Chevrolet Colorado, GMC Canyon Diesels To Be Further Scrutinized

Beyond the immediate issues of range and charge time/facilities, my issues with electric cars at this point are twofold: the materials involved with making the batteries on an industrial scale may be hard to come by (this also applies to the motors, to a lesser extent), and the intellectual dishonesty involved in calling electricity "green" when it is still largely generated by coal.

Agreed on all points.  Only one thing that would make sense:  if yer house is totally solar powered, off-grid, and you have a short ass commute, with no plans to ever take a decent road trip.

 

The Chevrolet Bolt will be the only piddly electric car fit to drive OFF the golf course.

Do not forget and will have a 200 Mile Range. Something that will make a difference.

 

+1

Beyond the immediate issues of range and charge time/facilities, my issues with electric cars at this point are twofold: the materials involved with making the batteries on an industrial scale may be hard to come by (this also applies to the motors, to a lesser extent), and the intellectual dishonesty involved in calling electricity "green" when it is still largely generated by coal.

My house is supplied by wind energy and it's slightly cheaper per kwh than the default coal/nuke selection.

Also, Tesla's supercharger stations are usually fed or offset by solar.

Beyond the immediate issues of range and charge time/facilities, my issues with electric cars at this point are twofold: the materials involved with making the batteries on an industrial scale may be hard to come by (this also applies to the motors, to a lesser extent), and the intellectual dishonesty involved in calling electricity "green" when it is still largely generated by coal.

Very much an East Coast Problem as the West Coast uses Hydro. Very green for us.

 

Beyond the immediate issues of range and charge time/facilities, my issues with electric cars at this point are twofold: the materials involved with making the batteries on an industrial scale may be hard to come by (this also applies to the motors, to a lesser extent), and the intellectual dishonesty involved in calling electricity "green" when it is still largely generated by coal.

My house is supplied by wind energy and it's slightly cheaper per kwh than the default coal/nuke selection.

Also, Tesla's supercharger stations are usually fed or offset by solar.

 

All of the Tesla's Supercharger stations in the Pacific Northwest are supplied by either Hydro, Solar or wind. Very green indeed.

Agreed on all points.  Only one thing that would make sense:  if yer house is totally solar powered, off-grid, and you have a short ass commute, with no plans to ever take a decent road trip.

Yet that is why you have your petrol powered auto for the long road trips and the Bolt for the daily commute to work.  

Just like you could have your EV Pickup Truck for daily commute to work and local errands and still have your TDI for enjoyable Weekend Trips and vacation drives.

I'm hoping the GM Diesel trucks will be at one of the two events I am attending over the next two weeks.  I look forward to trying them.

 

Beyond the immediate issues of range and charge time/facilities, my issues with electric cars at this point are twofold: the materials involved with making the batteries on an industrial scale may be hard to come by (this also applies to the motors, to a lesser extent), and the intellectual dishonesty involved in calling electricity "green" when it is still largely generated by coal.

Very much an East Coast Problem as the West Coast uses Hydro. Very green for us.

 

 

Not an entirety an East Coast problem.

Quebec is all Hydro. and Hydro-Quebec supplies electricity for Up State New York, Maine, Vermont and some parts of Massachusetts.

The only problem with Quebec and electric cars is that the charging stations network should be more elaborate than what already is...but its growing fast as Quebecois are seriously buying into this market.

Teslas are everywhere.

Volts too.

Fusion electric and Sonatas are gaining steam.

The Leaf....not so much.

The new Gen Volt and Tesla Model X should really take Quebec into another level.

Then there is the Bolt. 

I figure...as the Buick Encore is quite popular...that the Tesla Model X and Bolt will be the winners in Quebec when they will finally be offered.

Why do I assume this while giving the Encore as an example?

Because the Encore is sold as a premium urban vehicle as opposed to the Trax..the Chevy is not as popular as its Buick counterpart.

The Model S is quite popular and "upscale"

So...because the Encore is CUV...so is the Model X...and the Encore is a small "urban" vehicle...so is the Bolt...

People that have the money to buy Model X they buy th Model X and those that want an affordable urban vehicle will buy the Bolt...

Which makes me wnder why doesnt GM do a Trax like CUV that is like the Volt?

I bet a Volt based Trax would sell far more than the Volt itself.

The Gas Colorado took it to the new Tacoma in the new Car and Driver. Been years since I have seen that.

Bravo olds.

Greeks are some of the smartest MoFo's I know.

 

Has anyone in history come close to the many contributions we gave modern civilization, like:

architecture

philosophy

democracy

astronomy

buttsecks

sports and olympics

mathematics and geometry

alarm clocks

odometer

even early medicine

 

So everyone better listen when a Greek speaks

 

You forgot one, I fixed it for you. 

But what have they done lately?

Now it is fixed.

They lost their Mojo after Socrates died so it has been a while since they have contributed much.

The Gas Colorado took it to the new Tacoma in the new Car and Driver. Been years since I have seen that.

I'm not surprised. Toyota phoned that one in.

 

The Gas Colorado took it to the new Tacoma in the new Car and Driver. Been years since I have seen that.

