Jump to content
Create New...
  • William Maley
    William Maley

    California Mulls Ban On Combustion Engines

      Come on, don't tell us you didn't see this coming

    California is considering joining France and Great Britain in banning the sale of gas and diesel-powered vehicles.

    Governor Jerry Brown has been expressing an interest in banning the sale of internal-combustion engines according to Mary Nichols, chariman of the California Air Resources Board.

    “I’ve gotten messages from the governor asking, ‘Why haven’t we done something already?’ The governor has certainly indicated an interest in why China can do this and not California,” she said to Bloomberg.

    As we reported earlier this month, China is also considering a ban on internal combustion engines.

    California has set an ambitious goal reducing carbon dioxide emissions by 80 percent from 1990 levels by 2050.

    “To reach the ambitious levels of reduction in greenhouse gas emissions, we have to pretty much replace all combustion with some form of renewable energy by 2040 or 2050. We’re looking at that as a method of moving this discussion forward,” said Nichols.

    If California was to go forward with this, it would send massive shockwaves in the automotive industry due to the size of state's auto market. Last year, more than 2 million new passenger vehicles were registered, topping countries like France and Spain. Automakers would be under new pressure on making EVs the standard.

    But that doesn't mean California will have an easy time with this. While the state has the authority of writing its own pollution rules thanks to the 1970 Clean Air Act, they cannot be enacted with getting waivers from the EPA. With the Trump administration going on record that it would challenge California on any new environmental act, the state is looking for alternative ways to get what they want.

    “We certainly wouldn’t expect to get a waiver for that from EPA. I think we would be looking at using some of our other authorities to get to that result,” said Nichols.

    Nichols did say it will be a long time before something like this is implemented.

    “There are people who believe, including who work for me, that you could stop all sales of new internal-combustion cars by 2030. Some people say 2035, some people say 2040. It’s awfully hard to predict any of that with precision, but it doesn’t appear to be out of the question.”

    Source: Bloomberg

    User Feedback

    Recommended Comments



    They might be able to ban new car sales, but they cannot stop the of the used, or simply the use of them. 

    Many simply could not afford it, and they cannot get massive public transportation that fast either.....

    • Agree 2
    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    I can see a sale of New ICE auto's ending by 2040. Existing auto's I can see being limited to collector status and limiting miles driven. Many ways to force / change the type of auto's driven and the way they are driven.

    This could also push people into the conversion big time as people change over ICE powered auto's they like to EV powertrains.

    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    There is going to need to be massive investment in charging infrastructure.  Even if chargers are common enough for today's level of EV use, they aren't nearly plentiful enough for the entire state of CA to go EV. 

    I've started to contemplate having the outlet installed in my garage in the next few years.  When I get back into writing reviews in a few months time, I want to be able to take in plug-in vehicles. 

    • Like 2
    • Agree 2
    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    54 minutes ago, daves87rs said:

    They might be able to ban new car sales, but they cannot stop the of the used, or simply the use of them. 

    Many simply could not afford it, and they cannot get massive public transportation that fast either.....

    I'm assuming it is applicable to new cars, similar to the ban taking place in Great Britain. 

    • Agree 2
    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    Anyway we can get California to literally join France? As in move it next door? ;)

    1 hour ago, dfelt said:

    I can see a sale of New ICE auto's ending by 2040. Existing auto's I can see being limited to collector status and limiting miles driven. Many ways to force / change the type of auto's driven and the way they are driven.

    You cannot DO this: force people who legally own an approved consumer good as vital as a vehicle to suddenly be severely limited in its use. For one, the value of these items would instantly plummet to near zero, rendering these people without a trade-in (Would be no surprise to me if CA suggests a special tax to write every ICE owner a compensatory check). The only way this passes general acceptance is to allow grandfathering / attrition... over the course of many decades. Gov't can only ban the production of NEW ICEs... just as there are no retro-active vehicular equipment laws (that I'm aware of)- even after 50 years of federal vehicle regulation.

    The 'next step' then comes to question- what about people traveling into CA? Or moving to CA? And what about semi-trucks- would they be exempt?

    Edited by balthazar
    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    If CA does it, then the rest of the country will follow shortly after or auto makers will just give up on gas engines.  If California had 2 million car sales, that is 1/8th of all car sales in the USA.  That is huge.  

