2016 CES: Chevrolet Bolt, Now in Production Form!

Not bad.

 

The lower bumper is a little over complicated given the rest of the car, but new cars these days always have some quirks.

 

Now here's the deal.

 

How will this be received?

 

I think people looking to buy a Volt will have an even harder decision to make in the coming year. 

 

However, I will put out there a valid demerit of a quirk of the interior for the same reason people don't like the Toyota Prius's interior. The white porcelain type plastic trim is too unconventional, being space-agey for the sake of being space-agey. At least they use less of it.

 

The car seems well thought out. Excellent packaging.

 

But this reveal is but a lip-service.

 

We won't see driven reviews for the press for a while.

 

Here's a little nibble I gleaned from the press photos. Look closely and you'll see in the background what must be a hell of a villa on an estate.

 

Clearly the target buyer can afford any electric vehicle there exists out there.

"Gamification" is way too homo.  Bolt looks good.  I agree with Rico on the white interior trim thing.  I wonder if it will be available at any time in the dim, distant future in a color other than silver.  This is begging for a bench seat in front, since it appears there is no mechanical interface with the vehicle located in the console.  Upholstery sew pattern screams it.

This rocks.  And its GM engineering.  Perfect to bring EV back to GM.  Leaf buyers will say this is too spendy but you get what you pay for.  This should sell and it might actually raise Leaf sales too.

 

No BLUBOLT for ocnblu?

 

I'd take one of these in a HEARTBEAT

 

http://www.motortrend.com/news/2017-chevrolet-bolt-ev-first-drive-review/

 

Motor Trend prototype drive ^^^^

 I wonder if it will be available at any time in the dim, distant future in a color other than silver.

 

If it comes in the orange that the concept was wearing, I'll be all over it.

Its a cute little car.

 

Hence why its not my cup of tea.

Its cute

Its little.

Not my style.

 

The Volt is where I am.

In Quebec, this will sell very well. I predict better sales than Volt. Better than any other EV also.

I like the premise, especially if it is $30,000 before tax credits.  The exterior looks funky, but all these electric cars do for some reason.  The interior looks bad, looks cheap.  Which is why I think it needs to be $30k before the credits and not $40k minus tax credits to be around $30k.  For a $40k sticker you can get a BMW i3, which at least says BMW on it.

I like the premise, especially if it is $30,000 before tax credits.  The exterior looks funky, but all these electric cars do for some reason.  The interior looks bad, looks cheap.  Which is why I think it needs to be $30k before the credits and not $40k minus tax credits to be around $30k.  For a $40k sticker you can get a BMW i3, which at least says BMW on it.

So what? That i3 starts at $42K with only 81 miles of range (119 less than the Bolt) and while the interior uses higher quality materials (it better for $10K more and only an 81 mile range), the overall design is a mess. Of course, it matches that horrible exterior though. The Bolt is priced just fien for what it is and what it does BETTER than that overpriced BMW Aztek Electric edition.

We should see some reviews on this soon as they had it at CES for driving by the masses. Wife loves the car and the interior is way better than the Mess BMW i3 as is the exterior.

 

FYI, If the BMW i3 is such an awesome auto then why has everyone I know including my neighbor who is a BMW snob unload the leased auto less than a year afterwards and go back to a gas powered one. I see so many used now available. This also shows me that people are not afraid to change from petro to electric if it gives them their freedom and no range anxiety.

 

My gut tells me that the weird interior on the i3 and the piss poor range is causing people to dump them fast. My neighbor who drives 50 miles round trip to work each day said it would have been fine but if he worked closer to home and could still run errands and get what he wanted done during the day but the auto delivers less mpc or miles per charge than advertised and the interior was not at all user friendly.

 

End result, if the auto truly gave a 200 mile range like a bolt he would have kept it but he needed the ability to drive more than the auto gives. Same issue with the Nissan Leaf and 500EV or spark EV. These 80 mile range auto's do not fit into today's society unless you only drive a very short distance or live in the city. Suburban drivers need a much bigger range.

 

Bolt I suspect will easily sell everyone they build in 2017.

There was some talk of this and CES and the gameification angle on a daily tech news podcast I listen to. The hosts consistently called it the 'Volt'.

Edited January 7, 2016 by Cubical-aka-Moltar

There was some talk of this and CES and the gameification angle on a daily tech news podcast I listen to. The hosts consistently called it the 'Volt'.

 

I can't blame then since V and B sound similar.