I'm not surprised. Toyota phoned that one in.

 

The brand new Taco?

 

 

The Gas Colorado took it to the new Tacoma in the new Car and Driver. Been years since I have seen that.

I'm not surprised. Toyota phoned that one in.

 

The brand new Taco?

 

You can order Crappy Taco's by phone? 

The Gas Colorado took it to the new Tacoma in the new Car and Driver. Been years since I have seen that.

I'm not surprised. Toyota phoned that one in.

The brand new Taco?

You are so charitable calling it "brand new". It just a heavy redesign of the prior one.

The Gas Colorado took it to the new Tacoma in the new Car and Driver. Been years since I have seen that.

I'm not surprised. Toyota phoned that one in.

The brand new Taco?

You are so charitable calling it "brand new". It just a heavy redesign of the prior one.

I'm actually really excited to read some test reviews and comparisons. This segment has officially gotten competitive with the new Canyonado.

I'll probably drive the new Taco and new Colorado diesel next week. I ran out of time before getting to them today.

It's very interesting the new midsize truck dynamic. I think people really want more choices, they want more in this segment. So Ford, and Ram, please reconsider. A Dakota and Ranger would really round it out again.

Maybe it's similar to the downsized crossover craze?

I thought a new ranger was already known to be coming.

The last Ranger could have come here per the project manager as he said the only thing that kept it from America was Fords will to bring it. He wanted it here. I suspect they were so deep in the F150 investment they were waiting till the second gen and the funding from the new F150 was here to pay for it.

The next gen will be here and I expect it will be 2018-2019.

As for the Dakota. I know they have some work done but FCA has really limited Chryslers rework by taking the money and putting it into things like Alfa. They be depending on the Jeep truck to pick up the slack.

The last Ranger could have come here per the project manager as he said the only thing that kept it from America was Fords will to bring it. He wanted it here. I suspect they were so deep in the F150 investment they were waiting till the second gen and the funding from the new F150 was here to pay for it.

The next gen will be here and I expect it will be 2018-2019.

 

As for the Dakota. I know they have some work done but FCA has really limited Chryslers rework by taking the money and putting it into things like Alfa. They be depending on the Jeep truck to pick up the slack.

you act as if they are not coming out with new product and not putting money into new product which is completely false considering that within just a few years the entire Dodge, Chrysler, and Jeep lineup will be either all-new or heavily updated.  I know you hate FCA, but get off of it.  Besides, the Jeep truck makes MUCH more sense as the last Dakota bombed and people have been drooling for a Jeep truck since, well, forever......

The last Ranger could have come here per the project manager as he said the only thing that kept it from America was Fords will to bring it. He wanted it here. I suspect they were so deep in the F150 investment they were waiting till the second gen and the funding from the new F150 was here to pay for it.

The next gen will be here and I expect it will be 2018-2019.

 

As for the Dakota. I know they have some work done but FCA has really limited Chryslers rework by taking the money and putting it into things like Alfa. They be depending on the Jeep truck to pick up the slack.

 

you act as if they are not coming out with new product and not putting money into new product which is completely false considering that within just a few years the entire Dodge, Chrysler, and Jeep lineup will be either all-new or heavily updated.  I know you hate FCA, but get off of it.  Besides, the Jeep truck makes MUCH more sense as the last Dakota bombed and people have been drooling for a Jeep truck since, well, forever......

Stew this is the deal. Chrysler has two new cars based on older Fiat platforms. They have only done some refreshes to the RWD cars and are selling them at large discounts other than the Hellcat. I know my In laws just bought a 300 for dirt cheap.

Jeep and the Truck really have gotten the bulk of the investment but what money they are making is being dumped into Alfa and Maserati when it should be going to Dodge and Chrysler.

Sorry but I am not blind to the fact Sergio is expecting Alfa to increase sales from 160,000 to over 400,000 by 2017. Well that is not going to happen and he is pissing away money that should have gone into Chrysler 5 years ago.

Look at GM and Chrysler post bail out and GM is already to the point they have replaced most of their platforms with new platforms and are already into the second gen of refresh on some of theses models in the next one to two years. They even created a new Omega platform. Yet Chrysler is left with older and borrowed models. Even the RWD replacements were pushed back.

Sergio is bleeding them of money that should go to them as he needs volume and they are the brands to do it not Alfa.

Even you are wise enough to understand that for post bail out we have seen little done and much of what money Jeep has made went to Italy not Detroit where it should go.

Sergio is looking for a dance partner because he needs one. The man is desperate and is off his rocker. The sad part other than the trucks, Jeep and Ferrari no one is really interested in the rest of the line up. They offer nothing another company already does not have or need. Sergio has turned FCA into a parasite and it is looking for a main body to suck onto and drain blood from.

The car line up is far behind and not looking to be improving soon. The LX is a refresh and that is all. Improved yes but while the others have replaced or moved on with new platforms.

If you are happy with re bodied Fiats that is fine but if I were a Chrysler fan I would not be happy at all. Jeep should be paying for all new Chrysler products ones imported from Italy.