    They can't take away someone's gas car, but they can stop sale of new ones.  So if they want to be emission free by 2050, they need to ban sales of ICE cars around 2035 to allow 15 years for existing cars to run their life cycle.

    I think EV's will get better and better and no one is going to want a gas car anyway in 2030.

    • Like 1
    • Disagree 1
    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    4 hours ago, smk4565 said:

    If CA does it, then the rest of the country will follow shortly after or auto makers will just give up on gas engines.  If California had 2 million car sales, that is 1/8th of all car sales in the USA.  That is huge.  

    They can't take away someone's gas car, but they can stop sale of new ones.  So if they want to be emission free by 2050, they need to ban sales of ICE cars around 2035 to allow 15 years for existing cars to run their life cycle.

    I think EV's will get better and better and no one is going to want a gas car anyway in 2030.

    Oh, they could-but the results would be quite bad...

    Don't get me wrong, I like EVs, but you can't drag race them....:)

     

    But who knows, maybe Apple will make EVs.......

    • Agree 1
    • Disagree 1
    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    4 minutes ago, daves87rs said:

    Oh, they could-but the results would be quite bad...

    Don't get me wrong, I like EVs, but you can't drag race them....:)

     

    But who knows, maybe Apple will make EVs.......

    Yes you can, the Model S just won't Motor Trend's World's greatest drag race.

    • Haha 1
    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    Just now, smk4565 said:

    Yes you can, the Model S just won't Motor Trend's World's greatest drag race.

     

    More interested in the mainstream cars, not the higher end ones.....

    And I highly doubt you could abuse the model S like you could with say, A hemi.....

    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    35 minutes ago, daves87rs said:

     

    More interested in the mainstream cars, not the higher end ones.....

    And I highly doubt you could abuse the model S like you could with say, A hemi.....

    Its an electric motor. (2 motors...1 in the front, 1 in the back)

    3 phase.

    Are you trying to tell us that an induction motor is less durable and less reliable and less capable of achieving high and sustained RPMs than an internal combustion engine?

    I dont feel like writing a high school essay on why an induction motor is less likely to fail in a drag race versus an internal combustion engine.

    • While heat is detrimental to both...the internal combustion engine produces a shyte load of it while the induction motor produces very little, if any...
    • There are no fluids to overheat and to spill via ruptured hoses in an induction motor...
    • There are no gears to grind as there is no transmission...just a single speed transmission in an induction motor...
    • Running high RPMs all day long 365/24/7 is kinda the electric motor's thang...

     

    And that is just for starters...

    Its OK for you people not to like EVs...please though...dont just spew whatever comes to your head to justify your views...it dont look good for you folk when others are reading your shyte!

    • Like 1
    • Disagree 1
    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    PS: When HEMIs decide to self destruct, they make a huge and loud BOOM!

    Louder and bigger than any other engine in the racing world...something to be proud of actually...

     

     But... THAT is the explosive nature of an internal COMBUSTION engine....so...

    Edited by oldshurst442
    • Haha 1
    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    31 minutes ago, oldshurst442 said:

    Its an electric motor. (2 motors...1 in the front, 1 in the back)

    3 phase.

    Are you trying to tell us that an induction motor is less durable and less reliable and less capable of achieving high and sustained RPMs than an internal combustion engine?

    I dont feel like writing a high school essay on why an induction motor is less likely to fail in a drag race versus an internal combustion engine.

    • While heat is detrimental to both...the internal combustion engine produces a shyte load of it while the induction motor produces very little, if any...
    • There are no fluids to overheat and to spill via ruptured hoses in an induction motor...
    • There are no gears to grind as there is no transmission...just a single speed transmission in an induction motor...
    • Running high RPMs all day long 365/24/7 is kinda the electric motor's thang...

     

    And that is just for starters...

    Its OK for you people not to like EVs...please though...dont just spew whatever comes to your head to justify your views...it dont look good for you folk when others are reading your shyte!

    Helps if you read my other posts though.....

    I happen to like EVs  (rode in a new Volt and really liked it), and I am not flat out bashing it either. I'm just not sure they are just ready for prime time abuse just yet. I sadly and personally know of someone who managed to kill a very nice 2013 Volt.....

    And while I'm sure any drag race they would be fine....driving like one stole it might for a while might be interesting...like I said-I am just not sure about the long term-yet. I have no doubt the automakers are doing their best (personally seen what goes into a Volt at D-Ham) and they are building them tough-but they haven't met the dumb half of John Q. Public yet.....

