for lamenting high new car prices.  He should blame the automakers for the start of leasing cars 35 years ago in the first place.  Without car leases, the race towards higher-priced vehicles slows down.  There are also too many 60-72 month car notes out there too.  I thought that Hyundai/KIA would actually force prices down.  Instead they joined all others in their car pricing too, with slightly lower pricing.  Also, cars are not falling apart like they used to 30-45 years back, so new car replacements are less likely.  If it wasn't for used car pricing, car sales may end up being half of what they are. 

Where is the $10,000 small crossover?  Where is the $8000 small sedan and/or hatchback?

1 hour ago, frogger said:

There definitely won't be any big car payment for me until the mortgage debt is under 500k lol.

 

Mine is under 100k and I still don't want big payments. I enjoy tools, eating out, good wine, travel, good books, live hockey...and a bunch of other things.

Even if I had Mitt Romney level money I can't see going beyond the thirties for a personal car purchase...

Okay...maybe a CTS V or a Shelby Mustang...but only if I can pay cash for it new.

And even then clean Shelbys and V cars are available used in the thirties all day long.

14 minutes ago, riviera74 said:

I am not a fan of the new CAFE standards put in several years ago.

The real issue is keeping up with the Joneses when it comes to everything, not just cars.  I cannot blame the president of NADA for lamenting high new car prices.  He should blame the automakers for the start of leasing cars 35 years ago in the first place.  Without car leases, the race towards higher-priced vehicles slows down.  There are also too many 60-72 month car notes out there too.  I thought that Hyundai/KIA would actually force prices down.  Instead they joined all others in their car pricing too, with slightly lower pricing.  Also, cars are not falling apart like they used to 30-45 years back, so new car replacements are less likely.  If it wasn't for used car pricing, car sales may end up being half of what they are. 

Where is the $10,000 small crossover?  Where is the $8000 small sedan and/or hatchback?

The Ford Ecosport is as close to a ten grand crossover as you will find. Chevy used to build a very decent bare bones small suv.

Find an (online) clean Chevette and marvel at the interior. It had nothing inside, and you sweated. It was 10,000 miles away from a Cadillac/mercedes.

Now a kia forte HAS to have a leather-wrapped steering wheel, touch screeen, full power features/A/C, active safety warning features, 17" alloy rims, etc etc etc. It even looks like a low end mercedes. How they hell could it possibly be $8000??

Then we have the supposed wave of electrics coming, just about ALL of them priced 25% higher than their gas counterparts. Heading right toward $40K average price? Yep, I think so; electrics are supercharging that price push.

If a brand was to offer a quirky, futuristic, Minimalist Kar with a base sound system, A/C, crank windows/manual seats, no heated seats/wheel, no screen, peppy performance, upper class MPG- it has a chance but at those levels it starts to simply compete with used stuff, better equipped. So it hopes to 'win' volume on those who are willing to do without but HAVE to have a brand new car. How many consumers is that pool comprised of?

I blame the massive upgrading of entry level cars in features and design; it's eroded the degree of difference vs. upper crust cars, and upended the pricing range. Ultimately, a lot more model lines are going to fall- as amenities greatly overlap and size differences are minimal and everyone has 3 or 5 CUVs- the industry sags with oversaturation.

I've advocated for this before and I still think it has major merits. Less model lines, more variants within the model line. Mainstream brands STILL have too many model lines- it's not going to last ESP if new EV brands actually start producing.

2 hours ago, riviera74 said:

I am not a fan of the new CAFE standards put in several years ago.

The real issue is keeping up with the Joneses when it comes to everything, not just cars.  I cannot blame the president of NADA for lamenting high new car prices.  He should blame the automakers for the start of leasing cars 35 years ago in the first place.  Without car leases, the race towards higher-priced vehicles slows down.  There are also too many 60-72 month car notes out there too.  I thought that Hyundai/KIA would actually force prices down.  Instead they joined all others in their car pricing too, with slightly lower pricing.  Also, cars are not falling apart like they used to 30-45 years back, so new car replacements are less likely.  If it wasn't for used car pricing, car sales may end up being half of what they are. 