 

I like the premise, especially if it is $30,000 before tax credits.  The exterior looks funky, but all these electric cars do for some reason.  The interior looks bad, looks cheap.  Which is why I think it needs to be $30k before the credits and not $40k minus tax credits to be around $30k.  For a $40k sticker you can get a BMW i3, which at least says BMW on it.

 

Well it looks like the Bolt will cost $37,500 without any tax credits. The magical $30,000 is when you add in the $7,500 tax credit. From Chevrolet's site:

Looks so much better than that froggish Nissan Leaf. Great job GM... and like the 2016 Volt owners getting minimum 15% more in EV driving (from my readings)... I could easily see reports of this coming in at 230... 

 

 

The Revolution Will B Televised!!! 

So Chevy has updated their BOLT web site and it now seems that in average temp climates we should expect well over 200 MPC or Mile Per Charge.

 

With a 9hr charge time to full battery and the stated 25 miles per hr charged, that equals 225 miles on a battery pack. 80% charged if you use a rapid DC Fast charger in less than an hr.

 

Be interesting to see what the EPA ends up rating this at.

 

$37,500 before the incentives is a bit steep.  You could get a Leaf or Focus electric for less money, although you won't have as much range.  If you want to sell electric cars, they have to be price comparable to gas powered car.  There are a lot of good cars for mid $30s money.  But perhaps these manufacturers don't really want to sell electric cars.

It's priced correctly, and I think it will make a great example of a product done right.

 

But I think it's going to be so compelling that it'll take sales from the Volt as well. Well I guess they share common enough architectures, and anyhoo a sale to GM is lost on anyone else.

 

Well, another 12 months since it goes on sale. Plenty of time for other electric car debuts.

 

But another generation of this thing and the Volt will be obsolete. 

$37,500 before the incentives is a bit steep.  You could get a Leaf or Focus electric for less money, although you won't have as much range.  If you want to sell electric cars, they have to be price comparable to gas powered car.  There are a lot of good cars for mid $30s money.  But perhaps these manufacturers don't really want to sell electric cars.

Again there is nothing wrong with the price and if you are griping about its price then you should gripe even more at the pricier, with far less range, i3.

Let's see. Has the same range as $100K Tesla yet is only $37k. Yeah, real overpriced there.

But remember, it's the lease deals that true scrooge's wait for.

 

I can only imagine how a lease for a car like this might just pay for itself if driven an X number of miles per month.

 

But it'll involve a lot of steadfast planning and definitely the investment with a home charging station up front.

 

$37,500 before the incentives is a bit steep.  You could get a Leaf or Focus electric for less money, although you won't have as much range.  If you want to sell electric cars, they have to be price comparable to gas powered car.  There are a lot of good cars for mid $30s money.  But perhaps these manufacturers don't really want to sell electric cars.

Again there is nothing wrong with the price and if you are griping about its price then you should gripe even more at the pricier, with far less range, i3.

Let's see. Has the same range as $100K Tesla yet is only $37k. Yeah, real overpriced there.

 

Comparing this to an i3 is also like comparing a Sonic to a 3-series.  One is a BMW, one is a Chevy.  

 

The Tesla has slightly better range, but the Model S is also faster than a Corvette Z06.  I don't believe the Bolt will do 0-60 in 2.8 seconds.  The Bolt is similar in interior, size, performance, etc to a Sonic, but it is double the price.  That is a big premium for electric.

 

This is another problem with electric cars in general.  You pay more for range.  That is like paying an extra $5,000 for a Chevy Cruze with a 23 gallon tank vs the standard car's 14 gallon tank so you get more range.  No other car is sold on the basis of range.  And that isn't just an attack on the Bolt it is on all electric cars.

$37,500 before the incentives is a bit steep. You could get a Leaf or Focus electric for less money, although you won't have as much range. If you want to sell electric cars, they have to be price comparable to gas powered car. There are a lot of good cars for mid $30s money. But perhaps these manufacturers don't really want to sell electric cars.

Again there is nothing wrong with the price and if you are griping about its price then you should gripe even more at the pricier, with far less range, i3.

Let's see. Has the same range as $100K Tesla yet is only $37k. Yeah, real overpriced there.

Comparing this to an i3 is also like comparing a Sonic to a 3-series. One is a BMW, one is a Chevy.

The Tesla has slightly better range, but the Model S is also faster than a Corvette Z06. I don't believe the Bolt will do 0-60 in 2.8 seconds. The Bolt is similar in interior, size, performance, etc to a Sonic, but it is double the price. That is a big premium for electric.

