Sergio Marchionne: You Get a Crossover and You Get A Crossover

To boost sales every car should come with a free Sweater from Sergio’s Sweater Shack, offering the finest Italian made sweaters that are made in Italy.

9 minutes ago, smk4565 said:

To boost sales every car should come with a free Sweater from Sergio’s Sweater Shack, offering the finest Italian made sweaters that are made in Italy.

But if he is buying them online, then that means ultra Cheap, so probably China if not Malaysia made! Cheap shit, not Italian Shit.

In regards to the Story, Midsize Pickup they cannot find an economical way? BS, they are building a Jeep version, they sure as hell could rebadge it for RAM.  Another Idiotic Sergio mismanagement.

Ferrari has already lost the supercar race, Tesla beat ya too it with Roadster 2.0

FCA - Lead by the Ultimate Lemming Moron around!

Sad, too bad, next year cannot come soon enough for his retirement! 

I would skip a midsize pick up and do a small pickup of which there are none on market.  And couldn’t the Promaster city or some Fiat platform work for a pick up?  Or use the Pacifica platform for a pick up like Honda does with Ridgeline.

1 hour ago, William Maley said:

"I have seen the car when I was in Europe. It’s not finished. It’s going to be Ferrari. It will drive like a Ferrari or I’ll be taken to the shed. But it looks good,” said Marchionne.

I feel like it is impossible for any SUV to drive like a REAL FERRARI. 

1 hour ago, William Maley said:

FCA hasn't "found an economic way to get this done” when asked if there was the chance of a midsize Ram pickup.

Different body panels on the Wrangler pickup..? 

45 minutes ago, smk4565 said:

I would skip a midsize pick up and do a small pickup of which there are none on market.  And couldn’t the Promaster city or some Fiat platform work for a pick up?  

I think they'd be best lined up to do that for that reason. They already have a mid size in their portfolio(on its way) so to butcher up a little van shouldn't be too difficult. 

I don't really think there is space for even 2 tiny trucks though. If anybody comes out with one, I can't see enough market left for a second one. 

4 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

 

Different body panels on the Wrangler pickup..? 

 

Well, they would need to tool up a new cab, interior, bed, trim, etc..and being a Ram they could sell it cheaper than the Wrangler, wouldn't need the removable roof, etc.   Maybe they worry a Ram midsize pickup would cannibalize sales from the Wrangler pickup.

38 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

 

I don't really think there is space for even 2 tiny trucks though. If anybody comes out with one, I can't see enough market left for a second one. 

I don't know if it would be profitable to federalize the Ram 700--a mini-pickup based on an old Fiat car--that they have in Mexico now.saw a few in Arizona.    1500lb payload capacity.  It would be a unique entry in the market.

https://jalopnik.com/the-tiny-ram-700-pickup-truck-can-carry-more-than-half-1652291667

http://www.ram.com.mx/700/2017/?gclid=CjwKCAiAy4bTBRAvEiwAFtatHMTmrqNSK8P9HN9gDetiL46aSXxyL8B5JGD9vcelg1X1D4TpuZNiuBoCjy4QAvD_BwE

1 hour ago, smk4565 said:

I would skip a midsize pick up and do a small pickup of which there are none on market.  And couldn’t the Promaster city or some Fiat platform work for a pick up?  Or use the Pacifica platform for a pick up like Honda does with Ridgeline.

I like the idea of the mini promaster being used as a FWD mini pickup like they have in Europe. Inner city folks I think would buy it.

The Fiat Doblo Work Up pickup is pretty badass...front like the Pro Master City? 

cant they take the Jeep truck platform and bring back a Dakota?

oops...read proto, read before posting....thats been covered

54 minutes ago, Cubical-aka-Moltar said:

I don't know if it would be profitable to federalize the Ram 700--a mini-pickup based on an old Fiat car--that they have in Mexico now.saw a few in Arizona.    1500lb payload capacity.  It would be a unique entry in the market.

https://jalopnik.com/the-tiny-ram-700-pickup-truck-can-carry-more-than-half-1652291667

http://www.ram.com.mx/700/2017/?gclid=CjwKCAiAy4bTBRAvEiwAFtatHMTmrqNSK8P9HN9gDetiL46aSXxyL8B5JGD9vcelg1X1D4TpuZNiuBoCjy4QAvD_BwE

reminds me of the Tornado Chevy has down south of the border also

3 hours ago, Cubical-aka-Moltar said:

1500lb payload capacity. 