 

 

The last Ranger could have come here per the project manager as he said the only thing that kept it from America was Fords will to bring it. He wanted it here. I suspect they were so deep in the F150 investment they were waiting till the second gen and the funding from the new F150 was here to pay for it.

The next gen will be here and I expect it will be 2018-2019.

 

As for the Dakota. I know they have some work done but FCA has really limited Chryslers rework by taking the money and putting it into things like Alfa. They be depending on the Jeep truck to pick up the slack.

 

you act as if they are not coming out with new product and not putting money into new product which is completely false considering that within just a few years the entire Dodge, Chrysler, and Jeep lineup will be either all-new or heavily updated.  I know you hate FCA, but get off of it.  Besides, the Jeep truck makes MUCH more sense as the last Dakota bombed and people have been drooling for a Jeep truck since, well, forever......

 

Stew this is the deal. Chrysler has two new cars based on older Fiat platforms. They have only done some refreshes to the RWD cars and are selling them at large discounts other than the Hellcat. I know my In laws just bought a 300 for dirt cheap.

Jeep and the Truck really have gotten the bulk of the investment but what money they are making is being dumped into Alfa and Maserati when it should be going to Dodge and Chrysler.

Sorry but I am not blind to the fact Sergio is expecting Alfa to increase sales from 160,000 to over 400,000 by 2017. Well that is not going to happen and he is pissing away money that should have gone into Chrysler 5 years ago.

Look at GM and Chrysler post bail out and GM is already to the point they have replaced most of their platforms with new platforms and are already into the second gen of refresh on some of theses models in the next one to two years. They even created a new Omega platform. Yet Chrysler is left with older and borrowed models. Even the RWD replacements were pushed back.

Sergio is bleeding them of money that should go to them as he needs volume and they are the brands to do it not Alfa.

Even you are wise enough to understand that for post bail out we have seen little done and much of what money Jeep has made went to Italy not Detroit where it should go.

Sergio is looking for a dance partner because he needs one. The man is desperate and is off his rocker. The sad part other than the trucks, Jeep and Ferrari no one is really interested in the rest of the line up. They offer nothing another company already does not have or need. Sergio has turned FCA into a parasite and it is looking for a main body to suck onto and drain blood from.

The car line up is far behind and not looking to be improving soon. The LX is a refresh and that is all. Improved yes but while the others have replaced or moved on with new platforms.

If you are happy with re bodied Fiats that is fine but if I were a Chrysler fan I would not be happy at all. Jeep should be paying for all new Chrysler products ones imported from Italy.

 

Again, you show how little you know.  Where to start?  We know the BRAND NEW ALFA platform is going to give us the replacement for LX, so great investment IMO.  CUSW shares VERY little with the original Alfa platform,  basically when it appeared just a couple years ago, for all intents and purposes it was a new platform.  We have seen the new minivan, we know new powertrains and MANY new vehicles are coming AND CONFIRMED.  You choose to ignore these facts because they DESTROY your skepticism.  not to mention their sales are still INCREASING while they maintain the LOWEST percentage of rental sales of the big 3.  they have also managed to outsell Ford in retail sales which is a VERY big deal.  The facts are against yo.  Again, ou simply hate FCA and that is your real issue. Am I saying they are perfect?  no, but who is.  Cadillac is floundering in sales right now, there is the huge ignition recall and government fines that make FCA's "record fines" look like chump change.  Like FCA their trucks are doing great, but their cars aren't exactly setting the world on fire.  I like both companies.  I love my Dakota and m Silverado, but I neither is really perfect or overall really outperforming each other in a lot of areas since the bailout. 

 "Look at GM and Chrysler post bail out and GM is already to the point they have replaced most of their platforms with new platforms and are already into the second gen of refresh on some of theses models in the next one to two years. They even created a new Omega platform. Yet Chrysler is left with older and borrowed models. Even the RWD replacements were pushed back."
 

I think this summed it all up VERY well. I know it put it into a different perspective to me. Thanks hyper.

 "Look at GM and Chrysler post bail out and GM is already to the point they have replaced most of their platforms with new platforms and are already into the second gen of refresh on some of theses models in the next one to two years. They even created a new Omega platform. Yet Chrysler is left with older and borrowed models. Even the RWD replacements were pushed back."

 

I think this summed it all up VERY well. I know it put it into a different perspective to me. Thanks hyper.

the only poblem is, he is not being nearly truthful hear.  Most of the GM platforms are older than he lets on.  The Impala for example, just hit a platform Buick has been using for a few years and before that was running a NINE year old design based on a platform more than 20 years.  The Regal, 11-15 Cruze, were both based on platforms sold and designs sold in the rest of world for YEARS before they hit our shores.  The Malibu, 13-15 was based on that older Regal platform.  Alpha really is the only new car platform seen before 16.

Stew i am well aware of the plans but as most market observers have noted it has greater odds of failing.

You fail to understand that volume is a major issue here and they need it now not 5 years from now. The Alfa should have been a LX first.

minivan is dead with he growing CUV segment.