This is another problem with electric cars in general. You pay more for range. That is like paying an extra $5,000 for a Chevy Cruze with a 23 gallon tank vs the standard car's 14 gallon tank so you get more range. No other car is sold on the basis of range. And that isn't just an attack on the Bolt it is on all electric cars.

Only in your head. Like I said yesterday, the ONLY thing better on the i3 is the material quality of the interior. Everything else, it trails in, from the ugly outside to the pitiful range. Now using your logic about gussied up Chevys, why would anyone pay more than $40K outside of being able to say they have an ugly electric Beemer? After all, it is offering the criticism towards all electric cars. Edited January 7, 2016 by surreal1272

Btw SMK, my mentioning the Tesla was to point out the similar range for far less money. In no way am I trying to compare it in any other way. Point is that there is value in it whether you want to accept it or not. Remember, this is still fairly new tech so I find your "criticisms" a bit short sighted here.

One day the electric car will replace the gasoline powered car.  But that day isn't today, or any day in 2017.

 

I feel like this is an ELR repeat.  If they priced it at $30k before the tax credits it would be a winner, but at $37,500 they over shot the market.  Just like if the ELR was $55k and not $75k it might have sold.  

One day the electric car will replace the gasoline powered car.  But that day isn't today, or any day in 2017.

 

I feel like this is an ELR repeat.  If they priced it at $30k before the tax credits it would be a winner, but at $37,500 they over shot the market.  Just like if the ELR was $55k and not $75k it might have sold.  

 

-1, I totally disagree with you. This is priced at the sweet spot and beats Tesla model 3 vaporwear. It is superior in every way over the BMW i3. This will force all the others to lower their prices even. The car is what most people want, Good for you, everyone around you and the planet.

One day the electric car will replace the gasoline powered car.  But that day isn't today, or any day in 2017.

 

I feel like this is an ELR repeat.  If they priced it at $30k before the tax credits it would be a winner, but at $37,500 they over shot the market.  Just like if the ELR was $55k and not $75k it might have sold.  

It's called investing in the future. Mercedes should try it sometime. Of course, the problem with the tech is that you don't see Mercedes offering and electric car. Then, I'm sure you would be offering a different opinion than "But that day ins't today, or any day in 2017".

 

 

As far as the ELR remake goes, that's not even close to an apples to apples comparison.

One day the electric car will replace the gasoline powered car.  But that day isn't today, or any day in 2017.

 

I feel like this is an ELR repeat.  If they priced it at $30k before the tax credits it would be a winner, but at $37,500 they over shot the market.  Just like if the ELR was $55k and not $75k it might have sold.

It's called investing in the future. Mercedes should try it sometime. Of course, the problem with the tech is that you don't see Mercedes offering and electric car. Then, I'm sure you would be offering a different opinion than "But that day ins't today, or any day in 2017".

 

 

As far as the ELR remake goes, that's not even close to an apples to apples comparison.

That should read "remark" not remake. Thanks again autocorrect.

NIssan called and wants the Murano's (and Maxima's) C-Pillar back.

Datsun is officially old news, brah

Mercedes makes an electric car, it has been on sale in the USA for over a year, is $42,000 before tax credits and no one buys it. But by offering it they comply with California's laws and likely get some carb credits.

Mercedes also made an electric SLS with 737 horsepower a few years ago, but only sold it in Europe and it was crazy expensive, they didn't produce many of them.

Mercedes makes an electric car, it has been on sale in the USA for over a year, is $42,000 before tax credits and no one buys it. But by offering it they comply with California's laws and likely get some carb credits.

Mercedes also made an electric SLS with 737 horsepower a few years ago, but only sold it in Europe and it was crazy expensive, they didn't produce many of them.

 

Yes your talking about the B-Class Electric Drive.

 

177HP 251lbs of torque. 0-60 in 7.9 secs. 132 kW electric motor.

 

87 miles range at 50F degrees. MSRP $41,450

 

http://www.mbusa.com/mercedes/vehicles/class/class-B/bodystyle-EDV

 

I have seen actually more of these around Seattle than the i3 which is sitting on dealer lots. At least it has  decent interior and probably would do better if it had a 200+ mile range.

 

Its seems though that the Germans brands aren't really keen on doing the whole electric thing. Just a few years ago they were stuck in the diesel mindset thinking they could ride out the storm of high fuel prices...And their hedge didn't workout.

 

It reminds me a lot of Japanese companies for consumer electronics trying to compete with Samsung and LG. They never really found a way to differentiate themselves in a way that actually made them look superior,  even though that is the foundation of their initial success.

