pow

What he said.

I notice some people installed roll cages. Are there rules re: the condition of the driver as well as the condition of the car? No T-boning, etc?

That's the same city fuel economy as the Cobalt!

If your sole purpose of posting is to annoy me with your personal, but indirect jabs (like the cheap shot at inaccurately mocking me above) and to start a fire, quit it. You're ruining my experience of this board by your never-ending bullying. And please don't pretend your innocence. If you want me to go on, the Pontiac brand sits in GM's scheme much differently than the way BMW sits at BMW. I was satirizing the corporate structure of modern GM and its lack of brand individualization (SV6, anyone?), how Pontiac resides in GM like "Healthy Choice" in ConAgra. I mean, can anyone name the president of Pontiac?

About the enduro race, are you allowed to change tires? So no matter how tough your car is, if one of the tires get a flat, you're out?

By: Alistair Weaver Date Posted 10-10-2005 BMW and Mercedes-Benz are at war again, and the stakes could not be higher. This is not simply a matter of 7 Series versus S-Class or SLK against Z4. This is a struggle for the future direction of the automobile. Inside Line asked senior figures from Mercedes and BMW to outline their companies' visions of the future, and while they agree on some issues, there are also some startling and fundamental differences of opinion. Munich is represented by Professor Raymond Freymann. As the managing director of BMW's Research and Technology division, he is responsible for "translating crazy ideas into reality." His department contains about 200 scientists working to define the BMW of 2030 and beyond. In the Mercedes corner is Hans Multhaupt. As the program manager for Mercedes' large cars, including the S-Class, SLR McLaren and Maybach, Multhaupt will engineer the luxury cars of tomorrow. Societal Changes — an Evolving Demographic The demographic of Western society will change significantly in the next 30 years, and this has an important bearing on both companies' future directions. "We can say for certain who has not been born," says Freymann. "The 'silver generation' is becoming increasingly important. By 2030, over a third of the world's population will be over 60. Single households are also on the increase, and women are now driving larger cars, particularly in the U.S." But we won't be witnessing the development of the BMW 70 Series or the Mercedes-Benz Silver-Class. "The silver people are the proudest on earth," continues Freymann. "A car built for old people would not be saleable, but you must also ensure that there's no reason for them to reject the car." The Importance of Brand The importance of "brand" has grown dramatically in Europe in the past 30 years, and it's also becoming more important in the U.S. In the future, established marques such as BMW and Mercedes will seek to reaffirm their brand values for the sake of an edge over new competition from emerging markets, especially China. "People will not buy products from companies they don't know and don't like," says BMW's Freymann. "Car manufacturers from countries like China will grow from the bottom up. They may become a threat to a company like Ford, but not to us. We are not just selling a car, we are selling an image." Both Freymann and Multhaupt are keen to define their core values. "The driver must always be in the loop, that's central to the BMW ethos," says Freymann. "People buy an M5 because it's fun to drive and those impulses won't change. Our cars must also be safe, stylish and reliable." Safety and reliability are also central to Mercedes' core values, but Multhaupt places a greater emphasis on comfort. While Freymann cannot countenance the thought of a driverless BMW, Multhaupt is happy to consider the concept of a Mercedes that, in certain circumstances, drives itself. But he reckons that the technology is unlikely to be in place for at least 30 years. This subtle difference of emphasis has a major bearing on the two companies' approaches. The "Engines" of Tomorrow Although both believe that hydrogen is the fuel of the future, the two companies differ dramatically in their application of the fuel. BMW is convinced that the future lies with internal combustion engines powered by liquid hydrogen. Freymann claims to have built a one-cylinder supercharged direct-injection hydrogen engine that's already 125-percent more efficient than a normally aspirated gasoline equivalent. Such an engine is a long way off, but in a couple of years, BMW will launch a bi-fuel version of the 7 Series, capable of running on hydrogen or gasoline. To service such a car, hydrogen filling stations have opened in several European cities, and California's Governor Schwarzenegger has committed to building a "hydrogen highway" in California. According to BMW's vision, we could be about to enter the age of the guilt-free V8. Mercedes' Multhaupt thinks that such a vision is "stupid." According to the engineer, the widespread use of hydrogen internal combustion will "never, ever happen" because an internal combustion engine will always be too inefficient. "By 2030, we will have fuel-cell vehicles powered by electric motors," says Multhaupt. "The principle problems are solved, now it is only a question of cost and we are making breakthroughs all the time." The development guru believes that an onboard transformer will be used to generate the necessary hydrogen. Freymann does accept that, "a small, 5kW fuel-cell unit could be used to power the auxiliary systems, such as the air conditioning, when the car is stationary." But he reckons that "fuel cells have a long way to go before they can become a viable, affordable means of driving the car." Safety Both men agree that further major breakthroughs in passive safety — the ability to further lessen the degree of injury in an accident — are now unlikely. More emphasis in the future will be placed on avoiding accidents (active safety). "A bird doesn't have armor. We need to develop the intelligence of a bird to avoid an accident," says Multhaupt. The key to this technology will be to develop a means by which cars communicate with each other. Several manufacturers have already signed an agreement to this end, and BMW is testing methods of intervehicle communication using wireless LAN networks. This technology would not only be used to help cars detect and respond to threatening situations, it could also be used to improve traffic management by automatically directing a car around a jam. "This is the big vision of the future," says Multhaupt. Steady as She Goes Science fiction books of the 1960s were full of flying cars and flying saucers, but even with the arrival of a hydrogen fuel source, both men have a conservative vision of the next 20 years. "We are talking about a flying car, but we are not working on one," says Freymann. "The car of 2030 will be better connected to the outside world — we've moved from a non-knowledge to a knowledge-based society, centered on the Web. But it will still be instantly recognizable to us," Freymann asserts. "Cars won't be flying on air cushions — they won't have six tires. The driving experience won't change dramatically." In this, Multhaupt agrees, noting that his company works in a notoriously conservative sector of the market. Hollywood visions of the future will therefore have to wait, but the times they are a-changing. The automobile will continue to evolve, most particularly under the hood. And in that fundamental area of fuels and engine technology, BMW and Mercedes-Benz are veering off in different directions. They will not both be correct in their assessment of the future. ------------------ Personally, I like BMW's approach to hydrogen. I love all the thrills associated with internal combustion, despite its inefficiency. A whirring fuel cell car isn't my cup of tea.

