Marchionne Considers Spinning Off Jeep and Ram

Spinning off Jeep / Ram might be the only way for FCA to stay alive and keep the rest of the company going in the short term.

The auto industry is not a short term platform.

27 minutes ago, dfelt said:

Spinning off Jeep / Ram might be the only way for FCA to stay alive and keep the rest of the company going in the short term.

They have zero interest in passenger cars at this point, or in alternative energy/hybrid systems.  Yes, I know the Pacifica has a hybrid, but they follow, they do not lead.

13 minutes ago, A Horse With No Name said:

They have zero interest in passenger cars at this point, or in alternative energy/hybrid systems.  Yes, I know the Pacifica has a hybrid, but they follow, they do not lead.

As I posted in this write up, Jeep has a Plugin Hybrid 3 row SUV they will build for the China Market first. I can see this coming to the US once they are satisfying the gov in China for Plugin Hybrid or EV sales.

43 minutes ago, balthazar said:

The auto industry is not a short term platform.

True, I agree with you but idiot Sergio seems to only be able to look at short term solutions.

Just now, dfelt said:

As I posted in this write up, Jeep has a Plugin Hybrid 3 row SUV they will build for the China Market first. I can see this coming to the US once they are satisfying the gov in China for Plugin Hybrid or EV sales.

 

It is still kind of hard for me to see them as leaders in this field.

18 minutes ago, A Horse With No Name said:

They have zero interest in passenger cars at this point, or in alternative energy/hybrid systems.  Yes, I know the Pacifica has a hybrid, but they follow, they do not lead.

Hybrids are coming to jeeps, including the Wrangler. 

1 minute ago, A Horse With No Name said:

It is still kind of hard for me to see them as leaders in this field.

True, they are and will always be a catch up company. I just think that to survive since anyone with any common business sense would never get in bed with FCA, will end up spinning off groups to survive.

19 minutes ago, A Horse With No Name said:

They have zero interest in passenger cars at this point, or in alternative energy/hybrid systems.  Yes, I know the Pacifica has a hybrid, but they follow, they do not lead.

Hybrids are coming to jeeps, including the Wrangler. 

Also, you notice more and more companies giving SUVs/CUVs their lion's share of attention while their car lines get less and less.  They are companies.  they are in this thing o make profit.  To make profit, you have to make what people are buying, and sadly that is less and less cars and more and more of the SUV/CUV types. 

1 minute ago, dfelt said:

True, they are and will always be a catch up company. I just think that to survive since anyone with any common business sense would never get in bed with FCA, will end up spinning off groups to survive.

I can see the spin off thing for sure.  it may be the only way jeep survives...and that would be bad for Toledo here in Ohio if that plant closed...

Just now, Stew said:

Hybrids are coming to jeeps, including the Wrangler. 

 

Also, you notice more and more companies giving SUVs/CUVs their lion's share of attention while their car lines get less and less.  They are companies.  they are in this thing o make profit.  To make profit, you have to make what people are buying, and sadly that is less and less cars and more and more of the SUV/CUV types. 

True, not faulting them for this, but they are pretty much out of the passenger car amrket unless you want a retro muscle car.

4 minutes ago, Stew said:

Hybrids are coming to jeeps, including the Wrangler. 

Again, they are followers and not leaders...

2 minutes ago, A Horse With No Name said:

I can see the spin off thing for sure.  it may be the only way jeep survives...and that would be bad for Toledo here in Ohio if that plant closed...

True, not faulting them for this, but they are pretty much out of the passenger car amrket unless you want a retro muscle car.

Again, they are followers and not leaders...

Their tech, as in the Pacifica is top notch, which, btw, is the FIRST hybrid minivan.  They are not followers at all, not in their tech.  in introducing vehicles, maybe, bu they are getting there now.   There are worse ideas than spinning off Jeep and Ram, especially if it makes them profit.  Isn't marchionne supposed to be gone in like a year anyway?

Just now, Stew said:

Their tech, as in the Pacifica is top notch, which, btw, is the FIRST hybrid minivan.  They are not followers at all, not in their tech.  in introducing vehicles, maybe, bu they are getting there now.   There are worse ideas than spinning off Jeep and Ram, especially if it makes them profit.  Isn't marchionne supposed to be gone in like a year anyway?

