regfootball

G8 is almost here!!!!!!!

the only way any new sort of riviera is viable is to make it a good sized true 4 seat hardtop convertible (standard). or morph the riviera into a 4 door coupe along the lines of that mercedes. Unless its a convertible or 4 door, no one will buy a coupe buick of any size or shape.

the chryco lot by my house has at least 2 GC diesels rotting on their lot I am sure you could acquire for about 10 grand off sticker......

if NDak wasn't so effing cold, and i could get a good paying job there....I'd move back in a heartbeat. neither of those are bound to change any time soon.....

exactly. bingo. remember the conservationist movements in the 70's? like when my mom told me i would come home from school and i wouldn't let her have me take a bath with warm water because heating the water wasted energy. think those teachers weren't pushing agendas on the kiddies back then? here's what factored into the whole green thing cheap gas in the 90's + large SUV's as fashion = gotta swing the pendulum the other way and go to the other extreme. Great way for exxon etc. to almost double gas prices in 18 months and rake in excess profits. the social hysteria of the green movement only serves to prop up gas more. 9/11 and the Iraq war, lefties always need a cause (because they don't want to focus on doing real work) and they realized they lost Bush's push to fund and start a war, so fighting the war that is 'winnable' (i.e. a war of a cause, not against a people, that being, being green and the environment) is a cause the lefties and ecoweenies can feel good about. There is no life or death confrontation with a real evil opponent. It is merely a function of PR and some social cause. They can line up on talk shows and write endless theory articles and bully people but they don't have to solve a real tangible problem. There really isn't as important of a moral component to it. It's a lot easier to fight for a cause that doesn't require moral conviction, which is the type of cause the lefties usually have no problem lining up for. Just the fact we'll have a new pres and will prob pull out of Iraq at some point, plus engineering the economy to strengthen our mortgages will alone change the mood of many and we'll be on to other causes. Gas prices will drop some and people will be interested in big vehicles again. People want big vehicles in this country. There are too many people in this country whose well being is dependent on their homes being their source of financial strength, so you can bet in about 2 years the home and real estate markets will boom again and people will want the big cars to go with it again. No one wants to live in cramped dense urban communal hardscape either. ANd the part everyone forgets. The moment we double our mpg, the price of gas will double. We are hooked on gas and they have it figured out how much they can extract from us as a percentage of our incomes to get it. Only until we diversify what we propel our cars with will we create competition for those dollars we spend to move around. the politicians will want their tax cut out of it also. look at all the roads we need to fix and rebuild in the next 20 years or more. We're already seeing backlash in the building industry on green building and LEED. Owners and developers are questioning the merits of the dollars spent even more than ever, and recent efforts in green building that were well intentioned but not repsonsibly planned are exposing all sorts of flaws in extreme green building, with things like mold and moisture damage and poor air quality and materials that require too much maintenance and disintegrate too quickly. Or worst yet, building function is sacrificed, the new expensive facilities do not work as planned. The marketing benefits of green building is waning and when that driving factor is gone, people that pony up the money won't be wanting to spend it on that anymore.

what a lame piece of $h!. There is no other way to sum this up. infiniti EX meets pontiac vibe. interior is hardly 'coupe like' BMW has a decent concept here but this is totally half-assed. It's called 'execution' BMW. No stick? PUHLEASE. This is fat in the flanks. Style not part of the equation here? Turbo X sportcombi looks pretty sensible compared to this. I would also tend to agree with the other's comments about the interior being crap. Nothing about this interior design says 'driver oriented'. WHy not just get a mazda6 hatch? I would get a previous gen X5 with stick over this contrived pile of dung. This is the equivalent of renting times square and then masturbating infront of a live audience. This is simply a badge engineering job at its worst. The pricks who line up to buy this, even more so. This sort of concept could have been done a LOT better than this piece of crap and that is why I am ragging on it. This has all the effort of Aztek written all over it and that is why this fails in a massive way. At least the Infiniti FX has some style. This thing is a turd. About as totally retarded as the Mini CLubman.

i test drove a cobalt once and thought it was nice. solid little car. i would also shop focus if you look at the balt. i would be tempted to try a rabbit or zero option gti too, although the gti is pricey.

