smk4565

Diesel cars could end up dead in the next 5-10 years. Hybrid and plug in is getting better and better. Once electrification gets more wide spread in the 2020s, the diesel car will be going away. So then you wonder about diesel SUVs and pick ups like the Ram or Colorado. I would guess they would move to a plug-in hybrid set up too.

All I said was the Envision is in the small segment, yet priced on top of the XT5, which is mid-size and a Cadillac. How is saying the Envision is in the small segment, but priced similar to the XT5 trolling? It is the size of the vehicle and the price of the vehicle. But as we talk about Cadillac and we know an XT3 is coming, which will be cheaper than XT5, if you take $5k off the XT5 you have a $33,995 X3, that is cheaper than an Envision. Sure the XT5 price could rise, and XT3 priced at $38k, but it seems odd that Buick and Cadillac are so on top of each other. And the Mercedes GLC is 183.3 inches long, it is also in the small SUV segment. Same size vehicle as the Envision. How can the Envision be mid-size and the GLC be compact, when they are the same size? In what world can you claim the Buick Envision is a mid-size SUV? It doesn't make sense.

I tend to think it is a step above a LaCrosse or like a longer, bigger version of an ES350. It has fwd and 300ish hp like those other 2. But the Continental doesn't have a price point like those two. It will be interesting to see the advertising and how many people buy it.

Gas is cheap, crossover sales are up, crossovers = profits. Good job on capitalizing on that by GM. Although I think they could have another crossover at Chevy and they haven't got the Envision on sale yet, and Cadillac needs a couple more. So if they can fill out the crossover line, they should be able to keep this up.

You do NOT agree. Tiny crossovers is NOT where Cadillac should be going, at the very least because and Cadillac isn't AND because everyone wants them to stop saying See what you did there?? The market buys crossovers. Problem is Cadillac's SUV/CUV/whatever aren't based on the Alpha and Omega platforms where they put all their engineering dollars. And they only have 2 of them. I agree there is no business case for a smaller than ATS sedan, the ATS sedan isn't really lighting up the sales chart to think people want a smaller, cheaper ATS. But Cadillac without crossovers will be out of business. It has become the #1 selling body style.

The Buick is midsize. Nice trolling though. It is????? Buick Envision length 183.7 inches long Chevrolet Cruze 183.7 in Cadillac ATS 183.6 in BMW X3 183.8 in I always thought those were in the small segment.

Thunderbird all day long. That was a good looking car. And it has the 3.9 liter V8 from the Lincoln, so it has some power to it. Only 250 hp, but enough for cruising.

Anyone notice that a 2016 Buick Envision (which is in the small segment and made in China) is $42,995, and the 2017 will have a $34,990 base model. The Cadillac XT5 is $38,995, which is a mid-size crossover. A small Buick crossover is priced like a mid-size Cadillac. It doesn't make sense.

To me Cadillac is a challenger brand that isn't sure what direction it wants to go. It lacks focus. 10-15 years ago, they saw the 3-series and 5-series were successful and said let's copy that. For the 2010 SRX they saw the Lexus RX selling like crazy, so they made the SRX the same size with fwd to copy. There isn't really a true strategy of what they stand for. They want to have low weight, cut every gram possible sports sedans, but then their halo product is a 6,000 lb SUV in which they never bothered to cut any weight from. Now it seems like they will design cars to suit China, even though they still sell more Cadillacs here than they do in China. I do think there are some at Cadillac that want to make stylish, great American cars, play on the heritage, while offering the technology of today. However there are too many bean counters that will interfere, or those that will argue if we turn an Enclave into a Cadillac that is cheaper than making a CT6 based crossover, so let's just do the quick an easy route, offer discounts later to move metal. So you get what you what we have now. Concept cars and ideas that seam great, but get heavily watered down in the process. I don't care for BMWs all that much, but if everything they do is so wrong, or if the cars are bland, or no longer sporty the i3 is ugly and stupid, etc, then why do they whip Cadillac so bad? The BMW haters want to hate on them, but they are selling close to 2 million cars a year now. I think BMW makes their fair share of mistakes, but the people keep buying them.