That's full on mid-size territory.

Canyon: 1500-1620lbs

Colorado: 1492-1574lbs

Tacoma: 1100-1620lbs

Ridgeline: 1447-1584lbs

Frontier:  880-1500lbs

I thought Fiat had a pickup, good work on uncovering it.  The Fiat Fullback:

So they already make one, I don't see how Sergio can claim they can't find resources to do it.  

The Fullback is a rebadge of a Mitsubishi, which could work as a Ram, since in the 80s a Mitsubishi pickup was badged as the Ram 50...

1 minute ago, Cubical-aka-Moltar said:

The Fullback is a rebadge of a Mitsubishi, which would make since as a Ram, since a long time ago a Mitsubishi pickup was badged as the Ram 50...

One big circle if they did that again.  

2 minutes ago, dfelt said:

One big circle if they did that again.  

Ya.  And maybe they can partner with Mistu to get a compact and midsize sedan to replace the Dart and 200...

3 hours ago, Cubical-aka-Moltar said:

The Fullback is a rebadge of a Mitsubishi, which could work as a Ram, since in the 80s a Mitsubishi pickup was badged as the Ram 50...

Except that didn't work then, when pickups were far far far simpler.

7 hours ago, balthazar said:

Except that didn't work then, when pickups were far far far simpler.

Yes, but it is a path to a compact pickup they could explore.

On 1/19/2018 at 1:05 PM, Cubical-aka-Moltar said:

I don't know if it would be profitable to federalize the Ram 700--a mini-pickup based on an old Fiat car--that they have in Mexico now.saw a few in Arizona.    1500lb payload capacity.  It would be a unique entry in the market.

https://jalopnik.com/the-tiny-ram-700-pickup-truck-can-carry-more-than-half-1652291667

http://www.ram.com.mx/700/2017/?gclid=CjwKCAiAy4bTBRAvEiwAFtatHMTmrqNSK8P9HN9gDetiL46aSXxyL8B5JGD9vcelg1X1D4TpuZNiuBoCjy4QAvD_BwE

Priced right (below all the other mid size trucks), I could see that becoming a hit here. Young and college kids would eat this up, like in the days of the ranger and s10. The key here is going to be price.....

'Becoming a hit'? It's the Subaru Baja all over again : dreadfully over wrought and covered in blistered cladding, with no actual usable cargo space. Baja lasted barely 4 years- this is the same exact formula. 

I am on board with a true mini pickup returning to the USA.  A FWD/AWD based one might be the only way to go.  A preponderance of cladding is not cool though, currently.

I read up a bit on the Ram 700...built in Brazil from a Fiat Strada...it's pretty old and dated, the interior is an early 2000s gray plastic hell.   Available in regular cab and a 3dr club cab.  It's probably too dated for the US, but something new like this perhaps could work for FCA..

https://www.allpar.com/trucks/ram/ram-700.html

On 1/20/2018 at 10:28 PM, daves87rs said:

The key here is going to be price.....

Very much so! I think that's why small trucks went away in the first place. They were just too close to half tons while being so much smaller it was just a no-brainer to get the bigger truck for not much more money. 

Looking at Silverado and Colorado pricing, Outside of base 2WD and work truck trims, they're roughly 8k apart when both are 4WD, extended cab(double cab but not crew cab for the Silverado), and the lowest trim that isn't "work truck" and that you'll see on lots. Both in LT trim with no added options. 

I'd think for something substantially smaller than a Colorado or Tacoma you'd need another 5k difference for a mini truck again. At least in my opinion. 

On 1/20/2018 at 11:41 PM, balthazar said:

'Becoming a hit'? It's the Subaru Baja all over again : dreadfully over wrought and covered in blistered cladding, with no actual usable cargo space. Baja lasted barely 4 years- this is the same exact formula. 