everyone has heard that song. most folks know that be axl singing.

we had forteras on our aztek. finally replaced then las summer, they went about 75k miles i think. good traction, quiet, until about 60k, and good ride. we replaced them with michelin hydroedge, which are excellent but more carlike.

wow, such venom. sounds like reg in drag or something. ion redline i drove was a fun car. no doubt this one will be so much more even. HHR SS much cooler than the caliber SRT. at least you won't need to wear arm pads and you'll have real cargo space. Mazdaspeed has no real cargo area. the HHR is merely a cobalt wagon. compared to say, a focus wagon, a much better way to package a compact wagon. my brother in law is looking for a business vehicle. An HHR SS might be the ticket for him to carry a ladder and tools and have a neat image in the process (although i will push them to a FLex I think). as for the mpg, 21 is about what these highly charged compacts get. the mazdaspeed gets no better. the old svt focus got about that. And if you read real world mileage from users who own Honda Elements you find they barely get more than 20, despite much less power. The HHR SS has 100 horse on the new Vibe GT. When you consider how affordable the HHR is, I think its alright. FOr the compact class I would get a GTI anyways, not a MAzdaspeed. Another reason why the euro focus is a waste. Picky buyers would still get the GTI.

I thought he drove a Prius?

ah but do you have low gloss plastics??????

windy might be right. they simply have no idea what they are building and what standard to build it to. couple that with inadequate testing of prototype parts.......and in general, a tendency for japanese companies to design things to the bone in the interest of some sort of sick thrill of the mind...... I hope this stuff KILLS their reputation. its right. you can drive an old beater accord on good weather city streets 200k miles no prob, but i want to see some construction worker or rancher beat the CRAP out of a turd for 200k miles and see what's left. the FJ cruisers are not fairing much better. imagine buying a house, only to find the foundation was starting to collapse. "Oh sorry, i guess we should have made the walls 10 inches wide and put rebar in it. We didn't think you needed that". Go to a used car lot and find an 06-07 RAV4 and then open up that flimsy back door real wide and shut it quickly with some force. Oh yeah, real sturdy.

wow, i'm amazed, wouldn't a certain west palm beach resident have come on and said his piece of, er, about joshiepoo by now, you think? totally. to the maxx. it's the slacks.

http://wcbstv.com/watercooler/gunsnroses.s...r.2.610016.html

everyone deifies the Toyota production system as the worldwide standard, however, this stuff that is happening, are they NOT TESTING THE PRODUCTS or even doing QC checks? This is exposing some serious issues with their process. How can you trust a manufacturer that has these fatal weaknesses?

it's screwed together on the inside ok, it just is a weird design and is not at all pleasing or comfortable. It transcends dull typical but innofensive Japanese interior design and goes off in the creepy last gen Hyundai territory.

is this for real? if it looks and smells like a pig and oinks like a pig? this isn't even funny anymore. Do those dorks know what they are doing? Can someone please update the list on this lemon now? -tailgates crumpling -weak frame -camshafts exploding -bed bounce -'transmission part may break' what else am i missing here?

you are right in what you say about this class of vehicle replacing sedans. here is my beef. the cargo area in this thing was not great. taller, sure. But the trunk in my 500 holds way more than the trunk in this thing. vehicles like the grand cherokee and blazers and explorers and such at least have an identity to them and have some sort of masculine feel. Not the androgyny or femininity of a lot of these crossovers. A the edge has a much more substantial road feel. Now i get that those vehicles cost more. I think to me, a Mazda6 hatch or wagon would be as fucntionally useful as one of these RAV4's. I know the previous Vue actually had a very usable cargo area. I read the story on the HHR SS yesterday. That would even be something I would take over this RAV4. The only reason I mentioned the equinox / Torrent was because of the available 3.6 package and sport handling. Actually, now that I think about it, the Suzuki products here would hold some interest to me. The Grand Vitara has a nicer interior, even if its powertrain is not great. And the GV has better off road capability. The XL7 provides the 3.6 and usuable cargo room in a package that is not much bigger than the RAV4 and also is probably cheaper to buy. I do like the Outlander in this segment too, although it has some of the androgyny of the CRV and RAV4. The Escape is old but does have the truckish feel. I like the CX-7 because it is unique and sporty although the cheap interior and turbo four let me down.