Where is the $10,000 small crossover?  Where is the $8000 small sedan and/or hatchback?

Lets add in the other HORROR of auto sales, dealerships that flip an upside down auto value and roll it into a new auto purchase just increasing the debt making it hard for the person to ever pay off the auto.

@balthazar Gov requirement for all the nanny devices makes having a fully base auto with only say auto trans but manual windows, manual door locks, manual everything an impossible choice as many younger people feel entitled to fully loaded luxury auto's.

Example is the neighbor that took out a line of credit to buy their son a BMW as he was a marketing graduate and needed to arrive at interviews in a proper auto representing his capabilities according to them.

STUPID, Job interviews know nothing of what you drive and careless about it as it does not affect if you can do the job.

I never did that for my kids and see no reason to do it at all. If you want to help with a down payment as a graduation gift, fine your money, but I see no reason for parents to buy their kids luxury auto's and go in debt. 

It’s a push toward shared and public transportation, that’s why. About control. People are dumb enough that they would but piles of chit if it was the thing to buy.....

Having two bare bones Cavaliers over the last ten years make you realize what you can do without. I think they only real add on the cars have seem is a tom Tom GPS.....Having my Nox is like a whole new world compared to the cavs and Cobalt .

I’d rather not have all my money wrapped up in car and house payments....

I can't believe the average new car payment is $538/mth. Here at Rancho Balthy, the highest monthly we've had over... 8 different vehicle loans is $249.  Yet I build & price different new trucks and cringe at the payment which comes in between that low-mid $500 to low $600 range.

14 hours ago, William Maley said:

Welch notes there are some positive economic indicators "such as high employment rates, a solid GDP and a healthy economy overall."

Even with this reality, losing the cellar is not a good move.  GM fullsize truck prices are exorbitant in nature, for example.  They are trying to extort their loyal customers into paying for an iffy "future".  Homie don't play dat.

So you're boycotting??

7 minutes ago, balthazar said:

So you're boycotting??

Methinks yes, that is what he is doing. 

Prices are getting crazy..anything under $30-35k seems to be fwd/transverse 4cyl appliances, nothing interesting.---just despair gray interior generics.

Since I drove my last new vehicle 17 years, I'll probably be in my current for a while..but not that long..not going to keep it past 100k miles.

 I've been happy w/ my CPO experience, I can see doing that again... 

10 hours ago, daves87rs said:

It’s a push toward shared and public transportation, that’s why. About control. People are dumb enough that they would but piles of chit if it was the thing to buy.....

 

But people aren't taking advantage of public transportation. Here are some quotes from a recent article from The Economist that someone posted about a week ago.

Quote

The American Public Transportation Association’s figures show that the number of journeys in the country as a whole has fallen in each of the past three years. In 2016-17 every kind of mass public transport became less busy: buses, subways, commuter trains and trams. New Yorkers took 2.8% fewer weekday trips on public transport and 4.2% fewer weekend trips in the 12 months to April 2018, compared with the previous year. In Chicago and Washington, DC, the decline in public-transport trips has been even steeper.

Quote

One explanation, which is convincing in some cities, is that public transport has deteriorated. Look at Madrid, says Richard Anderson, a transport analyst at Imperial College London. Public-transport trips fell there beginning in 2008, as you would expect in a recession-hit country where unemployment was rising. In response to the downturn, the city cut services. People noticed, and stayed away. Between 2007 and 2013 the Madrid Metro lost 19% of its customers. Service levels, perceptions and demand have all improved since then, but the Metro remains quieter than it used to be before the financial crisis.

Quote

Perhaps public transport has come to seem relatively dismal because people have acquired better options. Uber, Lyft and other “ride-hailing” car services are probably luring people away from trains and buses, just as they are demolishing the taxi trade. In San Francisco public transport accounts for 16% of all weekday trips, ride-hailing for 9%. People mostly seem to use Uber and Lyft to get to places well-served by mass transport (see map). One study of the city by five Californian academics asked ride-hailing customers how they would have made their most recent trip if the service did not exist. One-third replied that they would have taken public transport. In a study of Boston, 42% said the same thing.