I agree. Something smaller would need to be a real truck still otherwise they'd fall into the same spot as the Baja. 

44 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

I agree. Something smaller would need to be a real truck still otherwise they'd fall into the same spot as the Baja. 

I also think we need to stop thinking a truck has to have everything your SUV / Car has. A mini pickup truck that can hold 3 people if in bench or two people with buckets can work for an alternative auto that can haul.

The death of the Mini was also due to someone wanting a SUV/CUV 4 door people hauler with a bed that can handle a 1000 lb payload.

Still think a basic Kingcab mini pickup would work for many people.

And I think we've come full circle on why there aren't mini trucks. A small CUV can already do what the tiny truck could do. 

A 1.5T Escape can tow 2000lbs.

A 2.0T Escape can tow 3500lbs.

Most of the competition is in the same range. I think the Cherokee stands out with a 4000lb capability. 

Unless you're using it for dirt or mulch or something a CUV has about as much open hatch space with the seats down as you would in a truck that small.

56 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

Unless you're using it for dirt or mulch .

That hits the nail on the head, inner city people wanting to get stuff like that for their tiny yard.

Otherwise I agree, that many of the compact hatches / CUVs can cover what they want.

37 minutes ago, dfelt said:

That hits the nail on the head, inner city people wanting to get stuff like that for their tiny yard.

Otherwise I agree, that many of the compact hatches / CUVs can cover what they want.

How tiny is that market though? That somebody inner city is buying dirt/gravel/sand by the truck load and not just individual bags that would utilize a tiny truck over a CUV more often? We have shrunk the market down to a niche of a niche of a niche and that's why they aren't around. They're too specific and likely not cost effective. They'd have to be significantly cheaper than a comparable CUV and I just don't know if that's feasible. 

A CUV is not a pickup truck by a long shot.  Tall or long objects won't fit in a CUV.  A pickup truck with 6' bed can handle 8' or 10' lumber.  It can handle a refrigerator or a warsh machine, etc. etc. etc.

Yes, for some things you just need a truck or van.  For moving boxes from my garage to my storage unit, I rented a van for a few hours from UHaul--do it in one trip rather than multiple trips with my Jeep.   For hauling tools, soil, trees, etc for yard work, my landscaper and my yard guy have pickups w/ trailers.  

Different tools for different tasks. 

15 hours ago, ocnblu said:

A CUV is not a pickup truck by a long shot.  Tall or long objects won't fit in a CUV.  A pickup truck with 6' bed can handle 8' or 10' lumber.  It can handle a refrigerator or a warsh machine, etc. etc. etc.

We're talking TINY trucks. Old Ranger and S10 size. MOST of the thing can fit in the hatch area of an SUV. I'd bet it's even difficult to fit a refrigerator or washing machine between the wheels of one of those trucks anyway. 

If CUVs would go back to the rear glass opening up the problem would be solved. My dad used his Envoy to haul lumber because the rear glass would open up. 

But the need for such a small truck, when a mid-size is available for those who genuinely plan to use it as a truck for above things, is so damn small it likely isn't worth building. 

And you can still attach a trailer to a CUV and you're not hauling 2000lbs of lumber. 

I think a lot of sales of the old Ranger was not because it was a small truck, but because it was so cheap compared to anything else. 

13 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

We're talking TINY trucks. Old Ranger and S10 size.  I'd bet it's even difficult to fit a refrigerator or washing machine between the wheels of one of those trucks anyway. 

Actually, I had hauled refrigs, washer and dryers and ranges in my Chevy Luv Truck when I had it. Plenty of room for sheetrock or plywood though it sat on top of the wheel wells.  Better to have mini trucks for small jobs than to do stupid stuff like I see all the time with cars.

Still think there is a market for mini trucks especially in the city. 

If we did not have all the stupid safety stuff, I am sure they could be built cheap like they were. 

My 1976 Chevy Luv Series 5 truck was bought new by my dad for $1567 dollars. I got it when I turned 16, restored it like new and then when I went to college in Japan, sold it for $3000 in 1987. I really wish I still had it, talk about an awesome roomy truck that just lasted.

Course I could see a modern mini like the Montana that Chevy builds in South America here too.