    But I know like anything else, they'll be just as tough as a Toyota Corolla given to a 16 year old....:P

    And,"you Folk"?

    • Like 1
    • Agree 1
    • Disagree 1
    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    6 hours ago, daves87rs said:

    but they haven't met the dumb half of John Q. Public yet.....

    But they have...

    electric motors...(different kinds of electric motors)...are EVERYWHERE IN EVERYDAY stuff stupid John Q public uses...I dont think e-motors dont wreak havoc upon us...

    But we are talking about a 3 phase induction motor.

    A stator, a rotor, copper wire, magnets and a shaft...

    The shaft may misalign itself...but that wont be because of stupid John Q misusing it...

    There are no fluids that will be forgotten to be topped off...

    The magnetic field that is needed to be produced for an induction motor to kinda do its thang kinda happens all by itself...

    A 3 phase  motor is inherently, kinda-like...idiot proof.

     

    If "you Folk"  is all you got on me, I suggest you revisit high school electric/physics class...

     

     

    • Like 1
    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    9 hours ago, balthazar said:

    Motor Trend "World's Greatest" drag only had 12 cars in it.

    Tesla Model S 100D : 10.6
    Dodge Hellcat Demon : 9.6

    Zero percent chance they could replicate a sub 10 second pass on an air strip. 

    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    7 hours ago, 67impss said:

    Smk how in the world do you get that these electric cars are emission free. They are still causing the burning of fossil fuels in over 90% of all power plants and would use 50% more than gasoline in MN.

    https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/electric-cars-are-not-necessarily-clean/ 

    Which only lends credence to the fact that states like Minnesota need to use different and cleaner forms of energy to produce said power. Arizona’s solar industry has grown every year and will continue to do so, lending a perfect match to charging up those EVs. 

    • Like 2
    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    17 hours ago, balthazar said:

    Anyway we can get California to literally join France? As in move it next door? ;)

    You cannot DO this: force people who legally own an approved consumer good as vital as a vehicle to suddenly be severely limited in its use. For one, the value of these items would instantly plummet to near zero, rendering these people without a trade-in (Would be no surprise to me if CA suggests a special tax to write every ICE owner a compensatory check). The only way this passes general acceptance is to allow grandfathering / attrition... over the course of many decades. Gov't can only ban the production of NEW ICEs... just as there are no retro-active vehicular equipment laws (that I'm aware of)- even after 50 years of federal vehicle regulation.

    The 'next step' then comes to question- what about people traveling into CA? Or moving to CA? And what about semi-trucks- would they be exempt?

    Valid Points, The west coast give big breaks to people who register their old auto's as Collectors and you are limited in how many miles a year you can drive them for all the perks  of being a collector. 6000 miles in Washington.

    Many ways for the gov to limit auto's being driven. Especially if it is not a daily driver, why not take the breaks and savings that can be had with limited driving.

    13 hours ago, daves87rs said:

    Oh, they could-but the results would be quite bad...

    Don't get me wrong, I like EVs, but you can't drag race them....:)

     

    But who knows, maybe Apple will make EVs.......

    WRONG, You need to learn young padawan!

    White Zombie is one of many that are street legal and officially Drag Race.

    Here is a video of it eating up all types of drag race cars. EV kills ICE.

     

    • Agree 2
    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    13 hours ago, daves87rs said:

     

    More interested in the mainstream cars, not the higher end ones.....

    And I highly doubt you could abuse the model S like you could with say, A hemi.....

    Actually the EV is more reliable and can take the abuse better than the Hemi.

    This comes down to a less complex engine or motor able to react faster.

    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    4 hours ago, oldshurst442 said:

    But they have...

    electric motors...(different kinds of electric motors)...are EVERYWHERE IN EVERYDAY stuff stupid John Q public uses...I dont think e-motors dont wreak havoc upon us...

    But we are talking about a 3 phase induction motor.

    A stator, a rotor, copper wire, magnets and a shaft...

    The shaft may misalign itself...but that wont be because of stupid John Q misusing it...

    There are no fluids that will be forgotten to be topped off...

    The magnetic field that is needed to be produced for an induction motor to kinda do its thang kinda happens all by itself...

    A 3 phase  motor is inherently, kinda-like...idiot proof.

     

    If "you Folk"  is all you got on me, I suggest you revisit high school electric/physics class...