I could easily go on. This is not hate as you like to claim but I do not wear the rose colored glasses.

I have no worries as time will prove what I am saying unless FCA wises up and dumps Sergio.

It is not GM that is after a forced merger with FCA but the converse. That is very telling of who has it and who needs it.

I want Chrysler to survive but as long as Sergio is there they will fall farther and farther into danger of failure.

 

 

 

The last Ranger could have come here per the project manager as he said the only thing that kept it from America was Fords will to bring it. He wanted it here. I suspect they were so deep in the F150 investment they were waiting till the second gen and the funding from the new F150 was here to pay for it.

The next gen will be here and I expect it will be 2018-2019.

 

As for the Dakota. I know they have some work done but FCA has really limited Chryslers rework by taking the money and putting it into things like Alfa. They be depending on the Jeep truck to pick up the slack.

 

you act as if they are not coming out with new product and not putting money into new product which is completely false considering that within just a few years the entire Dodge, Chrysler, and Jeep lineup will be either all-new or heavily updated.  I know you hate FCA, but get off of it.  Besides, the Jeep truck makes MUCH more sense as the last Dakota bombed and people have been drooling for a Jeep truck since, well, forever......

 

Stew this is the deal. Chrysler has two new cars based on older Fiat platforms. They have only done some refreshes to the RWD cars and are selling them at large discounts other than the Hellcat. I know my In laws just bought a 300 for dirt cheap.

Jeep and the Truck really have gotten the bulk of the investment but what money they are making is being dumped into Alfa and Maserati when it should be going to Dodge and Chrysler.

Sorry but I am not blind to the fact Sergio is expecting Alfa to increase sales from 160,000 to over 400,000 by 2017. Well that is not going to happen and he is pissing away money that should have gone into Chrysler 5 years ago.

Look at GM and Chrysler post bail out and GM is already to the point they have replaced most of their platforms with new platforms and are already into the second gen of refresh on some of theses models in the next one to two years. They even created a new Omega platform. Yet Chrysler is left with older and borrowed models. Even the RWD replacements were pushed back.

Sergio is bleeding them of money that should go to them as he needs volume and they are the brands to do it not Alfa.

Even you are wise enough to understand that for post bail out we have seen little done and much of what money Jeep has made went to Italy not Detroit where it should go.

Sergio is looking for a dance partner because he needs one. The man is desperate and is off his rocker. The sad part other than the trucks, Jeep and Ferrari no one is really interested in the rest of the line up. They offer nothing another company already does not have or need. Sergio has turned FCA into a parasite and it is looking for a main body to suck onto and drain blood from.

The car line up is far behind and not looking to be improving soon. The LX is a refresh and that is all. Improved yes but while the others have replaced or moved on with new platforms.

If you are happy with re bodied Fiats that is fine but if I were a Chrysler fan I would not be happy at all. Jeep should be paying for all new Chrysler products ones imported from Italy.

 

Again, you show how little you know.  Where to start?  We know the BRAND NEW ALFA platform is going to give us the replacement for LX, so great investment IMO.  CUSW shares VERY little with the original Alfa platform,  basically when it appeared just a couple years ago, for all intents and purposes it was a new platform.  We have seen the new minivan, we know new powertrains and MANY new vehicles are coming AND CONFIRMED.  You choose to ignore these facts because they DESTROY your skepticism.  not to mention their sales are still INCREASING while they maintain the LOWEST percentage of rental sales of the big 3.  they have also managed to outsell Ford in retail sales which is a VERY big deal.  The facts are against yo.  Again, ou simply hate FCA and that is your real issue. Am I saying they are perfect?  no, but who is.  Cadillac is floundering in sales right now, there is the huge ignition recall and government fines that make FCA's "record fines" look like chump change.  Like FCA their trucks are doing great, but their cars aren't exactly setting the world on fire.  I like both companies.  I love my Dakota and m Silverado, but I neither is really perfect or overall really outperforming each other in a lot of areas since the bailout. 

 

Stew, Hyper makes some very solid valid points as do you for FCA. With that in mind, FCA has delayed most of the new products for RAM, Dodge, Chrysler and Jeep and are just doing updates with older tech.

Hyper hits the nail on the head that Sergio is an IDIOT and wasting BILLIONS on Alfa that should NEVER have been approved by the Board or mgmt. Maserati auto's are not that great either and instead of improving them, he is trying to bring in another product line with lies on production numbers. Fiat has one of the highest turn over rates for people buying and then dumping their poor quality auto's and the amount sitting on dealer lots is scary. Gurufocus.com shows Fiat has twice the amount of inventory on lots in comparison to GM, FORD or any other brand.

The money earned from Jeep, RAM, Dodge and Chrysler should be pumped back into those brands not Fiat, Maserati or trying to resurect another label that is DOA for the US and I suspect the world outside of die hard fans of old Alfa's.

Stew i am well aware of the plans but as most market observers have noted it has greater odds of failing.

You fail to understand that volume is a major issue here and they need it now not 5 years from now. The Alfa should have been a LX first.

minivan is dead with he growing CUV segment.