Who is this demographic that is looking for a slightly smaller, slightly cheaper ATS @ Cadillac, exactly? A billion dollars spent to develop this model that's a shave & a haircut smaller- there's simply no point to it. Same demographic that buys the CLA... but later finds out its a POS.. Same buyer who will buy a 1 series or 2 series. And I doubt big time that it costs a billion$$ to develop the model.. Again.. when the newer ATS (CT3) will be a tad larger on the inside. I would also point out that while my preference is the Alpha platform be used.. I would have zero objection to a Dx vehicle that was a hatch or hybrid OK… that's your take. Mine is, there's no business case to bring out another sedan on the SAME PLATFORM as the ATS. I mean, hello? And this is coming from someone who doesn't place all that much significance in what platform is under a vehicle. CLA is moving copies (based on whoring out the badge), but the 1-2 series @ BMW is struggling. But a FWD hatchback Cadillac??????????????????? What sort of sales analysis threads am I going to be reading there?? It's not where Cadillac came from, it's not where they need to go. The whole 'must match the German's catalogs' mindset has to die but some folks just won't let it go. I agree. The sub ATS product they need is a crossover. They is always a business case for crossovers it now seems. The XT5 is basically a midsize vehicle, they can get 2 crossovers smaller than it in the line up easily. People don't want small sedans, look at the drop in Fiesta, Focus type cars, the Honda Fit basically dead, but the Trax, HR-V, and Mazda CX-3 are on the rise. You can sell a compact crossover, hard to sell a compact sedan if you aren't already established in that segment.

Of course they had to copy the Mercedes speaker covers and door mounted seat controls. It is funny how people here say Mercedes does so many things wrong, yet Cadillac and Lincoln both want to copy them, and Lincoln especially is hopeless in competing with them.

Mercedes could use cardboard boxes for front seats and the E-class or S-class would out sell the Continental. They may use faux leather on the base models, but they also offer a lot of options that others don't, and more 500 HP models than any other brand.

Still looks sort of boring. I look forward to seeing the sales numbers, and how Ford tries to spin in it when it doesn't sell.

Totally agree on the 640,000 mile E-class taxi. You'd have to buy 3 of any other car to get that many miles on it. The Lexus ES probably has better fit an finish than a Continental, maybe not as many gadgets or 30 way seats. But you have to remember in the minds of the consumer, Lexus has the best reliability Evaaarrrrrrr! Here is a comparison though, I don't think they are that far off.

The 2.7 V6 probably has decent low end torque, so it might not be that bad. However I don't think anyone is buying the Continental for speed. They would be buying it for interior, and unless you pay $65k+ for Revel audio, 30 way seats, leather and fabric upgrades, etc, then you aren't even getting that good of an interior. I think the people spending $60k or more will want some performance, and the people that just want a comfortable interior with no performance are happy with a Lexus ES350 for $43k. So there in lies the hard sell for Lincoln.

E-class luxury trim testing on the Nurburgring: Maybach S600 on Nurburring: A GL at the Nurburgring: etc, etc

SMK where did you hear officially that the XT7 will be based on the Enclave? I have found nothing and heard nothing to this statement at all. We have no idea what the new platform will be. Yes the XT7 could be a stretched bigger version of the XT5 but nothing has really been stated yet. There were pics of a test mule a while back, bit there was some debate. The belief was the XT7 along with Enclave and Traverse would be on long wheel base C2xx, while Acadia and XT5 are short wheel base. If I we're Cadillac I'd build it on Omega, make it 1,000 lbs lighter than Escalade and put a 400 hp turbo V6 and a 500 HP V8 in there.

All funny stuff, but also remember: Thou shall not call it luxury unless it has been tested on the Nurburgring. Some people don't care if the leather is real or not, so MB TeX does drip the base price more. I guess they priced this car pretty close to the XTS, but Lincoln has less credibility than Cadillac and less of a following. This car will struggle to sell 1,000 a month, they will fleet sale and discount the heck of out in year two.