Interesting, did not know he was leaving.

1 minute ago, A Horse With No Name said:

Interesting, did not know he was leaving.

It has been a while since I read that, could have changed by now.

If anyone needed proof of Serg's long-term desire to kill off Chrysler and Dodge, this should be the final piece to that puzzle. 

3 minutes ago, Stew said:

It has been a while since I read that, could have changed by now.

Having someone different at the helm would help thing immeasurably IMHO.

Just now, Drew Dowdell said:

If anyone needed proof of Serg's long-term desire to kill of Chrysler and Dodge, this should be the final piece to that puzzle. 

Not really sure any more evidence is needed...

When FCA bought Chryco. I was happy.

MOPAR gets to live.

When Sergio green lighted the Viper I was extremely happy as I naively thought that Chrysler will get to live without any merger bullshyte like it was under the "Merger of Equals" and I was definitely naive about Chryco. being starved of cash like it was when it was under Bob Nardelli's outfit...

Since then...there is not a day that goes by that I dont anticipate the sad day that will eventually come telling us that Chryco is no longer and that if Fiat is to survive then Chrysler and Dodge need to shutter down. And yes, with this news here....one step closer to that.

Ram has already been separated from Dodge.

Jeep is a brand that is on its own anyway...acquired by Chryco when Chryco bought AMC  which AMC had bought Jeep from Kaiser....

So...Chrysler has literally no cars to sell..other than the 300 which is set to be discontinued.

They have the Pacifica...a minivan....not a CUV

Dodge has no cars to sell either. Just a couple of aging muscle cars...

The CUVs and SUVs are all sold under name brands that Sergio just now mentions will be spun off...

The Giulia platform....Sergio at one time DID say that Chrysler and Dodge WONT be getting it...

I could only view this as sad news for a once proud American car company....

I guess it was either in 2009 or whenever the inevitable will happen. All this Sergio character do was just prolong the agony for Auburn Hills workers and line up his personal pockets further.

False hope this was!!!

Spin off the only profitable parts of the entire company and the only brands actually doing well. WHAT A BIZ WIZ

Too bad Sergio has no guts.  If he wants to kill off Chrysler and/or Dodge, then be quick about it.  If Chrysler can ditch Plymouth in 2000, what is he waiting for? Chrysler and Dodge vehicles NOT named 300/Charger or the minivans (Pacifica included) basically are bottom of the barrel and are undesired by most consumers (unless acquired on the cheap).  While I sympathize with those who will be fired as a result of Auburn Hills eventually disappearing, few auto consumers will actually miss Chrysler or Dodge.

Every once in a while, I still think of Oldsmobile and wonder what could have been (or at least I used to).  GM's survival and currently health trumps that, of course.  Unfortunately, it simply proves that Sergio is a businessman who is tasked with the health of FIAT, not Chrysler.  I bet he never really cared for Chryslers and Dodges as such.

3 hours ago, Drew Dowdell said:

If anyone needed proof of Serg's long-term desire to kill of Chrysler and Dodge, this should be the final piece to that puzzle. 

I agree.  If he sells Jeep off, we don't know if that means to another car company or just to make them independent.  Or as a temporary independent with intent to sell to someone else later.  But I bet there is some way that if he makes them independent, he can re-write dealership franchise agreements, and throw out the Jeep-Ram-Chrysler-Dodge package of dealerships.   The ultimate goal here is to get rid of Chrysler and Dodge, and have Jeep and Ram only left, possibly with Ram and Jeep as separate companies, then he can sell either one to another company.

43 minutes ago, riviera74 said:

Every once in a while, I still think of Oldsmobile and wonder what could have been (or at least I used to).  GM's survival and currently health trumps that, of course.

I still think about Oldsmobile and what could have been. (I think its time for me to let go though)

From Buick's resurrection from the dead a few years back when  it was only Lucerne, Lacrosse and Enclave and Buick quickly returned to relevance somewhat when they added Regal and Verano and Encore  to the missteps that are happening now...