Negative to Positive By John DiPietro Date posted: 10-10-2005 Back in 2003, we tested a Saturn Ion coupe, but didn't like it much. The rear access doors struck us as functional cool, but the mediocre seats, no-feel-in-the-wheel steering and unexciting handling left us cold. We closed that road test by saying optimistically, "The forthcoming Ion Red Line series coupe, with its promise of around 200 horsepower, supportive sport seats and a tightened-up suspension…could pump a lot of life into the nearly flat-lined Ion." So here we are, two years later with a snazzy Pacific Blue 2005 Saturn Ion Red Line with 205 horsepower, a five-speed manual, Recaro sport seats and a tweaked suspension. But is this jockish brother to the couch-potato Ion coupe as good as we thought it could be? We had a week of daily commuting, a session at the test track and a flog down seriously twisty Angeles Crest Highway north of L.A. to find out. Takes a Licking "No spoiler?" a colleague asked in mock amazement upon checking out this quasi-tuner sport coupe. That's right, no gaudy rear wing stuck on the trunk lid, a rare sight in this youth-driven segment, and a detail that appealed to the umm, more "senior" members of our staffers. But there's still enough eye candy here to show the masses you're not driving a base Ion coupe. A larger air intake in the front fascia, simulated brake cooling scoops in the front fenders, handsome 17-inch wheels, slightly flared rockers and a discreet "Red Line" badge on the rear add the requisite attitude. And if you really need it, an extroverted "aero-wing" spoiler is optional at $380. A unique feature of the Ion, and most other Saturns, are its flexible body panels. Yes, they result in larger body panel gaps (to allow expansion and contraction), but the first time you witness them saving your door from a nasty dent you'll be glad the Ion has them. Functionally Fine, Aesthetically Not Exactly Aces In the past, the Ion's cabin has taken well-deserved knocks for its abundance of hard plastic trim that comprises most of the dash and door panels. And although Saturn has given it a different texture and dressed up the center stack with faux metal trim, it's still not going to be confused with an Acura RSX. But look at those seats! Genuine Recaros, with all the support and comfort that their racy design promises. And they're nicely complemented by a meaty, leather-wrapped steering wheel that feels great in your hands. White-faced gauges add to the sporty feel, though most editors still don't like the odd location atop the center of the dash, claiming the dials are hard to read at a glance. Saturn must be aware of the problem. For 2006 it has added a combination boost gauge and "ladder tach" on top of the steering column to the $1,500 Competition Package. Three pairs of lights, two yellow and one red, flank the boost gauge and indicate certain rpm, ostensibly so one can check their revs without looking over at the tachometer itself. At the factory settings, the first pair of yellows light up at 4,400 rpm (where peak torque occurs), the second pair at 5,600 rpm (at peak horsepower) and the last pair (the red lights) at 6,200 rpm (300 rpm shy of redline). You can shut them off or change the settings to your preference. The Ion's rear access doors prove useful, making it easy to chuck a gym bag or sports equipment into the backseat. Of course, it also eases ingress and egress for rear passengers, who will find a pair of nicely contoured buckets back there. What's not useful are the cupholders, they're so shallow that a bottle of water does the Weeble's thing until it ultimately falls out. Supercharged Sprinter With 205 horsepower and 200 pound-feet of torque, the front-wheel-drive Red Line's supercharged 2.0-liter "Ecotec" four (shared with cousin Chevy's Cobalt SS) certainly qualifies as a muscle-bound mill. Coupled to the blown engine is a five-speed manual, no automatic is available. Running through