it was a tan cloth interior. in the past i have not been critical of the RAV4's cabin. I have sat in it and it has appeared pleasant if a bit odd with the way the center stack juts out and with its bizarre shaping. A design element I think is nice is the exaggerated door pulls on each door, very stylized and substantial feeling. The door panels had a nice design. The center stack and console I determined I just did not like or agree with. The location of the radio and climate controls are fine. However, the radio has that same ugly generic asian look you see in many cars, with cheap looking face panel and buttons. But that was not as offensive as the climate controls. Arranged in three round pods or stations, one would think they may put twist controls there. Um, no, that would be logical. Instead, they broke the parts up into loose fitting and cheap feeling buttons, all of which needed you to take your eyes off the road to even have a chance of picking up on the mode of operation. Accompanying this dizzy cluster---k of nonsensical, non tactile buttons was a cheesy cheap display that was tough to read, especially in bright daylight. Moving down, the cupholders occupy the spot in front of the shifter. In this vehicle it seems to be ok although I did not have a big gulp with to verify if you bang your knees on it. The cupholders were nothing special and maybe did not seem very secure, but certainly they seemed to invite big drinks into the cabin. I really have grown to like the cupholders to the side of the shifter like in my 500, but I would guess many buyers would be ok with this arrangement. The shifter itself was thin and cheap with an oddly shaped knob. The action of the shifter was an odd gated pattern which I thought was overkill for this vehicle. And it must be a 4 speed auto. Next to the D was the number 3. Altogether i felt the shift pattern was bizarre. The armrest was a bit smaller than I would like. I did not open the storage area under the armrest but I will assume it was ok. There is cool sliding door on the second storage bin on the passenger side. Kind of an extra storage spot, that doesn't hold much, but the sliding action was somewhat slicker than I expected and for those looking for more cubbies it is useful. I don't recall significant storage in the doors. So, I am seated now and looking at things directly in front of me. The 3 spoke typical Toyota steering wheel. I'll be honest with you, it looked kind of cheap. It had leather on it, which felt ok, and it was a nice size....but the controls built into it were cheesy and the plastic was cheap and glossy. There was very little range of height adjustment so I did the best I could to get it high enough to be usable but not block the gauges.....but the gauges are still way too low and have a cheap cartoonish korean feel to them. Plus, they are small. Give Honda credit, they do know how to make gauges that work. The gauges in this thing are last gen Hyundai. I felt the stalks off the side of the SW were in odd spots as well. What really pissed me off was hunting for the power mirror controls. took forever to find! The had thembetween the shifter and the armrest in the CENTER CONSOLE! Not on the door AS GOD INTENDED. The seats themselves, nicely firm, ok, maybe overly so. But what bothered me was the overshaping of them. They were not shaped for me, they try to contour them for each leg seemingly and all that jazz. Just a simple bottom cushion with some side bolstering is all that's needed. They try to creat a race seat or something and get it wrong. The backrest was supportive but again shaped wrong. I was at least able to adjust the depth and height and backrest to make it usable. Also, it had a power adjuster that worked well. The cabin also had easy ingress and egress for such a small vehicle and shoulder and hip room were good for this class of vehicle. Headroom too. The rear seats appeared to have decent legroom and a supportive cushion, but the seat bottom seemed low. I did not try but if i recall the backrests recline in the rear of this RAV4 as well. The trunk is what I really found disappointing. Very small. This unit in particular was very dirty and beat up in the back and maybe suggested to me cheap materials showing premature wear. And this leads to one of the biggest problems on this vehicle....the ridiculous rear door with the tire thing. It's awkward to open, has no key or unlock on the door itself, and is not sturdy. It shakes badly when closed and makes an awful slamming noise that i used to think only car doors from cheap 70's cars did. The glass panel above the door i think was frameless which is ridiculous if that's the case, it shook and flopped around making you think you'd easily shatter it at some point if you owned the rig. The cheapness, sloppiness, and terrible function of that rear door alone is enough for me to not recommend this vehicle to anyone. Another note.....the interior assembly quality of pieces is ok, and the plastics are low gloss, but they are hard to the touch and cheap looking once you fix on them. Certainly not any better than the Kia Sportage I had once for a rental. We are not talking bottom of the barrel Chrysler plastics here, but simply not that great. Nothing worth the mags praising at all. Al the interior trim seemed hard, cheap and insubstantial. Overall, a very Korean aura to the interior. Lots of cost cutting must have went on. And its all weird shapes and forms. The new Vue's interior is much more agreeable. I'll just capsule the ride and drive part tonight and expand on that tomorrow. Driving it was ok, decent four cylinder power, certainly most folks would be happy with it. A few times, it would not kick down and it would bog down when i gave it hard gas. Lots of hesitation. Steering has a nice light touch and feel, but not much feedback. You don't really get any sense of what is going on on the road below. The ride was stiffer than I expected, I felt too noisy and stiff for a chick car. But I could see where it has a plain sedan feel to it. Shifting was quiet but the 4 cylinder had a buzz and drone to it that even though was slightly muffled, was rather annoying. The most troubling and annoying thing was all the engine vibration through the floor and the seat and such, especially idling in gear at a light. BUZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ. DRONEEEEEEEEEEE. Refined? NO. then with the air on, the damn thing had trouble idling at times at the stoplight. Sad. And the whole vehicle felt insubstantial and light. Too light. Not secure and planted like the Edge. Well, that's about it. I used to think this thing was a class leader, and maybe its better with the 6, but no way in hell do I spend money on this overgrown comact car that lacks finesse and finishing and any sense of class or luxury. This must be why the crawling recreational vehicle outsells it or something. I am going to have to drive the new Vue and Equinox now. To me, packaging and solidity wise, both those GM entrants would be more desirable. Anyone looking at the RAV4 at least needs to look at the Vue. I might be keen on a Torrent GXP if i was shopping this class. All that is happening here is this. In the 90's the camry and accord dumbed down the larger more solid sedans into something tinnier and cheesier and cheaper in a form that women liked because it was smaller and lighter and more their scale. The cute utes is doing that now with SUV's. Turn them into small light tin cans that women feel comfortable drivng because they are nimbler and more manageable but at the same time they lose their stoutness and a bunch or real utility. JMO.