52 minutes ago, Robert Hall said:

Prices are getting crazy..anything under $30-35k seems to be fwd/transverse 4cyl appliances, nothing interesting.---just despair gray interior generics.

Since I drove my last new vehicle 17 years, I'll probably be in my current for a while..but not that long..not going to keep it past 100k miles.

 I've been happy w/ my CPO experience, I can see doing that again... 

CPO seems worthwhile to me also, it is how I bought the bug. Thinking maybe CPO Cherokee. They are priced nicely and are not bland FWD appliances.

16 hours ago, oldshurst442 said:

I do not think its the car manufacturers that are pricing the consumers out of new cars. I think its the consumer itself that does it. 

The consumers DEMANDED fully equipped cars over the decades and have migrated to higher priced CUVs and SUVs and 100 000 doallr work trucks to outshine their neighbors...

Even if car manufacturers make and produce "affordable" no frill CUVs, the masses will NOT buy them or lease them.

America has become a voracious consumer oriented society that just wants to outdo their neighbor...

 Yes, I can understand that...in a daily driver, I want the most creature comforts I can get...I couldn't imagine driving a depressing 4cyl FWD econobox w/ a despair gray interior...

5 minutes ago, William Maley said:

 

6 minutes ago, William Maley said:

But people aren't taking advantage of public transportation. Here are some quotes from a recent article from The Economist that someone posted about a week ago.

  

  QUOTE

Perhaps public transport has come to seem relatively dismal because people have acquired better options. Uber, Lyft and other “ride-hailing” car services are probably luring people away from trains and buses, just as they are demolishing the taxi trade. In San Francisco public transport accounts for 16% of all weekday trips, ride-hailing for 9%. People mostly seem to use Uber and Lyft to get to places well-served by mass transport (see map). One study of the city by five Californian academics asked ride-hailing customers how they would have made their most recent trip if the service did not exist. One-third replied that they would have taken public transport. In a study of Boston, 42% said the same thing.

Public transit isn't really a realistic option here in the suburbs..there are bus lines that run into downtown Cleveland and a light rail, but nothing practical for me.  If I were working downtown or in another suburb, I'd be commuting by SUV as I've done most of my career in other cities.    I do like Uber, I use it occasionally if I don't want to deal w/ parking in some areas or want to have a few drinks at dinner.  Very convenient. 

9 hours ago, balthazar said:

I can't believe the average new car payment is $538/mth. Here at Rancho Balthy, the highest monthly we've had over... 8 different vehicle loans is $249.  Yet I build & price different new trucks and cringe at the payment which comes in between that low-mid $500 to low $600 range.

I can't agree more! The most I've had was $279/month for me Escape. As long as it is under $300 I don't mind it and I still feel like I'm in control of the loan and not worried about not having the money to ever pay for it.

My current Focus is $114/month. 

45 minutes ago, William Maley said:

But people aren't taking advantage of public transportation. Here are some quotes from a recent article from The Economist that someone posted about a week ago.

 

Could this also be due to more companies embracing work from home rather than office space which is costly. ?

1 minute ago, dfelt said:

Could this also be due to more companies embracing work from home rather than office space which is costly. ?

After doing it the last 18 months, I love working from home/working remotely...definitely driving much less than when I was in a cubicle in Scottsdale. 

20 minutes ago, Robert Hall said:

After doing it the last 18 months, I love working from home/working remotely...definitely driving much less than when I was in a cubicle in Scottsdale. 

But then you are sitting at home working, looking out your front window and this happens...

4 minutes ago, A Horse With No Name said:

But then you are sitting at home working, looking out your front window and this happens...

 

Heh-heh..what I usually see from my cameras are deer strolling through the front and back yards..

1 hour ago, Robert Hall said:

Prices are getting crazy..anything under $30-35k seems to be fwd/transverse 4cyl appliances, nothing interesting.---just despair gray interior generics.

Since I drove my last new vehicle 17 years, I'll probably be in my current for a while..but not that long..not going to keep it past 100k miles.