I could easily go on. This is not hate as you like to claim but I do not wear the rose colored glasses.

I have no worries as time will prove what I am saying unless FCA wises up and dumps Sergio.

It is not GM that is after a forced merger with FCA but the converse. That is very telling of who has it and who needs it.

I want Chrysler to survive but as long as Sergio is there they will fall farther and farther into danger of failure.

 

 "Look at GM and Chrysler post bail out and GM is already to the point they have replaced most of their platforms with new platforms and are already into the second gen of refresh on some of theses models in the next one to two years. They even created a new Omega platform. Yet Chrysler is left with older and borrowed models. Even the RWD replacements were pushed back."

 

I think this summed it all up VERY well. I know it put it into a different perspective to me. Thanks hyper.

 

the only poblem is, he is not being nearly truthful hear.  Most of the GM platforms are older than he lets on.  The Impala for example, just hit a platform Buick has been using for a few years and before that was running a NINE year old design based on a platform more than 20 years.  The Regal, 11-15 Cruze, were both based on platforms sold and designs sold in the rest of world for YEARS before they hit our shores.  The Malibu, 13-15 was based on that older Regal platform.  Alpha really is the only new car platform seen before 16.

 

But look at what GM is pumping out NOW. They have a brand new Colorado/Canyon, '16 Cruze, '16 Malibu, Their half tons were done in '13..updated again for '16, '16 Camaro, CT6, XT5, Bolt, Volt.. What has Chrysler, Dodge, Ram, Jeep done in comparison? I mean I understand when you say those were on older platforms but everything I listed is no longer on those dated platforms and the Chrsler products still are and will be for some years yet. GM is no longer living under their bailout timeline and Chrysler is with too many of their products.

 

 

 "Look at GM and Chrysler post bail out and GM is already to the point they have replaced most of their platforms with new platforms and are already into the second gen of refresh on some of theses models in the next one to two years. They even created a new Omega platform. Yet Chrysler is left with older and borrowed models. Even the RWD replacements were pushed back."

 

I think this summed it all up VERY well. I know it put it into a different perspective to me. Thanks hyper.

 

the only poblem is, he is not being nearly truthful hear.  Most of the GM platforms are older than he lets on.  The Impala for example, just hit a platform Buick has been using for a few years and before that was running a NINE year old design based on a platform more than 20 years.  The Regal, 11-15 Cruze, were both based on platforms sold and designs sold in the rest of world for YEARS before they hit our shores.  The Malibu, 13-15 was based on that older Regal platform.  Alpha really is the only new car platform seen before 16.

 

But look at what GM is pumping out NOW. They have a brand new Colorado/Canyon, '16 Cruze, '16 Malibu, Their half tons were done in '13..updated again for '16, '16 Camaro, CT6, XT5, Bolt, Volt.. What has Chrysler, Dodge, Ram, Jeep done in comparison? I mean I understand when you say those were on older platforms but everything I listed is no longer on those dated platforms and the Chrsler products still are and will be for some years yet. GM is no longer living under their bailout timeline and Chrysler is with too many of their products.

 

A platform generally lasts a minimum of 10 years.  2 completely new designs and generally 2 refreshes.  CUSW was new in 13.  Dart was new in 13, Cherokee in 14, Renegade in 15, Town and Country next year, Rm is from 09 with a major refresh in 13, Durango and Grand Cherokee were brand new for 11 with Major refreshes in 14 that went way further than skin deep.  There is a basically new Pentastar appearing next year in the Grand Cherokee and probably others for 16.  The upgrades to the LX platform were pretty major for 15 and there no longer a single component left from the original Benz platform.  And the platform works.  The LX cars have actually gotten quite a few accolades for the 15s in the handling department.  Worry less about the age of a platform and more on how it works and it does.  I can attest from m 15 Challenger drive compared to than many earlier ones I have driven, it feels like a new platform.  Anyways, to continue, a replacement for the Patriot and Compass are VERY close.  We are seeing these vehicles being tested now, at least the ones closest to launch including the Wrangler (thank goodness this keeps it's JK platform!), Compat replacement, and te new minivan.  Their whole lineup has actually been redesigned in the least 4 years and MANY have already received major refreshes and their sales are soaring.  I do thing the GM merger crap is ridiculous, but otherwise there is nowhere near the doom and gloom out there as Hyper spouts. 

FCA, the next company to go bankrupt and be torn apart at auction I predict.

Not meaning to argue, we all know i absolutely love the Colorado and Canyon.

FCA, the next company to go bankrupt and be torn apart at auction I predict.

I dunno... a Ferrari IPO and a wobbly Volkswagen may ensure that Sergio (and Chrysler as a whole) get to keep that horseshoe firmly stuck where the sun don't shine.

^

I could see some investors demanding Ferrari be sold off for investor pay back. After all it is a public company now and this will bring people looking to make gains and clearly get their hands on more money.

We shall see. All I know is that Marchionne's ability to make good stuff out of scraps has so far been successful. It may all end badly, still. But nobody's gotten wealthier betting that way to this point.