Ok, first off, I am not against the notion of cute utes. But the style and aura of many of the entrants into this class, quite honestly, are either feminine or sexless vehicles. After driving this thing, I am guessing many of the buyers are, too. I actually have driven quite a few crossovers, but not all of them in this smaller class. I have driven enough to know that the cute utes, feeling more smallish and carlike, are desirable by women because they are more managable and intimate than bigger SUV's. But this smallness makes things like this RAV4 feel more like a bloated hatchback than any kind of truck. This is where I will note that in the past, I never felt the old Saturn Vue (which I test drove like 4 different times) had that sort of androgynous personality. The Old Vue felt like a truck to me, but I can plainly see the new Vue was morphed to be more like vehicles like the Rav4 and Honda's popular Crawling Recreational Vehicle. In essence, these vehicles have an oddball feel to them that I am not sure I like. You sit more upright, but at the same time, the vehicle does not really have a wide truckish stable feel. You really get no glimpse of the hood out the drivers window. So, if you think you like cute utes, go drive one and see if it's your cup of tea. Ok, so, current gen RAV4, 22k miles on the odo, 4 cylinder AWD. Cloth. Aplliance white. So specifically I will start out with the interior.

SO, I got blessed with a RAV4 for a couple days on a work trip. I was in no mood to try and negotiate what I really wanted this trip with all sorts of folks queued up at the rental joint, so I just let fate cast its ugly hand. OMG, the irony. Me forced into a hoyotha. And a p*$$y ute nonetheless. Well, let's just say I ain't buyin one by any stretch. And believe or not, this was one of the only Toyota's I've been ok with saying 'class leader' and 'I am fine with it'. Just remember folks, try before you buy........ (more to come)

i'm the one driving, i could give a crap if the people in the back get an armrest. the only thing i have heard consistently about bmw's, never buy one, lease one new only, because the repair bills will kill you, and are inevitable. nice cars, but certainly will put you in the poor house with all sorts of repairs.

mi2

i like that he appreciated the CTS was unique in its own way and didn't mention the 3 series about 30 times.