 

For example, OLED TVs are here to stay and Sony is still stuck in the LCD age. They've thrown their hands in the air and balked at the prospect of even trying to compete because there's no way they could possibly differentiate themselves. Even though they were among the few companies that even tried OLED at first. Funny story.

 

The one thing that German car companies hate, above all, is following any company that isn't German.

 

And it's really hard to actually build an electric car that is complicated. They're so much simpler than ICE cars powertrain wise. Most electric cars will have a pancake battery that acts as a structural member much like a frame. That means every one of them will have a great center of gravity and weight distribution. The thinner and the lighter they become, even better.

 

That's NOT how the Germans do business. They can't compete on price or deliver amazing value, so they use word "complicated" or an aura of being the "over-engineered" as a clear allusion to "sophisticated"  in their proposition of value to the customer. That only works so long as people are deeply attached to those attributes. And it only works in their perennial best-selling vehicles or vehicle segments that are truly theirs - the ones that their history can truly be delineated from, such as the S-Classes and X6s of the world.

 

But no matter how salient people are to that kind of product, the Germans will not be able to continue it, atleast not in much of America, eventually.

 

The i3 is hobbled by many things.

 

For being a BMW, it's got nothing that really represents the hallmarks of the company. It does use a lot of CFRP, but it doesn't deliver meaningful advantages in range or acceleration. 

 

And the comical tires used up front don't provide any handling confidence. It isn't a BMW. It's a novelty that is already obsolete. It provides nothing to the traditional BMW buyer, and it is a superficial attempt to cater to the basic care factors of alternative vehicle buyers.

Interesting observation on the tires:

 

BMW i3 - 19 x 5 155/70 all season low resistance tires.

 

MB B Class EV - 17 x 7.5 225/45R17 All season Extended Mobility tires.

 

Chevy Bolt - It appears based on looking at pictures that the size is very much like MB. 

 

Chevy and MB seem to have gone with a realistic tire in comparison to BMW.

Mercedes is working on an electric vehicle architecture that will underpin 4 vehicles, 2 sedans and 2 crossovers.  The smaller ones would be C to E class size, and  there 2 would be full size.  Supposedly a 300 kWh batter pack, 400 hp for rear drive models and 600 hp for all wheel drive models.   These are coming in the 2018-19 time frame.  So they'll have 5 full EV's and 10 or so plug-ins.  But if this stuff has a huge price premium people won't buy it.   The AMG line will probably outsell the electric line, however if the electric line buys them enough CARB and CAFE points to build V12s then bring on the green mobiles.

Mercedes makes an electric car, it has been on sale in the USA for over a year, is $42,000 before tax credits and no one buys it. But by offering it they comply with California's laws and likely get some carb credits.

Mercedes also made an electric SLS with 737 horsepower a few years ago, but only sold it in Europe and it was crazy expensive, they didn't produce many of them.

And like the i3 it has a crap range and it was limited to one state for sale so again not an apples to apples comparison here. Keep the excuses coming though.

Well you said Mercedes doesn't make an electric car.  Yet they do, and that is all I was saying.  I never said it was a good electric car or it had a long range.   But the B250e range is double the Volt and in the Volt thread the Chevy fans were saying how the Volt's range meets 90% of drivers needs and Volt owners buy gas 3 times year, etc.  So 85 miles must be enough range for most electric car buyers. 

 

I wouldn't buy any of these electric cars because you pay a $10-20,000 premium over a similarly performing gas car.  The range isn't the problem, the price is.

 

An E250 diesel has an 886 mile range, does that make it the best luxury sedan on the market?  As I said, no one is car shopping for range.

 

Mercedes makes an electric car, it has been on sale in the USA for over a year, is $42,000 before tax credits and no one buys it. But by offering it they comply with California's laws and likely get some carb credits.

Mercedes also made an electric SLS with 737 horsepower a few years ago, but only sold it in Europe and it was crazy expensive, they didn't produce many of them.

And like the i3 it has a crap range and it was limited to one state for sale so again not an apples to apples comparison here. Keep the excuses coming though.

 

The M-B B-class electric is currently sold in 11 states.

 

An E250 diesel has an 886 mile range, does that make it the best luxury sedan on the market?  As I said, no one is car shopping for range.

 

The range does not make it one of the best Luxury sedans, but it does make it one of the best compact eco cars competing with the Cruze diesel. They are in the same boat.

