Spying: 2020 Cadillac CT5 Makes Its Spy Photo Debut

I know the stories say the hood scoop will not be there, but I can see it on a V edition of the Car.

Yes it has the over all body of the Escala car and I will say for a 4 door coupe sedan it is one of the better executed if they hold close to the concept. 

Yet with that, being said and as we have discussed how homogenized the car segment has become, I was hoping for something more.

I wonder how close to the interior it will stay?

My question is what do they do different this time?  The ATS and CTS were sales flops, they better rethink their attack this time around unless the strategy is to be a price leader and sell these for $35k which I doubt it is.  That being said I think Cadillac or GM for that matter is not capable of making a competitive sedan.

45 minutes ago, smk4565 said:

...I think Cadillac or GM for that matter is not capable of making a competitive sedan.

Boom.

3 hours ago, smk4565 said:

My question is what do they do different this time?  The ATS and CTS were sales flops, they better rethink their attack this time around unless the strategy is to be a price leader and sell these for $35k which I doubt it is.  That being said I think Cadillac or GM for that matter is not capable of making a competitive sedan.

So MB and BMW are the only real choices then?  Not everyone is a Euro badge snob.

2 hours ago, balthazar said:

Boom.

A car that is priced with a 5-series and E-class, but gets outsold 4 to 1 by them in the USA.   In China, it's worse, the E-class outsells the CT6 10 to 1.   And Cadillac originally wanted to go against the 7-series and S-class but forgot 200 hp and a list of luxury features along the way and had to retreat.  

Cadillac is a brand without mojo, and I don't know what the solution is, they tried mid-size car for small size price, tried selling the CTS for $10k less than a E-class or 5-series, tried 640 hp, they tried full size car at mid-size prices, they have tried 2 different naming schemes in 10 years, and endless marketing campaigns and none of it has worked.  The only thing they haven't tried yet is the 10 year/100k mile warranty.  

So I don't know what the answer is for Cadillac, but I am curious to see what they do with CT5, although my guess is more of the same formula of the past 6 years.

Oh yeah, I forgot : SALES is the Only True Metric.
Vat a dummkopf I ist.

Well, sales equal revenue, and ultimately lead to profits, which is the name of the game.  

But the German sedans, mid-size or full size, have more power, more tech, better build quality, better interior materials, better performance than the CT6.  Even on interior sound, the E43 was the quietest car Car and Driver tested in 2017.  

I think what Cadillac should do on the CT5 is develop some hybrid powertrains, they have to have cutting edge technology to have any chance.

Germans triplets (that's THREE brands) don't unilaterally exceed Cadillac in every metric. In fact, they must exceed each other in a multitude of ways & criteria- doesn't mean any one brands' Model X 'is the best'. Of course- the triplets aren't dead even model for model with EACH OTHER, right? So does that leave room for individual preference anywhere??

I've read that 'Buick loses money', 'Chevrolet makes no money'... which if true would only leave GMC & Cadillac to have generated the $10 billion profit last year. Or are you trying to say Cadillac also made no profit? Is GMC carrying the whole Company?

We will likely NEVER know exactly how Cadillac's book fall, but there's NO QUESTION the brand is highly profitable WITHOUT selling 2 millions units world-wide. The Divisions' goal is 500K, not 2000K+. And that's COMPLETELY FINE, despite whatever standard you want to hold a brand that has utterly no interest to you, to.

So you can put to rest the whole tired schtick 'mega-millions sales are necessary to make any profit' - it's obviously not remotely legitimate.

• Ferrari sells about 8K cars/yr. Reportedly the brand makes $90K profit per vehicle based on the balance sheet, tho fully 30% of the brand's business is merchandise.

• Porsche reportedly makes $17K profit per vehicle on 238K. I wonder if the car third of the business is profitable by now- I believe the SUVs are carrying the cars from what I read some years ago.

• Cadillac sold 356K last year at an ATP of $58K. Just going by straight numbers --which is probably low due to China's huge prices-- that's $20 billion in revenue. I wouldn't worry that Cadillac isn't making money due to sale levels.

True on Ferrari, a lot of their profit is merchandise and licensing, they sell a lot of shirts and hats to people that cheer for the perennial 2nd place F1 team they have.   Porsche and Bentley are big money makers for Audi obviously.

Cadillac is probably making about $4,000 per car, the Escalade bank rolls it, but they have to put heavy incentives on those sedans and they don't sell the Escalade in China either.  Even if Cadillac makes $5,000 per car like BMW and Mercedes do, the problem is BMW sold 2.1 million cars in 2017 and Mercedes sold 2.29 million.   That is a whole lot more profit at BMW and Mercedes.

And Chevy for sure turns a profit, they probably make $500 per car on stuff like the Cruze and Malibu, but all crossovers make money and pick up trucks make even more.

3 hours ago, riviera74 said:

So MB and BMW are the only real choices then?  Not everyone is a Euro badge snob.

If you want a sedan, it is getting more and more that way.  Audi still sells a lot of sedans worldwide, and has a big following.  Lexus does well with the IS and ES, they don't do well with the GS and LS.  Infiniti has 1 car that sells in the Q50, although it does pretty well.   

Looking at the  number of crossovers that sell in the $40-60k range whether they be luxury brands or a loaded up Honda Pilot, there are people spending that kind of money on cars, but not a lot of compelling sedans to steal buyers back.  You have dead weight like the Acura RLX, Jag XF, Continental, the trio of sedans Cadillac wants to kill off, the Infiniti M56/Q70 that has been on the market 10 years, etc.  There is opportunity here for Cadillac to build a winner and take some slice of the $40-60k segment, but they better do better than they did in previous efforts.

And the problem I see is most automakers don't even care about sedans anymore, they just throw something out there for people that want a sedan and figure they can just push them with incentives if they have to.