Good stuff is questionable as he has a habit of making trash look good so he can sell garbage wrapped up in a pretty bow, but that does not mean everything is good stuff. The RT/SRT/Hellcat are exceptions. Jeep is doing good but has had some rough starts especially the hella 9 speed tranny in the Cherokee.

Good stuff is questionable as he has a habit of making trash look good so he can sell garbage wrapped up in a pretty bow, but that does not mean everything is good stuff. The RT/SRT/Hellcat are exceptions. Jeep is doing good but has had some rough starts especially the hella 9 speed tranny in the Cherokee.

There is a lot of good stuff out there right now, he only real exception may be the Dart and it is a matter of tuning and engines.  Basicall everyone who has used the 9 speed has had issues, from Range Rover to Acura to Honda. 

Indeed.

And I wouldn't exactly call their pickup lineup crappy either. Or their full-size rear-drivers. Or Jeep. Or...

You're quite free to hate the playa. But his game's been pretty strong.

the only poblem is, he is not being nearly truthful hear.  Most of the GM platforms are older than he lets on.  The Impala for example, just hit a platform Buick has been using for a few years and before that was running a NINE year old design based on a platform more than 20 years.  The Regal, 11-15 Cruze, were both based on platforms sold and designs sold in the rest of world for YEARS before they hit our shores.  The Malibu, 13-15 was based on that older Regal platform.  Alpha really is the only new car platform seen before 16.

But look at what GM is pumping out NOW. They have a brand new Colorado/Canyon, '16 Cruze, '16 Malibu, Their half tons were done in '13..updated again for '16, '16 Camaro, CT6, XT5, Bolt, Volt.. What has Chrysler, Dodge, Ram, Jeep done in comparison? I mean I understand when you say those were on older platforms but everything I listed is no longer on those dated platforms and the Chrsler products still are and will be for some years yet. GM is no longer living under their bailout timeline and Chrysler is with too many of their products.

A platform generally lasts a minimum of 10 years.  2 completely new designs and generally 2 refreshes.  CUSW was new in 13.  Dart was new in 13, Cherokee in 14, Renegade in 15, Town and Country next year, Rm is from 09 with a major refresh in 13, Durango and Grand Cherokee were brand new for 11 with Major refreshes in 14 that went way further than skin deep.  There is a basically new Pentastar appearing next year in the Grand Cherokee and probably others for 16.  The upgrades to the LX platform were pretty major for 15 and there no longer a single component left from the original Benz platform.  And the platform works.  The LX cars have actually gotten quite a few accolades for the 15s in the handling department.  Worry less about the age of a platform and more on how it works and it does.  I can attest from m 15 Challenger drive compared to than many earlier ones I have driven, it feels like a new platform.  Anyways, to continue, a replacement for the Patriot and Compass are VERY close.  We are seeing these vehicles being tested now, at least the ones closest to launch including the Wrangler (thank goodness this keeps it's JK platform!), Compat replacement, and te new minivan.  Their whole lineup has actually been redesigned in the least 4 years and MANY have already received major refreshes and their sales are soaring.  I do thing the GM merger crap is ridiculous, but otherwise there is nowhere near the doom and gloom out there as Hyper spouts.

Stew the Theta and Lambda platforms are the only two old platforms left at GM. Both will be replaced starting this year and next year.

The rest of the line up is on new platforms and at least one to two generations of new models offered since the chapter 11. While the 13 Malibu was offered on the older platform it was one new model not just a simple refresh and now we have a new platform and second all new model this year.

GM plowed what money they had left into product before the chapter 11 and this permitted them to bring some new product out till the new platforms arrived. While not the best product it was something vs. the simple refresh that the Chrysler cars were.

The Dart is re regenerated Fiat corporation product living on discounts already. The LX models are living also on major incentives. How else can you get a 300 for $30K the price of a simple mid size car. The 200 while a nice looking car is a back marker in the segment even with incentives. Nearly every review says it is a better car than the last but far from segment leading. Transmission issues also have been an issue.

The Challanger may feel new but it is older than dirt. If it had not been a decent car to start with it would have been a fatal move to just refresh it. But Chrysler can not live just on LX and Hellcat sales alone. The Fiat models have all under performed and many dealers are wanting to bail on the line.

Chrysler lacks good small and mid sized cars where the volume and profits are right now and that is what Sergio needs to fix but as of now he can not even afford to pay attention. He lacks major work in Hybrids and EV cars that will hurt them in the future too.

This is not just my view but also most every market watcher out there. You really have to get a grip on reality and learn this Italian idiot is killing your company to try to save his own countries brands. If you the fan does not wake up you will lose more models than just Plymouth.

The people who watch the markets have put Chrysler at risk and Mitsubishi. Both have low cash reserves and volumes lower than what can sustain spending to improve the brands as needed.

Again do you really think Alfa by 2017 will make the 400,000 goal Sergio predicts? Their sales this year are even down from the 168,000 of last year. If the Euro economic conditions remain as they are or worsen it will make things even more difficult than it already is.

The trump card here is Chrysler but they still are not getting the money they need to do what they can do.

