Drew Dowdell

Are you guys *sure* this isn't a Toyota something?

What's with the coffee can sticking out of the hood?

Direct injection 2.8 litre turbo would fit the car's market and make it fairly zippy like the MazdaSpeed 6

1. Profits are affected by overhead costs. GM's are $1500 more expensive regarless of the car they build. 2. GM has to keep the mills cranking and selling to fleet simply because of these overhead costs. 3. GM has to try and cheap out on the designs simply because if they didn't they couldn't be price competitive and make money due to their over head costs. Could GM build a car that would kill the Camry? Sure... and they'd sell every one. Except to remain price competitive they'd have to sell them all at a lose OR bump up the price to where a comparible Camry is 3k cheaper then an equal quality Malibu.

my numbers were made up of course.... but the sentiment is the same. The majority of Camry owners are not passionate about cars. A much higher percentage of Grand Prix owners are. Heck, if the Grand Prix sells only to the Nascar set, my point still stands.

Absolutely fully loaded GPV8... including engine block heater is 29,951 on CarsDirect.com. Add in potential GM card rebate <you only have to have *some* points to be eligable for the $2000 "top off" rebate> and you're in a loaded V8 GP for 27k. An absolute BASE 325 is 30,928 on CarsDirect.... try finding one on the lot. An absolute base A4 is 28k, but then you're saddled with an un-fun 4-cylinder in a heavy car... and you don't even get Quattro... So yeah... the GP V8 seems like a pretty sweet deal.

But that's probably because you give all indications that you are straight. I doubt that OCN does.

If that were the case, why hasn't GMC withered away and died yet? Strangely enough, Cadillac is one of the few brands that has completely changed their buyer demographic sucessfully. In 1996 Cadillac was totally for the 70's set. Today it's younger, wealthier people. Rappers and underweight white actresses love the Escalade. I'm 27 and got my CTS when I was 25. This is something Toyota HASN'T been able to do... hence the existence of Scion. You forget that this *was* a volume vehicle for GM. It cost extremely little for GM to tool up for this because it's just a Holden Monaro. They just had to swap a few badges, swap the driver side, and ship it over. Even at the low sales numbers of the GTO, they probably still made money on it because the more plebian models were sold with reasonable sucess in Australia.

To be fair, it all depends on where you live. Here in Pittsburgh, $700 a month rent gets you a fairly rockin place. Heck, my mortgage is $765 a month and I have 3 bedrooms, hardwood floors, fireplaces, porches, gargages and 1/3 acre of land.... yet I'm 15 minutes from downtown.

meh, people lack imagination. I was stuck in the cooperate rat race for years getting measly 3% raises. Now that I'm on my own, I have much more freedom, satisfaction, and most importantly much more money.

In the same vein, what do Volkswagen, Mercedes-Benz, BMW, and Alfa Romeo have in common? Well, minus BMW. Chrysler is a comonality between the rest. VW was a partner in developing the Rabbit/Omni, Benz owns Chrysler today, and Alfa had that horrible Lebaron/Maseratti rebadge.

Ford had an AWD Tempo... and apparently at one point sold an AWD, 5-speed, Diesel tempo...... yeah, it's strange, but a neighbor had one. Pontiac had the 6000 STE AWD, and I think the Astro Van.

There were a pair of reviewers that panned the handling of the GP Comp-G. It apparently pissed off Lutz enough that he invited the reviewers to race him. They could pick any car in the GP's segmant they wanted, while he drove a Comp-G. One of the reviewers picked a Maxima. Lutz wiped the floor with it.

Had you said Honda, I would have said the early Civic. Can't think of anything from Toyota. At least Datsun/Nissan Z proved that japanese sports cars could be cool.

#1. As people frequently like to point out, GM's engines and transmissions have been around for a long time now. No complaints about sluggishness. #2. Except for the S/C 3800, GMs generally require 87 to get their advertised horsepower. #3 So the jury is still out on those..... and great, the car shift 4 times before I make it to 25 MPH....smooth. Lexus's new 8-speed is only for the highest end model. The number of gears race is getting a bit rediculous. GM should just trump them all and start sourcing 16-speeds from allison for all their vehicles. Would that shut you up Toyoguy? A good 5-speed, 6-speed, or CVT is all any car needs.

Whoopdie flippin do! Pontiac and Buick have been offering 240-260hp in family cars for years now. The 268hp Camry is only the top model. Get a top model Impala and you get a 303hp V8. Chevy and Olds had a DOHC 215hp V6 in 1994 while Toyota was rockin it with 188hp and Accord could only be had with a 4 cylinder, 145hp Max. One thing HonYota has never done is out HP GM in a given class.

You don't need to, everyone assumes. Especially so if you have a ring on your finger or pictures of your kids on your desk. I'm not saying OCN should title himself the "Gay--- whatever", but open about it is still fine.

I agree and I disagree. Ocn doesn't have to be shouting "I'm Gay" from the roof tops with a fiddle, but he should be able to be comfortable talking about it when the subject of dating, partners, homosexuality, comes up. Heterosexuals don't realize how much they "flaunt" their sexuality. Having rings, holding hands in public, having sport illustrated swimsuit calenders, talking about their wives or girlfriends, husbands or boyfriends.... all the while Ocn is supposed to just sit there and smile and not talk about his date with a hot guy? I don't think so. My BF and I make a point of being honest and open about our sexualities without being over the top with it. We mention each other as "my partner" in casual work conversation. We hold hands in public... walking on the street even. We try to set a good example of being open about sexuality without flaunting it. I think Ocn can do it too.

Ocn, you sound like you're fairly butch. I would have responded "No, I'm the gay one." When they all look at you wonderingly... just say... "What...as if you didn't know..." This does two things. Admits that you're gay, and puts them on the defensive because they suddenly feel dumb because now it seems that it is A. something they should have already known. B. something that apparently everyone else already knows. C. Something you are obviously comfortable with them knowing. It's a very easy way to diffuse someone like that.

Ocn, she knows.... all moms know.

You're still not out to your mom?

Toyota isn't sucessful becauseit has less brands, it's sucessful in spite of having less brands. GM's brands <including Olds>, managed properly, would be very sucessful. The difference is this. For the 300k Camrys Toyota sells, 10 people are actually excited to be purchasing one. For the 50k Grand Prixs that Pontiac sells retail, 30k of them are actually excited to be buying one. People buy Toyotas the way they buy refridgerators.... reliable, efficient, unobtrusive. People buy Pontiacs the way they pick out a wife.... fun, great to be around, and dances well. Right now, the perception is you can't be fun and reliable/high quaility at the same time.

I can't wait for someone to criticize the CTS or STS overhangs.. :-)

I wonder if some of those may be hybrids. Remeber the RX400.....

The one I was amused by most recently was a 'low' listed in Cheers and Gears. "It's still a Trailblazer"