 I've been happy w/ my CPO experience, I can see doing that again... 

The only problem with CPO or lightly used cars, is that everyone who is looking to get a nice CPO vehicle depends on all the people you guys criticize for taking hugely expensive loans and leases.  So if everybody will be "smart" consumer than there will be not enough used cars.  Actually, due to the high prices the used car market is already became worse.

i think the biggest jump in prices happened when active safety became expected and mandated.  It significantly raised the prices of even base vehicles, raised prices of repair and therefore the insurance.   You guys can bitch about "you don't need all that stuff" you are "excellent drivers" etc, etc, but the fact is these devices work and save lives, which is their purpose.  Same as it was with seat belts, better, more expensive car structure, air bags.  All these previous safety features added to the cost of vehicles as well. historically

Also, I thought this is an auto enthusiast forum, but it seems to me most people here are perfectly fine driving crappy old appliances.   Believe me, I understand living  within you own means, I have family and bills.  However, I think if you are a car enthusiast than sometimes you need to make some different choices than everyday consumer.

Just my $0.02

1 minute ago, Robert Hall said:

Heh-heh..what I usually see from my cameras are deer strolling through the front and back yards..

Watch long enough and you can watch them bringing Bambi into this world.

39 minutes ago, ykX said:

The only problem with CPO or lightly used cars, is that everyone who is looking to get a nice CPO vehicle depends on all the people you guys criticize for taking hugely expensive loans and leases.  So if everybody will be "smart" consumer than there will be not enough used cars.  Actually, due to the high prices the used car market is already became worse.

i think the biggest jump in prices happened when active safety became expected and mandated.  It significantly raised the prices of even base vehicles, raised prices of repair and therefore the insurance.   You guys can bitch about "you don't need all that stuff" you are "excellent drivers" etc, etc, but the fact is these devices work and save lives, which is their purpose.  Same as it was with seat belts, better, more expensive car structure, air bags.  All these previous safety features added to the cost of vehicles as well. historically

Also, I thought this is an auto enthusiast forum, but it seems to me most people here are perfectly fine driving crappy old appliances.   Believe me, I understand living  within you own means, I have family and bills.  However, I think if you are a car enthusiast than sometimes you need to make some different choices than everyday consumer.

Just my $0.02

Which is why some people here do drive nice auto's.  

20 hours ago, oldshurst442 said:

I do not think its the car manufacturers that are pricing the consumers out of new cars. I think its the consumer itself that does it. 

Why is it that Ford is cutting its sedans in favor of producing and selling CUVs and SUVs? 

Why is GM almost doing the same?

Why are Toyota Camrys and Honda Accords selling at a slight lesser rate than once before and why is it that Toyota's and Honda's CUVs outselling their sedan counterparts?

When was the last time you actually saw or heard a suburban wife talk about how she wants to buy (not lease, because leasing too causes the consumer to  out-price himself out of a new car) a base bare bones  compact car?

It seems suburbanites all want the most recent, option filled truck or SUV and who cares how much it costs... 

There was a time when down and out folk used to buy pick-up trucks, no options pick-up trucks,  because these were the cheapest means of transportation anybody could buy...

The consumers DEMANDED fully equipped cars over the decades and have migrated to higher priced CUVs and SUVs and 100 000 doallr work trucks to outshine their neighbors...

Even if car manufacturers make and produce "affordable" no frill CUVs, the masses will NOT buy them or lease them.

America has become a voracious consumer oriented society that just wants to outdo their neighbor...

Excellent points made here. 

2 hours ago, ykX said:

The only problem with CPO or lightly used cars, is that everyone who is looking to get a nice CPO vehicle depends on all the people you guys criticize for taking hugely expensive loans and leases.  So if everybody will be "smart" consumer than there will be not enough used cars.  Actually, due to the high prices the used car market is already became worse.

i think the biggest jump in prices happened when active safety became expected and mandated.  It significantly raised the prices of even base vehicles, raised prices of repair and therefore the insurance.   You guys can bitch about "you don't need all that stuff" you are "excellent drivers" etc, etc, but the fact is these devices work and save lives, which is their purpose.  Same as it was with seat belts, better, more expensive car structure, air bags.  All these previous safety features added to the cost of vehicles as well. historically

Also, I thought this is an auto enthusiast forum, but it seems to me most people here are perfectly fine driving crappy old appliances.   Believe me, I understand living  within you own means, I have family and bills.  However, I think if you are a car enthusiast than sometimes you need to make some different choices than everyday consumer.