And of course GM's health trumps all that, I still dont see myself driving a Buick. The design language does not speak to me. Its nice....but it aint sporty and elegant like Oldsmobile always was. (Minus the awkward Olds LSS Delta 88s and Achieva of the early 1990s before the Aurora came out)

Chrysler from the 1990s all the way to today's 300 from the Concord, 300M, 300C, early 2000s Sebring coupe and Convertible had a certain desirability to them...

Dodge with their muscle cars and muscular looks on all their vehicles from the Viper to the Challenger to the Charger to the Stealth to Intrepid to the Magnum to their DODGE RAM trucks also had a certain desirability to them.

Much like Pontiac and Oldsmobile....

Chrysler having a slight edge on Oldsmobile and Dodge a slight edge on Pontiac...

I am doing CURRENT what if scenarios with the Chrysler 300 in my mind with a successor to the 300 and ditto for the Charger and Challenger....let is not forget what Ralph Gilles could do with proper money and R&D for a Viper....

It is a shame that it was a short decade ago when the RWD 300 took North America by storm on a then older platform....

2 hours ago, riviera74 said:

Too bad Sergio has no guts.  If he wants to kill off Chrysler and/or Dodge, then be quick about it.  If Chrysler can ditch Plymouth in 2000, what is he waiting for? Chrysler and Dodge vehicles NOT named 300/Charger or the minivans (Pacifica included) basically are bottom of the barrel and are undesired by most consumers (unless acquired on the cheap).  While I sympathize with those who will be fired as a result of Auburn Hills eventually disappearing, few auto consumers will actually miss Chrysler or Dodge.

Every once in a while, I still think of Oldsmobile and wonder what could have been (or at least I used to).  GM's survival and currently health trumps that, of course.  Unfortunately, it simply proves that Sergio is a businessman who is tasked with the health of FIAT, not Chrysler.  I bet he never really cared for Chryslers and Dodges as such.

I still expect Alfa to die again and Fiat to have to pull out as the crap they sell know does not seem to hold an owner past 10K miles before being traded in for something far better either from 1 of the only 2 american auto companies or a German / Asian brand.

Italy sucks at making autos.

1 hour ago, smk4565 said:

I agree.  If he sells Jeep off, we don't know if that means to another car company or just to make them independent.  Or as a temporary independent with intent to sell to someone else later.  But I bet there is some way that if he makes them independent, he can re-write dealership franchise agreements, and throw out the Jeep-Ram-Chrysler-Dodge package of dealerships.   The ultimate goal here is to get rid of Chrysler and Dodge, and have Jeep and Ram only left, possibly with Ram and Jeep as separate companies, then he can sell either one to another company.

Expect Sergio the worm to spin off Jeep and Ram and then sell them off to a Chinese company to make enough money to continue to keep his Italian crap going till he can take his golden parachute and retire. That is how I see it.

If Jeep gets sold to a Chinese company I will be royally PISSED.

Well Sergio's mission is to make money for stock holders, and thus pump up the value of his stock options and then also cash out and retire for sure.   Selling off pieces is a good way to make quick cash and basically play role of corporate raider.

18 minutes ago, ocnblu said:

If Jeep gets sold to a Chinese company I will be royally PISSED.

Sadly, that is what the rumor is.......

This is one of  the brands they want and could afford to get......

17 hours ago, Drew Dowdell said:

If anyone needed proof of Serg's long-term desire to kill off Chrysler and Dodge, this should be the final piece to that puzzle. 

I have little doubt Chrysler will die, but Dodge is integral to being able to Amortize the costs associated with Alfa and a very pricey platform.  Now, if they were spinning everything off, Alfa, Fiat, Maserati, etc too, then you may have a point. 

11 hours ago, daves87rs said:

Sadly, that is what the rumor is.......

This is one of  the brands they want and could afford to get......

How the frig did it go from spinning them off to selling them off?  I hate these wild jumps of assumptions.

10 minutes ago, Stew said:

I have little doubt Chrysler will die, but Dodge is integral to being able to Amortize the costs associated with Alfa and a very pricey platform.  Now, if they were spinning everything off, Alfa, Fiat, Maserati, etc too, then you may have a point. 