Great Pics and info here

Again, nothing a trailer couldn't fix for the >1% of time you need stuff that doesn't fit in a hatch. 

"... Now, before you think this is a matchbox truck, get this: the truck is capable of hauling up to 1,671 lbs. in its bed. That’s about 144 lbs. less than a regular cab Chevrolet Silverado equipped with the 4.8-liter Vortec V8.

The Montana has a base price of $18,720 and can get to as high as $25,770 for a fully loaded top-of-the-line edition. If this pickup peaks your interest, you might want to heed the advice given by Jamie Ardilla, President of GM South America, back in July: “The Montana is also exported to Mexico, and the new version will be exported to Argentina and South Africa. If you are interested in the U.S. market, by all means place your order.”

Read more: http://gmauthority.com/blog/2010/10/chevrolet-montana-debuts-in-south-america/#ixzz551U100cB"

Chevy Colorado starts at $20,200. 

19 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

"... Now, before you think this is a matchbox truck, get this: the truck is capable of hauling up to 1,671 lbs. in its bed. That’s about 144 lbs. less than a regular cab Chevrolet Silverado equipped with the 4.8-liter Vortec V8.

The Montana has a base price of $18,720 and can get to as high as $25,770 for a fully loaded top-of-the-line edition. If this pickup peaks your interest, you might want to heed the advice given by Jamie Ardilla, President of GM South America, back in July: “The Montana is also exported to Mexico, and the new version will be exported to Argentina and South Africa. If you are interested in the U.S. market, by all means place your order.”

Read more: http://gmauthority.com/blog/2010/10/chevrolet-montana-debuts-in-south-america/#ixzz551U100cB"

Chevy Colorado starts at $20,200. 

Great info, nice job. I get the point of cost, but size is the issue that I think a Mini Pickup does over mid or full size for inner city neighborhood ownership where parking is a premium. I just think a Mini size has it's place.

28 minutes ago, dfelt said:

Great info, nice job. I get the point of cost, but size is the issue that I think a Mini Pickup does over mid or full size for inner city neighborhood ownership where parking is a premium. I just think a Mini size has it's place.

I agree but I just don't see it financially making sense. I think maybe a real single cab short bed configuration of the mid sizers might be a better solution for the manufacturers. It will keep it small, capable, and they won't be trying to add a whole new vehicle for certifications and shipping and all that jazz of something completely different which may make it financially viable. 

9 hours ago, Cubical-aka-Moltar said:

I think a lot of sales of the old Ranger was not because it was a small truck, but because it was so cheap compared to anything else. 

That's what Ford thought when they publicly tried to steer Ranger customers toward the Fiesta.  Dismal failure in judgment.

12 hours ago, ocnblu said:

That's what Ford thought when they publicly tried to steer Ranger customers toward the Fiesta.  Dismal failure in judgment.

More true words were never spoken.

Just my opinion, but that Montana is hideous.

17 hours ago, ocnblu said:

That's what Ford thought when they publicly tried to steer Ranger customers toward the Fiesta.  Dismal failure in judgment.

lol Because that makes sense.. 

34 minutes ago, balthazar said:

Just my opinion, but that Montana is hideous.

Yup, I agree it is not the prettiest truck out there, but the aerodynamics are there for an EV powertrain or a very efficient small engine as an inner city truck.

38 minutes ago, balthazar said:

Just my opinion, but that Montana is hideous.

YES. 

18 hours ago, dfelt said:

Yup, I agree it is not the prettiest truck out there, but the aerodynamics are there for an EV powertrain or a very efficient small engine as an inner city truck.

0-60 is 12 seconds, the Brazilian version has 97 HP. I'm not really sure it can get up to speeds that .cd shows any benefits.
But that's besides the point- it can look 50 different ways and still generate the same .cd.

1 hour ago, balthazar said:

0-60 is 12 seconds, the Brazilian version has 97 HP. I'm not really sure it can get up to speeds that .cd shows any benefits.
But that's besides the point- it can look 50 different ways and still generate the same .cd.

When it came out it was priced(with inflation) above today's Colorado's base price.. There's no market for something like that.