If the world of the Hemi demise is true in 2019 that will damage them even more. This has been the calling card of Chrysler and you remove that for some imported TT V6 and many will turn away.

The money also from Ferrari is not going to do much either. A billion today will fix one platform or at least a part of one major platform.

I hope you like Jeep and Ram as that is all that may be left it Sergio is not removed soon.

With the VW troubles they may make them a better dance partner for Chrysler and the Germans will remove Sergio in a heart beat.

Good stuff is questionable as he has a habit of making trash look good so he can sell garbage wrapped up in a pretty bow, but that does not mean everything is good stuff. The RT/SRT/Hellcat are exceptions. Jeep is doing good but has had some rough starts especially the hella 9 speed tranny in the Cherokee.

It is better than what they have had but not better than anyone else for the most part.

Jeep risks have paid off and the Renegade may be the next Soul. Odd little cars like this get a cult following and even the odd things about them endear them to the owners. In truth it is a shame it was not a Fiat model here as they really could use a car like this in their line up.

The next 2-3 years will be critical and a lot of things need to go right. Also the things that are outside like Economy could really damage any comeback badly.

I really wish Chrysler was free of Fiat. I really think then they would have a chance with another brand partnering with them. But as it is no one wants Fiat and their damaged or low volume brands.

The Renegade is a Fiat here. It's the 500L.

The Renegade is a Fiat here. It's the 500L.

No they should have used the Jeep styling with a more Chrysler like nose. Lets face it the Fiat family face is not selling.

Ya, but you can't limit the looks of the Renegade to a small dealer network either. It needed to be a Jeep for that reason, if no other.

 

The Renegade is a Fiat here. It's the 500L.

No they should have used the Jeep styling with a more Chrysler like nose. Lets face it the Fiat family face is not selling.

 

Wow um no.  The 500X hasn't even been on market long enough to gauge it's sales success.  Also, I wouldn't call the 500 2 door a failure as it's sales are not that far behind the Mini which offers both a 3 door and 5 door and is brand new to the market in it's current gen.  You keep failin to see the big picture................

The Renegade is a Fiat here. It's the 500L.

You guys don't get the actual Renegade up there? Just the 500L?

To me, the Renegade looks 10X better than the 500L. I think the 500 looks good but the L just looks like a bloated 500 but not in a good way.

No we get the Renegade. It looks pretty decent, worlds better to my eyes than the 500L.

 

the only poblem is, he is not being nearly truthful hear.  Most of the GM platforms are older than he lets on.  The Impala for example, just hit a platform Buick has been using for a few years and before that was running a NINE year old design based on a platform more than 20 years.  The Regal, 11-15 Cruze, were both based on platforms sold and designs sold in the rest of world for YEARS before they hit our shores.  The Malibu, 13-15 was based on that older Regal platform.  Alpha really is the only new car platform seen before 16.

But look at what GM is pumping out NOW. They have a brand new Colorado/Canyon, '16 Cruze, '16 Malibu, Their half tons were done in '13..updated again for '16, '16 Camaro, CT6, XT5, Bolt, Volt.. What has Chrysler, Dodge, Ram, Jeep done in comparison? I mean I understand when you say those were on older platforms but everything I listed is no longer on those dated platforms and the Chrsler products still are and will be for some years yet. GM is no longer living under their bailout timeline and Chrysler is with too many of their products.

A platform generally lasts a minimum of 10 years.  2 completely new designs and generally 2 refreshes.  CUSW was new in 13.  Dart was new in 13, Cherokee in 14, Renegade in 15, Town and Country next year, Rm is from 09 with a major refresh in 13, Durango and Grand Cherokee were brand new for 11 with Major refreshes in 14 that went way further than skin deep.  There is a basically new Pentastar appearing next year in the Grand Cherokee and probably others for 16.  The upgrades to the LX platform were pretty major for 15 and there no longer a single component left from the original Benz platform.  And the platform works.  The LX cars have actually gotten quite a few accolades for the 15s in the handling department.  Worry less about the age of a platform and more on how it works and it does.  I can attest from m 15 Challenger drive compared to than many earlier ones I have driven, it feels like a new platform.  Anyways, to continue, a replacement for the Patriot and Compass are VERY close.  We are seeing these vehicles being tested now, at least the ones closest to launch including the Wrangler (thank goodness this keeps it's JK platform!), Compat replacement, and te new minivan.  Their whole lineup has actually been redesigned in the least 4 years and MANY have already received major refreshes and their sales are soaring.  I do thing the GM merger crap is ridiculous, but otherwise there is nowhere near the doom and gloom out there as Hyper spouts.

Stew the Theta and Lambda platforms are the only two old platforms left at GM. Both will be replaced starting this year and next year.

The rest of the line up is on new platforms and at least one to two generations of new models offered since the chapter 11. While the 13 Malibu was offered on the older platform it was one new model not just a simple refresh and now we have a new platform and second all new model this year.

GM plowed what money they had left into product before the chapter 11 and this permitted them to bring some new product out till the new platforms arrived. While not the best product it was something vs. the simple refresh that the Chrysler cars were.