How the frig did it go from spinning them off to selling them off?  I hate these wild jumps of assumptions.

Serg doesn't value any of the American brands beyond what money he can suck out of them to revive his failing Fiat and attempt to rebirth Alfa.  He is raiding the American companies to pay for his pet projects.

Just now, Drew Dowdell said:

Serg doesn't value any of the American brands beyond what money he can suck out of them to revive his failing Fiat and attempt to rebirth Alfa.  He is raiding the American companies to pay for his pet projects.

He isn't going to sell off one of the only brands bringing in money and what I said is true.  Dodge is needed for Alfa.  Chrysler, well, IMHO, they have been dead for a while, as much as Pontiac, Oldsmobile, Hummer, and Mercury were before they got he chop. 

26 minutes ago, Stew said:

He isn't going to sell off one of the only brands bringing in money and what I said is true.  Dodge is needed for Alfa.  Chrysler, well, IMHO, they have been dead for a while, as much as Pontiac, Oldsmobile, Hummer, and Mercury were before they got he chop. 

Why would Dodge be needed for Alfa?  Alfa can share platforms with Maserati and a growing Fiat and possibly a rebirthed Lancia. 

Fiat can replace Dodge in the "family car" segment

Lancia can replace Chrysler in the "premium family car (aka Buick) segment".  Lancia Pacifica anyone?

Alfa is to be the BMW/Benz/Cadillac fighter.

Jeep and Ram are spun off to pay for all of this.

Serg has no love for the American brands.... his vision is to restore the greatness(??) of the Italian Automotive industry. 

50 minutes ago, Drew Dowdell said:

Why would Dodge be needed for Alfa?  Alfa can share platforms with Maserati and a growing Fiat and possibly a rebirthed Lancia. 

Fiat can replace Dodge in the "family car" segment

Lancia can replace Chrysler in the "premium family car (aka Buick) segment".  Lancia Pacifica anyone?

Alfa is to be the BMW/Benz/Cadillac fighter.

Jeep and Ram are spun off to pay for all of this.

Serg has no love for the American brands.... his vision is to restore the greatness(??) of the Italian Automotive industry. 

The big issue that he has is that those brands ahve zero equity, or perhaps negative equity, here in America.  Lincoln can regain it's market equity because it is attached to Ford and has an 80 year plus history of selling the Lincoln name here....the Italian brands have none of that.

2 minutes ago, A Horse With No Name said:

The big issue that he has is that those brands ahve zero equity, or perhaps negative equity, here in America.  Lincoln can regain it's market equity because it is attached to Ford and has an 80 year plus history of selling the Lincoln name here....the Italian brands have none of that.

You and I know that.... but Serg thinks he can rebuild the Italian auto industry and he is raiding the American one to do it. 

39 minutes ago, Drew Dowdell said:

You and I know that.... but Serg thinks he can rebuild the Italian auto industry and he is raiding the American one to do it. 

Very true and in the process Idiot Serg will build resentment that will hurt his so called Italian Auto rebirth.

3 minutes ago, dfelt said:

Very true and in the process Idiot Serg will build resentment that will hurt his so called Italian Auto rebirth.

One of the best things one can do is take hands totally off and watch something fail...difficult to do but...letting people fail for themselves is often productive.  And we will have no shortage of failure.

On 4/28/2017 at 8:56 AM, Stew said:

I have little doubt Chrysler will die, but Dodge is integral to being able to Amortize the costs associated with Alfa and a very pricey platform.  Now, if they were spinning everything off, Alfa, Fiat, Maserati, etc too, then you may have a point. 

How the frig did it go from spinning them off to selling them off?  I hate these wild jumps of assumptions.

Sorry...didn' t mean to make it sound that bad.....

But agreeing with along the lines of what Drew said- FCA is not is a position to make deals right now...these interested companies don't want to have a piece of the action, they want the whole thing. As a Chinese company, you don't want strings attached.......

well, actually if Chrysler and Dodge go to pasture, I don't see Muhrica latching any more to Fiat, and in fact, GM would probably be the biggest beneficiary.  Which isn't saying a lot, if Ram and Jeep are still out there.