     

     

     

    No, I was actually asked what you meant by it. And since you want to insult  me like a high schooler, no point in adding anything further.......

    I'm just pointing out ideas for debate...and if I learn something new, cool....all for it in my quest for knowledge. And you come off like I am against it- when the that's not true. I just question how ready, that's all.....

    And I know dfelt is picking on me (cause he's a good guy)- but not sure if you are...

    If you don't like my idea train-just say so....:)

    • Agree 2
    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    42 minutes ago, dfelt said:

    Valid Points, The west coast give big breaks to people who register their old auto's as Collectors and you are limited in how many miles a year you can drive them for all the perks  of being a collector. 6000 miles in Washington.

    Many ways for the gov to limit auto's being driven. Especially if it is not a daily driver, why not take the breaks and savings that can be had with limited driving.

    WRONG, You need to learn young padawan!

    White Zombie is one of many that are street legal and officially Drag Race.

    Here is a video of it eating up all types of drag race cars. EV kills ICE.

     

     

    I've heard about it....but damn that's cool.....

    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    38 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

    Unless they have quick chargers at drag strips that's still not a viable option. 

    For the west coast, yes, Level 3 quick chargers are now standard. The public and Professional drag races are pretty cool seeing all the various teams that are going EV.

    6 minutes ago, daves87rs said:

     

    I've heard about it....but damn that's cool.....

    Check out NEDRA, the West Coast EV Drag Racing association.

    Also check out the European EV Drag Racing, crazy cars at 500HP

    Current World fastest EV Drag Racer, VW Beetle baby with a 9.5 sec run.

     

    • Like 1
    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    1 minute ago, dfelt said:

    @daves87rs Check it out! :metal: 

    Don Garlits is going for 200+ MPH in Pure EV Drag Racer!

    Gotta Love these new sleeker EV Dragsters! :metal:

     

    Stop...lol!:):P

     

    You're giving me the urge to modify a Volt or Leaf......that totally looks like fun!!!!

    I think I could have more fun with these than a gas engine.....maybe!:D

    • Thanks 1
    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    28 minutes ago, daves87rs said:

    Stop...lol!:):P

     

    You're giving me the urge to modify a Volt or Leaf......that totally looks like fun!!!!

    I think I could have more fun with these than a gas engine.....maybe!:D

    Leaf 2.0 will have a Nismo version. :P 

    • Haha 2
    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    54 minutes ago, dfelt said:

    Leaf 2.0 will have a Nismo version. :P 

     

    Ah, after my boy racer heart are we....:D:P

     

    On a more serious note, stuff like this could make more "car" folk again...which is always a good thing....

    • Agree 1
    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    1 hour ago, daves87rs said:

     

    Ah, after my boy racer heart are we....:D:P

     

    On a more serious note, stuff like this could make more "car" folk again...which is always a good thing....

    Yes, Yes we are! :P

    1 hour ago, Cubical-aka-Moltar said:

    And a GT-R version..

    I hope GM is paying attention as a BOLT SS would be totally cool! :metal: 

    • Like 1
    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    1 hour ago, daves87rs said:

     

    Ah, after my boy racer heart are we....:D:P

     

    On a more serious note, stuff like this could make more "car" folk again...which is always a good thing....

    You want more check out this 1968 Ford Mustang called the Zombie 222. A tribute to the White Zombie and even better as a street legal EV muscle car.

    Plenty more you can check out on Youtube on this bad boy.

    https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=zombie+222

    • Thanks 1
    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    4 hours ago, daves87rs said:

     

    No, I was actually asked what you meant by it. And since you want to insult  me like a high schooler, no point in adding anything further.......

    I'm just pointing out ideas for debate...and if I learn something new, cool....all for it in my quest for knowledge. And you come off like I am against it- when the that's not true. I just question how ready, that's all.....

    And I know dfelt is picking on me (cause he's a good guy)- but not sure if you are...

    If you don't like my idea train-just say so....:)

    Well...YOUR argument was not even high school grade...

    If you feel that Im not a good person...its OK...

    Just put your big boy pants on and except confrontation when you post dumb things...

    YOUR argument was not of a jokey one...like how it turned out now...

    YOU were serious...about a Model S not being able to be abused on a drag race...

    I posted 2 posts.

    The first was aggressive...the second was direct but playful....I could understand if you did not take it that way...but that is what you get when you get egg on your face...