The Dart is re regenerated Fiat corporation product living on discounts already. The LX models are living also on major incentives. How else can you get a 300 for $30K the price of a simple mid size car. The 200 while a nice looking car is a back marker in the segment even with incentives. Nearly every review says it is a better car than the last but far from segment leading. Transmission issues also have been an issue.

The Challanger may feel new but it is older than dirt. If it had not been a decent car to start with it would have been a fatal move to just refresh it. But Chrysler can not live just on LX and Hellcat sales alone. The Fiat models have all under performed and many dealers are wanting to bail on the line.

Chrysler lacks good small and mid sized cars where the volume and profits are right now and that is what Sergio needs to fix but as of now he can not even afford to pay attention. He lacks major work in Hybrids and EV cars that will hurt them in the future too.

This is not just my view but also most every market watcher out there. You really have to get a grip on reality and learn this Italian idiot is killing your company to try to save his own countries brands. If you the fan does not wake up you will lose more models than just Plymouth.

The people who watch the markets have put Chrysler at risk and Mitsubishi. Both have low cash reserves and volumes lower than what can sustain spending to improve the brands as needed.

Again do you really think Alfa by 2017 will make the 400,000 goal Sergio predicts? Their sales this year are even down from the 168,000 of last year. If the Euro economic conditions remain as they are or worsen it will make things even more difficult than it already is.

The trump card here is Chrysler but they still are not getting the money they need to do what they can do.

If the world of the Hemi demise is true in 2019 that will damage them even more. This has been the calling card of Chrysler and you remove that for some imported TT V6 and many will turn away.

The money also from Ferrari is not going to do much either. A billion today will fix one platform or at least a part of one major platform.

I hope you like Jeep and Ram as that is all that may be left it Sergio is not removed soon.

With the VW troubles they may make them a better dance partner for Chrysler and the Germans will remove Sergio in a heart beat.

You do realize that when you criticize one company for their incentives, you are criticizing all of them (except for the uber luxury and high performance makes of course) right? It is a seriously tired and pointless argument based off of  that one simple fact alone.

The Renegade is a Fiat here. It's the 500L.

You guys don't get the actual Renegade up there? Just the 500L?

 

To me, the Renegade looks 10X better than the 500L. I think the 500 looks good but the L just looks like a bloated 500 but not in a good way.

It is better looking and has more appeal.

You do realize that when you criticize one company for their incentives, you are criticizing all of them (except for the uber luxury and high performance makes of course) right? It is a seriously tired and pointless argument based off of  that one simple fact alone.

You realize there is a greater difference between getting $1500 off a Cruze and $7500 off a 300. Also you have to factor in is the incentives at the end of the year or the dead of winter or are they year round for the last 3-4 years at the high end dollar amounts.

My in laws bought a Chrysler 300 for less than a Chevy Malibu. While this was a good deal for the in Laws it was not a good thing for a cash poor company who is not leaving much meat on the bone in profits per car.

Same for all the Chryslers dumped on the Fleet Sales. I could hardly get a car last summer when traveling that was not a current FCA product [Note one was a Maserati rental Not a good thing for image].

Yes GM has fleet sales but often it is the out going model that has remained in production like the Captiva, Impala and like we will see with the present Nox and Cruze. These cars will be replaced in the new car market and they will go to fleet to add income and not damage the new models sales.

It is a matter of taking all factors into account here. You can not just toss out a incentive or fleet blanket over the entire industry as it is the details that tell the entire story.

In the end it is how much meat is on the bone that counts and at Chrysler they are leaving meat on the bone that they really could use. I blame not Chrysler but Fiat for their lack of better support and the misleading guidance or Sergio.

The way I see it time will sort this one out and unless there are some changes it will prove my case.

Personally I have only been luke warm to the Jeep Renegade with this being the best looking one I have seen.

I also feel that not only should Jeep follow through with this accessory they should build and sell but I think GM should do this for the Colorado / Canyon twins.

Personally I have only been luke warm to the Jeep Renegade with this being the best looking one I have seen.

 

Jeep-Renegade-BlackEdition.jpeg

 

I also feel that not only should Jeep follow through with this accessory they should build and sell but I think GM should do this for the Colorado / Canyon twins.

 

JeepRenegadeAccessories.jpg

I would not buy one but it has that Soul like quality of being different that appeals to many people. If quality holds it should do well.

I hate the tail lights as they look like the eyes of a dead cartoon figure.

 

Personally I have only been luke warm to the Jeep Renegade with this being the best looking one I have seen.

 

Jeep-Renegade-BlackEdition.jpeg

 

I also feel that not only should Jeep follow through with this accessory they should build and sell but I think GM should do this for the Colorado / Canyon twins.

 

JeepRenegadeAccessories.jpg

I would not buy one but it has that Soul like quality of being different that appeals to many people. If quality holds it should do well.

I hate the tail lights as they look like the eyes of a dead cartoon figure.

 

Very true the tail lights do remind me of dead cartoon characters but then anime and cartoons are big right now all over especially with Marvel Movies.

What do you think about the trailer? Should GM do something like that for their twins?