Mercedes makes an electric car, it has been on sale in the USA for over a year, is $42,000 before tax credits and no one buys it. But by offering it they comply with California's laws and likely get some carb credits.

Mercedes also made an electric SLS with 737 horsepower a few years ago, but only sold it in Europe and it was crazy expensive, they didn't produce many of them.

And like the i3 it has a crap range and it was limited to one state for sale so again not an apples to apples comparison here. Keep the excuses coming though.

The M-B B-class electric is currently sold in 11 states.

okay. That makes more sense but it still proves my point that no one ever heard of it for good reason. It suffers the same range problem as the i3. What is really funny though is that someone caught a case of the foot in mouth. He says that as long as Mercedes gets those big old V12s, then he is all for his favorite brand putting out electric cars. Guess it never occurred to him that GM is thinking that EXACT same thing. Get enough greenie credits from the EVs to keep putting out big old V8s. But hey, maybe GM can't do that because they don't have such a sterling reputation like MB (sarcasm wholly intended. See statements about how Daimler screwed Chrsyler six ways from Sunday while being run by such great engineers).

An E250 diesel has an 886 mile range, does that make it the best luxury sedan on the market?  As I said, no one is car shopping for range.

 

The range does not make it one of the best Luxury sedans, but it does make it one of the best compact eco cars competing with the Cruze diesel. They are in the same boat.

its also a pretty asinine assumption to 1.)compare an election if model to a fossil fuel model and 2.)assuming that people are not shopping for range when it comes to EVs. He needs to step out of that little biased bubble of his, that's all I'm saying because I simply can't weather anymore of his silliness.

Well you said Mercedes doesn't make an electric car.  Yet they do, and that is all I was saying.  I never said it was a good electric car or it had a long range.   But the B250e range is double the Volt and in the Volt thread the Chevy fans were saying how the Volt's range meets 90% of drivers needs and Volt owners buy gas 3 times year, etc.  So 85 miles must be enough range for most electric car buyers. 

 

I wouldn't buy any of these electric cars because you pay a $10-20,000 premium over a similarly performing gas car.  The range isn't the problem, the price is.

 

An E250 diesel has an 886 mile range, does that make it the best luxury sedan on the market?  As I said, no one is car shopping for range.

Where do you pull these comparisons from? Why are you comparing an ALL electric Mercedes to an plug in hybrid Volt? Sorry but that is just asinine. This is why nothing you say really means jack squat around here. Sorry to be the one to tell you but someone clearly needs to.

Its seems though that the Germans brands aren't really keen on doing the whole electric thing. Just a few years ago they were stuck in the diesel mindset thinking they could ride out the storm of high fuel prices...And their hedge didn't workout.

 

It reminds me a lot of Japanese companies for consumer electronics trying to compete with Samsung and LG. They never really found a way to differentiate themselves in a way that actually made them look superior,  even though that is the foundation of their initial success.

 

For example, OLED TVs are here to stay and Sony is still stuck in the LCD age. They've thrown their hands in the air and balked at the prospect of even trying to compete because there's no way they could possibly differentiate themselves. Even though they were among the few companies that even tried OLED at first. Funny story.

 

The one thing that German car companies hate, above all, is following any company that isn't German.

 

And it's really hard to actually build an electric car that is complicated. They're so much simpler than ICE cars powertrain wise. Most electric cars will have a pancake battery that acts as a structural member much like a frame. That means every one of them will have a great center of gravity and weight distribution. The thinner and the lighter they become, even better.

 

That's NOT how the Germans do business. They can't compete on price or deliver amazing value, so they use word "complicated" or an aura of being the "over-engineered" as a clear allusion to "sophisticated"  in their proposition of value to the customer. That only works so long as people are deeply attached to those attributes. And it only works in their perennial best-selling vehicles or vehicle segments that are truly theirs - the ones that their history can truly be delineated from, such as the S-Classes and X6s of the world.

 

But no matter how salient people are to that kind of product, the Germans will not be able to continue it, atleast not in much of America, eventually.

 

The i3 is hobbled by many things.

 

For being a BMW, it's got nothing that really represents the hallmarks of the company. It does use a lot of CFRP, but it doesn't deliver meaningful advantages in range or acceleration. 

 

And the comical tires used up front don't provide any handling confidence. It isn't a BMW. It's a novelty that is already obsolete. It provides nothing to the traditional BMW buyer, and it is a superficial attempt to cater to the basic care factors of alternative vehicle buyers.

the Germans, yes I agree....they don't want to or can't compete on mainstream simplicity.