Hold up.. are U saying that General Motors is incapable of building an engine with more power/torque than the V12 BT?? LOL.. U Crazy.. On top of that.. why would they need to. The LT4 in a car the weight of a CT6.. that's almost 1000lbs less than the S-Class doesn't need that much torque to achieve a.. LOL.. 4.2 0-60 time. It could achieve that with a NA LT1 The argument about the S-Class being heavily discounted is not only sound.. but relevant. If U are gonna tout the $220,000 price as something that is so desirable.. then explain why NO ONE ACTUALLY PAYS the $220,000 price. Incentives?? Even without the $220,000.. ooooops... $170,000 (price corrected for fire-sale) Cadillac still managed to have the highest ATPs last month and ranked in the top 2 most of 2015 and 16 Bottom line on the CT8 is U don;t kno a GOD DAMN thing yet.. nor do I, but I personally don;t see a need for a CT8, when the CT7 hasn't shown up yet. Quite frankly I would be disapointed if Cadillac followed the tired German formula at this point with just another big sedan in a market segment that is going no where I'll agree on CT8, or anything else above a CT6. We don't know anything, especially because as of now it looks like they aren't going above CT6. But maybe they will, maybe the CT6 in 2nd generation will go up market and get a name change, when they name change ATS and CTS to CT-number cars. So we have to wait and see what happens there. I also think GM is capable of building a V12 engine, I just know that they won't spend the money to do it. They could try to increase more power form the LT4, but at what level of refinement? A car in that price range needs to be quiet and smooth too. I also think if it was so easy as drop an LT4 into a CT6 and price it against an AMG S-class they would have done that already. As far as ATP, the Escalade is a big % of Cadillac sales right now, it outsells the ATS and CTS. Once they get an XT3, and XT1 or sub-ATS car and the line up fills out, that average will drop. A better judge would be ATP of ATS compared to 3-series, IS, C-class and compare ATP of CTS to A6, 5-series, E-class, etc. If you go segment by segment Cadillac probably loses all of them. But BMW and Audi don't have an $85k SUV (base price, I know a loaded up X5 gets there) to pull their average up. Which why it has taken BMW this long to get na X7 is their own dumb fault as well. But I think brand ATP can be misleading on brands with only a few models. Nada... The Escalade sold 3200 last month.. the SRX.. right the least expensive due to incentives to get rid of old model for arrival of XT5, sold almost 1000 more. Surely that should have brought the ATP down.. or at least nullified any real gain that the Escalade offered. I think what U may be afraid to admit is that CTS sales stabilized.. being down by ONE.. ONE sale. On top of that.. a $100K CTS-V boost that number up some. I will add that the CTS was actually higher than the 5series in ATP in 2015.. Just admit it.. U hate Cadillac.. U hate GM.. U hate America I don't hate Cadillac, I am realistic. I have said for years I wanted a Cadillac convertible, a DOHC V8, more models etc. They could make some good product, especially when you compare to what Lexus and Acura have now, those are beatable brands. I did read when Johan de Nyschen said CTS avg. transaction price in 2014 was $47,000, better than BMW. Maybe he meant the BMW brand as a whole. Right now a 528i rear drive with no options and destination charge is $51,195. Now I am pretty sure there isn't a single BMW sold in the USA that has zero options on it, so once the BMW options lists jacks the price up, no way they are selling 5-series for under $50k, even with discounts. If we are going to use ATP as a measure of Cadillac success vs the Germans, then once Cadillac has an XT1 and XT3 for sale for $35k eating up volume, we should use the same measure. I'd imagine Volvo has a good ATP since half their sales are XC90 SUVs. Are we going to crown Volvo king of luxury cars because no one buys the S40 or S60? Jaguar has a high ATP too, simply because they don't have any cars under $50k for sale until that XE hits dealers. Jag is practically on life support, their ATP of $65k or $70k isn't doing them too much when they sell 1000 cars a month.

The interior doesn't even seem all that great. They are asking Mercedes E-class money, for a car based on the Fusion, good luck.

Sounds awesome just like my Cadillac dealership. Glad the experience is so solid. Yet with that, just like my dealership, this is just bland and does not speak luxury to me. In this case I would have to say that both MB and Cadillac have failed us in having a luxury attractive dealership. That building is actually pretty huge, because it goes back really far. And you drive inside to drop your car off,so you are never outside, which is nice in winter. But the service from the people I think is more important to the experience rather than the building.