the gears, the stick is smooth gate-to-gate, if a bit rubbery in feel. Although the clutch stroke is sportingly short, it still manages to be linear, making smooth takeoffs and gear changes a snap. We did notice that the engine tends to hold onto revs a bit when you back off the gas while changing up. It wasn't a problem, as in some other vehicles where it makes for somewhat slurred upshifts, but something we noted. Still, this is the best four-cylinder to ever roll out of a GM plant. Smooth (thanks to balance shafts) and eager (thanks to 12 pounds of boost) right to redline, it doesn't give away much to the Japanese. With all that torque on tap, feathering the throttle off the line is necessary to avoid sending the front Dunlops up in smoke. Once rolling, jumping into the throttle yields a 0-to-60-mph time of 6.7 seconds. A blast down the quarter-mile takes just 14.6 seconds, a quicker time than we recorded in the '06 BMW 330i we tested recently and faster than most cars in this class. A free-flow exhaust adds to the fun with its slightly aggressive and snarly tone. Against EPA ratings of 23 city/29 highway, we averaged 23.1 mpg. Not bad at all considering we had our foot in the boost at every opportunity. Fleet of Foot Along with the power upgrade, the Red Line receives a sport-tuned suspension (independent up front, semi-independent torsion beam setup out back) that's lowered 10mm and features firmer spring, damper and bushing rates as well as larger stabilizer bars. Mounted on those alloys are 215/45ZR17 Dunlop performance tires. Although it doesn't boast a fully independent suspension like some more expensive rivals, it's a well-sorted setup that provides rock-solid handling, plenty of grip and fine balance when zinging the car through a set of S curves. In the slalom, the Red Line ran through the cones at 61.1 mph, certainly respectable, though that performance still trails the Cobalt SS (64.9 mph) which runs 18-inch Pirelli P Zero Rossos and weighs about 100 pounds less. When you're not playing Speed Racer, the Ion provides a supple ride that won't beat you up on broken pavement. The limited-slip differential which is also part of the Competition Package is appreciated when powering out of low-speed corners, though it was still possible and fun on really tight corner exits to light 'em up at times due to the healthy dose of torque on tap. Heavy-duty, equal-length halfshafts do their best to mitigate torque steer. Under hard acceleration in a straight line the car pulls straight, but when blasting out of those tight corners some torque steer does surface. We're happy to report that the electric-power steering has been recalibrated for the Red Line and the result is a pleasing heft in the wheel and a precise on-center feel. With this Ion, you feel connected to the front wheels. Still, the steering felt unnaturally heavy at times, such as in slow, tight corners, but overall it's much improved over Saturn's other setups. Disc brakes all around aided by standard ABS are up to the task of quickly reining in the Red Line. Stopping from 60 mph consumed only 121 feet of pavement, and whether on the track or during the daily grind, the brakes are strong and easy to modulate. Pocket Change Pocket Rocket All told, the Red Line is a well-rounded, if not very refined package — ripping performance, confidence-inspiring handling, a decent ride and great seats make it a choice for enthusiasts on a budget. And for 2006, the price has been lowered about $1,500, making the '06 version of our test car listing out at $21,770. If you're looking for a cabin with Audi-like craftsmanship, then let's be honest, this just ain't your ride. But if a grin-inducing driving experience is what you're after for around $20K, then there's a good chance the Saturn Ion Red Line will get you all charged up. -------------- Personally, I think it looks great, *inside* and out. I'd consider buying one if its safety improved.