Just my $0.02

If I can get my driveway re-shaped, I would like to own a CPO CT6 Platinum in a few years. 

Right now, it high-centers at the top of the driveway and I believe (I never got it down the driveway to find out) it would scrape at the bottom. 

Eff it... I just need to buy a new house with a flat driveway.

5 minutes ago, Drew Dowdell said:

Excellent points made here. 

If I can get my driveway re-shaped, I would like to own a CPO CT6 Platinum in a few years. 

Right now, it high-centers at the top of the driveway and I believe (I never got it down the driveway to find out) it would scrape at the bottom. 

Eff it... I just need to buy a new house with a flat driveway.

 

Our department head drives a CTS wagon...his driveway is sloped and he lives next to a lake. Driveway was frozen up the other night...Caddy didn't want to stop on downhill sheet of ice...almost went into the lake. 

You BOTH need a flat driveway. 

1 minute ago, A Horse With No Name said:

Our department head drives a CTS wagon...his driveway is sloped and he lives next to a lake. Driveway was frozen up the other night...Caddy didn't want to stop on downhill sheet of ice...almost went into the lake. 

You BOTH need a flat driveway. 

My driveway slopes down and then there is a flat area to park the cars.  Beyond that is a further hill covered in a forest of bamboo.  Coming home last night the bottom of the driveway was iced over and I was going too fast. Almost ended up with the Buick in the Bamboo.

14 minutes ago, Drew Dowdell said:

Excellent points made here. 

If I can get my driveway re-shaped, I would like to own a CPO CT6 Platinum in a few years. 

Right now, it high-centers at the top of the driveway and I believe (I never got it down the driveway to find out) it would scrape at the bottom. 

Eff it... I just need to buy a new house with a flat driveway.

 

And a big garage

4 minutes ago, Drew Dowdell said:

My driveway slopes down and then there is a flat area to park the cars.  Beyond that is a further hill covered in a forest of bamboo.  Coming home last night the bottom of the driveway was iced over and I was going too fast. Almost ended up with the Buick in the Bamboo.

You need WRX or STi with winter tires

Just now, ykX said:

And a big garage

Yeah, at least 3 car next time. 

I need a wider garage..it's narrower than other 2 car garages in the neighborhood..I should have measured it before I bought.  Oh well, something to improve upon w/ the next house. 

29 minutes ago, Robert Hall said:

I need a wider garage..it's narrower than other 2 car garages in the neighborhood..I should have measured it before I bought.  Oh well, something to improve upon w/ the next house. 

I am in the same boat, another 4 foot wider and 4 foot longer would be wonderful. 

30 minutes ago, Drew Dowdell said:

Yeah, at least 3 car next time. 

3 for my work shop, two for daily drivers, and 2 slots for collector cars. And then an outbuilding for bikes and lawn equipment. That would be ideal...right now I have a standard two car garage...so full of tools and projects that no car has parked inside of it for ten years. 

4 minutes ago, A Horse With No Name said:

I am in the same boat, another 4 foot wider and 4 foot longer would be wonderful. 

The Jeep and Trax both fit, but I have to get the right side of the Jeep up close to the wall and fold up the mirrors on the Trax and get it close to the left wall to be able to get in the Jeep.. 

Nice comfortable looking house though....I love living in Ohio. If I were closer I would bring my pressure washer over to do the driveway.

23 minutes ago, Robert Hall said:

The Jeep and Trax both fit, but I have to get the right side of the Jeep up close to the wall and fold up the mirrors on the Trax and get it close to the left wall to be able to get in the Jeep.. 

What year is that house?

My guess would be about 1968 or so.