    Then instead of saying "yes Oldshurst...my bad!!! You may have a point..."

    YOU continue on trying to defend an undefendable argument...

    One thing I HATE the most...whether on the internet or real life...is when people CANNOT ADMIT THEY ARE WRONG!!!

    So yeah...tell me Im a bad person...

    If correcting you...even if slightly aggressive..but NO INSULTS WERE THROWN AT YOU...I JUST TOLD YOU TO GO BACK TO HIGH SCHOOL PHYSICS BECAUSE THE ARGUMENT YOU MADE...A HIGH SHOOLER WOULD NEVER HAVE MADE....THEN YEAH.... IM AN A$$H0L3!!!

    PS: I ALWAYS ADMIT WHEN IM WRONG!

    I LET PEOPLE TEACH ME!

    THAT IS HOW I LEARN!!!!

    IT AINT ABOUT EGO!!!!

    MAYBE YOU SHOULD LOOK YOURSELF IN THE MIRROR AND SEE WHO REALLY INSULTED WHO???!!!

     

     

    REMEMBER...YOU SAID I WAS A BAD GUY!!!!

    SHOULD I TAKE THAT AS AN INSULT????
    SHOULD I CRY???!!!

    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    I dont know?

    Ask the dude who called me a bad person...

    Ill tell you why I reacted the way I did the first time.

    I do take things serious when electrics get thrown in the mud constantly. Maybe I shouldnt be wearing  my panties too tightly...

    But I take it to heart even more when said arguments dont even hold water just using common knowledge...

    But...I did lighten it up with the HEMI engines going boom!

    The next response to me was even more childish than the first...

    Ill repeat...

    Its OK if you folk dont like or wont accept electrics...just dont be stupid about it!

    BE HONEST!

    Take this post for instance...
     

    Quote

     

    Unless they have quick chargers at drag strips that's still not a viable option. 


     

    Is it sooooo bloody hard for the operators of a drag strip to call in Tesla to install one?

    Knowing damn well that Tesla Model S-es are more and more raced...Im willing to bet my left testicle that this has already been done at at least 1 drag race strip somewhere in the USA!!!

    So...sure...my panties are in a knot...

    Can you blame me?

    How old are we in this forum?

    Im sure we are all over 30 years old...

    We sure arent teenagers bench racing Playstation Gran Turismo games!!!

    Common!

    Im asking for intelligent discussions...

    Ill have to tone it down...Im sorry...

    But lets get real here!!!

     

     

    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    12 minutes ago, oldshurst442 said:

    I do take things serious

    Summed up the book.

    13 minutes ago, oldshurst442 said:

    Knowing damn well that Tesla Model S-es are more and more raced...Im willing to bet my left testicle that this has already been done at at least 1 drag race strip somewhere in the USA!!!

    Absolutely! But that one does me no good and likely a good chunk of the mid-west. 

    Best part of going to NHRA events is the irrationally loud cars. I would not be entertained by EV drag cars. I probably would be entertained driving them but not watching them.

    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    11 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

    Summed up the book.

    Absolutely! But that one does me no good and likely a good chunk of the mid-west. 

    Best part of going to NHRA events is the irrationally loud cars. I would not be entertained by EV drag cars. I probably would be entertained driving them but not watching them.

     

    Still a high school argument though, non?

    When did pointing out the truth become a no-no?

    26d132ba67f40940ff8783cc30d36dd9.jpg

     

    About the drag racing super charging stuff...

    and...CORRECT ME IF I AM WRONG...PLEASE!

    A Tesla Model S  could do...3-4 maybe even 5 passes before the battery is no longer able to give you the ludicrous juice?

    Even at 3 passes...dont most casual drag racers only do about 3 or 4 runs anyway on average?

    Why would we want to look for hindrances when these are barely hindrances?

    Where there is a will, there is a way is how I was brought up!!!

     

    Edited by oldshurst442
    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    Nope, I've made 6 passes in a night when there wasn't a sh!t ton of ppl that allowed for shorter intervals between passes. Why would you only make 3 passes? 

    Barely hindrances? I have to drive home after those passes as well. :spin:

    Edited by ccap41
    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    6 hours ago, dfelt said:

    H'mmmm :scratchchin: Are we having a Man-O-Pause Moment in this thread? :o

     

    Maybe....:D

    Olds, you're good...I don't think you're bad....maybe a bit sassy, but you're fine....