CLAR does sound like a cluster of materials. The new 7 is lighter than the previous, so I assume they will be able to used this mix material concept and cut weight on all models. What is interesting is that the X7 is going to be a different platform. Maybe a Rolls-Royce platform then, but that seems odd that they wouldn't use the 7-series platform for it. They say there will be a V12 in the X5, that won't happen, the X7 is getting a V12 though. I would assume CLAR must be really flexible, because Mercedes builds the GLE and GLS off an SUV platform they have, it is not shared with any cars. Thing about the Cadillac XT7 though is it is going to be Enclave based, that won't hold a candle to a rear drive V8 and V12 SUV.

I don't call $45k for a Lincoln Fusion with the same 3.7 V6 from a Taurus a good deal. Even worse is the $55k Reserve trim still has the 3.7 V6. At least make the 2.7 V6 standard at $45k price point and up. If they want to offer a 3.7 V6 or even a turbo 4 to the fleet market for $39,995 go on ahead. Problem he is they aren't selling handling or performance, nor are they selling badge or image or prestige. All they have to sell is quite and comfortable interior. At least with the 2.7 turbo V6 it would have low end torque so you could drive around at a low engine speed and the car would seem quiet and torquey, and have a bit of a premium feel. Cranking that 3.7 V6 up to 4,000 rpm to move all that mass isn't refined luxury.

Since we are posting dealerships, here is where I get mine serviced. Bobby Rahal Mercedes is a 12 time Best of the Best award winner. I must say they are on it, they greet you right when you pull in, loaner cars are waiting, service advisors meet with you pretty quickly, they text and/or call with updates, car is always washed and clean when you pick it up. The people there are top notch at customer service.

Hold up.. are U saying that General Motors is incapable of building an engine with more power/torque than the V12 BT?? LOL.. U Crazy.. On top of that.. why would they need to. The LT4 in a car the weight of a CT6.. that's almost 1000lbs less than the S-Class doesn't need that much torque to achieve a.. LOL.. 4.2 0-60 time. It could achieve that with a NA LT1 The argument about the S-Class being heavily discounted is not only sound.. but relevant. If U are gonna tout the $220,000 price as something that is so desirable.. then explain why NO ONE ACTUALLY PAYS the $220,000 price. Incentives?? Even without the $220,000.. ooooops... $170,000 (price corrected for fire-sale) Cadillac still managed to have the highest ATPs last month and ranked in the top 2 most of 2015 and 16 Bottom line on the CT8 is U don;t kno a GOD DAMN thing yet.. nor do I, but I personally don;t see a need for a CT8, when the CT7 hasn't shown up yet. Quite frankly I would be disapointed if Cadillac followed the tired German formula at this point with just another big sedan in a market segment that is going no where I'll agree on CT8, or anything else above a CT6. We don't know anything, especially because as of now it looks like they aren't going above CT6. But maybe they will, maybe the CT6 in 2nd generation will go up market and get a name change, when they name change ATS and CTS to CT-number cars. So we have to wait and see what happens there. I also think GM is capable of building a V12 engine, I just know that they won't spend the money to do it. They could try to increase more power form the LT4, but at what level of refinement? A car in that price range needs to be quiet and smooth too. I also think if it was so easy as drop an LT4 into a CT6 and price it against an AMG S-class they would have done that already. As far as ATP, the Escalade is a big % of Cadillac sales right now, it outsells the ATS and CTS. Once they get an XT3, and XT1 or sub-ATS car and the line up fills out, that average will drop. A better judge would be ATP of ATS compared to 3-series, IS, C-class and compare ATP of CTS to A6, 5-series, E-class, etc. If you go segment by segment Cadillac probably loses all of them. But BMW and Audi don't have an $85k SUV (base price, I know a loaded up X5 gets there) to pull their average up. Which why it has taken BMW this long to get na X7 is their own dumb fault as well. But I think brand ATP can be misleading on brands with only a few models.