Nice... we have a 240 auto as our beater too, an '88 GL model. It's so bad dynamically that it's amusing... I floored it going up a hill and went from 45 MPH to 46 MPH. There's at least three inches of deadplay in the steering... I love it!

I have a feeling it'll do great in frontal crashes, not so much in side crashes or rollovers. It doesn't have any rollover hoops, and it doesn't have side airbags. No car has passed the IIHS side test without them so far. At least it has OnStar available... and sooner or later, stability control. Does the passenger seat have weight sensors for child seats?

Congrats on the new car! Since yours is a convertible, you can forego the annoying door buttons and, uh, you know... nevermind. I'm surprised by the quantity of upgrades for 2006, considering it's only a year old. I didn't know until today that the 6-speed automatic is available, which comes with a new gear lever. The new three-spoke wheel is a definite improvement.

Werd... I swear I thought the SSR had a rear 3/4 window. Guess not... must have been an illusion, the result of the curvy greenhouse.

Ehh, dislike the three enormous Pontiac-esque A/C vents. And that hood above the center console looks like an afterthought, aftermarket Subaru (or Mitsubishi Montero) psi/oil temp/volt gauge.

I guess they did enough styling changes to convince at least one person that it's a Mitsabooshi.

More importantly, would it pass the lesbian test?

Well, you could get two Santa Fe 4-cylinders for the price of one loaded Tribeca.

I saw their new commercial... it was similar to the Eclipse's. A Frontier emptied its fluids at the sight of the Raider. Its interior is a lot nicer than the Dakota's.

Well, hardtop convertibles with the roof up look exactly like a hardtop coupe, except for the extra cutlines... Such a clean looking car... puts the 9-3 Cabrio to shame.

I don't think he wants the same car as his grandmother... :P

Its top is identical to the Solstice's, clumsy operation, wrinkles, and all. Still, the flying buttress look is worth it... reminds me of the F430 and 6-series cabrio.

Most of the rags you describe take pride in their "enthusiast" status. I doubt an average Mr. Smith would suscribe to R&T and Automobile, but I could be wrong. Most would be lost in terms like lift-off oversteer, torque steer, and downforce, and be disappointed that their Camry is nowhere to be found.

Beautiful car, beautiful scenery!

No, the current Camry was based on an all-new platform. The previous two generations, however, weren't.

They do...

Yep, I've seen quite a few in LA so far. It's classier and more substantial looking than the PT Cruiser.

Thought this was going to be a Survivor rant... Anyhoo (is that even a word?), I wouldn't mind a rebodied Cobalt SS. Fit the Solstice body onto it, and I'm sure it'd be a hit.