    Besides, I used to bump heads with folks on here who I'm friends with now....

    And if I'm wrong, I am fine with that too. Both of you showed my a few things I didn't know....funny considering I had to work with Tesla for a while(parts side).

    You just surprised me, that's all. I changed my panties and all is well....:P Okay, I'll admit I might have had a butthurt moment.......

    I will say it is amazing now fast things are changing with EVs......

    • Like 1
    • Agree 1
    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    15 hours ago, oldshurst442 said:

    Yeah....

    like I said...

    There is a will, there is a way...

     

    https://www.plugshare.com/?location=45376

     

    Like deflt already said, they're out west but that still does me no good in the mid west or at my closest drag strip. I already gave me zip code. Look up all of the available charging locations around me. Between me and Gateway Motorsports Park. 

    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    39 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

    Like deflt already said, they're out west but that still does me no good in the mid west or at my closest drag strip. I already gave me zip code. Look up all of the available charging locations around me. Between me and Gateway Motorsports Park. 

    You could blaze a trail and check and see if your local power company has any rebates for installing a home 220v Charging system.

    Washington rebates the cost of the unit, you just have to pay installation. So pretty good deal. Plus adds value to the home as it then becomes EV ready. :P 

    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    That's not blazing a trail at all... I know I can install one at home. I don't know about the rebate or incentive aspect of it but that doesn't really help me if I'm trying to make a handful of passes at a drag strip w/o a charger at or close to the track. 

    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    15 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

    That's not blazing a trail at all... I know I can install one at home. I don't know about the rebate or incentive aspect of it but that doesn't really help me if I'm trying to make a handful of passes at a drag strip w/o a charger at or close to the track. 

    True, I understand that, course that is also the cool thing as I bet at your track near you, they probably do have some 220 or 440 outlets so you could get a charge cord with the proper twist lock and just plug in. :P 

    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    I mean really... must every debate on EV's be reduced to strawman arguments?  Are we really arguing over supercharger/DCFC locations relative to drag strips now as a knock against EVs? We're talking a percentage of a percentage of a percentage of EV drivers that will ever do such driving.

    Link to comment
    Share on other sites

    I understand the "why", I'm just venting the frustration that every time EV's come up there is some obscure reason they'd never work large scale because (insert highly specific and uncommon occurrence here). 

    Link to comment
    Share on other sites




    Join the conversation

    You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
    Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

    Guest
    Add a comment...

    ×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

      Only 75 emoji are allowed.

    ×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

    ×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

    ×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


  • google-news-icon.png



  • google-news-icon.png

  • Subscribe to Cheers & Gears

    Cheers and Gears Logo

    Since 2001 we've brought you real content and honest opinions, not AI-generated stuff with no feeling or opinions influenced by the manufacturers.

    Please consider subscribing. Subscriptions can be as little as $1.75 a month, and a paid subscription drops most ads.*
     

    You can view subscription options here.

    *a very limited number of ads contain special coupon deals for our members and will show