Just now, A Horse With No Name said:

My guess would be about 1968 or so.

Good guess..1967 split level...everything in the subdivision seems to be from then...some have wider garages than others. 

2 minutes ago, Robert Hall said:

Good guess..1967 split level...everything in the subdivision seems to be from then...some have wider garages than others. 

Given how big the cars were in the 1960s, one wonders what the builders were thinking with the garage design. There's no way an 88 sedan would have fit in there and no way an 88 coupe could have gotten its doors open. 

58 minutes ago, Drew Dowdell said:

Given how big the cars were in the 1960s, one wonders what the builders were thinking with the garage design. There's no way an 88 sedan would have fit in there and no way an 88 coupe could have gotten its doors open. 

I know..it makes no sense...the garage door is narrower than the driveway.  1967 I was thinking Ford Country Squire & Fairlane..or Impala wagon and Chevelle..wouldn't fit.   It seems like it was built more for two Beetles or a Nova and a Camaro. 

The odd thing is on the same street there are houses that appear to be the same model, but with a wider garage...down the street there is a house w/ a late model Explorer and Fusion in the garage, and when they have the door up it's clear they have a lot more walk-around room than I do..

57 minutes ago, Drew Dowdell said:

Given how big the cars were in the 1960s, one wonders what the builders were thinking with the garage design. There's no way an 88 sedan would have fit in there and no way an 88 coupe could have gotten its doors open. 

A lot of families back then only had one car. personally...like the mid sized cutty from 67. 

That is what needs to be in that garage.

Garage mate...

9 minutes ago, A Horse With No Name said:

A lot of families back then only had one car. personally...like the mid sized cutty from 67. 

 

 

It's funny...I was thinking about the summer of 1967...was still 3 years before I was born.  My sister was 10, my brother was 17...my folks moved back to Ohio after 3 years in Saipan and Guam.  They bought a house in North Baltimore, Ohio (near Findlay),  my Dad bought himself a new '67 Cougar--silver green w/ 289, 3spd manual, bought my Mom a used '65 Mustang coupe (289 4bbl 'high-po' w/ 4spd, black on black, and bought my brother a used '66 Mustang GT convertible ( 289 4bbl 'high po' w/ 4spd, dark green w/ black interior and top).   He took it off to Ohio State that fall, totaled it a couple years later.  My Mom drove the '65 until '69 then got the white '69 Mustang 351...   different world then. 

Were those K code Hipo cars?

Just now, A Horse With No Name said:

Were those K code Hipo cars?

Yep...have seen old photos of them, and I remember seeing the convertible in the 70s..it sat in the barn for a decade with the front smashed in...he eventually sold it.  

Hopefully someone rebuilt it. That is almost the holy grail to me...66...4 speed...dark green. black top and interior...K code....

8 minutes ago, A Horse With No Name said:

Hopefully someone rebuilt it. That is almost the holy grail to me...66...4 speed...dark green. black top and interior...K code....

Yeah...it sold around 1980-81, before the whole boom in Mustang reproduction parts..he had hit a power pole on High Street in Columbus head on pretty hard..I remember the front inner fenders were buckled and the whole front was pushed upward.  I remember it was a guy from the Pittsburgh area that bought it...always wondered if it was restored.    When my Mom got the '69, he got the '65 coupe, which got totaled a year or so later in Columbus also--got hit from behind.    He then drove a rusty '58 Biscayne his final year at Ohio State...

4 hours ago, Robert Hall said:

The Jeep and Trax both fit, but I have to get the right side of the Jeep up close to the wall and fold up the mirrors on the Trax and get it close to the left wall to be able to get in the Jeep.. 

Got a little room to the left side of the house to remodel out to widen that garage with some spare space for a work bench.  

5 hours ago, Drew Dowdell said:

My driveway slopes down and then there is a flat area to park the cars.  Beyond that is a further hill covered in a forest of bamboo.  Coming home last night the bottom of the driveway was iced over and I was going too fast. Almost ended up with the Buick in the Bamboo.

The Buick Bamboo...

The perfect name for a Chinese market only Buick cute ute crossover!