  • Similar Content

  • Posts

    • Sending a Christmas eve chuckle your way: Here's Dyan Cannon, who has again poured herself into her clothing, to attend a Lakers game, which she does often. It looks like she can easily fit down many chimneys.  Maybe even into a Christmas gift stocking. I find the different chapters of Dyan Cannon humorous.
    • @Drew Dowdell @Robert Hall @trinacriabob @A Horse With No Name @ccap41 @surreal1272 @oldshurst442  And including all of the C&G members that are here that I do not interact with often enough or those I have forgotten their handles. Wishing each and every one of you a Merry Xmas Eve and Merry Xmas.  To those that do not celebrate Xmas, Happy Hanukkah, Happy Holidays, Happy time off. Wishing each and every person here a restful end to the year, one of love, respect, relaxation to you and your families. Wishing all the best!
    • MOU means that these companies have signed a "Memorandum of Understanding" to explore the participation, involvement and synergy sharing in relation to the business integration through a joint holding company. Back in August 1st, 2024 Nissan and Honda created a Joint Holding Company for the commencement of a strategic partnership focused on intelligence and electrification. This was to start the consideration towards integration of the two companies. Mitsubishi Motors has now signed onto this MOU to explore the possibility of achieving synergies at an increased level through business participation or integration. In basic terms, the three companies have agreed to join forces in sharing costs to move forward with EV platform R&D while they also look at the ICE "Internal Combustion Engine" gas side of having shared platforms to reduce costs and hopefully save the three auto companies by keeping them alive.  While Nissan and Honda have agreed to move forward in this integration of the two auto companies, Mitsubishi Motors will make a final decision by the end of January 2025 about possibly joining in with the integration of Mitsubishi Motors into this joint 3 auto company venture. Nissan and Honda have already agreed to a full SDV or Software-defined vehicles program moving forward that will allow them to have a solid crucial collaboration of intelligence and electrification for future products. Both companies have stated that the acceleration of technology and the rapid change of the auto industry will allow these two companies to maintain global competitiveness and deliver more attractive products and services for customers worldwide. Nissan global mobility product line merged with Honda four-wheel-vehicles, motor cycles and power products can allow both companies to become more attractive to shareholders and innovation of products to sell to customers worldwide according to the CEOs of both companies. Nissan and Honda have stated the following: Nissan and Honda aim to become a world-class mobility company with sales revenue exceeding 30 trillion yen ($190 Billion U.S. Dollars) and operating profit of more than 3 trillion yen ($19 billion U.S. Dollars). The expected synergies from the business integration at this time are: 1. Scale advantages by standardizing vehicle platforms By standardizing the vehicle platforms of both companies across various product segments, the companies expect to create stronger products, reduce costs, enhance development efficiencies, and improve investment efficiencies through standardized production processes. The integration is projected to increase sales and operational volumes, allowing the companies to reduce development costs per vehicle, including for future digital services, while maximizing profits. By accelerating the mutual complementation of their global vehicle offerings - including ICE, HEV, PHEV, and EV models - Nissan and Honda will be better positioned to meet diverse customer needs around the world and deliver optimal products, leading to improved customer satisfaction. 2. Enhancement of development capabilities and cost synergies through the integration of R&D functions In accordance with the MOU to deepen strategic partnership and the joint research agreement on fundamental technologies dated August 1, the two companies have started joint research in fundamental technologies in the area of vehicle platforms for next-generation software-defined vehicles (SDVs), which is the cornerstone of the field of intelligence. After the business integration, both companies will encompass more integrated collaboration across all R&D functions, including fundamental research and vehicle application technology research. This approach is expected to enable both companies to efficiently and swiftly enhance their technological expertise, achieving both improvements in development capabilities and reductions in development costs through the integration of overlapping functions.   3. Optimizing manufacturing systems and facilities The companies anticipate that optimizing their manufacturing plants and energy service facilities, combined with improved collaboration through the shared use of production lines, will result in a substantial improvement in capacity utilization leading to a decrease in fixed costs.   4. Strengthening competitive advantages across the supply chain through the integration of purchasing functions To fully leverage the synergies from optimizing development and production capacity, both companies intend to boost their competitiveness by improving and streamlining purchasing operations and source common parts from the same the supply chain and in collaboration with business partners.   5. Realizing cost synergies through operational efficiency improvements The companies expect that the integration of systems and back-office operations, along with the upgrade and standardization of operational processes, will drive significant cost reductions.   6. Acquisition of scale advantages through integration in sales finance functions By integrating relevant areas of sales finance functions of both companies and expanding the scale of operations, the companies aim to provide a range of mobility solutions, including new financial services throughout the vehicle lifecycle, to customers of both organizations.   7. Establishment of a talent foundation for intelligence and electrification The human resources of the companies are an invaluable asset, and establishing a strong human resource foundation is crucial for the transformation that will come with the business integration. After the integration, increased employee exchanges and technical collaboration between the companies are expected to promote further skill development. Moreover, by leveraging each company's access to talent markets, attracting exceptional talent will become more attainable. Method of business integration and stock listing Nissan and Honda, with the result of the consideration, plan to establish, through a joint share transfer, a joint holding company that will be the parent company of both companies. This will be subject to approval at each company's general meeting of shareholders and obtaining necessary approvals from relevant authorities for this business integration, based on the premise that Nissan's turnaround*1 actions are steadily executed. Both Nissan and Honda will be fully owned subsidiaries of the joint holding company*2. Additionally, the companies plan to continue coexisting and developing the brands held by Honda and Nissan equally. Shares of the newly established joint holding company under consideration are planned to be newly listed (technical listing) on the Prime Market of the Tokyo Stock Exchange (“TSE”). The listing is scheduled for August 2026. With the listing of the joint holding company, both Nissan and Honda will become wholly owned subsidiaries of the joint holding company and will be scheduled to be delisted from the TSE. However, shareholders of both companies will continue to be able to trade shares of the joint holding company issued during this share transfer on the TSE. The listing date of the joint holding company and the delisting date of both Nissan and Honda will be determined in accordance with the regulations of the TSE. Regarding the organizational structure of the joint holding company, and both companies which will become wholly-owned subsidiaries of the joint holding company after the business integration, the optimal structure for realizing synergies, including the integration of R&D functions, purchasing functions, and manufacturing functions, will be discussed and considered within the integration preparatory committee, with the aim of establishing an organizational structure that enables efficient and highly competitive business operations after the business integration. The CEO's of all three companies had the following to say: Marking the announcement, Nissan Director, President, CEO and Representative Executive Officer Makoto Uchida said: “Honda and Nissan have begun considering a business integration, and will study the creation of significant synergies between the two companies in a wide range of fields. It is significant that Nissan's partner, Mitsubishi Motors, is also involved in these discussions. We anticipate that if this integration comes to fruition, we will be able to deliver even greater value to a wider customer base.“ Honda Director and Representative Executive Officer Toshihiro Mibe said: "At this time of change in the automobile industry, which is said to occur once every 100 years, we hope that Mitsubishi Motors' participation in the business integration discussions of Nissan and Honda will lead to further social change, and that we will be able to become a leading company in creating new value in mobility through business integration. Nissan and Honda will start the discussion from today onwards with an aim to clarify the possibility of business integration by around the end of January in line with the consideration of Mitsubishi Motors." Comment from Mitsubishi Motors Director, Representative Executive Officer, and President and CEO Takao Kato said: “In an era of change in the automotive industry, the study between Nissan and Honda about a business integration will accelerate synergy maximization effects, bringing high value also to the collaborative businesses with Mitsubishi Motors. In order to realize synergies and to make the best use of each company's strengths, we will also study the best form of cooperation.” Upon looking at the press releases, it makes total sense that these companies would look to merge as each company is having a challanging time. Nissan globally has seen a 33.7% reduction in sales taking the estimated 2024 market share to 5.2%.  Honda globally has seen a 9% reduction over all with a 32% reduction in the asian rim leaving them with a 2024 estimated 5.4% market share. Mitsubishi Motors globally has seen a reduction year over year of a 10.7% drop leaving them with a 2024 estimated market share of 4.6%. All three auto companies lag the industry in technology connected auto's, feature / functions and especially EVs. All three companies have seen their profits turn into negative earnings for their respective companies leaving them with no real ability to perform R&D in building EVs to compete in China or the U.S. let alone Europe that has mandates in place for the end of ICE by 2035. End result is it looks like for these companies to survive, merging into one company that shares platforms and technology especially in the software and battery sectors will be the only way to move forward. View full article
    • I think I'm dreaming ... this vehicle would be the oldest of my handful of favorite "blast from the past" cars. A Cutlass Salon coupe in perfect condition, the first year I liked the colonnade Cutlass (and it's last year, of 3, with round headlamps in the colonnade), those huge bucket seats, and, oddly, A/C is there, but with manual windows.  It featured the new but not as popular 260 (4.3L) V8.  It also featured the light enamel blue they didn't repeat.  If the exhaust system is tight, this car will be whisper quiet. 1975 Oldsmobile Cutlass Salon (Numbers Matching Drivetrain) for sale: photos, technical specifications, description See anything odd?  Come on.  Quick. . . . It has Buick rally wheels instead of Oldsmobile rally wheels. * sigh ... I wonder what time frame this ad goes back to *
  • Who's Online (See full list)

    • There are no registered users currently online
  • My Clubs

×
×
  • Create New...

Hey there, we noticed you're using an ad-blocker. We're a small site that is supported by ads or subscriptions. We rely on these to pay for server costs and vehicle reviews.  Please consider whitelisting us in your ad-blocker, or if you really like what you see, you can pick up one of our subscriptions for just $1.75 a month or $15 a year. It may not seem like a lot, but it goes a long way to help support real, honest content, that isn't generated by an AI bot.

See you out there.

Drew
Editor-in-Chief

Write what you are looking for and press enter or click the search icon to begin your search